Mindless

Any italian Sikhs on this board??(or if you know anyone who lives in italy)...please message me!! Thanks

vaheguru, is anyone on this forum from Italy, or have gursikh contacts in Italy... If so, please please PM me, I need some important information Thnaks

http://www.damdamitaksaal.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=80&Itemid=68&limitstart=22 ^ Above is a link to the maryada according to Taksaal. From personal experience, ramming the Chaupai Sahibs have helped. They give you the strength to deal with it, aswell as emotionally support others. Salok Muhalla 9 helps detach oneself. All Gurbani is equal really, just ram the bani, katha and uplifting keertan. Sometimes its not always easy to just sit and listen to the Sehaj Paat, due to family/friends being around and offering their condolences/serving refreshments e.c.t, so as a tip, you can keep a cd playing on loop, with Sukhmani Sahib/Any Bani, so there is atleast some sort of jaap going on. Cos not everyone will come over with the same mindset. Salok: kabeeraa marathaa marathaa jag muaa mar bh n jaanai koe || Kabeer, the world is dying - dying to death, but no one knows how to truly die. aisee maranee jo marai bahur n maranaa hoe ||1|| Whoever dies, let him die such a death, that he does not have to die again. ||1|| Most importantly.. do ardaas and ask maharaj for the ability for you and the family to accept bhana and live in hukam.

Kaur's Kamai camp begins tomorrow!! If you have not registered, you are more then welcome to participate and take lahaa during the day!!

FINAL DAY for Kaur's Kami camp registration!!! Apply online at www.boss-uk.org

Two days remaining untill the Kaur's Kamai camp registration deadline!! Apply online at www.boss-uk.org This is a golden opportunity for bibiya to get together, have sangat of like-minded gursikhs and focus purley on Maharaj without any worldy distractions.. Dont miss out jee! A photograph from a previous Kamai camp, during a workshop on learning how to do Maharajs Seva/Bishaaee

beautifully said/written

Three days till Kaur's Kamai camp registration deadline!! Places are filling up fast!! visit www.boss-uk.org to confirm your place

Some pictures from previous singhnia kamai camps

A chance to experience a more focused approach to being a camper! Over the last few years there have been many camps and workshops addressing needs of younger children and newcomers into sikhi however a gap has always existed in regards to developing the spirituality and motivation towards spiritual effort for practising amritdhaaris. Seeing this gap sevadaars sought to address it by taking inspiration from Sant Baba Harnam Singh Rampur Khere wale’s Naam Abhiaas Kamai smagams which are still being held to this day in India. Albeit slightly modified, several camps have taken place in and around the Uk with the motivation and optimism of sevadaars around the UK. Now we hope to make this a regular occurrence. So what can you expect: - Collective Amrit Vela ishnaan and Parkash darshan - Personal Nitnem and collective sangat time - Simple Langar and sleeping arrangements - Personal Challenge - Hukamnama Veechar of Mahapurkh recordings - Also your personal requirements added in - A quick energiser which will keep you going for months - Sangat of like minded practising Gursikhs - A chance to just focus on naam bani,veechar and sangat without distractions - Separate Singh/ Singhni camps. If you are interested please fill out the form at the boss website asap! Places are limited and it is strictly first come first served. We will email you a campers pack and a list of what essentials to bring when you have a place confirmed. There is no cost for this camp although donations are always welcome for future initiatives. Singhnia Camp is on the 28th to 30th January 2011 Closing date for application is Fri 21st January 2011 Singhs camp is 4th to 6th February 2011. Closing date for application is 28th January 2011 Both begin at evening times so that it bodes well with people travelling from home towns. The camps will take place at Leicester Guru Tegh Bahadur Gurdwara. Any questions pls contact 07882 340954 Strictly over 18’s only. Visit www.boss-uk.org to apply! Keertan from the second Kaur's Kamai camp that took place in Leicester

yes there are! this is taken from the boss website... What can you expect from the Kamai camp A chance to experience a more focused approach to being a camper! Over the last few years there have been many camps and workshops addressing needs of younger children and newcomers into sikhi however a gap has always existed in regards to developing the spirituality and motivation towards spiritual effort for practising amritdhaaris. Seeing this gap sevadaars sought to address it by taking inspiration from Sant Baba Harnam Singh Rampur Khere wale’s Naam Abhiaas Kamai smagams which are still being held to this day in India. Albeit slightly modified, several camps have taken place in and around the Uk with the motivation and optimism of sevadaars around the UK. Now we hope to make this a regular occurrence. So what can you expect: Collective Amrit Vela ishnaan and Parkash darshan Personal Nitnem and collective sangat time Simple Langar and sleeping arrangements Personal Challenge Hukamnama Veechar of Mahapurkh recordings Also your personal requirements added in A quick energiser which will keep you going for months Sangat of like minded practising Gursikhs A chance to just focus on naam bani,veechar and sangat without distractions Separate Singh/ Singhni camps. If you are interested please fill out the form at the boss website asap! Places are limited and it is strictly first come first served. We will email you a campers pack and a list of what essentials to bring when you have a place confirmed. There is no cost for this camp although donations are always welcome for future initiatives. Closing date for Singhnia camp is Fri 21st January 2011 Singhnia Camp is on the 28th to 30th January 2011 Closing date for Singhs Camp is 28th January 2011 Singhs camp is 4th to 6th February 2011. Both begin at evening times so that it bodes well with people travelling from home towns. The camps will take place at Leicester Guru Tegh Bahadur Gurdwara. Any questions pls contact 07882 340954 Strictly over 18’s only. You can apply free on the boss website : www.boss-uk.org cnt wait!! :D

beautiful stuff paji!! there is so much energy in your style!! In our city (in england) we have open exhibitions where locals can put up their work and promote themselves as artists..you might have one at your own city gallery..? really encouraging to see more sikhs exploring visual expression!! (its a great meduim for parchaar!)

my dear paji, keeping kes, refraining from meat, alcohol, drugs, and relationships, are not restrictions ...they are common sence these are disciplines and TOOLS, rather then just 'rules' to HELP us acheive union with mahraj. e.g not drinking alochol keeps a clear and alert mind, so we can keep focus on naam before making the big decision, make sure it is a well and informed one, so i implore you to fully study/meditate on the essence of sikhi/truth, which is moolmantar. In reference to ' i will look alot better with my hair cut'.... alot better for who? Its important to keep asking yourself why you are doing something in order to get to the root of it. Most of the time the root will be the existence of your 'self' as a seperate being, which is exactly what we should be trying to overcome guaranteed, that once you take a closer look at this very rare and beautiful jewel of sikhi, it will be completely impossible for you to turn away, nothing else will seem as sweet Maharaj has done much kirpa to bless you with enough pyaar to atleast question what you are doing, so let that pyaar grow, through seva, sangat and simran please do ardaas to ask for the ability to understand the importance of kes, and the rest is up to maharaj : ) hope that all goes well

I've heard many times that, sri dasam granth is bir rassi, and guru granth sahib jee is shaant rassi

bump

-amrit sanchaar is at 10am -I'm sure there will be lots of nice people to show you where it is exactly -if your a Singh, usually they make you take your trousers off, so you might feel more comfortable wearing a longer top..? aslong as the clothes are clean, fresh and modest, it shouldnt really matter what you wear specifically. Some gursikhs would advise that if you've been for a number one(a pee) then you should wash your hands, face, feet, and avoid wearing the same clothes. If you've been for a number 2(a poo) then you should take full ishnaan again, and fresh clothes(if you wore them while pooing). But this is purley up to personal sharda and maryada(i think) Make sure you have full isnaan, i.e : kesh If you tie a dastaar, try and leave a little flap at the top, so your kesh are easily accessible And enjoy the beheading wedding apologies for any mis-information, dont hesistate to contact one of the gursikhs on the barsi poster, they would be happy to help!

i'm not going to go and quote e.c.t, ..but skimming through the thread, some quick points to comment on : the kirpan IS a practical thing, which SHOULD be sharpened and known how to use the kirpan on a practical and symbolic basis serves humanity, stands up and defends the rights of other and oneself e.c.t When gurusahib blessed us with the kirpan, at the time, no-one else except the oppressive rulers were allowed to carry weapons and so on. Maharaj broke that and demonstrated that EVERY person has the right to defend oneslef and others, on a physical, mental and spiritual basis, its almost a symbol of freedom too, i guess, and also, ALWAYS bring ready The kirpan is a beautiful blessing given to us by gurusahib, and its ashame that we are so restricted these days. In the days of gurusahib (tho these are the days of Gurusahib still) even tho sikhs were not 'legally' permitted to carry shastr by the rulers, alongside other things like horses and playing saaj e.c.t, but they still did, they stood above any form of oppression. we are not free, yet we are made to believe so major apologies I hope gurusahib does awnser the question for kphull, apologies for rambling, or being offtrak or any further confusion e.c.t

I used to ask the same question. I think its more the word 'meditate' or 'appreciation' rather then praise, which can sometimes be a little misleading. Its meditating on the nature of God, the fact that God is EVERYTHING, the pencil, the paper, the leaves, the pineapple,- sab gobind hai sab gobind hai, gobind bin nehee koi, - (everything is maharaj, everything is maharaj, there is nothing that is not) and aiming for that goal, to merge into that one-ness too, to rid of any concept of yourself. If we dont meditate on that essential nature, then we'll never really be able to reach that frame of mind. Thats why Maharaj has so beautifully gifted us with Gurbani, literally its themself in written form, to be listenened to, understood, accepted and eventually lived. Maharaj says: anal agam jaisae lehar mai oudhadh jal keaval jal maahee The wind may rise huge waves in the vast ocan, but they are just water and water In this case, our sence of self, our ego can be compared to the wind, which gives us that false sence of identity and duality. e.g My names so and so, I have this and so, I am a seperate entity. Those beautiful souls, who have given their heads completely, Maharaj says in Rehraas Sahib, 'Har harjan duo eek hai bib bichaar kach nahe'- Maharaj and their devotee/slave are one, there is no differnce between them. Major apologies for any misquotes or anything really, translations never do justice, may Maharaj do soo much kirpa that we may understand and experience Gurbani firsthand

Penji you can use knickers/boxers e.c.t underneath your kashera, to stick your pads on

Soho road gurughar, Birmingham (not sure what its called) 21st June, this sunday I think its held every month, on the following sunday after sangraand

Theres an excellent response to this topic on a gursikhs blogs >> http://everydaysikhee.blogspot.com/2008/12...osexuality.html but i will paste it all on here anyway, cos its just that great!, its quite a long read, but worth it. "There I was sitting with a Christian and a homosexual (now that's what I call an opening line!). The Christian seemed as though she wanted to like the homosexual but openly admitted she found it hard to accept him. Her opinion which metamorphosed into an argument and then fizzled away, seemingly due to the fact she didn’t want to offend him, was that we choose our destiny and although God is The Architect of Destiny, it is we who ultimately play the leading part. We either walk the 'blessed route’ before us or we transgress and take an alternative route of our own choice. I told them that my belief is that ultimately everything is according to Hukam (Divine Will / Cosmic Order) - that ultimately we are unable to decide who is good and who is bad because The One Light resides in all. But am I saying homosexuality should be promoted amongst Sikhs? No. He was trying to encourage her to overlook this aspect of his personality given that it troubled her, and to realise that his sexuality does not totally define him as a human-being. He explained that there are parts of one another, be it views, attitudes or lifestyle, that we all find hard to accept. I agreed with him. Am I saying homosexuality should be promoted amongst Sikhs? No. So what am I saying? Well, let’s let the threads of this post unravel some more… The subject of homosexuality comes-up very often when one talks of religion or spirituality; usually it is seen as beyond the pale; something to be despised and hated. Even in these politically-correct times, many religious leaders brazenly speak their minds regarding the subject, thereby illustrating how an anti-homosexual standpoint is readily accepted by much of the population. Earlier today, the Pope attracted the anger of the gay community after he described homosexuality as being equivalent in terms of gravity to the fate facing our environment. Gays haven't just started to become a problem that needs sorting - The Old Testament which guides Jews and Christians talks of homosexuals being killed by God and a whole village being destroyed due to the ‘abnormal behaviour’ of its gay inhabitants. The Pope alluded to this proposition, that homosexuality is an act against nature, when suggesting that humanity should take its cues from nature. The problem is that it doesn’t seem Mother Nature can be relied upon to support The Pope. Elephants, flamingos and salmon are just some of the animals that have been known to exhibit homosexual behaviour. Are we going to argue that nature is unnatural? Various Islamic sources demand that Muslims should kill homosexuals. P.s. If you’re gay and live in Iran, I think it’s best you move-out very soon. Even if you live in a predominately Christian or Jewish area, be careful – some of them may believe that you should be put to death as per Old Testament Law. It is astonishing how directly homosexuality has been addressed by the major religions and the manner in which the appropriate punishment has been declared - no political-correctness here! So what does GurbaaNee, The Satguroo, teach us regarding homosexuality? Homosexuality is not directly dealt with by The Satguroo anywhere within GurbaaNee. The reason being that The Satguroo deals with the root issue - not the trunk, branches, twigs, leaves or fruit. Always remember that The Satguroo addresses the source, not the implications or extensions of a given issue. This is why The Satguroo does not provide us with a great big list of do’s and don’ts. There is no need to shoot the little space-ships if you cancel-out the mother-ship! Deal with the essence and the rest automatically gets taken care of. Lust (kaam) is an essential urge which drives the world to hunger for the most fleeting of physical pleasures, no matter how badly this pursuit compromises us. It’s one of the five thieves (panj choor) which constantly rob us of our spiritual equipoise. These are the five overarching tendencies which separate us from merger with Vaheguroo, from Enlightenment: lust (kaam), anger (krodh), greed (lobh), attachment (moh) and ego (ahankaar). Interestingly, lust is often described by gursikhs as the most powerful: ਹੇਕਾਮੰਨਰਕਬਿਸ੍ਰਾਮੰਬਹੁਜੋਨੀਭ੍ਰਮਾਵਣਹ ॥ hae kaama(n) narak bisraama(n) bahu jonee bhramaavaneh O sexual desire, you lead the mortals to hell; you make them wander in reincarnation through countless species. ਚਿਤਹਰਣੰਤ੍ਰੈਲੋਕਗੰਮ੍ਹੰਜਪਤਪਸੀਲਬਿਦਾਰਣਹ ॥ chith harana(n) thrai lok ga(n)mya(n) jap thap seel bidhaaraneh You cheat the consciousness, and pervade the three worlds. You destroy meditation, penance and virtue. ਅਲਪਸੁਖਅਵਿਤਚੰਚਲਊਚਨੀਚਸਮਾਵਣਹ ॥ alap sukh avith cha(n)chal ooch neech samaavaneh But you give only shallow pleasure, while you make the mortals weak and unsteady; you pervade the high and the low. Ang 1358 But what of the vast majority of us, heterosexuals, homosexuals and bisexuals who live our lives as single, boyfriends, girlfriends and spouses? Is lust something which we’ve managed to control and normalise through these relationships, these social constructs? Have we somehow assimilated lust into our lives and thereby controlled it or contained it? Can we lead a spiritual life whilst indulging in it or even just actively thinking about it? The first thing to note is that lust even impacts upon those who do not partake in it – and most probably, to a greater extent. Remember it’s not just an action – it’s a thought-process. Even if we try to actively suppress it, it festers away, merely pushed out of sight...always using it’s down-time to make itself more and more stronger. Even the celibates and the renunciates who walked away from it found it burning in their hearts, like an ember ready to be reignited at the behest of even the slightest breeze. The second thing to note is that according to The Satguroo’s Teachings, lust can only be overcome when one has merged with The One who is beyond all desires. In order to help us realise this lofty objective, The Satguroo has promoted grishtee-jeevan (a householder’s lifestyle), which revolves around a married heterosexual couple who have children, work for a living and advance spiritually. This enables Sikhs to slowly begin the process of neutralising lust by focussing it upon only one individual, in a stable, controlled and mature set of circumstances. Bhai Gurdaas Jee describes this philosophy thus: ਏਕਾ ਨਾਰੀ ਜਤੀ ਹੋਇ ਪਰ ਨਾਰੀ ਧੀ ਭੈਣ ਵਖਾਣੈ॥ eaekaa naaree jathee hoe par naaree dhee bhain vakhaanai Having one women as wife he (the Sikh) is a celibate and considers any other's wife his daughter or a sister. Panna 6 - Bhai Gurdaas Jee’s Vaaraa(n) What about having partners outside of marriage? Well they introduce instability, they chop and change and come and go. That’s perfect fodder for lust, which will simply envelop us more, thanks to such unstable circumstances - ever heard of 'rebound relationships' where people just sleep with someone to get over breaking-up with someone else? So as far as sexual relationships go, it's clear that for sikhs they should only exist within a marriage. There have been some very prominent and very spiritual gursikhs who did not marry e.g. Bhai Gurdaas Jee, Sant Attar Singh Jee, Baba Nand Singh Jee etc. The common factor between them is that they were very committed gursikhs who had been blessed with major responsibilities by The Satguroo, and had decided to focus upon a life of intense spiritual practice and selfless service. They represent the exception, not the rule. Despite effectively being celibate, Baba Nand Singh is reputed to have said that the fruits of naam simran (meditation upon Vaheguroo) achieved by a celibate person in 11 years are achieved by a married person in one day. I think he was trying to explain that by being married, and still focussing upon Vaheguroo, an individual is rewarded greatly and finds it easier to negotiate the pitfalls that lust throws in front of them. It’s as though they take the more difficult option and still succeed. As such the married person, if they are blessed, will come to realise that the sexual act between a man and woman is simply to produce children, to procreate, and that the illusion of separateness, of ego, of maya (illusion), previously led them to accept lust as love. A person cannot harmonise with Vaheguroo until they discard all the temporary pleasures of lust, delicious foods, the latest fashions etc. The Satguroo makes clear that until these ‘tastes’, these pleasures, are relinquished, the spiritually-saturated taste of Naam and it’s amazing properties (which is a whole other ball-park!) cannot be savoured: ਪ੍ਰੀਤਿਬਿਨਾਕੈਸੇਬਧੈਸਨੇਹੁ ॥ preeth binaa kaisae badhai sanaehu Without love, how can one's affection increase? ਜਬਲਗੁਰਸੁਤਬਲਗੁਨਹੀਨੇਹੁ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ jab lag ras thab lag nehee naehu 1 rehaao As long as there is attachment to pleasure, there can be no spiritual love. 1Pause Ang 328 So where does that leave those brothers and sisters of ours who are homosexual and wish to have a sexual relationship within marriage? Well, with a big problem because such a relationship does not have the potential to lead to a realisation that lust is only non-destructive when it comes to reproduction – their sexual act will always be for physical pleasure. They cannot have an anand kaaraj (become married in the eyes of The Satguroo) because as the laavaa(n) (related verses) make clear the aim of the anand kaaraj is to merge with Vaheguroo and this cannot be achieved by people who enter the institution of marriage knowing that their forthcoming relationship will not ultimately enable them to realise that lust's only useful purpose is procreation. The laavaa(n) depict the stages that the gursikh spiritualist passes through and culminate by describing the point at which merger with Vaheguroo, their True Husband, occurs. These verses are actually using the male/female metaphor that the institution of marriage affords in order to remind those soul-brides (suhaagan) entering marriage to understand who their real spouse actually is and in doing so, indirectly highlight that this new relationship which will most probably have a sexual component is not the True Union that the soul (atma) actually hungers for. The relationship between two physical bodies will always remain impermanent as opposed to the relationship between the soul-bride and her Eternal Husband (us and Vaheguroo). Here's how the laavaa(n) end: ਹਰਿਪ੍ਰਭਿਠਾਕੁਰਿਕਾਜੁਰਚਾਇਆਧਨਹਿਰਦੈਨਾਮਿਵਿਗਾਸੀ ॥ har prabh thaakur kaaj rachaaeiaa dhan hiradhai naam vigaasee The Lord God, my Lord and Master, blends with His bride, and her heart blossoms forth in the Naam. ਜਨੁਨਾਨਕੁਬੋਲੇਚਉਥੀਲਾਵੈਹਰਿਪਾਇਆਪ੍ਰਭੁਅਵਿਨਾਸੀ ॥੪॥੨॥ an naanak bolae chouthee laavai har paaeiaa prabh avinaasee 42 Servant Nanak proclaims that, in this, the fourth round of the marriage ceremony, we have found the Eternal Lord God. 42 Ang 774 Just like the heterosexual who thinks that lust has been mastered through marriage, the homosexual will also miss the truth. However for the heterosexual married person, if they are blessed with Perfect Destiny, there is the potential for lust to be defeated. The pleasure it affords will seem pale and insignificant, it will seem insipid, compared to the True Pleasure that meditation upon Vaheguroo affords. So let’s go and tell all our misguided brothers and sisters to stop being gay and to marry a member of the opposite sex and progress spiritually via grishtee-jeevan right? Well perhaps it isn’t as simple as that. Many scientists believe that homosexuality is related to one’s genetic disposition and is not a learned behaviour. In other words gays are born that way. So how can someone who feels they cannot stop being gay start to live according to The Satguroo’s teachings? Every single one of our tendencies and behaviour patterns are related to our previous actions and current actions; our karam. If people are born as homosexuals then this is simply their destiny – their previous actions, whatever they were, have led to this. We are all in the same boat. We have taken birth because the account of our previous actions meant that we were not spiritually-capable of merging into Vaheguroo. If your homosexuality is something which cannot be changed, and you feel unable to marry a member of the opposite sex, then you would have to remain celibate – easier said than done I know, but the only logical approach. Such a person who masters lust, regardless of their ‘sexual orientation, would surely merge into Vaheguroo, The Desire-less: ਆਸਾਮਨਸਾਸਗਲਤਿਆਗੈਜਗਤੇਰਹੈਨਿਰਾਸਾ ॥ aasaa manasaa sagal thiaagai jag thae rehai niraasaa who renounces all hopes and desires and remains desireless in the world; ਕਾਮੁਕ੍ਰੋਧੁਜਿਹਪਰਸੈਨਾਹਨਿਤਿਹਘਟਿਬ੍ਰਹਮੁਨਿਵਾਸਾ ॥੨॥ kaam krodh jih parasai naahan thih ghatt breham nivaasaa 2 who is not touched by sexual desire or anger - within his heart, Vaheguroo dwells. 2 Ang 633 Sikhee is a Path which points us towards the absolute pinnacle of spiritual realisation so naturally it’s a given that it will not be successfully traversed by many. Those who master lust, the gurmukhs that The Satguroo often talks about, are very rare. Perhaps one amongst thousands or even tens of thousands. And just in case you are wondering, I am certainly not one of them. I do not speak on behalf of other sikhs, let alone The Satguroo. I know that many gursikhs will probably not share my views. But that is fine, because we must all treat our conversation with The Satguroo as something special and unique. What I will say is that there is certainly no need to stone or kill homosexuals, there is no need to hate, avoid or reject them or tell them that Vaheguroo is their enemy. There is no need to keep thinking about their sexual persuasion when we talk, laugh and spend time with them, when we shake their hand or bump into them. A gursikh could never indulge in any such destructive behaviour - quite the opposite in fact: ਸਭਨਾਮਨਮਾਣਿਕਠਾਹਣੁਮੂਲਿਮਚਾਂਗਵਾ ॥ sabhanaa man maanik thaahan mool machaagavaa The minds of all are like precious jewels; to harm them is not good at all. ਜੇਤਉਪਿਰੀਆਦੀਸਿਕਹਿਆਉਨਠਾਹੇਕਹੀਦਾ ॥੧੩੦॥ jae tho pireeaa dhee sik hiaao n thaahae kehee dhaa 130 If you desire your Beloved, then do not break anyone's heart. 130 Ang 1384 So let’s end on this note - the fact that no matter what someone’s sexual persuasion, GurbaaNee does not advocate any kind of judgement, hatred or punishment. We are commanded to love all unconditionally. Neither should we brutishly force our interpretations of GurbaaNee upon others - when requested or sincerely motivated, we should simply assist anyone and everyone to make their own direct connection with The Satguroo, and to find Spiritual Truth themselves." ( ( ( :- ) >>> Atma Singh

Alot of facts have been mixed up, so please be careful

..could it also be looked at as.. naam..= naa(no) meh(me) so naam is the moment when you are not present as yourself, as a seperate entity, but when 'your conscience' is 'present' in a moment of complete one-ness with everything, absorbed completely into the beauty of waheguru ji, nothing else. so the constant practice of this, would hopefully lead to a permanent state of this ultimate bliss, (brahmgyaan) ??