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What do you expect? Most western countries are not actual countries but multi-national corporations which would prefer business deals over human rights issues of minorities in India which they consider- tribal issues from tribal people. We are naive to assume countries like- US, CANADA, UK do not know human rights violations happening in INDIA, CHINA, RUSSIA. They know all that, they just don't care- passing statement from time to time of human rights violations its all strategy of being politically correct- to look good infront of UN/international stage, some of it its strategy of proxy war happening between these countries on high level, it be extremely naive to think they genuinely care. Just picture yourself as representing big pool of corporations name- USA, CANADA OR UK, if during business dealing with India which happens every day, small group in india brings human rights issue to plate, are we really naive to think- big corporations will kill their business dealing with India by putting pressure on India.?? When I wear evil goggles of big corporation working out business deal with India and see small group of people protesting be it - kashmiri, sikhs, muslims, christians- i only see tribal group are bickering and i ignore them or pass small universal "human rights statement" hoping these tribal groups go away. I used to think captalism is something to do with conservatives only but its cycle liberals or ndp parties would be part of it in Canada as well after one gives deep thoughts, its all same crap- minorities suffer in hands of powerful countries like- India, china, Russia.. CSIS know all the human right abuses in punjab/delhi how culprits are roaming free , how GOI tries its best to demonize sikhs in Canada, even know who are real culprits behind air india bombing which is GOI but they still refuse to do anything? Why? Because it does not matter at the end of day as long as business deals are made with India- super power in asia on daily basis and as long as its business as usual- human rights does not matter..!! So response by balpreet singh was good but lets try spending more energy towards awareness of sikh religion instead of dwelling and begging infront of huge transnational corporations like US, CANADA, UK to put pressure on India human right abuses..its not going to happen, surely may get sweet talk from mps of all different parties in election time but on a bigger picture, nothing is going to happen..i.e- pressure in UN, sanctions etc..!! For me khalistan or khalsa raj is not limited to banners or placards. The actual khalsa raj or khalistan is when each sikh born becomes khalsa of sri guru gobind singh ji maharaj to serve humanity, nature and stand up against injustice..!!!

Osho was very gifted with the ability to explain such subtle concepts in a way that made sense to the average person. He also attained a very high degree of awareness. However, he didn't understand Guru Nanak or Sikhi. In his description of various prophets, he stated that Guru Nanak believed in sargun bhagti only. The truth is that Guru ji taught a method to take us from sargun to nirgun. This shows that his understanding and level of study of the Sikh dharm was quite limited. Still, his insights are inspiring, but be cautioned.

Don't like this negativity. Gurbanee is Gurbanee. Many people in our Panth are against Dasam Granth Sahib and Sri Sarbloh Granth and now they are going to against more Banee. Respect all Banee equally. Think about the hits you'll get from Dharam Raaj from saying such things about Guru Granth Sahib Jee!!!!!!!

I don't think that that is very accomodating considering the fact that Sikhs have given absolutely huge sacrifices for the british and have been repeatedly stabbed in the back by them. these people actually **DO** owe us and there is no reason to comprimise our dharm for them.

Giani Jee is in Southall! The videos of the Huddersfield programs should be available soon. Also I have heard they are going to Slough and Northern Ireland, dunno when this is. Also, Giani Jee are attending the 22nd September program @ Southall, opposite the Guru Amar Dass Gurdwara.

Eloo! Gurfateh Rom-rom Simran is something that is exhibited, or displayed. Meaning that, it is seen in individuals and experienced by them, only when inner feelings and workings are aligned. Which is why we are told to ‘go inwards’ for our bhagti and naam simran. Once our surti is steady, and ‘tik-ed’ (stable / at peace / at one with naam simran), we start to feel at peace. Then we carry on with the naam simran train to god. Then, u feel a click. Some people experience this click slowly, others, it’s literally a click. This click is what bani talks as a teer to your heart. But its not heart, its hirda.. (some people say, where’s the hirda?.., its 10 finger widths down, from where u speak from. Aka, near enough your chest. In sidh gorst, >tre sat angul vaaee keheeai<.) so this teer that u experience, will have been experienced throughout your naam simran stages that u climb. So..., imagine a druggie. He hears bani, it hits him. Then he thinks to change his ways. Then, he does naam simran. Then few months down the line, it hits him again, and he starts to take active roles in learning bani, and keertan and so on.. in naam simran, the teer will hit, and overcome you. This is where the so called ‘bani / naam simran shakti’ comes from. (jus to say also, bani has come from naam). So ur feeling the naam. Then u ‘go quiet’ as most people say. (cuz ur simran is going into urself – so its very key to be able to comtrol this and not speak during this process etc..) Then, with the sutra tik-ed, naam simran overcomes your body. And ur hair stands up in waves, as described by people. Guru naanak dev ji sez in jupji sahib, let each hair on my body, become a tongue. There are 50 billion, Billion, hairs on average human body. So, when u say 1 waheguru, your entire body will vibrate with that, to turn it into the ‘fal’ (fruits) of saying waheguru 50 billionbillion times. When u get to these levels, u move away from the notion, that naam is a word. Then u get into the viewpoint that naam is something else entirely, and the ‘word’ as such, is a means to realise naam. Then, bout 2-3months later, u will start slipping into the sunn reality. (Note: all timelines that iv sed, are on the assumption that u do simran everyday). Guru ji has given us tools to do naam simran, however, some of these need to be unlocked. We have tongue, footsteps, the beat of the heart, hair, surti, etc. All are tools to jup the naam to open the tenth gate, and go onward to the journey to god, to then meet god, and to get the true mukti, to merge with him. Through these tools, we slip into the sunn, where nothing is, aka god, and then we travel to make the journey to him. U don’t need to worry about sunn just yet. U will know when it happens. Swaas swaas simran, and rom rom simran, are near enough, siblings. They come together, >near enough. Science says, the breath is the link from conscious mind to the subconscious mind. They right obviously.. there’s evidence. Same goes for naam simran. Using the breath, ur rom rom simran can be unlocked. Guru ji also said in jupji sahib, that inside the mind, there are jewls, >rattan javaahar maanik<. Also, jus to say, jupji sahib, is amazing to do for ur dasam dwaar. But to feel its power, is also hard and u need effort, aka kamaaee. Some people try focussing on getting this and that going e.g. gota get the rom rom simran going, but, this is the wrong way to do it. Focusing on the shabad, and trueness, is the way, and all will align for the tenth gate to open. Rom rom simran makes u shine. Glow. I wish I was blessed with this gift also. We have been given 5 senses, ontop of this, guru ji has given us gifts in our body. Through which, we are able to climb the levels. And even get the ridh sidh, which is relatively rely low level. Meaning, its not too too hard to get ridh sidh.so.. yh.. U also mentioned about hearing things. This is very high avastha things. Its after ur in the sunn avastha level for a while. Then u start to hear naam. The vibration of god. And no, its not the white noise u hear if ur ear pops! If u do hear that white noise, its good sign, it means ur ears are sorting themselves out to get redy to hear the naad. Aka, the sound. High level stuff. Ppl that hear this, are very close to god, hence, close to themselves. Simply, 1. be patient... you cannot push what cannot be pushed. 2. jup naam with reverence and conviction... strive to success. 3. jup for the love of jupping it... within randomness, is utter beauty. Utter. These are my rules that iv found. All of bani is naam. Take jaap sahib.. Aad – the beginning --> aka, waheguru! Roop – the true saroop --> aka, waheguru! Anaad – never ending --> aka, waheguru! Moorat – the true moorat --> aka, waheguru! Ajorn - akaal --> aka, waheguru! Purakh – sat-purakh --> aka, waheguru! Apaar – totally, nex level --> aka, waheguru! All of bani is naam. Bani comes form naam. And >through naam, we merge into waheguru. We start to see naam everywhere. Then eventually, see god everywhere. We start to see sarab byaapak. And then some.. it goes on.. no point in talking bout it.. although, info is good. And reely does help.. gives some clarity.. etc. Its all about the journey. Not so much the end result. Reward is given to manz that earn it. Else, no reward! God wants us to n-joi ourselves. So..! jup like never before!!!!!! (im not telling u to specifically do anything, its the choice of the individual!. Im pretty sure u will tho ) Happy jupping!! :l: email me if u wana to lemi no how u getting on! or, jus to chat etc.. = / :lalala: :angeljump: :yeehaw:

Osho - Philosophy is a game for people who are not thirsty. Religion is the journey of those who are thirsty. Therefore philosophy plays with words; not so religion. Religion takes cognizance of the hints the words give and follows them. When the quest is for the lake, what can the word lake do? When the search is for life, the word life alone sounds hollow. Let us understand a little about a profound question facing the philosopher. A tourist comes to India and he is given a map of India. What is the relationship between India and the map? If the map is the same as India then it must be as vast. If it is exactly like India, it would be useless, because you couldn't carry it in your car, much less put it in your pocket. If it is not like India, how can it still be useful? The map is a symbol. It is not like India and yet by means of its lines, it conveys useful information about India. You may roam the whole of India without ever seeing a map of India. Wherever you go you will find India; the map is nowhere to be seen. But if you have the map with you and understand it and use it, the journey will be made easier. By either keeping the map in your pocket, or by looking at the map and never leaving your room, you will not learn a great deal. Both together make for the fullest understanding of the experience. Religious people the world over hold the maps to their chests as if the maps were the actuality, the totality. Scriptures, holy books, images, temples -- all contain hidden pointers that keep the maps from being just a burden. The Hindu is carrying his load of maps, the Mohammedan his, the Christian his. The maps have become so numerous that the journey is now almost impossible, so weighted down are you by maps. The maps should be short, abridged, and they are not to be worshipped in themselves, but to be utilized on the journey. Nanak drew his essentials from both the Hindu and the Mohammedan religions. He cannot be called Hindu nor Mohammedan; he is both or neither. It was very difficult for people to understand Nanak. There was a saying: "Baba Nanak is the king of the fakirs. He is the guru of the Hindus and the saint of the Mohammedans." He is both. Of his two special disciples, Mardana and Bala, one was Hindu and the other a Mohammedan. Yet Nanak has no place in the Hindu temple or in the Mohammedan mosque. Both doubt his position and do not know where to place him. Nanak is the confluence of the two rivers, of Hinduism and Islam. He harvested the essence from both. Therefore the Sikh is neither Hindu nor Mohammedan; they must be both or none since their religion arises out of their junction. Now it is difficult to understand this confluence; when there is a river on the map it is clear-cut, but here two rivers have become one. Some words relate to Islam while others reflect Hinduism, and together they became hazy, but gradually the fog clears when you enter into the experience. If you keep Nanak's words on your chest as you do other scriptures, it becomes like any other holy book -- and we do find the Sikh worshipping his words as if they were the guru. Is it not astonishing how we repeat our mistakes? Nanak went to Mecca. The priests there told him to be careful not to point his feet toward Kaaba while he slept. As the story goes, Nanak's reply was that they should turn his feet where God was not, and, it is said, the holy stone of Mecca turned wherever they turned his feet. The symbolism means only this: wherever you turn your feet, there God is. Where will you put your feet if He is omnipresent? I was invited to the Golden Temple at Amritsar. When I went they stopped me at the entrance saying I must cover my head before entering the place of God. I reminded them of the incident with Nanak at Kaaba and asked them, "Does it mean that right here where I stand with my head uncovered, there is no God, no temple?" We keep on repeating our mistakes. I further asked, "Then please show me a place where I can be without a head-covering. And don't you remove your turbans while bathing, and while sleeping? Then isn't that also an affront to the Lord?" Man's foolishness is the same everywhere. Whatever Buddha says, his followers paint with their own brush to suit them. And so also with Nanak. The same web is woven once a master has pronounced his words, because man's foolishness has not changed, nor has his deafness improved. He hears, but he draws his own individual conclusions which he then follows accordingly, never putting into practice what he actually hears. Nanak says, no matter how many songs are sung about the lord, nobody has covered it completely. Different people sing different songs because there are many paths to reach Him. However antithetical their songs may seem there is no contradiction anywhere because they all contain the same message. The Vedas say exactly what the Koran says, but the method by which Mohammed reached is different from Patanjali's approach. Buddha also says the same thing but his method is entirely different. Infinite are the gates to His abode. Whichever way you go leads to His gate. Once arrived you can begin to define the gate through which you entered, and describe the path you have trodden. Another person will likewise describe his own door and his road. Besides, it is not only the path that differs, but your understanding, your perception, your emotional attitude all play a significant part. When a poet enters a garden, he sings in ecstasy; an artist would paint a picture; if a flower-merchant comes along, he will think in terms of sale and profit; a scientist will analyze the flowers or soil to find out their chemical composition and why they grow; a drunk will be oblivious to the beauty around him, he will not even know that he went through a garden. Whatever you see passes through the windows of your own eyes which impose their own color on everything. Says Nanak: Some sing the praise of His power -- He is all powerful, omnipotent. Some sing of His benefaction and munificence -- He is the supreme giver. Some sing of the glory of His attributes, His beauty -- He is the most beautiful. Some cll Him truth, some call Him Shiva, some call Him the beautiful." Rabindranath has written: "I found Him in beauty." This says nothing of God; rather, it tells of Rabindranath. Gandhi says: "For me, He is truth -- truth is God." This speaks of Gandhi rather than of God. Rabindranath is a poet; for a poet God resides in beauty, supreme beauty. Gandhi was no poet, he is practical, and it is natural that such a mind sees God as truth. From the point of a lover -- He is the beloved. How we see Him reflects our insight. He is everything simultaneously and also -- none of these. In this context Mahavira's reflection is wonderful. He says, "Unless and until your sense of vision drops, you cannot know Him." For whatever you will know, you will know through your own seeing; it will be your view of knowing. Mahavira calls his method no-view. Seeing only occurs when all vision drops. But then you will lapse into silence, because how will you speak without a viewpoint? When you are freed of your vision, you will become like Him; because you will be so extensive, so comprehensive, you will be one with the open skies. How will you speak? You will no longer be separate unto yourself, but one with the absolute. A viewpoint means that you stand apart from what you see; to have a viewpoint means that you are separate from Him. Therefore Nanak says that all the viewpoints are correct but none is complete; when the partial is proclaimed as complete and perfect, the illusions begin. Any sect or organization claims one particular incomplete vision as perfect. One sect stands against another, whereas all sects are different aspects of religion, and no one sect is a religion. If we were to amalgamate all possible sects that have been, that are and that will be, then religion would be born. No sect on its own can be called religion. The word for sect in Hindi, sampradaya, also means the path, that which takes you to the goal; whereas religion, dharma, means the destination. The destination is one, the paths, many.

some photos i did 9 is sant jarnail singh ji mukhi ddt and shaheed bhai kulwant singh ji nagoke at village nagoke after bhai sahibs shaheedi 15 is amar shaheed bhai manbir singh chaheru these photos are for a up coming video

Amazing Amazing Amazing. Sant Nirmal SIngh Ji Khalsa Pipli Wale

On one of his travels Guru Ji came to a town and stopped at the house of an old Sikh called Chundhwadi. He was very poor and was in a fluster as to what food to place in front of Guru Ji. He went to the local town not knowing what to do. While he was there he saw a gathering of people and went to see what was happening. It was a wrestling match and the local Nawab was parading his champion. Now, the champion was called Maskeen and was tall and muscular and was undefeated. He stood while the proud Nawab challenged all the town if there was any person who would take on his champion. Maskeen strode into the middle of the large circle flexing his muscles. No one dared step forward for fear of serious injury. When Chundhwadi heard that the prize was 50rps he thought that if he could get the money he could use it to buy provisions to place in front of Guru Ji. He stepped into the ring and declared his intention to wrestle Maskeen. All fell about laughing, how could such an old man who was just skin and bone take on the mighty Maskeen? As the two opponents came close Maskeen asked “What are you doing old man? You have no chance against me, what possesses you to fight me, you are going to get seriously hurt” Chundawadi said “Oh champion, Guru Nanak Dev Ji is coming to my house today and I have no food to place before him, my only chance is to beat you and use the prize money.” Maskeen fell into thought, “I have heard of Guru Nanak” he said “they say he is Khudha himself. I would also like to meet him.” After much soul searching he said “Old man, if I let you win will you take me to see Guru Nanak?” “Yes” said Chundawadi “but what will become of you? If you lose, and lose to an old man your patronage will end and what will become of you?” But Maskeen did not hear this, all he could think about was meeting Guru Nanak. So it happened that after a few moves Maskeen fell to the ground with a thump and as planned the old man put his foot on his chest and claimed the prize. There was pandemonium, there was a riot, the proud Nawab was humiliated and disowned his wrestler. Maskeens reputation was ruined, he knew that he would be turned out of his house. His family were even more livid, when they heard what had happened they planned to do away with him. They hastily dug a trench under his munja and stuck in spikes and covered the whole thing with large palm leaves, they planned to murder him and then plea with the Nawab to let them stay at the house. As Maskeen finally got away from the crowd he could not find Chundawadi in all the commotion and wondered home. His favourite daughter met him on route. She had seen what was happening and told her father. But Maskeen was a broken man, he did not care what happened to him, he shuffled to his house and went straight to the munja and lay on it fully expecting the whole thing to collapse into the hole underneath, but nothing happened. His little daughter ran to him and peered underneath “Papa, I can see a man in robes holding up your munja” she shouted. He knew, he just knew. Maskeen jumped off the bed and before he knew it Guru Nanak Dev Ji stood before him. He fell to his knees placing his head on Guru Jis feet. Guru Ji sat him down. “Oh Maskeen, you were willing to lose everything for me, I am now here for you” Guru Sahib Ji blessed him and said that he would be remembered for always. Fifth saroop, Guru Arjan Dev Ji adds Maskeens name to the 15th Sloke in Sukhmani Sahib Ji – “ Sukhi vasay Maskeenia aap nivaar tallay, wudday wuddy hunkarian Nanak garab gallay.

Vahiguroo, my Guru is Gurbani. That is it.

You wrote "Many people confuse rom with hair; some say it is pore." Professor Saahib Singh Jee and many other renowned translators of Sri Guru Granth Saahib Jee explain that rom is hair. But technically they are still right because you see/hear (perceive) God everywhere in rom rom simran even your hair is God. But the way I describe rom rom simran is much greater than just being your hair. Everything is God would you just like to see/hear simran in your hair or everywhere? Quote "But the word rom has it's root from sanskrit sources." Please provide that reference. I will be grateful. I heard it from a katha where someone was well versed in sanskrit. I will try to find the katha for your reference but it is hard to find websites that do good translation of sanskrit. Maaf karna ji that I can not show you now. Quote "It technically means anything that is perceivable or conceivable by the 5 senses." Is it really rom all that we perceive or conceive through five senses? Yes there is no other than God - basically where a perceiver is present. Quote "When one's perception changes due to inference caused by seeing the world, thoughts and emotions etc as God. This is rom rom simran." Have I understood it correctly? Rom rom Simran is the change of perception. Rom rom simran always is; even for the ignorant. God (Sachkand) always is - it is ones inference that needs to be tuned. Satguru mehar karan Daas consciousness

I agree with sheikhfareed. There are too many papoo singhs walking around that wait for someone to knock their pagh off. The question you should ask yourself is are you a sheep or a Lion? You should stand up for yourself and use that bir ras and NOT anger (as we all know anger is bad). Do you really want to be like the singh in the video below:

LOL maybe some one should get started on that btw your display pic of farladhari akaalis is awesome

I know! I'm baffled.

. . . . What is this - OSHO promotion festival ? . . .

Using the multi-national corporation logic - Sikhs in Canada (Sangat) should see them as shareholders. Directors of the multi-national will listen/respond to shareholders if the shareholders (Sangat) are organised and have an effective campaign. Directors (politicians) will fear losing their jobs and are also concerned with reputations with the wider 'non-Sikh Sangat' (voters).

Singh or Singhnee.. I'm guessing you are a Singh if you play rugby.. there is nothing to be embarrassed about! Things as such happen and I am sure this has happened to many people right here on this forum.. Stay confident and strong. There is a lot of stubborn, ignorant people in this world and we must learn to rise above that. Even if this guy doesn't apologise then just ignore it, act normal around him. By your normality he will then to begin to question his own actions. When you return to school walk with your head held high then other students will realise that your absence wasn't due to intimidation... Hope this was of some help... Stay Chardi Kala Gurmukh Pyareo!.... :happy2:

OMGGGGGGGGGGG!!! THIS ONE YOU WILL NOT BEILVE... THIS IS THE ONE 2 WATCH!!! OSHO MAKES CONNECTION WITH GURURS... CALL IT HOW YOU SEE IT PEOPLE!!!

Wow very interesting Osho does seem quite intelligent I think osho's main point is that for all the bani we read how much do we actually incoporate in our lives. I kind of agree with bundha's point above but if we believe guru ji is everywhere at every moment than surely it becomes disrespectful to take your dastaar off at home/bathing/sleeping? I understand that a gurughar is worthy of the upmost respect but that is like saying that guru ji is afforded more respect in one place but not in another? p.s i am playing devils advocate here only because this is an interesting topic

I LOVE OSHO!!! I OSHO DENIYS THE PERSONALITY OF GOD... IT MAKES SENSE... YOU HAVE TO WATCH HIS TALK.. AMAZING.... HE SAYS ONLY 10 PEOPLE KNEW THE LIGHT... WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU... EVEN HE IS INTELIGENT TO KNOW THAT WJKK WJKF

The big problem as I see it I might be totally wrong, is that more than one person attacks us. There is no united body for us willing to answer back. The attacks frequently occur online. One person cannot do as much as lets say three groups dedicated to fighting religious attacks. These groups can themselves be divided into Gurbani, explaining Gurbani etc. History and scouts who find the anti-Sikh material. Second problem is that after 1984 many Sikhs have this anti-Hindu mentality. Lets not get in discussion about Khalistan here but even Dr. Subraniam Swami and A.R. Darshi have praised Sant Jarnail Singh's assistance of Hindus. However many of the youngsters today are aware of Hinduvata attacks on Sikhi but slagger of anti-Hinduism. If we can take out that mentality and convince Hindus Sikhs are different from them then prachar can be effective. Look at the Singh Sabha movement, Hinduvata has targeted itand is foul-mouthing it but it shows their fear of a second Singh-Sabha movement. Many Hindus became Sikhs due to that.

This video presents that there are many different opinions on where one word stops and where another starts in a tuk. Okay fine there is different opinions. Now whether Satguru is larivaar or Pad Ched the same people will make a pause between words at the same spot and then move to the next word. So how do you plan on handling this issue...........its separate from having Maharaj in Larivaar or Pad ched. This second issue of breaks between saying a word is about taking santhiya from a certain jatha or person and how they were talk to read Larivaar Saroop of Maharaj. Also there is no correlation between people wearing small kakkars around their neck and having Maharaj in Pad Ched. Maybe if these people took the time to read Maharaj in Pad Ched, where Gursikhs have done the task of reading Bani is easier, they would have worn a Kirpan as Satguru told them. If their was a correlation between the two then 99% of the Amritdharis will have small necklace kakkars around their neck. No doubt many Amritdharis have disowned Kakkar rehat among other rehat, but is that really do to having Pad Ched Saroop of Maharaj or just one way you guys thought to scare the Sikhs. I think its the latter. I know many Sikhs who have taken Amrit because they were able to understand Maharaj in Pad Ched Saroop. As others have said...............i'm all for Larivaar Saroop of Maharaj. Maharaj wrote Gurbani like this so we need to follow. But to say Pad Ched is not Saroop of Maharaj, Gurdwaras with Maharaj Parkash in Pad Ched are not Gurdwaras, no Guru in Larivaar equals no sangat are very immature comments that have no sound reasoning backing it. One poster made the comment that if Maharaj was in Larivaar Saroop then Shaheed Singhs will not let an attack on Maharaj take place. When Sri Akal Takht Sahib was attacked in the past and more recently, wasn't Larivaar Saroop of Maharaj present? Again such comments have no sound reasoning. Taksal's name was mentioned in the video. After going to Taksal Singhs students and teachers. They teach students in Pad Ched. And these students of Taksal were the students of Sant Baba Gurbachan Singh ji Maharaj. Even Taksal Gutka Sahib are in Pad Ched There needs to be a push for Larivaar teaching and learning, but the reasons to support can't be intimdation tactics and very poorly thought out correlations that don't exist.

This is a great opportunity for Sikhs in Canada to show their political strength. The Sikh Federation (UK) has advised the Canadian Sikh Coalition to launch a mass letter writing campaign through the Sangat at Gurdwaras to Canadian MPs and get oposition MPs to raise Parliamentary Questions. The objective is to explain to as many MPs as possible the democratic right of Sikhs living in Canada to campaign for Sikh self determination and lawfully call for a separate Sikh homeland. Baird should be made to explain himself, apologise or even resign. MPs and Ministers should get a taste of Sikh community feeling and think twice about sucking up to India at the expense of Sikhs living in Canada that have put them in power to represent them.

The Indian government should be more concearned about terrorists in their ranks such as Tytler who have blood on their hands yet roam free. This world is full of hypocrisy. A state government(like the GOI) which is recognized by other nations is free to bully and terrorize it's population anyway they want, yet nationless nations(like the Sikhs) are branded as terrorists and separatists if they even ask for their rights. Ultimately the biggest mistake is ours that our leaders trusted nehru and gandhi in 1947 instead of demanding the restoration of the Sikh nation from the British. Master Tara Singh and Sardar Baldev Singh are said to have greatly regretted after the independence of India for not carving out a Sikh nation when they had the chance but by then it was too late to do anything.

you are right bro they do owe us... but we should be working out royalty deals with them instead working in their army. I don't know about others, but i m kinda against the idea of khalsa working in the british army, kind of defeats the idea of khalsa being sovereign and making sovereign decisions based on khalsa ideals. I mean we already seen war fiasco in iraq and libya...khalsa should pay allegiance to his Guru not British umpire..!! I mean peace keeping force/duty of law enforcement-cop/working for UN army are honorable position that all sikhs should be striving for but working in army and going to war to please parliament/congress and their corrupt politicians just so they can take over oil/gas and natural resources in middle east is totally against khalsa ideals, they always be on clash course with khalsa ideals.!!

I haven't read all the thread so forgive if I'm repeating what someone has already posted. The earlier reference to a nihung being mutilated on the orders of MRS doesn't come from British sources but from a Transylvanian doctor who worked for the Lahore state and seems to have been very impartial/unbiased. His name was Honigberger and he wrote about the incident in his memoirs as follows: I also agree with the earlier assertion that today people have a tendency to let their imaginations run riot when it comes to nihungs of old. They were certainly tough and free spirited in independent Panjab, but they weren't complete angels - and I don't see this as any sort of slur before anyone gets their knickers in a twist!! Anyone interested can read more extracts from Honigberger's book here. Not sure if you need a login to view though? The extracts are well worth taking time to read!! http://www.sikhawareness.com/index.php/topic/12872-john-martin-honigberger-maharajah-ranjit-singhs-doctor/page__hl__honigberger__fromsearch__1

When Banda Singh Bahadur became a Sikh his name was Gurbaksh Singh. Some people claim he was a Hindu because they think if a person is born in a certain faith they must remain in that faith for ever. But in our history we have many Sikhs who were born as Hindus but later adopted the Sikh faith. Famous examples are Master Tara Singh Ji, Prof Sahib Singh Ji, Bhai Rama Singh Ji(UK), Bhagat Puran Singh Ji of Pingalwara. Similarly Baba Banda Singh Jee was born in a Hindu family but he adopted the Sikh faith. More Hindus should follow their examples of adopting Gurmat instead of trying to rewrite history. Having said the above I feel it is a great weakness on our part that we are not doing parchar to the Hindus of India. If we had actively done Parchar today much of North India would have been Sikh.

I go to the temple and ask the pardaan or sevadaars if it has a larivaar saroop (if real guru is present). If it is not then I exit the premises. What's the point me being there? How can it be real satsangat when our guru is not present? ਜੋਜੈਸੀਸੰਗਤਿਮਿਲੈਸੋਤੈਸੋਫਲ੝ਖਾਇ ॥ Jo jaisī sangaṯ milai so ṯaiso fal kẖĝ­ė. According to the company one keeps, so are the fruits that one eats" ਉਹਝੂਲੈਉਹਚੀਰੀਝਸਾਕਤਸੰਗ੝ਨਹੇਰਿ ॥੮੮॥ The thorn bush waves in the wind, and pierces the banana plant; see this, and do not associate with the faithless cynics. ॥88॥ Please control your tongue bhai sahib ji. siaamala(n) madhhur maanukhya(n) ridhaya(n) bhoom vairaneh || The mortal is beautiful and speaks sweet words, but in the farm of his heart, he harbors cruel vengeance. [/left] During my past 8 years spent among youths, i have seen many changes myself included..those who were lefty- hippy sikhs became staunch right wing nut bars and those who were right wing nut bars became staunch lefties soo much soo much that they fell in ideaology of rss or vice versa fell in hands of ultra elitist tat khalsa fanatics. It's a human nature, if one's keep hearing extreme right or extreme left parchar, chances are many will revolt sooner or later and will go opposite side of the spectrum unless you are really lucky by staying in middle ground which is real sikhi..!! [/left] So guys, its just an stage, i m sure he will recover when his hyper ventilation, gurmat/mamat- black and white sikhi trumpet wears off..I do pray when he does recover, he finds an middle ground in sikhi!! [/left] [/left] Let me tell you there are some people who want to follow every hukam of guru sahib attain his total happiness but many try to find short cuts and ways out. Will you get love (sackhand) without following guru sahib totally? I was once a manmukh went to parties and hanged around with the wrong crowd. Those people loved me because I was LIKE them but when I started keeping my kes and started to follow a gursikhi lifestyle they started to neglect and hate me. Why? because they were jealous. Next I moved to certain group in sikhi (I don't want to mention any names) who were obsessed with keeping only certain rehats such as sarbloh bibek etc. I was with them for sometime and they liked me a lot because we were similar. But one day I questioned them about not doing keertan in raag and that it is wrong not to as this is hukam by guru sahib. I told them we left manmukh sangat (sharabi kababi people) because they didn't follow rehats and we are doing the same but you know what happened? They got so angry and joked about raag being not important. I knew these people were only obsessed with one teaching of someone but didn't want to follow all hukams of guru sahib. I wrote this in another post but this is very important so I'll paste it below: I would also like to add and this is very very important. As well as what I wrote above about sarbloh bibek and amridhari cooking the food only. I have noticed a weakness in others rehit as well, which for serious seekers of gurmat naam should keep focus on. Raag vidia is a MUST! Keertan sung in non raag is not keertan and should be not listened to. Guru's bani is perfect and keertan sung from gurbani must be perfect. People who do not sing in raag should learn how to and this is a hukam from guru sahib (as gurbani is composed in raag). Ones who do not sing in raag should be avoided. We must follow ALL of guru sahib's hukam to get his full blessings and get sachkand. Without following all hukams the maximum we can reach is KARAM KHAND. ONLY gursikhs who do keertan in raag, keep sarbloh bibek ie all hukams can become one with Guru! NB. Obviously this will apply to serious seekers of naam abiaas so choose your sangat wisely. Anyway I had no sangat for very long time but unfortunately I fell and tried to find a short cut by following some teaching of saints (don't want to mention any names because they are very prominent in sikhi i.e. they have autobiographies and recordings online). But guru ji then did kirpa again and made me realise NOT all of these KEPT ALL REHATS OF GURU SAHIB. So how were they saints? We need to follow our TRUE GURU not some sant or dehdari Guru. Running from one sants teaching to another. Remember this - here's a pad ched for your reference. ਬਿਨੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਕਿਨੈ ਨ ਪਾਇਓ ਬਿਨੁ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਕਿਨੈ ਨ ਪਾਇਆ ॥ bin sathigur kinai n paaeiou bin sathigur kinai n paaeiaa || Without the True Guru, no one has obtained the Lord; without the True Guru, no one has obtained the Lord. ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਵਿਚਿ ਆਪੁ ਰਖਿਓਨੁ ਕਰਿ ਪਰਗਟੁ ਆਖਿ ਸੁਣਾਇਆ ॥ sathigur vich aap rakhioun kar paragatt aakh sunaaeiaa || He has placed Himself within the True Guru; revealing Himself, He declares this openly. Satguru Mehar KARAN Daas consciousness

Come! the rose and the nightingale both wait for you, For a moment, come into my life's garden, God be with you!

So what do you do when you go to Gurdwara, first check Guru Ji's saroop and if it is not to your liking you walk away ?

The reason I believe there are attacks at gurdwarea is because the granth sahib saroop is not in larivaar. Only larivaar saroop is Guru; No one would dare to attack even the gurdwara because if guru sahib was in larivaar - shaheed singhs would look after everything. This is a sad state of the panth. True Gurbani (larivaar) is Agam Agaadh Bodh. Consciousness

Evolution is a fact. The reason why so many bacteria become resistant to various antibiotics and diseases become resistant to vaccines si because of evolution. It's simply how Waheguru creates the worlds and breaks them down. ~~~~~ hir Awpy pMc qqu ibsQwrw ivic DwqU pMc Awip pwvY ] har aapae pa(n)ch thath bisathhaaraa vich dhhaathoopa(n)ch aap paavai || The Lord Himself directs the evolution of the world of the five elements; He Himself infuses the five senses into it. ~~~~~

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/entertainment/bollywood/news-interviews/Ajay-assures-to-remove-objectionable-contents-from-Son-of-Sardar/articleshow/16236526.cms Shows what the Sikh community can achieve when we are organised and put our minds to such serious issues.

You are at the wrong forum. Are you not ashamed of yourself? You want to recite Gurbani to wreck the life of another girl who doesn't deserve to be punished? Thats the cheapest thing I've read in a long time. Ok, I don't mean to be harsh, I understand you're in pain. But my only suggestion would be to let go. You can't even sum up the courage to speak to your folks about him, yet you want to cause a disaster in his family? Why cause pain in someone else life if your fate caused it in yours? Just forget about this guy, he isn't worth it. If he really loved you he would have stood up for you before his family. He didn't! So forget him and move on. Trust me even if you end up with him, you won't be happy. A man who can't defend his love from a strong breeze of air will never hold on to it once the storms of life strike him. Read this: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:pQfUXsZEPUcJ:www.rajkaregakhalsa.net/literature/General%2520Sikhism/Amanpreet%2520Kaur%2520Marries%2520a%2520Hindu.pdf+%22amanpreet+kaur+marries+a+hindu%22&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESiTMbUgHG4Krf1sUyUYgBaM6Kb7CFbY3ZND_lLLV_D8HyfU1mSnADz0-wTMc1X3rCmEAHw0wfgH7xZdwNq9KwC6TB-sl1tGSgFKnRIB2Am90NRC7JCMmERzYdiZsX02O4Gk1HST&sig=AHIEtbQhG8_otEN2BVK8rROPDTLIQb3Yww

Waheguru.... Bhai Kultar Singh ji and his sister of Manchester were killed in this accident when they coming back from Gurdwara Sri Guru Harkrsihan Sahib Manchester after Deevaan. Two Sons Harveen and Ajmeet Singh are still in ICU. http://www.telegraph...d-accident.html Manchester City's Courtney Meppen-Walter arrested after two killed in road accident Manchester City footballer Courtney Meppen-Walter has been arrested on suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving after two people died in a collision last night. The 18-year-old was arrested after a silver Mercedes and a red Nissan Micra collided in north Manchester, leaving a 32-year-old man and a 37-year-old woman dead and two teenagers, believed to be 15 and 16, with serious head injuries. They remain at Salford Royal Hospital. It is believed that Meppen-Walter was driving the Mercedes. The 32-year-old man was driving the Micra with the 37-year-old woman in the front passenger seat and the two teenagers in the back, Greater Manchester Police said. A second man, aged 19, who was driving a grey Volkswagen Golf, was also arrested on suspicion of causing death by dangerous driving. Defender Meppen-Walter joined Manchester City in 2003. He has also played for England's U-17 side. He is currently out of action with a knee injury. A spokesperson for Manchester City said: "This is a devastating tragedy for this family and also for the Greater Manchester community at large. "Manchester City Football Club offers its heartfelt condolences to the family and all affected by the events of yesterday evening. "The situation is subject to an extensive investigation by Greater Manchester Police and therefore we are unable to make specific comment on the incident itself at this time."

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh whats up singho, if your on facebook, add my page dedicated to shaheed singhs...check out the pictures and posts https://www.facebook.com/pages/Shaheed-Baba-Gurbachan-Singh-Manochahal/111975982152373?ref=hl

Beware the Trojan Horse ... and the Vultures Hovering Over By SANDEEP SINGH BRAR August 10, 2012 The Trojan Horse is a tale from the ancient Trojan War about the stratagem that allowed the Greeks finally to enter the city of Troy and end the conflict. After a fruitless 10-year siege, the Greeks constructed a huge wooden horse, and hid a select force of men inside. The Greeks pretended to sail away, and the Trojans pulled the horse into their city as a victory trophy. That night the Greek force crept out of the horse and opened the gates for the rest of the Greek army, which had sailed back under cover of night. The Greeks entered and destroyed the city of Troy, decisively ending the war. Ever since, the "trojan horse" has been a metaphor for subterfuge. In the aftermath of the Wisconsin shooting, there has been a tremendous amount of support from the American public: from candle-light vigils to emails and a great interest in the media and general public to learn more about Sikhs and their religion. Our spokespersons have been doing yeoman service in inviting non-Sikh Americans to learn more about Sikhs in the wake of this terrible tragedy. I expect that there will be an unprecedented number of non-Sikh visitors to gurdwaras across the nation over the next few weeks. Not only will it be an opportunity to educate many Americans about their Sikh neighbours and the Sikh religion, it will also be an opportunity for all Sikhs and non-Sikhs to come together as a nation mourns and remembers the victims. While most non-Sikh visitors this weekend visiting gurdwaras will have come out of a genuine sense of curiosity to learn more about Sikhs and their religion, or to express sympathy and solidarity with Sikhs, there will ufortunately also be another type of visitor to our gurdwaras with an entirely different agenda. This particular group of visitors is not coming to our gurdwaras out of interest in learning about Sikhs or sympathy, but with their own agenda. That agenda is to use this as an opportunity to try to start the process of converting Sikhs to Christianity through a first outreach to Sikhs. A Christian website states the following: “In the wake of one of the greatest tragedies to hit the Sikh community in North America, Southern Baptists have an unprecedented opportunity to reach out to their Sikh neighbors with the Gospel of Jesus Christ … We have an opportunity now to turn this very sad situation into a life-changing encounter with the Gospel for Sikhs throughout North America.” And how do they plan on doing this? Apparently the website mentions that they have ‘church planters’ who coordinate and work with partner churches. The website gives an example of how an opportunity arose this week when their ‘planter’ worked with a local church to contact a gurdwara, first expressing sympathy and then using this as an opportunity for an entirely different purpose as a stepping stone for their real agenda. In their own words: “Masih said he has already seen ministry opportunities emerge this week. He mentioned one Sikh temple next door to an SBC church in Baltimore. On Monday, Masih talked with the pastor, who told him about his struggles to build a relationship with the neighboring temple. Masih then, with the pastor still on the phone, called the temple's priest and, in his own Punjabi language, expressed his sorrow over Sunday's tragedy. He asked for the opportunity to bring local Southern Baptists -- including members of the neighboring church -- to visit the temple and to give the Sikh community a tour of an SBC church. He said the temple leadership enthusiastically agreed -- and even volunteered to bring the food. Both sides will have an opportunity to share what they believe and Masih plans to share his own testimony. He also plans to leave them with a film on Jesus in their Punjabi language. Masih noted that believers who feel led to reach out to Sikhs in their community should start by building bridges -- much like what happened in Baltimore. “When we start with us and what we believe, they're not going to listen," Masih said. "When you talk about them, they'll listen. That's how you build a bridge. Show an interest in their lives, and you'll build a relational bridge." It’s so sad and disturbing to think that there are people and religious organizations out there that would exploit this tragedy for their own ulterior motives. To take advantage of Sikh gurdwara hospitality in the wake of the Wisconsin tragedy and betray our trust for their own arrogant agenda is truly disturbing. “Masih encourages Christians not to argue theology with Sikhs. Ask a lot of questions. Find out what they believe. Greet them with their own traditional greeting (pronounced "Sat Sri Akal"), if you'd like. If you choose to visit their temple, follow their instructions and be good guests. Instead of focusing on the differences between Christianity and Sikhism, be prepared to share your testimony and show them in your attitudes and actions how much God loves them.” In Sikhi we use the beautiful metaphor of the world being like a garden and each flower in that garden under the Divine Gardner, Waheguru’s care. We regard other religions as flowers in that garden. Our path is one of those flowers that we follow and love, but we recognize the diversity of flowers and religions in God's garden. How disappointing to see the appearance of weeds in this garden: of the arrogance of some that cannot respect other people’s beliefs or religions and would betray opportunities for genuine interfaith dialogue and trust for their own cheap agendas. In the coming weeks be hospitable and welcoming to new visitors to our Gurdwaras, but also beware of the Trojan Horse and the vultures that hover over it.. Sandeep Singh Brar is the Curator of SikhMuseum.com and the creator of the world’s first Sikh website, Sikhs.org. . .

SInce Guru Gobind SIngh ji Maharaj was Akal Purakh Jot, thus he had authority to point to mistakes which earlier avtaars made. But we are not even sikh and should avoid doing Ninda of Avtaars(of any religion) and be more concerned about ourselfs(of Our life boat which is sunk). Give Respect to Others, If you want the same in Return.

Those who have not met Sant ji in person and asked them questions and about their doubts directly....don't say anything wrong .......you guys call urself true sikhs....then do follow sikh teachings....don't say wrong about anyone, .........you have doubts....go to Sant ji direclty and ask them...........u'll get your answers..........and we are with him from last 40 years...have met him in person.........he has always shown us right path......always taught and brought us close to Nitnem and Sikh Gurus...... HAVE YOU ? if not then you have no right to defame him.....you should keep quiet or go to him and get the clarifications you are asking other people here....... A BRIEF HISTORY - He is Sant Attar Singh ji's avtaar....Sant Attar Singh ji Mastuana Sahib left some jobs undone and said he'll do it in next birth and now Sant Baba Balwant Singh ji has compaleted and is completing those jobs,,,,,,,,,,,,He has written Malwa Itehaas sanchis.......many volumes......if you have read any of them ...you'll get to know what he's doing......the Malwa Itehas contains the lives of saints - Udhasi samparda and others like Sant Gurbachan singh ji khalsa and may more......which was started by Baba Sri Chand Ji...Guru Nanak Dev ji's elder son and baba Beeram Daas ji having more than 400 yeard of life follwed this samparda....Another fact which many of us might not know is when Guru Gobind Singh ji lelt the physical body in Jahoor Sahin....sangat was doing virlaap.....Baba Beeram Daas ji went to Hajoor sahib from punjab and was sitting at the bank of Godawari (if I am not mistaken) and Guru ji before going to sach khand and after having left the body asked baba beeram daas ji to go to the sangat in naderh and teel them guru ji has gone nowhwre...will always be with Khalsa....and he should go to Punjab and spread sikhism and give daats to more spiritual beings...many of which are famous saints...Guru ji belssed his kirpa on Baba Beeram Daas ji.......Baba Jwala Singh ji Harkhowal wale, Baba Puran das ji and many more got the daat of spirituality from Baba Beeram Daas ji.....Guru ji asked baba beeram daas ji to " bhanda dekh ke vastu deni" ...........and finally Baba Balwant singh j's guru were Baba Puran Das ji...... this is the brief history.....so if you still defame him because of your tush budhi.......Sukhmani sahib has results that you'll get.......in astpadi "Sant ke nindak...... " sorry for being rude.......satguru sabhnu sumaat bakhshan I won't argue to prove myself right because...................jithon rab te usde sant shuru hunde han othe tak akal te tarak khatam hunde han....te koi us cheez nu nahin jaan sakda jo manukhi akal de daeyre ton bahar howe kyon ki othe tak akal pahunch nahin sakdi.............. koi kise da doubt nahin clear kar sakda...jadon tak ansi khud usnu jake apne shanke door nahin kar lende......apne mare bina swarag nahin disda....... Jahangir te Chandu ne Guru Arjan dev ji nu dekheya si par suneya nahin.....je suneya hunda ta paap na kmaunde.........

What’s wrong with Singhnia having facial hair? If a Singh can have this mane why can’t a Singhni have her whiskers.