seektruthgal

Does anyone know where someone who doesn't speak or read Gurmukhi fluently can get English versions of the Guru Granth Sahib?

So, I just want to say thanks. As I was sitting here reading this, it occurred ot me that something about our dialogue somehow helped me to identify, and answer, an internal conflict that has been plaguing me for a few years now. It occured to me, that, I feel like I sold myself out. By that I mean, there was a time when I felt so strong in my convictions, whether or not I felt them to be religiously based, or just based on my combining all the things around me into patterns I saw as right or wrong, and then after the crumbling of a first and only relationship, I suddenly found myself not caring anymore, as if a bubble had been burst. I realize now that what was really bugging me was that I had fallen into a relationship, into many things, but in a way that still allowed me to adhere to my values - there was so much that I didn't do, that we both didn't do - because we had the same values. Once that ended, for some reason, now, I remember, it through me into this downward spiral where I started to question everythng -I started to drink, I stopped caring about things I used to. I felt somehow as though everything I thought was possible, suddenlyh wasn't, and that, those values that I thought I managed to find a happy medium of, in another person, were also false. I was always very isolated from other punjabi and/or sikh people my age - and when I started to see what the rest of them were like, something inside sort of crumbled, and its funny I didnt remember that moment until today. It was almost as though my values, or the hope I had that I coudl somewhoe live a life where my values and those of the world around me matched, died too. I cant really think of any other way to explain it. Now that it;s been a few years, and I guess I'm at that age where you start to want to think ahead, I feel so weighted down by all the things that have happened to me since. I feel like a dumb girl who didn't know any better, and now I've seen so many things that don't match what I thought the world was, that I dont know how to go back. Its like one event changed all the rule sfor me, and I went through this fog for so long, because I lost faith in my reasons for those rules, and now for the first time I can accept myself and those rules again. And the worst part is, I want to go back to that person I was before -- I am terrified that I am 'ruined', and that there isn't a place for me anywhere because of it. Be it gender based, cultural, or even, religious -- how far do you have to stray to be a lost cause - or is there such a thing? What do you do when you strayed away from your own convictions, and then realize your error once all your pain is gone and you're not blinded by it anymore?

Wow, thanks for the responses! I like this website. I have to say, that this adds some clarity -- its obvious that I have some skewed perceptions that I'm acting on as truth. You're right that family values maybe shouldn't be generalized to an entire population. I suppose it is just hard to get away from being taught things as 'right' or 'wrong' and then growing up and realizing, at an age when I think you should be more 'wise', things that are not necessarily the truth. Here's another angle though -- if religion says one thing, your family says another, general broad society still another, then how do you decide what to do? It seems a simple question -- but living your life trying to please everyone else, can cause serious problems. I was reading somewhere that first generation western born punjabi girls have been persenting characteristics of borderline personality disorders. The result of having fragmented identities - ie - being one way at home, and another way in the real world. I touched on several issues at once -- sort of just babbled on the screen. My issue is, well everything. I just see hypocrisy everywhere i look. I liked the media example you gave - we are taught one thing at home, taught that beauty is not on the surface, taught to focus on other things, taught to enjoy our rotia, and then we are bombarded with images that we can never aspire to, like blonde blue eyed sex objects that we see. Now, I guess it makes sense that with migration, cultures change. So therein lies another dilemma - things that were previously taboo, are now slowly sneaking their way into dominant punjabi culture - for example, things like dating, sex, even displaing some of the superficial characterisitics that we see in western media all around us. So -- the question now becomes, what do we participate in, what can we now do, because the things that we didn't do before, telling ourselves that we are being 'sikh', or 'punjabi' (and i recognize that you're right, people do confuse the two as being interchangeable, and they shouldn't), are now allowed. As a teen here in Toronto today, you can date, pretty much behave as your friends of any other culture do, and it seems that on the whole, there is a 'niche' or a place for you to belong within the culture, that there wasn't before. In essence - I see a shift even with the kids that are a decade younger today -- the way they carry their identity is fascinatingly different - its almost as though the 'rules' you had to obey before, in order to be able to say ' i am punjabi' have now conveniently broadened so that its almost as though anything goes. ANd if anything goes, then really aren't we just painting the broader global culture brown, yet calling it our own? Is there really any place for it anymore? Does culture go beyond just music and food today? On the gender in the media issue - I really relate to what you were saying - in fact I've had this conversation with friends before, and I find that the so -called liberal sexuality that westerners claim to enjoy, is actually disguised oppression - it always will depend on the sexual values in the eye of the beholder - liberalism allows for women to 'flaunt' - which- yes - encourages a focus on appearance - so that we are essentially grooming ourselves to be just what we are told we are being freed from - an object. People who advocate that the see a lot of eastern cultures as 'oppressive' - are basing that on the fact that the non-flaunting of natural sexuality or appearance, is a form of oppression - but is it really? I've found that arguments can be made for either case. Is any of this making sense. Im babbling.

So Im writing this as a twenty-something female who is disturbed by the patternsof behaviour, socializing, and the punjabi approach to relationships that I am seeing. I, like many other people on this site, have grown up with great family values, a lot of support, and have been instilled with the desire to succeed, to make good the sacrifices our parents made when they came here. Many of us I think innately carry that goal within us. Many have termed it 'the first generation guilt factor', but I do not think that is the case. I think that making good of our parents sacrifices is a blessing, and something that I am proud to do. Here is where the dilemma is though. I feel that, as a female, how much I achieve, what I do, and how much I try, will never be seen in the same light or with the same level of prestige, as our male counterparts. Especially when it comes to relationships. I feel like the expectations placed on us, as first generation children, are not realistic. Men do not have the same expectations and are not stigmatized to the same degree as we females are. Religiously, we are all equal. Culturally we are not. If we allow ouselves to be judged according to culaturally subjective titles such as 'good vs bad girls' and or any other deragotory lables, then aren't we in fact saying that culture is overriding religion? Which, I certianly believe should not be the case. What I am trying to say is, when we are taught to stay home, not be assertive, listen to what we are told, marry within our caste -- all of these things are the opposite of what our religion tells us, which as much as I know, I am proud to say, is to respect women and men equally in front of the khalsa, and the Golden Temple has four doors to accomodate all castes. If all castes are welcome in the Golden TEmple, then surely they can be welcome in our homes, and families. A lot of the strife and fighting that occurs within families and between parents and children is about just that, caste, and other things, which religiously, we should all accept as SIkhs. What do folks think?

My two cents are be strong, and dont minimize the physical symptoms that your mind might be manifesting. I am not a doctor, and aside from having a mild interest, and having taken some psychology in school, what advice I will give you is based strictly on what I have read, and help that I have got for myself. If you are a waking up, regularly, and these dreams are recurring, maybe it is a sign that you have a concern, that comes to the surface of your mind at night. It might be worthwhile to talk to somebody you can trust about it, even your doctor. Finding out what you are scared of, and resolving it, will help you maybe stop the fear. I read your entry, and thought, wow, the same thing has been happening to me. I don't have dreams, but I wake up, at the same time every early morning, and feel panicked -- and so scared. You might be having anxiety, or panic attacks. THe mantra vaheguru I think is a good idea because it is essentially a repetitive calming word, and cam help you deel breathe. I do it too, and someone suggested to me try deep breathing, and at first I didnt think they knew what they were talking about with the breathing, but it worked, at least it calmed me down a bit. Now I have to work out all the things that I am scared of, and have no one to talk to them about.