humgareeb

This is NOT true information and has been verified with the Sevadars at the school. They have never allowed any interfaith marriage at the school, and have no such wedding booked for this weekend. If you have any doubt come down and see for yourself. Clearly your WikiLeaks aren't working correctly..

Both methods are parvaan. Doing loudly first and listening to it will increase your concentration, otherwise there is danger of you start doing it with repetation, but because you know it, you won't necessarily listen to it, but just complete it for the sake of doing it in auto-mode. With regards to the granthi, you should have asked him, whats the need for eating food everyday? Once you have eaten it once, you know what it tastes like. In the same way gurbani is the food for our soul. Doing nitnem everyday is required to constantly remind our forgetfull mind of gurus message and feeds the soul. prabh baanee sabadh subhaakhiaa || The Word of God's Bani, and His Shabad, are the best utterances. gaavahu sunahu parrahu nith bhaaee gur poorai thoo raakhiaa || rehaao || So constantly sing them, listen to them, and read them, O Siblings of Destiny, and the Perfect Guru shall save you. ||Pause||

To celebrate Vaisakhi and commemorate the Amritsar Massacre that set alight the flames of justice in the panth and gave birth to the dharam yudh morcha. Akhand Kirtani Jatha UK invites you to join sangat from all over the world for the 19th Annual International Akhand Kirtan Smagam. Many Kirtani Jathas and sevadaars from around the world will be taking part in kirtan seva. Giani Pinderpal Singh (Kathakaar) will also be attending the smagam. All programs at: Sri Guru Singh Sahba Gurdwara, Princess Street, Derby, DE23 8NT Monday 14th April - Wednesday 16th April 2014: Sri Akhand Patth Sahib: 10am Arambh - 5.30pm Bhog followed by: Rehras Sahib followed by Akhand Kirtan: 5.30pm-9pm Thursday 17th April 2014: Asa Di Vaar Kirtan: 6-10am Rehras Sahib & Akhand Kirtan: 5.30PM-9pm Friday 18th April 2014: Asa Di Vaar Kirtan: 6-10am Rehras Sahib & Akhand Kirtan: 5.30PM-9pm Saturday 19th April 2014: Asa Di Vaar Kirtan: 6-10am Akhand Kirtan: 7.30pm-12am Sunday 20th April 2014: Akhand Kirtan: 8am-11am followed by Mahan Panthic Conference Reansabai Keertan: 6:00pm-5:00am Other Information Please note Amrit Sanchar on Saturday 19th April 5PM 
 Accommodation has been arranged for the whole Smagam. Bibian accommodation has been specially arranged. For further details, contact Bhai Bhupinder Singh on 07719225401 Bibiaa and family accommodation will be catered for contact Bh. Bhupinder Singh Special exhibitions will be on display in National Sikh Museum covering history from the Guru Khalsa Panths, the 1978 Shaheedi Saka, Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh and the ghadar movement - Amrit Sanchar Information - - Saturday 19th April 5PM - Wear 5 Kakaars, including Keski and Dastaar. The colours for Keski and Dastaar are Blue, Black, Basanti/Orange and White. Wear Gurmukhi Baana. Males should not wear Pajaami while females should wear Pajaami. Bibiyaan who wear a suit, must ensure that the suit is plain and loose. Kirpan must be made of Sarbloh and held in Gaatra. Kachhera must be White only 
 Karra must be made of Sarbloh All Abhilaakhis must come after Body & Kesh Ishnaan, please ensure Dastar and Bana are 'sucha'. 5 Kakaars Will be provided as free Seva if needed Note – It is strongly advised all New Abhilaakhis should do 2 hours Mool Mantra Jaap & 7 Baniaa in preparation for Amrit. (Ideally starting months before) All Abhilaakhis should sit and listen to the Akhand Paath Sahib & attend the Keertan Divans

I'm sure guru sahib wrote bani for this - so commercialied nowadays!

Baba Ji was in Singh Sabha Derby on Sunday. He did katha and veechar Live on Sangat TV from there and was then present in the Q&A session which they have from 4-5.30pm. I suppose people might start saying now that he has gone all "missionary" because he was meeting with AKJ UK reps there.. lol

Apprently he is going to be in Kenya from 10-19 Nov.

Then the maryada should be changed to say jhatka is allowed, because at the moment it only says kuttha, which is defined as killing in SGGS which the jot of 10 gurus. Plus other quotes I have shown you also lead one to believe that one shouldn't kill for pleasure of your rasna.. Unless u think SGGS is different from guru Gobind Singh?

How many maryadas did guru Gobind Singh administer? More than one? Where has guru sahib said this? I've shown you where SGGS talks against

Then should Guru gobind singh have had 2 separate amrit snachars? one for the khalsa and one for Nihangs? Bit silly don't you think?

Isn't it the case that evenry sikh should aspire to be a sant-siphai (saint-solider) so why would there be one rule for one and another for someone else? Guru Gobind Singh created the khalsa in order to make one type of sikh. Yes - there are different jathebanids etc, which ultimately shoudn't be the case, but it's absurd to say that one type of sikh can eat meat and another can't. At the end of the day meat is meat whether you jhatka it, halaal it, kuttha it... and IMHO there is no referece to pro-meat in SGGS ji, see my earlier post.

I heard that they have reached 1 million, but the more the merrier

An interesting reply I came across in regards to this issue: ਕੁਠਾ (kut(h)aa) To my knowledge the Akal Takhat Rehat marayada neither mentions the word halal or jhatka. It uses the word Kuttha (ਕੁਠਾ ). Now if we look at how this word is used in the context of Gurbani in Guru Granth Sahib ji: ਇਕੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨੁ ਰਵਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਭਾਉ ਦੁਯਾ ਕੁਠਾ || (p. 321) eik nira(n)jan rav rehiaa bhaao dhuyaa kut(h)aa|| The One Immaculate Lord is pervading everywhere; He destroys the love of duality. ਤਿਸ ਦਾ ਕੁਠਾ ਹੋਵੈ ਸੇਖੁ || (p.956) this dhaa kut(h)aa hovai saekh || If the Shaykh is killed with that ਕਾਢਿ ਕੁਠਾਰੁ ਪਿਤ ਬਾਤ ਹੰਤਾ ਅਉਖਧੁ ਹਰਿ ਕੋ ਨਾਉ ||੧|| ਰਹਾਉ || (p.714) kaadt kut(h)aar pith baath ha(n)thaa aoukhadhh har ko naao ||1|| rehaao || The Name of the Lord is the medicine; it is like an axe, which destroys the diseases caused by anger and egotism. ||1||Pause|| It is clearly evident from these references the the word Kuttha (ਕੁਠਾ ) is used to describe killing or destroying. It doesn’t make any reference to the method used. Therefore it should be taken that any form of meat is forbidden by sikhs as defined in the Sikh Rehat Marayda. It is up to us if we want to continue twisting the meaning for our means. Other Quotes in Gurbani There are numerous references in the SGGS, in simple daily language for any common man that does not need a Harvard trained professor to explain, which indicate that the preferred diet is vegetarian food for a Sikh. Some of these are as follows : 1. Asankh Gal Vadh Hatianh Kamaih. Japji, p.4 Countless cut-throats and ruthless killers. 2. Baid Pareh Mukh Mithi Bani, Jian Kuhat Na Sanghe Parani. Fifth Guru, p.201 With his mouth, he recites the Vedas in sweet musical measures, and yet he does not hesitate to take the lives of others. 3. Khak Noor Kardang Aalam Dhuniah, Aasman Jimi Darkhat Aab Paydaas Khuday. Bandhe Chasm Didang Fanay, Dhunia Murdar Khurdhani Gaafal Havai. Gaibaan Hehvaan Haram Kustani Moorrdar Bhakoraih. Fifth Guru, p.723 The Lord infused His Light into the dust, and created the world, the universe. The sky, the earth, the trees, and the water - all are the Creation of the Lord. O human being, whatever you can see with your eyes, shall perish. The world eats dead carcasses, living by neglect and greed. Like a goblin, or a beast, they kill and eat the forbidden carcasses of meat. So control your urges, or else you will be seized by the Lord, and thrown into the tortures of hell. Your benefactors, presents, companions, courts, lands and homes - when Azraa-eel, the Messenger of Death seizes you, what good will these be to you then? 4. Jiih Badhuh Soh Dharam Kar Thappoh Adharam Kahoh Kath Bhai, Appaas Ko Munivar Kar Thappoh Ka Koh Kohho Kasaiy. Kabir, p.1103 You kill living beings, and call it a righteous action. Tell me, brother, what would you call an unrighteous action? You call yourself the most excellent sage; then whom would you call a butcher? 5. Rojah Dharre Manaveh Alloh Suadhat Jiih Sangareh. Kabir, p. 483 You keep your fasts to please Allah, while you kill other beings for tasteful pleasure. 6. Joh Sabh Meih Ek Khuday Kahat Ho Toh Kioh Murghi Mareh. Kabir, p.1350 You say that the One Lord is in all, so why do you kill chickens? 7. Kabir Bhang Machli Surra Paan Joh Joh Parani Khain, Thirth Varrat Naim Kiyah Teh Sabhe Rasathel Jainh. Kabir, p.1377 Kabeer, those mortals who consume marijuana, fish and win - no matter what pilgrimages, fasts and rituals they follow, they will all be wasted. 8. Jeh Ratt Lageh Kaperah Jama Hoi Palleet, Joh Ratt Pivanh Mansa Tin Kioh Nirmal Chheet. First Guru, p.140 If one’s clothes are stained with blood, the garment becomes polluted. Those humans who drink the blood—how can their consciousness be pure? 9. Kabir Khuub Khana Khichhri Jah mein Amrit Lone, Herra Rotti karney Ghala Katave Kaun. Kabir, p.1374 Kabeer, the dinner of beans and rice is excellent, if it is flavored with salt, Who would get his throat cut, to have meat with his bread? 10. Brahman Naave, JihaGhay. First Guru, P.662 The Brahmin kills for the purpose of sacrifice and then takes cleansing baths. 11. Bagga Bagge Kapare Thirth Manj Vassan. Ghut Ghut Jihan Khavney Bagge Na Kahihan. First Guru, p. 729. The herons in their white feathers dwell in the sacred shrines of pilgrimage. They tear apart and eat the living beings, and so they are not called white 13. Maha Kasab Shurri Satt Pahi. Karanhaar Prabhu Hirdey Vuutha. Fifth Guru, p.898. The great butcher throws away his knife when the Creator Lord God abides in the heart 14. Hinsa Toh Mann Te Nahi Shutti Jih Dya Nahi Palli. Parmanand, p.1253. Cruelty has not left your mind; you have not cherished kindness for other living beings. 15. Lahore Sehar, Jehar Kehar Savaa Pehar. First Guru, pp. 1412. In city of Lahore, painfully animals are slaughtered early morning.

Just because one committee member says one thing doesn't make it the real reason. It could be his personal opinion.. Some people just need to chill and see the bigger picture..

That's what it was all about.. A picture.. And then wen they were begining to look stupid, they turned it into, it not about the pic, but the principle that the Sangat should be consulted before taking major decisions.. Lol, seriously, if they did that for everything, they would waste a lot of time asking 10,000 members. Plus the reality is that they didn't remove the pic altogether, they displayed it in the library, as they had been told it was a health and safety issue as it was blocking the glass elevator.. Some people just need to find something better to do on a Friday evening, than protest about silly things. Suppose the Sangat sitting there reciting jaap wasn't a a whole waste of time tho.. Anyway, the comittee have now agreed to put it back up in the main foyer, but in different place due to the health and safety issue, but apparently some protestors still aint happy, they want it back in the same place... True warriors..

We are not worshipers of pictures but gurshabad. Plus if they are going to put up th picture somewhere else what does it matter.. Over inflated egos is the problem, nothing else.. 300 people don't make up the whole Sangat.. I can bring 600 people to support the committee, then which is considered as Sangat..?Yes comittee shoul ask Sangat before taking important decisions, but moving a pictures ain't one of them IMO

Neither does Malhi, that's where all the drugs started from.. Get your priorities right..

Apparently the comittee removed a pic of guru sahib and sahibzaday in order to move to another location because it was causing obstruction to the lift. People started protesting coz thu took it down from its original location. Seriously? There must be more exciting things to protest about. What a waste of time.. So what if they are moving it? Looks like another feeble attempt from the opposition comittee to stir more trouble, for their own ego gain.. This is the reason our Panth is in the state it is. Can you imagine what the police are thinking? There 300 people protesting because of picture being moved.. What's next the colour of the toilet paper.. ?Get real people..

Serious gupt is known to spread hatred between the Sikh community... Get my point?

I am not here to give you a history lesson - but if you go back and look at the history pre-1940's akal takhat 5 kakkar included the keski. You aren;t going to believe anything I say so it is better you go and do your own research. You may want start here S. Shamsher Singh Ashok who has been an active member of the Singh Sabha movement and an erstwhile Research Scholar of the S.G.P.C., while discussing the prevalence of the use of 'keski', states: '...and, consequently in the Amrit-Parchaar at the Akal Takht Sahib, this was a precondition even for ladies before they could be baptized there. Any woman who was not prepared to wear Keskiwas not baptized. This practice continued even after the end of the Gurdwara movement. Relaxation was made only when Giani Gurmukh Singh Musafir became the Jathedar of the Akal Takht.'23 : Also those 13 reforms, Bhai Sahib probably only supported (not changed) about 2 of those, all the others were against gurmat and the reason bhai sahib went his own way and also why Bhasauria got excommunicated, whereas Bhai Sahib was given the Son-ChirRi of the panth and the only person to have been given hukamnaamay siropay from all the takhts. Slight difference.

When you take quotes from silly websites then obviously it makes you look like you have no idea what on earth you are on about. Here is a letter from Bhai Sahib when he returned from Jail during which Bhasaria was excomminctaed: After Bhai Sahib’s release, Babu Teja Singh tried to meet his old friend after twenty years and came to his house to resurrect their old friendship. Bhai Sahib was not there at that moment. When he came to know later of Babu Ji’s visit, Bhai Sahib wrote him a letter politely declining to meet him. The contents of the letter are very moving and reveal the true personality of Bhai Sahib and his unshakable and abiding faith in the Sikh tenets, values and traditions. It is therefore considered worthwhile to reproduce the English translation of the same below: “Babu Teja Singh ji, Waheguru ji ki Fateh. You, dear Sir, have come to see this humble servant of the Panth after one fifth of a century, i.e., 20 years. I was no less eager to have the chance of meeting with you and talking together. But I was deeply pained when I learnt that you have been excommunicated from the Panth by a congregation at Sri Akal Takht. What is even more distressing, you continue to disregard the authority of the Panth. It is now my request that you should be obedient to the Command of the Guru Panth and return to its shelter. Then we shall meet like brothers. It is my hope that you will accede to my request and thereby please the hearts of all of us. I am confident that you will not defy the Guru Panth and will abide by the tradition coming down through generations. Your sincere well wisher Randhir Singh” Thus, no personal relationship would deflect Bhai Sahib from obeying in letter and spirit the edicts of the Guru Panth issued from Sri Akal Takht Sahib (the Sikhs highest seat of authority). It is a misconception that Bhai Sahib was under the influence of Bhasauria. When Bhasuaria started doing manmant Bhai Sahib went his own way.

The statement says 'seems to be plausible', not just plausible but until such time the Panth doesn't make a decision, they will abide by whatever Akal takht decides. Akal takht has also said that people should do kintu and discuss such topics, but you are still doing so.. You have failed to answer any of my other questions properly and keep on getting hung up on this point.. The discussion is not going anywhere, I have am said all I have to say.. Vjkk vjkf!

Sure - if that makes sense to you. :D

Your hair is not something you need to keep, it is something that is already given to you by God when you are born. When you are baptised 5 kakkar are given to you, you cannot be given hair, as that you already have this. All the other kakkars are external items. Also, if you cut your hair after taking amirt, it is considered a bujjar kuhreit, where as if any other kakkars are separated from your body, it is not a bujjar kuhreit. So the question is why is hair treated differently to the others? Most of women in Taksal and Nihung dals also wear keski, but why they don;t believe in it as a kakkar, I don't know.

Yes I do. My point is that when people start interpreting things different ways, it causes rifts..

Prior to 1930/40s this was the rehat given in amrit sanchars at Akal takht, it was changed by the then Jathedar. This was same for women and men.