Leaderboard

I think Admin should ban this "JalandharSher". He's come here with pre-conceived ideas to promote caste-ism and defame Gursikhs. People like this have no place on SikhSangat.

The same Guru Ji also says jo AwieAw so clsI sBu koeI AweI vwrIAY ] jo aaeiaa so chalasee sabh koee aaee vaareeai || Whoever has come, shall depart; all shall have their turn.

As difficult as it is to separate Sant Jarnail Singh Ji with the theological aspects connected to his life (not that I'd ever dream of doing so but I'm trying to make a point), if people are finding it difficult to see any positives in Sant Ji just look at it this way. He stood up to a corrupt, racist government hell-bent on cleansing a religion and its people from its natural homeland. He tried to give Sikhs a bit of self-respect and attempted to open our eyes to how we were being abused in our own country. In hindsight its easy to pick holes in Sant Ji's strategies - in terms of how he took on the security services, etc - but he never claimed to be a great military leader. Would any of us have fared any better if we'd had to step-up and fight? Anyway, sorry for the wildly off-topic post.

Who really cares about the techincal "caste" specifics of the alcohol consumption? The activities are anti Sikh just like smoking is. And when Prabhandik committees promote alcohol, meat and parties on Gurdwara properties then they are highly unlikely to implement any controls on smoking. RST Birmingham is old news anyway and with Maharaj's Kirpa the Committee have taken the brave step of stopping the Gurdwara hall being used for booze parties. One can accuse you of the ignorance and hypocrisy as you're the one clearly stirring the caste cauldron here!

Bhagat Singh is a douta of my village ie his mum was from my village and i asure u that no-one is more proud of Bhagat Singh than the people of my village, particularly my family....every year a Sri Akhand Paath Sahib is done in hounour of his Kurbani by my village in UK. While i respect Shaheed Bhagat Singh very much, but for me and my family...Sant Jarnail Singh was a Grusikh...no he is not a Guru but he was a chardikala, rehitvaan, abhiyaasi, naam rasia Sikh of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee. The only murderers of those innocent Sikhs are your masters, the Indian government. Tell me why is it that when the hundrends of Sikhs in the Indian army who came to "free" Sri Harmandir Sahib (as they were falsely told), actually ended up turning on the army themselves after they saw the loot, murder and rape of innocents people taking place by the very same Indian Army! Dhan Guru, Dhan Hai Guru De Pyare

Unlike Jalandersher "who is not Ramgharia", I was born into families you openly promoted what I would term"Ramghariaism". It's a common ethos about Baba Vishkarma that's propagated in many families that classify themselves as "Ramgharia". See this link on a very Ramgharia website http://www.ramgarhiakom.com/com/vishav_main.html Many Ramgharia Gurdwaras do not discourage the worship of Baba Vishkarma and I witnessed Ramgharia Coventry around 7 years ago do a Gurdwara programme to celebrate Vishkarama Day (around diwali) which ironically fell on the same day as Baba Deep Singh's Shaheedi Purb. Sadly there was no remembrance of Mahan Baba Deep Singh on the day. Reference to Nairobi (as per Jalendersher's previous posting), Ramgharia Gurdwara Pangani used to celebrate Vishkaram Diwas, certainly did in 1989 when I was in Nairobi. Regarding Jalandershers references to Santji being the blame for the Genocide that the Indian Army/ Govt/Punjab Police carried out on civilians is just basede on the prejudices and theories that are pushed around in some pro-Congress/Ramgharia circles. I certainly grew up on those theories until I spent time and interacted with Mahapurshs and Gursikhs who gave me more Gian than the pardaan at the Ramgharia Gurdwara I grew up in did. It's a sad fact some of Ramgharia Gurdwaras today promote meat and alcohol in halls run and governed by the Gurdwara Committee. They even call them Ramgharia Halls. It's something even you Jalendersher cannot deny. If you want proof ring up the committee offices of Leeds, Coventry, Woolwich, Small Heath and book the hall for a party.

Please clear some facts please. After such indisputable video evidence of the Granthi pouring "pegs", is this Granthi still allowed to do sewa at Gravesend Gurdwara? If so, then this is absolutely disgraceful. It's obvious that the video of him openly drinking in his kachera was taken after he had already been confronted in the Gurdwara by the Sangat for smelling of alcohol (as he states himself in the video). Yet if he had any remorse, the content of his discussion about what happened would show some regrets but NO, the pathetic person is getting drunk again! So not only was he caught drunk, the joker carries on drinking. What kind of ludicrous state are we in where a Granthi drinks, does sermons in our Gurdwara and there are people coming on this forum saying that the way in which this fraudster was confronted was "unethical"! Come on guys, start seeing things in black and white.

I can't believe what I'm seeing. http://www.youtube.c...feature=related The current leader of this sect surinder singh, Dhesian Kanha, was recently given 'punishment' of doing 21 sri Jap Ji sahib paaths from Jatheadar Akal Takht Gurbachan Singh for allowing singing (Hans Raj Hans) and dancing in the presence of Guru Granth Sahib. Who knows what beadbi still goes on there, Baba Baljit Singh ji said that the current 'guru' of this sect still sits on same level as Guru Granth Sahib like the previous 'Guru' in the video above. The followers of this sect after coming out of Akal Takht added further insult by doing jaikaraas as if they had been successful. Damadami Taksal (Ajnala) confronted these fools inside Darbar Sahib. I think the panth is in a deep sleep. Rabb Rakhe

Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh Guru Pyare Sadh Sangat Jee, Bhai Gurnimit Singh Raaj has been in the UK for some time now and has only done kirtan seva 4 times. They really want to do kirtan seva and thus need bookings. They love doing kirtan seva and would like to do a lot more in around London area. I user stand they will be going to the midlands too at some point. Please PM me for their contact details, and then pass it on to your local Gurdwara Sahib for bookings. Also please get in touch with any other sangat you know who may be able to help. I must say, some gurdwara comitee's have been very rude to them, they just want to do kirtan seva. Humble bentee to uk sangat, lets help them make bookings for kirtan seva. Guru ang sang sahai Vaheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Vaheguru Ji Ki Fateh

The fact that he's talking about this without any remorse shows he is still guilty from a Gurmat perspective. Until he goes Pesh, is truly sorry for his Bujjar Kurehit and changes his ways, Sikh Sangat have every right to make an example of him, because he shamed the institution of "Granthi" sevadaar, a duty Guru Arjan Dev Ji Maharaaj gave to Brahmgyani Baba Buddha Jee!

lol Well if i cared enough i would fly over. I had no camera at the time. Did you want me to pick up the cigs and post them to you? Well if the people walking past are competing for the olympics then it might be them...but they would have to throw the butts about 50 metres into the Gurdwara premises. It could be the walking past walk around the gurdwara and hall and smoke and the gurdwara can't control this. Or it could be the people partying at the hall who smoke, obviously it would be highly stupid to ask the gurdwara to control this because it is the gurdwara who allows them to book parties and have alcohol and tobacco in the first place. If i cared enough i would evidence all of this but i don't. You seem to care a lot about something...not sure what it is yet but you are getting quite worked up about it. Take a chill pill. Can mods please rename jalandhar from sher to Billi. Thanks.

Are you saying that there shouldn’t be pictures of Baba Deep Singh Jee, Bhai Gurdas Jee, Baba Buddha Jee, Chotte Sahibzadey in gurdwara's too? Surely your naïve logic could be applied to Guru Gobind Singh Jee when they were surrounded at Anadpur for 8months...did the Khalsa not fight from inside the kila for 8months...its called strategic fighting. The Khalsa of the past were far to superior and intellectual to fall for this bravado nonsense...they fought all battle’s strategically. By assuming all Khalsa did was just run into every battle without any thought is just sheer insult!!! When Guru Jee and the 40 sikhs were outnumbered enormously a Chamkaur Sahib, they could have just all walked onto the battle field at straight away without any strategy...but they didn’t...there is a reason. The Singh’s inside Sri Darbar Sahib too were outnumbered and used intellect and strategy. Its sheer stupidity to say "why didn’t they just walk out onto the battlefield" - it totally shows your level on intellect!

Who is 'WE'? Are you part of Ramgharia board or something? I didn't have a camera and i don't live anywhere near there. So did you want me to take the photo down? If you care so much why don't you ring Woolwich and ask them to clarify for you , in your guru ka seva.

Hanjee true but in this case i was the normal sikh guy. She came from a highly respected religious family and i came from a very liberal type of the family.. However we both took amrit in early 20's.. In marriage everyone should keep sikhi as the strong base when it comes to make decision in many family/financial/social matters. Sikhi inside is very important in order to run things smoothly. Practically following sikhi (even basic sgpc sikh code of conduct) will help young couples in this world to survive their marriage. Keeping faith in waheguru jee is very important whenever tough time comes.. i haven seen many of my friends marriage hitting the rocks and it is always about ego and culture taking over sikhi. Other non-religious things to consider.. 1. Same or similar background - If one lived his whole life in city and got together with someone from pind will face bit trouble water ahead. 2. Same or similar education background is also important. similar interests/hobbies.. it is very hard to click the relation when there are two totally opposing viewpoints. 3. Understand sikh/punjabi culture which means how to live with in-laws, respect elders and others etc..

Pyara ji, he was thankfully kicked out last week.

The vidiya of shaster used from 1600-1800s is very important and will be important in the future as well. We don't need advanced military weapons because usually they are used to kill innocent people. Our aim is self defense. You can always make arrows and keep your sarbloh shaster on you whereas a gun only lasts for so long. Wrestling and h and to hand combat is important too. With that said, does anyone know how the bows were made? I really want one. I have a bow at home, but it's more of a european style bow that doesn't have nearly as much tension a Soorma's bow would have...

VaheGuru Jee Kaa Khalsa VaheGuru Jee Kee Fatheh! That's a great idea when you can't make the necessary arrangements to carry out Sri Akhand Paath Sahib Jee and want to take the Rass from listening to Baani. I've done this too ... What I did was I ensured the room and area where the Paath was played was cleaned and made sure to move unnecessary things like TV/Stereo out the room or just shift to a different side of the room, unplug it and cover with a cloth so no-one accidently switches it on. Alongside Paath, you could have your Laptop on with the translations or follow the Gurbaani whilst Paath being played ... There's Maryaada for this too like ensuring the PC/Laptop is 'clean' ... i.e. no unnecessary clutter of dodgy files/pictures/music etc and no other windows should be up alongside the Baani ... Let everyone know that Paath will be played in that particular room and when entering keep a level of personal hygiene and no shoes allowed ... Also when in the room ensure that no-one speaks/talks ... Try to be strict about keeping the atmosphere peaceful and quiet where one is to just listen attentively to the Pavittar Baani. In the room, I put cloth on the floor and sit in lotus position (cross-legged as you do in the Gurdwara), avoid lying down. Also, I light incense sticks (dhoof) and you could light a Joyth but that's optional, just to make the atmosphere tranquil ... If there's anymore ways of keeping to Maryaada please do post up ...

Graded G for energy efficiency for a modern building? My word....

Kirpa Kaur jee you're 100% correct. -- and as for Ramram jeeo i agree with you too sir, however you say mr lalli has nothing to do with the committee then why does he not keep his nose out of it and concentrate on khalistan matters?? why did he speak at the ijlass couple of weeks ago like a puppet to jaspal dhesi pardan.??? the new committee include the baksees singh sodhi the old nirankari - follower hand in glove with indian goverment - -- sodhi and his crew were elected out of gravesend gudwara more than decade ago due to them showing the gurdwara at a loss every year - year after year till people got sick and tired of it. Then after they got voted out - Mr Gill was elected - who in the first year managed to save £90000 in one year --!!! - now the sodhiee who never comes to the gurdwara for any other reason apart from politics is back in power -- very very sad state of affairs -- 100% certain this indian governmet guy as there are a few others in gravesend. the bigger power man behind him IS NARINDERJIT thandee -- who is the quite one - you know what they say about quite ones being the worse ones.-- he has not said a single word either against the alchol abuse and he is MR SIKH STUDENT FEDERATION MAN -- IF SEWA SINGH LALLEE IS TO BLAME THEN IS SO IS THIS CHARACTER TOO - ask anyone what did he say about the alchol incident in gravesend., enough said about these committeee BOAKS - NO NEED TO WASTE ANY MORE TIME ON THEM - instead focus on the future -- what future is there where the youth generation gap is so large -- there is no youth committed to the gurdwara - therefore this sad state of affairs we see in this thread. and ramram jeeo if as you say all these boyz are playing a political game for power with giani and pathhess as PAWNS then their TRUTH has come about in the OPEN for GOOD. What solution do we have - for a 13 million pound building with a 500000 over draft - whose accounts if you look on the wall NO TRANSPERENCY WHATSOEVER. - -IF ANYONE comes to the Gurdwara please reaD THE accounts on the BOARD INSIDE - SEEMS A 10 YEAR OLD COULD DO A better job -- no BREAKDOWN of COSTS - JUST LARGE SUMS OF MONEY PAID HERE AND THERE - SANGAT IS BEING FOOLED - CONCLUSION IS SANGAT IS BEING FOOLED -- BUT THESE fools will realize IN THE LONG RUN THEY WILL BE FOOLED AS IT'S ALL COMING OUT IN the end AND always DOES -

Ha ha! No one is going to take this blatant arse kissing seriously are they? It's like some obnoxious kid in a playground trying hard to get liked by others by being bitchy about another kid. lol On the plus side, maybe such pressure will make certain pendu elders think twice about getting over excited and using kirpans in Gurdwara conflicts..... ...actually I doubt it will...

Is it wrong to do langar seva (serving langar) to the sangat who are sitting on the floor with socks on? I ask because some people at the gurdwara I was doing it at didn't like it (gianis and the sangat themselves), they told me to take my socks off. But I have really bad nail fungal infections on both my feet and it is extremely embarrassing and also unhygenic if you think about it (bare feet which have this infection a few inches away from peoples plates). A few people were ok with that and let me carry on when I explained myself but there have been instances where they are still not happy and say I can't do it. I make sure I wear clean socks when I go to the gurdwara to do seva i.e. they have not been worn at home. Is this ok? Thanks

I bet that Sony vaio laptop didn't come cheap and probably brought with the sangats money, which even wasn't gathered by honest means, as this guy is showing double standards. why are committee members turning a blind eye to situations like this? Why oh because some of them are in on the money too. Most gurdware are now almost like a business rather than doing good for humanity. These type of people should be named and shamed on various media such as Sikh channel so the whole world can see and ex communicate from the path those who do wrong and never be allowed to do seva for the panth again, but what goes around comes around it's only a matter of time...

Firstly I would like to say that this is a great shame for the Sikh community that this issue has been raised in this particular way. Just to make things clear the granthi that was beaten up in the Gravesend Gurdwara was not employed by the Gurdwara at all. This Granthi respected everyone. People have mentioned that this Granthi was being paid £500-600 a week, where is the proof of this? He was not being paid any wages by the Gurdwara, compared to the other granthi currently at the Gurdwara who get paid £200-250 a week, and then get more on top of this from the money that the sangat give them. Nobody ever witnessed this particular granthi coming into the Gurdwara drunk. The only problem that he faced was that he was paying the price of a disorganised management team from the top level down. A majority of these management team only turn up for the big occasions to boost their own publicity within the community or within the media. The night that the Paathi was beaten up by two so called Singh’s that were carrying out sewa for an Akhaand Paath. These individuals were purposefully misinformed by certain committee members and were encouraged to carry out this act. After beating the Granthi up the individuals decided to call committee members to discuss what to do next. If they were really that concerned why did they not call the committee members before hand? When the committee members did turn up the area where he was beaten up in was completely cleaned and no one would could smell any alcohol. Considering one of the Singh’s has a brother who is a Sergeant in the Kent Police, surely he should know what the law is, and the fact that he can not take it into his own hands. The Granthi was taken to the hospital by ambulance with some committee members, in hospital there was no mention of him having any alcohol in his body, after he was discharged from hospital after several hours he returned to the Gurdwara. If these individuals felt they were doing the right thing by beating this person up, then why did someone try to ruin the CCTV footage, not only by taking the footage but by also taking the main hard drives, which is kept in a locked area, where only two individuals are key holders, how did this happen??? Even if the Granthi was drunk on that night what right did they have to beat him up in a place of worship? With regards to the you tube video, why were the guys in the background putting words into his mouth? I personally believe that it is disgraceful for any human being to enter the Gurdwara under the influence of alcohol. It has been known that in the previous Gurdwara in Clarence Place the gyani were drinking alcohol within their quarters upstairs, names were: Gurdwara Granthi, and Jay Singh and Darshan Singh Pathara, these people were drinking regularly and this was a known fact. For general information for everyone Mr Sewa Singh Lalli has nothing to do with the Gurdwara committee, and is also the Leader of Khalistan. He has nothing to do with the Gurdwara management committee. Ram :happybouncer:

Please evidence how my comment is a "blanket condemnation" when you are providing no evidence to the contrary??? Where have I made any generalisations about the Gurmat Maryada, Akal Takht or Caste??? I have provided factual discussion for debate, as opposed to your collective idiotic unsubstantiated ramblings.............and anything in my post that you deem idiotic, I can assure you is based as sarcasm based on an equal logic to your twisted ideas of faith for illustration purposes................

Ok, so a partial evidence based response, and I respect you for that Ksingh, but whilst you say "the panth has accepted Sant Jarnail Singh as the Greatest Sikh of the 20th Century and up until now, no panthic jathebandi has challenged that" - Are you sure????? Moreso than Shaheed udham Singh? Moreso than Shaheed Bhagat singh? How many innocent people's death did they cause?? How many holy gurdwaras di they turn into battlegrounds?? Shall I take it up with the Shiromani prabandhak committee? The one that Jagir Kaur is a member of? The lady that decided that its ok to be religious and kill her own daughter at the same time? Sure, I will give her a call, and get her supreme insight on the path of a righteous sikh.

Regarding Sant Jarnail Singh, you are entitled to your opinion but the panth has accepted Sant Jarnail Singh as the Greatest Sikh of the 20th Century and up until now, no panthic jathebandi has challenged that. Are you sure?? I mean really sure? Are you sure that the relatives of those innocents that were in the harminder sahib complex on the day that it was turned into a seige by its own followers with their relatives martyred would agree??? I f you think so, then you are an insult to the sikh religion in my view.

Sure I can drive up to Leeds Ramgahria and have a look, but I could also make wild unsubstantiated claims about singh sabha gurdwara nairobi, and invite you to fly on over and have a look. No pictures? If you were so in shock you couldnt evidence it? And how do you know that the butts had anything to do with the hall? How do you know these werent flicked on by people walking past? And how does the gurdwara control this? Speaking of kennels, you ignorant imbecile, I suggest you make your kennel welcome to all the other fools who share such a low level of intelligence as yourself.

Ok, so this post I will treat with some respect, based on the fact that it is based on a rational argument, rather than caste bias or shocking ignorance based on the use of words such as "kennels". That said, you have no idea what I have read, and a wild assumption to the contrary is pretty ignorant. So what you are saying is that even if it is not in SGGS, it is the interpretation that is "known". But what makes you think that YOUR interpretation is more correct rather than anyone else's? And what makes you more knowledgeable? Maharaja Ranjit singh had a number of wives, some of whom were not even sikh, and he built mandhirs, is this beadbi? Was he a blasphemous sikh? Was he not something for the sikh religion to be proud of? If not, why not? If so, this is contrary to your logic. Akbar took langar on the floor in guru's house - correct. But what was the teaching of guru nanak behind it? It was that no matter who, all people taking langar will be at an equal level. Spin it how you want, that is what Aad Guru teaches. "Guru taught Sikhs to be humble always, and your post is quite full of ignorance and a little stupidity as well. " Again, please evidence which part is ignorant or stupid, not interested in your ego or opinion, but evidence to support that ridiculous argument.

"I have seen with my own eyes a picture of Vishkarma in Woolwich Ramgharia." If you would be so kind as to post a photo of this, in your guru ka seva, we might be able to take this seriously..................................... until hen I can only assume that these are delusions based on the lack of oxygen available in YOUR kennel...............

Regarding Jalandersher’s references to Santji being the blame for the Genocide that the Indian Army/ Govt/Punjab Police carried out on civilians is just basede on the prejudices and theories that are pushed around in some pro-Congress/Ramgharia circles. I certainly grew up on those theories until I spent time and interacted with Mahapurshs and Gursikhs who gave me more Gian than the pardaan at the Ramgharia Gurdwara I grew up in did. My opinions are not based on prejudices, as i have no need for any. My opinions are based on facts. Historical facts. Did he use the holiest place for sikhs as a military garrison? Yes. Did that directly result in the slaughter of hundreds who had done nothing wrong but to go the gurswara on a gurpbrub? yes. Where is the prejudice here? It's a sad fact some of Ramgharia Gurdwaras today promote meat and alcohol in halls run and governed by the Gurdwara Committee. They even call them Ramgharia Halls. It's something even you Jalendersher cannot deny. If you want proof ring up the committee offices of Leeds, Coventry, Woolwich, Small Heath and book the hall for a party. How come we are not talking about TOBACCO here too? Like some other imbeciles here tried to imply earlier that this is allowed by gurdwaras too? I am not advocating the serving of meat and alcohol. Lets be clear. Its your collective basis for debate that disgusts me. Your argument being that it happens because they are Ramgharia. And how about you? Are you vegetarian? Tee total? And you talk of heavy drinking meat events after weddings in the gurdwara - who has the most raucous events i.e. booze flowing, majority meat lucnhes, followed by a couple of fights int he car park? Jatts I think you will find. and YOU cannot deny that. Smacks of ignorance and hypocrisy.

No he shouldn't be "named and shamed" you fool. He made a mistake yes, and he has been punished accordingly . You tell me what naming and shaming or "exposing" someone who made a mistake achieves. Hes made a mistake that he will live with, you are not God, unless you are perfect you have no right to "expose" him. People that think like this really piss me off, focus on your own jeevan before you judge other. EVERYBODY MAKES MISTAKES, there are SENSIBLE ways you deal with them before you just jump to the solution of "oh let's embarrass him even more."

Mandy Mandy Mandy!! My good friend mandyyyy!!! firstly please could you use punctuation properly, I'm not trying to be a prick or anything by saying that, I just genuinely found it hard to understand exactly what you were saying. Regardless of whether he intended to do it or not ( and obviously he knew exactly what he was doing- I'm not denying that), it is still classified as a mistake right? If you do something you shouldn't, the general name given to such an action is a "mistake". Im also finding it hard to find exactly where I lied, or shared my opinion based upon a lie as you said. If you could tell me that would be great as I can work on being a more honest person. :rolleyes2: You are not a fool, I take it back, on the contrary you seem to be very wise. I apologise for that particular part of my message... I made a MISTAKE. :-) I love you really, please don't hate me :unsure2: