hawk13

Bro control ur self even I get litle rough with u if I hurt ur feelings I also appologises for this despite having socalled extreme views I as a most humble sikh never likes to hurt anybody feelings including u I want to have healty debate.Sometimes u have different point of view u have full liberty to have it.Now I come to ur question relevance of materialist in this debate as u see sikhi in modern perception in today times this is age of matrerialist or selfish age,That is why u find my posts about sikhi or glory of sikh history as just like a comic story and this word looks offending to other members on this forum and to me this is not ur fault because u see it from modern point of view which is purely society selfish way .During the times of Gurus and Khalsa rule and Gurus situation was even worse for example Aurangjeb wanted to convert hindus to Islam never intended to convert sikhs this was evident from the conversation between Emperor and Guru Tegh Bahadur ji when Guru ji was arrested for the first time and freed before Assam operations of Mughals Mughals were convinced that there is no basic differnce between the muslims and sikhism but When Guru ji took up the cause of hindus he asked the Guru ji u do not believe in idol worship like the muslims and these very Brahmins tried to force ur Guru Nanak to wear janue why r u suppoting them The Guru ji replied they were at that time wrong they tried force and now u r using force u both r wrong .In fact first armed attack on sikhi took place during Guru Amardass ji when armed fanatic sadhus fired at a boat mistaking it to be of sikhs but in fact it was the part of convoy of Emperor Akbar which led to strong retailiation from Mughals againist the sadhus.U will be surprised to know that it was the brahmins who made a written complaint to Akbar againist Guru Amardass and then againist Guru Ramdass ji but Akbar wanted to verify himself that is why he visited Gobindwal shaiab twice and rejected the complaint of Brahmins..As sikhism is againist the intolerance during Akbar time Birbal was the biggest enemy of sikhs although he was the most immoral person and used to have physical relations with his own daughter for this he was totaly boycotted other nobles.U may say it is relevant in this but just for ur knowledge Iam unfolding some unknown facts of history if u r not feeling uneasy I will post more if u want and r not feeling bore.

She represents the true thinking of sikhi .She at such tender age is true kid of Guru ji . Those dicarding sikhi should learn from this brave kaur it shows true sikhi still exists and will remain so ever.

U r attacking personaly ur self did I post any personal comments or taunts but u r like self styled scholar or realist person when u fails in reason u tends to attack personaly by this u r just fooling ur self. U have a materialist thinking which is called faith of conviance not of conviction which changes colors according to situation this is bitter truth,

Due to some problem in my computer some words r missed .I regret this problem many words may be missing.

Bro as a sikh u have to be proud of ur history but ur forgetting one thing there r devoted sikhs a lot of them but Indian state never allows these people to emerge they r framed in false cases or r killed .Iam telling u some examples take the example of Sant Jarnail Singh,Jagdev Singh Khudian,Bimal Khalsa,Avtatr Singh of Jammu Gurjit Singh Kaka of 80s and 90s, Just recently long detention OF Bhai Daljit Singh Bittu,Pala Singh,jASWINDER sINGH A VERY INTELLIGENT YOUNG BOY who got injured in 5 dec 2009 Ashutosh protest now lodged in Nabha Jail.These r true leaders but these just gets killed or spends their life in jails after getting toture of eletric shocks ,getting chiilies in their wounds this is reality this is reason why trators like Badal gets full state support see at SGPC elections 80 percent voting is fake as 80 percent voters were nonsikhs media vidieographed it but it suits Indian state to force on sikhs badals as the Mahants were forced on sikhs after the occupation of sikh kingdom. It is easier to debate in PC and blame sikhs. But in reality who wants their young boys to get tortured or killed ? U just talk about the sikh issues in public u will be on watch list of state intelligence and gets ur self prepared to be framed up this is reason why traitors have become leaders because they r able to accept the overlordship and slavery of hinduwadis who control sikh institutions through their agencies .There is no surprise that people like badals r given PanthRatan I will not be surprised if tomoorow same award goes to KPS GILL as the sikh Institutions r under the control of state agencies .it is the state agencies who confered the award on badal not the sikhs .

Do u call urself scholar or u wrongly say sikhism is overgloried U have a narrow outlook of securlism but sikhs were more secular in medival than the socalled secularists of modern times as for as my mistakes in english is concerned in different nations there is different type of english but u were able to read my ealier posts..Gurmat never or sikhs never overglorifies religion sikhi is itself like sun our Gurus has regarded sikhs as supirror to himself example is of Guru Nanak when Guru Angad ji became Guru Guru Nanak himself bowed before Guru Angad ji Guru Gobin Singh bowed before Panch Piaras and asked for Amrit these happenings were never overglorified but was well recorded

iT is not comic book these facts r proven as u seems to live in ur own world secondly yes there r sikhs I and you r nobody our Guru has given the definition of sikh u must go through sikh history which in ur wrong opnion is like comic book but these facts r proved u r confused about modern times relevence about it in modern times .It was again the sikhs who taught tactics of gurilla warfare after 80 years of prosecution when sikhism was banned and this this was known as Dhai pat war . U need to learn we r pruod to declare despite such hardships sikhs and sikhi still exists despite winning great battles we never commited exceeses not going far away u can read the BATLLE OF SARA GARHI,1984 SIKHS RESISTANCE TO INVADING FORCES WHICH USED TANKS ,HEAVY GUNS,EVEN MUSTARD GAS THIS WILL ALSO SEEM TO U AS a fiction.Same underestimation led to many defeats of allied againist japan during WW II ,

Then I must u should know more about sikhi only sikhi makes u honest u have no knowledge of sikhi that is why u used word hypocrite first scan the sikh history ur world is different that is what sikhi tells us SARBAT DA BHALLA

First sikhs got their empire after great sacrifices they could prosecute Mughals but they never did.It was again Khalsa who captured Delhi but returned it big evidence about the conquer of Delhi is TEESHAZARI in Delhi.The Sikhs could have made alliance with Ahmad Shah abdali but never did as it was againist the ethhics .Sikhs were main power in Asia as they had defeated Mughals,Persians and Afghans but sikhs never believed in prosecuting other religions.Sikhs were able to contain mighty Gurkhas and evicted them from Kangra During Ranjit Singh times during the last days of Ranjit Singh Nepal ,China and even afghans along with sikh kingdom tried to make the alliance as evident from the presence of high officials along with gifts from these kingdoms along with pmost powerful kingdom of India the Nizam of Hyderabad who was consisdered to be close ally of Brithisers but this planned alliance ended due to treachery of Dogras,Suri brothers,Brahmin lobby only nonsikh groups which showed some loyalty were Kashmiri Pandits such high officials like Pandit Dinanath and Punjabi muslims. Otherwise even during the last days of Maharaja conpiracies were strated.

U r mistaken first a sikh can never be hypocrite sikh is the the very swaroop of Akalpurarkh secondly Badal never comes under the definition of sikh he has become nonsikh by his actions. Sikh ethics and Rehat MARYADA IS SUPREME THAN ANY JATHEDAR EVEN GURUS CONSISDERS REHAT MARYADA HIGHER THAN THEMSELVES.U r again wrong when u says none will care about Sant Bhindrawale go and see ur self people buys his posters,stickers etc but not of any other socalled sikh leader.See the gathering of sikh youth in ludhiana court in favour of Bhai Jagtar Singh HAwara u will get better answer.It is hoodlum mafia,drug mafia or land mafia on WHICH is responsible for existence of fake Akali dal of badal.

See Gurmat does not recogonise any gods be it hindus or anyone. Please I request admin. not to take my post negatively. some of the acts of gods r not not only immoral but againist the ethics of civilised world this is not my view but it is mentioned in vishnu puran and other texts. 1 Is it right to justify the rape of King Jalandhar wife who also happens to be brother in law of vishnu who burns herself and vishnu converts her into tulsi plant in old bollywood movie it is mentioned and hindu texts justifies it?and Jalandhar city is named after her husband this is belief of hindus 2 even Gautam buddha is avtar of vishnu these people propagates this is game of fanatic hindus not the common hindus to destroy sikhi 3 in sikhi there is no importance to gods I do not want to mention any incidents as many kids watch this site or this forum shall be dubbed as anti hindu site.

Toofana veer ji thanks for information as few days back when I went to Mohali court to meet a lawyer friend I saw young Nihang Singh in police custody talking to his lawyer some one told me he was Bhai Parsotam Singh talking to High court lawyer Brijinder Singh Loomba .I can never forget the Darshani Singh like Bhai shaiab ji I was also told that special judge in whose court case case is going on was very unconfrot able when lawyer Brijinder Singh asked for grenades to be brought to the court also told barjinder singh is being harrased because he is fighting the cases of Singhs in most bold way . Is he the same person who has caused dis confort to both state and central goverment in case relating to leakage of uranium in Punjab? I also saw intelligence people making vidiography of this particular lawyer I hope he should not face same fate Khalra has faced. The recovery at Ambala is 100 percent fake it is another tactic of anti sikh lobby to frame up more sikhs and to shield the hindu terorrists for example in ludhiana bomb blast in shingar cinema on 14 oct 2007 on eve of id was caused pipe bomb similiar to blasts caused in ajmer.12 oct 2007,hyderabad 16 oct 2007 malegoan 2008, poona 2009. tenkashi in Tamilnaidu ,Panipat in Samjauta express and many places in India by RSS men but unfortunately muslim youths were released but sikh youth in Ludhiana may face death penalty but no sikh organisation raised voice while hue and cry is being raised for Sarbjit case in pakistan it is for singhs of USA and other placces to put pressure on fake akalis like badals who framed up the singhs before they r convicted take it as appeal as all singhs families in ludhiana blast r facing miserable life just boycot BJP and Akalis like Demostrations being held againist the kamalnath.

The news channel reports of recovery of explosive matreial is biiggest fraud on common people to defame sikhs There is several unanswered questions one why dog squad of haryana police and experts failed to find any thing dog r of same breed and electronic euipment failed of haryana police. why it took 5 hours to detect matreials took midnight and there is no idependent version The special cell of delhi police and IB I\is known for antisikh mentality. This was evident from their earlier actions one such case is put up againist Parshotam Singh a katha wachak in Amb shaiab Gurdwara in mohali he was arrested by special cell of delhi police and handed over to mohali police and framed up in false case of recovery of hand grenades,revolver, RDX. Another case is of arrest of Harminder Singh ,jaswinder Singh ,gurjanrt singh,manjinder singh those singhs whoopposed Ashutosh function in ludhiana.Another case is of framing up of harminder singh,ravinder Singh,Gurpreet Singh in ludhiana bomb blast case in which these may get death penalty.there r lots of cases in which singhs r framed up all at the behest of anti sikh intelligence body IB.PUNJAB INTELLIGENCE SPECIAL CELL DELHI POLICE.

I have seen some incidents of biggest PAKANDHS in my childhood one such Pakandh was doing Shradh for GURU NANAK in Gurdwara and another is ladies and young girls performing fast and coming to gurdwara with thalis another pakandh was the Linking Rakhri with Guru Nanak and offering rakhris to GURU GRANTH SHAIAB but during those days noone dared to say anything about these Biparvads and anti Gurmat acts as even wives of office bearers of gurdwara used to keep fast.It is good sign now Singhs openly oppose these Pakands due to spread of information technology and due to this forums. This is my personal experience which Iam sharing with my brothers and sisters on this forum. May more such forums on line comes and creates awareness. Gurfateh to all my brothers and sisters as I have just recovered from dengue fever by blessings of my singh friends.

Mehatb Singh ji it is the state of Uttrakhandh not UP ,Secondly BJP led goverment is trying to create trouble each year as many sikh pilgrims pass through this state on their way to Hemkunt shaiab .Last year there was also a clash between pilgrims and local shopkeepers the reason DUE ROAD SIDE GURU KA LANGAR RUN BY SINGHS LOCALS ALLEGED THIS AFFECTED THEIR BUSSINESS wHILE SINGHS ALLEGED they were given unhygenic food by local shopkeepers at 3 to 4 times rates and dhabbaswallahs openly indulged in verbal abuse and making communal comments.Last year Uttarakhandh goverment banned road side Langars which led to protests by sikhs in allover India but Prakash chand badal refused to intervenue when the matter was resolved badal and co tried to get credit this was the last year issuse.Present cause of trouble is unknown it is high time sikhs should learn to defend themselves and devolep milatary doctrine and invest in arms.In punjab a large no of migrant people r given arm licenses which r otherwise impossible in Bihar.U.P.iF SIKHS CAN INVEST IN COSLY CARS ,HOUSES WEAPONS COSTS LESS IT IS HIGH TIME WE SHOULD LOOK INTO IT.

gURFATEH U do not know about the WWII US and Russian forces battle for Oikanawa Islands in Japan where the Japenese fighters with Samurai lineage fought with traditional arms againist heavily armed forces of Soviet union when regular forces exhausted amno then local fighters took field and used hit and run tactics with such success that Soviet Union lost70,000 troops and made a retreat but 4 lacs US troops surrounded the 15 islands and due to hungerand extreme troubles US troops succeeded in capuring the islands not before losing their 40.000 troops this was shown in discovery channael 3 years back and US TROOPS TOOK LARGE NO OF KHATTANA SWORDS AS MEMORY TACTICS R MORE IMPORTANT EVEN DURING VIETNAM WAR IN MANY CASES LOCAL FIGHTERS KILLED LARGE NO OF US SOLDIERS DESPITE BEING BOMBARED BY AIR FORCE AND SUFFERED LOSSES DUE TO USE OF BIOLOGICAL WEAPONS U NEED TO DEVOLEP JUST TACTICS AND DOCTRINE ALONG WITH MODERN WEAPONS IN MANY CASES TRADITINAL WEAPONS CAN BECOME LETHAL COMBINATION THIS WAS DEMOSTRATED BY SIKHS DURING WAR WITH MUGHALS ,AFGANS AND ENGLIGH.

Removing the heads of these papis will be less punishment their hands must be thrown into same well so these papis will remember all their lives.

Gurfateh, Today is sahheedi divas of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur and I was moved into tears by listening to sacrifices of Puratan singhs. Have we become so insenstive to the saheedis of puratan singhs that we may celebrate the many sant mahapurush Barsis but have forgoten the real Mahapurushs of sikh panth. We have to shed this insenstiveness we means MYSELF even I did not remember it .

Firstly A Gurughar is dedicated to the Guru Maharaj and secondly Sant ji spread the message of his master Guru Nanak ji and Sri Guru Granth Shaiab ji Maharaj it was not anybody personal message which is for the whole universe.All living beings r mortal Only GUR SHABAD IS SUPREME.

Even the relatives r keeping away due to police excesses among these Harminder Singh and Ravinder Singh might face death penalty for the offence which was commited by hinduwadi as Shingar blast was caused on ID MUSLIM FESTIVAL further it was caused by pipe bomb same device used in Malegaon, Hyderabad,Ajmer blast it is favorite bomb of hinduwadi terorrists same device was used in Tamil Naidu .Most important is Panipat, ajmer hyderabad and ludhiana blast were caused in 2007 close to eachother for details TEHLAKA REPORTS, MIROR INDIA REPORTS AND CHARESHHEET FILED BY INDIAN CENTRAL AGENCIES ARE BIGGEST PROOF. While badal group is playing politics on bhullar issuse in HARMINDER sINGH Ravinder and others cases they r bent upon hanging the harminder singh despite the fact that the witnesses r called again and again and pressurised to give false evidence. Harminder Singh is defended by team of lawyers led by Brijinder Singh Loomba a high court lawyer along with G.S Rattu and Gurjinder Singh. Apart from these singhs there is Gurmel Singh from Buta Singh wala who has become mentallly unstable due to inhuman police torture of khanna policemen like ramandeep singh.arvind puri ssp sukhminder singh mann. Arvind Puribroke the leg of Harminder Singh ,rAMANDEEP BROKE THE CHAIR ON THE HEAD OF GURMEL SINGH THEN POURED BOILED WATER ON HIS WOUNDS AND SSP KEPT ON LAUGHING AND GURMEL SINGH WAS GIVEN ELECRIC SHOCKS ON ALLOVER THE BODY HE IS POOREST AMONG ALL PRISONERS. gURJANT sINGH WAS ASKED BY ssp sUKHMINDER MAAN YOU TOLD US TO FIRE AT UR CHEST SINGHS GETS BULLETS ON THEIR CHESTS WHAT NOW THAT SINGH TOLD THE POLICEMEN FEARLESSLY UNTIE MY HANDS SEE UR FATE POLICEMEN GAVE ELETRIC SHOCKS GAVE HIM SEVERE BEATINGS HE CAN STILL BARELY WALK,JASWINDER SINGH STICHES ON BULLET WOUNDS OPENED UP DURING OLICE TORTURE IN THE STOMACH. THESE POLICEMEN UNDER BADAL RULE R COMMTING EXCESSES ON SIKHS BUT NRIS AND SIKHS OF PUNJAB KEEPS ON LICKING THEIR BOOTS

That creep hardeep has trimmed hair and has failed in first test of sikhi ,that creep has no right to speak on behalf of sikhi . He is a sirgum these types of people has been excluded from sikhi as per sikh rehat along with nari marr and kurimars unfortunately these people have been given a new name sehajdhari which has no relations with sikhi , Main source is bhai mohkam singh writings and bhai nand lal singh sakhi rehat ki this type of creep needs to be sued for hurting the feelings of sikhs.

Gurfateh, There is rather 2 very good shops one oposite the STD booth and before that shop one is of damdami taksal .I have seen a singh buying 5 kg tegha from him. Patiala is the best apart from puratan ones one singh near nabha road manufacture good shasters resembling the puratan infact these r shops of Siklighars. The best shasters can be found in Patiala and same quality is in Huzoor shaiab.