Sukhvirk1976

https://media.sikhnet.com/Bhai Avtar Singh - Mero Sundar Kaho Millo.mp3

I took a year out after uni and was in India for vasakhi 1999 when I came across bhai avtar Singh ragi. 

I first heard this during that time and it blew my mind

On 7/29/2021 at 2:37 PM, jkvlondon said:

I do believe that , remember he also was part of the team who hand built Akal Takht too

I thought you were being sarcastic lol 

On 7/26/2021 at 4:34 PM, jkvlondon said:

and of Course Baba Buddha ji trained Guru Har Gobind ji in shastra vidhiya

 

you don't believe that? 

On 1/19/2019 at 2:22 PM, puzzled said:

The most filthy site was this young white couple sitting on the bench right in the middle of our busy high street kissing each other, using their tongue and everything!  Being mainly a Asian town that is not a common site, it was very out of place and they looked like a pair of shameless pigs.

I wouldn't be surprised if some jihaadi guy went up to them and told them to stop.

 

It sounds like you could easily be that "jihadi guy" 

On 11/28/2019 at 5:16 PM, puzzled said:

It's disgusting 

Plus it's not modest   a sikh is supposed to be modest, openly sharing saliva in public is far from modest behaviour 

So you've seen sikh people with articles of faith properly snogging in public? 

1 hour ago, puzzled said:

I have    I saw this young singh from india with a dastar and long flowing dhari kissing his wife or gf while going up the escalator   I was going down the escalator while they were going up   he felt no shame  even when he saw me.

Iv seen regular punjabis kissing aswell   just saw one around 3 weeks at southall train station kissing a kali 

Why do you find it offensive? 

On 12/12/2018 at 12:28 AM, Guest PuzzledSingh said:

The most thing people find offence is seeing 2 gay men kissing in public.

 

As i saw 2 men at it in public touching each other i secertly watched it and liked it a lot seeing them !!!

Why do you find it offensive? 

On 12/11/2018 at 8:26 AM, puzzled said:

What's your view on sikhs kissing in public? Is it acceptable or not?  Is there anything in sikhi which indicates it's wrong to do that?

I personally wouldn't do that, iv had a traditional upbringing and that the way I am. 

But is it right or wrong? 

I've never seen any Sikhs kiss in public? Have you actually ever seen it? Or is it a hypothetical question? 

1 hour ago, Big_Tera said:

Yep I also noticed that alot of people mistakenly think that Sikhism is in someway influenced by Hinduism and Islam when in reality it is a unique religion.  

Had this ignorant old guy say he thought Sikhism comes from Hinduism and Islam by combing the two. 

It does employ the lingua franca of both those religions.. But is Tisarpanth 

4 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

I'm still wondering about people's notion of 'Panjabi culture'. The way some people are talking is like it has been some generally stable thing for milenia. Is that true?

Didn't all the fluxes due to changes in leadership (Moghul rule, British rule, previous eras where Buddhism must have been an influence on the region) cause changes to the culture. Is culture ever a static thing or something that changes through various influences both external and internal? 

Also, as regards to culture in Panjab, how did this differ across regions and we all know different jaats have different practices and norms too. 

Are we in danger of idealing the past, and creating a vision as a prop to help us through rapidly changing and often confusing times?  

 

Culture is never static. But it can have characteristics. So it could be said panjabi culture is inherently pluralistic

On 2/23/2019 at 2:59 PM, mahandulai said:

smashed it bro, 100 percent,  correct

sat meaning what tho?

If something is 'Sat' it is 'True'. Truth is its fundamental characteristic

On 2/23/2019 at 5:21 PM, dallysingh101 said:

Do you never think that you might be missing important aspects of it because of translation issues? 

Of course I do.

If it was in Gurmukhi I would still be missing important aspects.. As a student I would always strive to learn and never assume that I have learnt everything that my teacher is teaching me.. Otherwise they would cease being my teacher. 

As a Sikh I believe that the pursuit of 'truth / Sat' is my duty. 

If I am a sikh and have taken a 'teacher / Guru' (Guru Granth Sahib) then I as a true student and seeker of truth, I shouldn't be so arrogant as to think I have arrived at the truth.

 if something is contradictory then by definition it is illogical. Which means I must question and seek the truth. It means I yet to fully understand what my guru is teaching me. 

On 2/21/2019 at 5:53 AM, Akalifauj said:

Anyone coming to Sikhi whether from another religion or race or country brings a lot of baggage.   And they don't want to let go of that baggage.   Just look at 3ho white Sikhs.  They have made a mockery of Gurbani.  They get together on certain dates and dance while Gurbani is being played.  The organizers step up the platform for this disrespect to continue every year.  They encourage their white culture as the bread and butter of Sikhi.  Culture of Sikhi is tied in with punjab.  Yet these other people who claim to be Sikh want to change sikhi culture because then they can have relationships outside of marriage with the opposite sex.  They can go to their beach days in a bikini and see nothing wrong with it.  Because they will say, the Guru never says you cant expose yourself.  White, western culture will never be compatible with Sikhi.  

 

Lol  

On 2/22/2019 at 12:24 AM, Guest guest said:

 

the word illogical is not the opposite of logical.

Mool Mantar /Gurbani is neither logical nor illogical.  There isn't some binary necessity to ascribe it (or anything else)  to either category.  

For example- is a famous person's biography logical? no. then is it illogical?  no.   its neither of those.  what about a famous poem.  is it logical? no.  is it illogical? no.  It's not necessary for everything to either be one or the other category.  

by the way, you're one that claimed Gurbani " is logical", then turned around and said "it is beyond logic"

keep nitpicking to detract from the argument.

Gurbani is perfectly logical.. It may appear to some that it is like some existential poetry expression. Except gurbani is unique because it is not reductive.. It expresses existential, philosophical truths whilst at the same time being absolutely clear in its expression. Any phrase someone could take from bani is true and I have yet to see a example that is not logical 

On 2/22/2019 at 12:24 AM, Guest guest said:

 

the word illogical is not the opposite of logical.

Mool Mantar /Gurbani is neither logical nor illogical.  There isn't some binary necessity to ascribe it (or anything else)  to either category.  

For example- is a famous person's biography logical? no. then is it illogical?  no.   its neither of those.  what about a famous poem.  is it logical? no.  is it illogical? no.  It's not necessary for everything to either be one or the other category.  

by the way, you're one that claimed Gurbani " is logical", then turned around and said "it is beyond logic"

keep nitpicking to detract from the argument.

Well. First of all I asked a question. Is Mool mantar illogical? 

You make a very simple mistake however in interpreting and applying rules of grammar and semantics to the word logical and what you view as it's apparent binary opposite... Truth is always logical.. Logical can accept seemingly contradictory concepts.. I.e non-dualism is logical.. Because it is 'Sat'. But if something is illogical it can never be sat because it is not a complete truth.. 

It is interesting that you refer to a poem because nature of poetry is elusive and can be relative and therefore express a truth and be Sat. 

Why do you think bani is in poetic form and set to music..? 

3 hours ago, Guest guest said:

i suggest you look up the word 'logical'.  i don't think you understand its correct meaning.

Mool Mantar is not a 'logical statement'.  Logical means building up one statement on another.  For example:   

• All trees have trunks. An oak tree is a tree. Therefore...the oak tree has a trunk.
• https://examples.yourdictionary.com/examples-of-logic.html

Mool Mantra is not a set of prepositions that lead to some kind of inference.  And the last line of Mool Mantra is 'Gur Prasadi'!

I am not saying Gurbani is 'illogical'.  

Your last statement is really beautiful, but you are the one who claimed logic.  Now you are saying it transcends logic.  So you are just changing your position in order to justify your own views.

 

In one post you have managed to say Mool mantar is not a logical statement whilst at the same time say gurbani is not illogical.. 

Simple question.. 

Is Mool mantar illogical? 

3 hours ago, Guest guest said:

i suggest you look up the word 'logical'.  i don't think you understand its correct meaning.

Mool Mantar is not a 'logical statement'.  Logical means building up one statement on another.  For example:   

• All trees have trunks. An oak tree is a tree. Therefore...the oak tree has a trunk.
• https://examples.yourdictionary.com/examples-of-logic.html

Mool Mantra is not a set of prepositions that lead to some kind of inference.  And the last line of Mool Mantra is 'Gur Prasadi'!

I am not saying Gurbani is 'illogical'.  

Your last statement is really beautiful, but you are the one who claimed logic.  Now you are saying it transcends logic.  So you are just changing your position in order to justify your own views.

 

I think you should expand your horizons.

Are you suggesting Mool mantar is not logical? 

On 2/18/2019 at 12:57 AM, Guest guest said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance

so theres no evidence you shouldn't smoke or drink alcohol in the Gurdwara.  Why don't you go try it on that basis?  See the degenerate nature of you line of 'reasoning'?  

Gurbani is not based on logic.  It is not written as a logical treatise.  It is based on revealation (Gur Prasad/ Dhur Ki Bani).

Logic (Nyaya) is one of the 'six schools (of philosophy)' which is referred to in Gurbani.

 

Gurbani is not logical.. 

Please let me refer you to mul mantar.. 

It is logical in every way possible.. 

Also if it not logical then are you suggesting it is illogical..? 

Nyaya maybe one of the six schools.. But have you considered that bani is unique because it encompasses and transcends any one truth.. It demonstrates the limitations of any one school and goes to the essence.. 

5 minutes ago, dallysingh101 said:

Well, you're the one constantly ranting like they know everything. What can anyone teach you? You know it all already! You're so magical, you can fathom out all of Gurbani without even needing to learn Gurmukhi!

You know all about the historical Sikh codes of conduct, without even reading about them!

You're either a brahm-giani who has access to the highest spiritual knowledge via mystical routes or you're a complete <banned word filter activated> whose unaware of his own limitations. I'm not sure which one of these you are just yet. 

 

Give me a bit of time before I draw a conclusion......

I haven't made any claims. Please demonstrate where I have? 

7 hours ago, dallysingh101 said:

Please make some sort of decent effort to research before you run your mouth off like some expert. 

Since you are the expert maybe you can enlighten us

On 2/14/2019 at 4:03 PM, dallysingh101 said:

This might be a misconception on your part. There is plenty of evidence in extant rehat-namas that suggest the preference was for Sikhs to marry Sikhs. 

And when you talk of pluralism, you seem to wash away the fact that the panth does have a whole host of demarcations that mark it off as separate from other communities. 

I'm not saying that marriages across dharams never took place, but it's not right to say that it was some sort of free for all in the name of pluralism. That's the reality of it. When they did take place it was usually down to compulsion (unavailability of Sikh brides in say Hazur Sahib) or derived of political machinations or personal whims like some of M. Ranjit Singh's marriages. 

No one suggested free for all. 

Your assertion does require some qualification though, first of all a definition of sikh is required, then evidence of said rehat namas. 

You may very well be right and I broadly agree I just don't think the evidence stacks up for it to be conclusive 

On 2/14/2019 at 4:03 PM, dallysingh101 said:

This might be a misconception on your part. There is plenty of evidence in extant rehat-namas that suggest the preference was for Sikhs to marry Sikhs. 

And when you talk of pluralism, you seem to wash away the fact that the panth does have a whole host of demarcations that mark it off as separate from other communities. 

I'm not saying that marriages across dharams never took place, but it's not right to say that it was some sort of free for all in the name of pluralism. That's the reality of it. When they did take place it was usually down to compulsion (unavailability of Sikh brides in say Hazur Sahib) or derived of political machinations or personal whims like some of M. Ranjit Singh's marriages. 

Please provide evidence 

On 2/15/2019 at 1:05 AM, Guest guest said:

you clearly have no idea about the basics of logic.  not trying to be funny, but maybe you should read a book about it?

for example.  there is scant evidence that sikhs are not meant to worship fairies.  Shall we start worshipping faiires?

Err. Before giving it the big intellectual challenge maybe you should read up and learn about how logical thinking and critical thought works.. "There is scant evidence that sikhs are not meant to worship fairies." doesn't mean that we should start worshipping fairies. It just means that until you provide evidence that we shouldn't you can't say that we can't.. 

You need to learn about the laws of logic. Gurbani is based on logic. Before you give it the big un at least come correct.. 

Joker lol  

On 2/15/2019 at 1:00 AM, Guest guest said:

if your ancestors did that, you wouldn't be sikh.  race=culture=history=transmission of religion.  if you dilute it then what?

'Sikhs' choose to marry 'Sikhs'.  e.g. to give a silly example, you're not going to chose to marry a Capitalist if you are a Marxist.

you probably think sikhism is just a slogan.   you have no idea about walking the walk.

You choose to be skin deep 

On 2/15/2019 at 1:05 AM, Guest guest said:

you clearly have no idea about the basics of logic.  not trying to be funny, but maybe you should read a book about it?

for example.  there is scant evidence that sikhs are not meant to worship fairies.  Shall we start worshipping faiires?

Just show me the evidence. Otherwise you are just being hyperbolic