Search the Community

I recently did this documentary (15 min.)with my local Gurudwara Bhai on the Kirpan. Bhai Saab is going back after next week. Unfortunately I wasn't able to burn the film to disc and sent myself an email of it to upload it on Youtube. The problem is that the media player says "format not supported." Whenever I try playing it on my laptop and youtube also says a similar thing. How do I change the format for free?

Wahe guru ji ka khalsa wheguru ji ke fathe, Just wanted the members of this site to give me there opinions, on the kirpans . I am trying to make an affordable usable and beautiful kirpan for everyday carry. Yes the design is very similar to a popular produced kirpan, honestly he got it right on the design but not on the price.Hand made Damascus/ wootz 1095 carbon steel with 15n20 nickel about 180 layers. The picture with 3 kirpans are made from a single billet and are cut and shaped accordingly. the other two are made of the same material but the handles are pinned and are not one piece of steal. Both blades should be really strong was just figuring out the best way to making them. This is still in the early stages. Will be torture testing these kirpans to make sure they are battle ready weapons. I still not sure about the sheath. I am working on kydex sheaths now still in design phase. But i am hoping to offer these kirpans for $150-180 dollars usa. I am also working on a economical version at about $90 us dollars. Not really a business for me its more of a hobby and side-project. All version will come with kirpan and sheath. Well i am eagar to read your comments. Wahe guru ji ka khalsa wheguru ji ke fathe

its length is 3ft , on its hilt a flag symbol and its number is mentioned , my uncle was in patiala army, , after his death, this pass to me, in 1947 many muslim people killed by this sword , and this sword also used in many clashes , in one pic the cut on its blade tells its story, when i was in 8th class it given to me by my uncle, this is old sword,

Apologies for the long post, please take time to go through it and the references. Please accept my apologies for hurt sentiments and I would be grateful for your observations into my failings or misunderstandings of the teachings. And lastly, this is not about debating the Khalsa (it had to be included in this post for obvious reasons), but rather this is about Peace vs. Violence in Sikhi in a pure theological sense so let us keep comments to that. I'm surprised that this topic has not been debated in greater detail by the Online Sangat. I appreciate that it may be a taboo subject as the Guru Gobind Singh ji has stipulated specific rules on the carrying of a kirpan and there is the long tradition of the Nihangs and violent acts by Guru's orders (therefore the inference that violence is not prohibited), but correct fundamental understanding is very important: "Whoever does not realize the essence of the soul / all his religious actions are hollow and false" The issue at the heart of the matter is not whether or not we should be carrying kirpans and whether this infers that violence is therefore acceptable, but rather, whether Waheguruji Himself condones violence- at all in the context of the perfect nature of his (formless) existence. Now if we look at the only possible source of inspiration in the issue, which is Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji- the everlasting embodiment of the Gurus, there is no reference to condoning violence, indeed we have the contrary, speaking against violence. "The heart is filled with anger and violence, which cause all sense to be forgotten." Where people see weapons and violent actions being mentioned metaphorically, the context is always to highlight why it is wrong or that it is a metaphor for achieving right through spiritual wisdom. The SGGSji is the truth, we cannot choose to ignore any of the specific lines because it conflicts with what we want to interpret. Specifically: "The pursuit of virtue is my bow and arrow, my quiver, sword and scabbard." "You hold in your hands the sword of the Guru's spiritual wisdom; with this destroyer of death, kill the Messenger of Death." "The True Guru has placed the sword of spiritual wisdom in my hands; I have overcome and slain the Messenger of Death." "In His Mercy, God has blessed me with the sword of spiritual wisdom; I have attacked and killed the demons." "From the Guru, I have obtained the supremely powerful sword of spiritual wisdom." And importantly: "Devotional worship of the Lord is the sword and armour of the True Guru; He has killed and cast out Death, the torturer." Threfore a reference such as: "When it pleases You, we wield the sword, and cut off the heads of our enemies" HAS TO BE consistent with what "sword" means as highlighted above. You cannot chose to turn a blind eye towards this. A revealing reference: "You pray for hours to God the Beautiful/ But your gaze is evil, and your nights are wasted in conflict. /You perform daily cleansing rituals, / wear two loin-cloths, perform religious rituals and put only milk in your mouth./ But in your heart, you have drawn out the sword..... You dance, but your consciousness is filled with evil....... You are lewd and depraved - this is such an unrighteous dance!" (abridged, pg 1351). Sikhi is not an Abrahamic religion- A key distinction needs to be made with the fundamental understanding of the soul and Waheguruji's hukam; and practical methods to life in the physical realm. Having established that God never condones violence (against a living being), we move onto the physical realm. We, ourselves create problems for humanity. Hatred, discrimination, slavery and all other causes of violence are entirely man-made. What is a man-made problem, caused by NOT living the way Waheguruji intended us to exist in the physical embodiment, is something Waheguruji will not actively engage in to change- as He does not engage (we strive to engage with him) and he is pure, true and beyond such frivolous material things. It is for man to solve problems by using the teachings of Saints, Gurus and Prophets. Unnerving faith in Waheguruji protects from evil. He creates and destroys (He has the power to do so). It is He alone who can take a life (indirectly). Waheguruji being the ultimate creator or destroyer is a description as to how vast his power is- it is beyond our knowledge or capabilities. Kabir's story of Prahlaad (SGGSji pg 1194) comes to mind in the context of the person who did not give up his devotion: "The king became angry and drew his sword" "Show me your protector now!" "So God emerged out of the pillar, and assumed a mighty form." "He killed Harnaakhash, tearing him apart with his nails..He saves His devotees like Prahlaad over and over again. " There are two significant points regarding this: a) ultimate devotion protects against tyranny b) Kabir's couplet is a story- not to be taken literally (God isn't about to emerge from a pillar in physical form, although He could if He chose to)- it's the moral story that is to be learnt i.e. point (a). © The story could have quite as easily had Prahlaad pull out his kirpan, but this would inconsistent with the message of Waheguruji. There is general consensus in most circumstances where violence should not be used, but there are some who would justify violence under certain circumstances such as protecting the oppressed and innocent/ defending from tyranny and evil etc. Once again the SGGSji is consistent in this matter: "Kabeer, to use force is tyranny, even if you call it legal." The bottomline is that violence simply cannot be justified. With those unsatisfied with true devotion (including living as intended) as being sufficient and the only thing that ultimately matters and if you disagree with the line above, we need to address the man-made problem of conflict and violence and how to deal with it practically. This raises the following questions: 1) Are we, as mere mortals commanded by God to directly and physically be involved in the liberation of the oppressed etc? 2) If so, are we commanded to use force and violence to achieve these means I am not aware of any reference in Waheguruji's Hukam (SGGSji) which supports either. "He preserves our soul, our breath of life, body and wealth. By His Grace, He protects our soul." Note the difference in words between preserve our body and protect our soul, which is key. We are but an insignificant speck in the history of the universe and entirely insignificant in the everlasting greater cosmos. Universes and existences have come and gone, that is said, we could be one of an infinite number of spacetime existence to have ever existed and which will exist. The body is preserved, but not protected by Him, and He is all powerful. He therefore is concerned with our souls, which may theoretically always exist as being part of Him. We are concerned with protecting our bodies because of the overwhelming desire to protect Maya. "You fool! Why are you so proud of Maya?" "The animals and the birds frolic and play-they do not see death/ Mankind is also with them, trapped in the net of Maya." "The enticing desire for Maya leads people to become emotionally attached to their children, relatives, households and spouses." "Because of attachment to Maya, the world is bound by the Messenger of Death." And critically: "please save me from Maya, the cause of death." So, given that Maya is the cause of death, theolgically how does one escape from the clutches of Maya? (Rhetorical question) Through more Maya or through remembering Him? (Rhetorical question) Therefore theologically, belief that physical life is supreme is wrong. This I'm afraid would appear to be the uncomfortable truth- Waheguruji does not take notice of what happens in the Maya state and the body does not matter to him to the extent that he will protect it- he will only seek to preserve it to give us an opportunity to release ourselves from the cycle of birth and death. Propagating violence will not break the cycle of birth and death. Unlike in Abrahamic texts such as the Koran which promise rewards for fighting in the name of God for what it views as just actions, we have the benefit of knowing that the cycle of birth and death cannot be broken by these means. The uncomfortable truth is that if a mortal had faith and acted in compliance with His hukam, but in doing so the world as we know it ended, then that is the intended outcome. Worlds and life will continue to be created (or not) as He desires. The uncomfortable truth is that we want to preserve life (defence), and being virtuous, we find it difficult to tolerate oppression, discrimination etc to the point where we are willing to use violence to achieve these goals (even though as far as I'm aware Waheguruji does not command us to do so). "One whose mind is pleased and appeased, has no egotistical pride. Violence and greed are forgotten." Now this throws up some further questions: 1) Let's assume that this is true; that mere devotion and living life as intended is sufficient for our physical forms being preserved ; does this mean that I stand by whilst the innocent are slaughtered? 2) But hold on Veerji, you are forgetting about Guru Gobind Singh ji, he asked us to protect the innocent and weak and gave us the Kirpan and several Gurus engaged in battle and by all accounts, killed other people. Are you saying that that was not consistent with how we should be living our lives? Both of these statements are the same argument essentially. Firstly, we ourselves are not Sat Gurus, we are their disciples (and ultimately of Waheguruji). Guru Nanak dev ji's guru was Waheguruji. He and the other Sat gurus were not necessarily subject to the the rules of Maya which entrap us. With regard to protecting the innocent, opposing tyranny, once again, being Sat gurus, I would say they were obliged to act as they were caught in Maya and therefore concerned with the it's preservation (not protection) whilst they were actively able to. If they used violence it does not mean we are authorised to do so. Their teachings are embodied in Guru Granth Sahib Ji, which are non-violent and will never be able to be violent. They had a specific plan for humanity and they attempted to deliver it on the ground. Instead of the whole human race readily accepting this, the inherent nature of how we exist in Maya meant that that was never to be. They had to go deliver us SGGSji by His command and if that meant by His grace and by His grace only lives had to perish then it was by His grace. Now what of the Khalsa? That's a very interesting question and for me it is easily answered. The ultimate source of inspiration is SGGSji. Guru Gobind Singh ji did not compile his own banis into SGGSji and for very good reason. There is a distinction to be made with SGGSji and the Dasam Granth and ancillary texts, and actually it's in my view a very advanced system for this, compared to other religious texts, where the word of God is intermixed with stories, myths, untruths and Maya-ic elements. SGGSji is purely related to the core theological belief of God realisation. It does not condone violence in any form and for any reason. Sri Dasam granth and ancillary texts have an inherent Maya-ic element and therefore these could not be incorporated into the SGGSji. Indeed Guru Nanak Dev ji and other Gurus were very particular as to which external Saints' and gurus' and historical verses should be accepted as the truth of relating to the core theology. Guru Gobind Singh ji, a Sat Guru in his own right, had every right to have his contribution added to SGGSji, but a lot of it is not purely theological and has Maya-ic elements. Guruji was concerned with the preservation of Sikhi. Maya in Sikhi poses a great paradox; If the religion and the world are not preserved then they both may die out both in the short term and long-term; if Sikhi is not preserved it would die out and if the world is not preserved then fairness and justice will be overwhelmed over time by tyranny and oppression, thereby not allowing the opportunity of souls to escape Maya in this reincarnation of the universe. However Sikhi itself does not condone violence and is entirely free of Maya. Whilst it could be, it is not a perfect world and for the two to co-exist, there have to be rules relating to self-preservation which are inconsistent with what the theological and Ultimate ASPIRATIONS of God'd will is. Well and good you may say, but where does leave me and where does it leave the Khalsa? This is my view on this: 1) The Khalsa was created by the order of the tenth Guru and therfore serves a purpose. Through Gurujis kirpa, the Khalsa is born and it belongs to Waheguru (as does everything). "Waheguru ji ka Khalsa waheguru ji fateh" (But also bear in mind the only mention of Khalsa itself means pure): "Says Kabeer, those humble people become pure - they become Khalsa - who know the Lord's loving devotional worship." Not everyone was intended to be a (warrior style) Khalsa Sikh, even among Sikhs. This again comes out of the fact the Khalsa was not incorporated into SGGSji and that anyone who follows SGGSji will be liberated; anyone is free to do so. Only the most pure can be Khalsa (and therefore Amritdhari as per varying rehats) and they have responsibilities which an ordinary Sikh need not undertake. The Khalsa is a specific path which is a balance of God's true word and the fact that it has to be practiced in an imperfect world. SGGSji is available to one and all to follow and seek liberation. The Khalsa are special and they serve a purpose. Khalsa belongs to Waheguru and only though His kirpa can someone be a Khalsa Sikh (complete with kirpan and licence to kill). Whether the act of violence by a Khalsa Sikh in carrying out his duties as ordered by the tenth Guru will result in delayed liberation from the cycle of birth and death is a question solely for Waheguruji and Waheguruji alone (liberation is never assured- even if one does everything to the letter, it is permissible and probably almost always certain). In my personal view, a Khalsa Sikh, being the most pure and having to balance Guruji's orders of accepting Waheguru's command of peace whilst living preserving life in Maya; a paradoxical state; has a difficult internal battle and it is this internal battle which gives him righteousness. God preserves life, one of his methods may be through the Khalsa. He however protects souls and a true Khalsa should strive to have his soul protected by following Waheguruji's command whilst humbly serving Guruji's orders. The conclusion is thus: Theologically, from the core fundamental principles, Wareguruji does not condone violence; one must always speak out against violence whatever the justification. Violence is a product of Maya. Khalsa is a product of Sikhi and Maya needing to co-exist; a paradoxical state; Khalsa Sikhs may, by Guruji's kirpa be ordered to assist in the preservation of human life for it's continued survival but must always be aware of the eternal word of Waheguruji as per SGGSji. However the entire human race need not be Khalsa, a 'Sikh' (in the literal sense of the word); a truth seeker, can be non-violent person and this will be in accordance with Waheguruji's wishes. Please do not scorn those who reject violence, they are as pure as those following any other path can be. Equally do not scorn the Khalsa, they are truly noble for undertaking the difficult responsibility of supporting a paradoxical state of existence. Apologies for the long post, please take time to go through it and the references. Please accept my apologies for hurt sentiments and I would be grateful for your observations into my failings or misunderstandings of the teachings. And lastly, this is not about debating the Khalsa (it had to be included in this post for obvious reasons), but rather this is about Peace vs. Violence in Sikhi in a pure theological sense so let us keep comments to that.

I am not against Hindus but I need to point out to you how just about all of them believe Sikhi is part of Hinduism. Below are the points they always, always raise in a debate. 1.) Hindus wear janeu, Sikhs kirpan. There is no difference. (This is a recent one). 2.) Because a majority of Hindus became Sikhs it must mean Sikhs are Hindus. 3.) Neo-Nazi Sikhs have changed shabds in Gurbani to suit themselves. (This is where Singh Sabha is slagged off). 4.) Guru Sahib used names of Hindu Gods and Godesses in Gurbani. This means Sikhs are Hindu. (They are getting quite creative with this mean. Bhagauti is supposed to be Bhagwati in Hindi now). I know there are many veers on this forum who could answer this stupidness in their sleep, but I am thinking about creating a whole team to smash their arguments to pieces. Off course their mentality will not let them accept the truth of what we say. Maybe a few blogs, facebook pages can be set up. Social media goes a long way nowdays.

Please feel free to correct and criticise me, I just listened to these two kathas and was impressed with the knowledge displayed. http://www.manglacharan.com/2011/05/chandi-pargat-hona-katha-by-giani-baba.html However I do not understand Shakti, was that Akal Purakh in one of his forms? I also do not understand the bit regarding Mata Sahib Kaur Ji. Is Akal Purakh's shakti in Kirpan? Hence is Kirpan chandi? How do we, in Gurmat, view Durga? How does our view of Chandi and Durga differ from Hinduism?

GurFateh! Last time we went to visit Buckingham Palace and Houses of Parliment we were told that we would have to take off our Sri Sahibs to enter. This was back in 2009 and in the end we refused to take them off as its just not an option and got a refund; and that's after initially waiting for 2 hours! So now we are heading back to London next week and were wondering if this is still the case? I know that the London Eye have given a stubborn no to entering with a Kirpan but what about other places in London e.g. Madam Tousards, Tower of London etc. Is it just pot luck if you get caught? Is it best to email both places asking for confirmation or just go there and see what happens on the day? What's the best way to handle such situations? Thanks

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH! Daas would like to acquire a Puratan 3ft sri sahib/Khanda.Tegha. Any puratan kirpan would be preferred with a design on the hilt. Looking for a strong, stirdy, battle ready piece from 18th/19th century. Looking for a quick buy.

I have recently completed filming a movie for school, on the Kirpan. The movie is going to be 15 minutes in length and is documentary style. As I am the only Sikh in the school I decided that highlighting the importance of the Kirpan to the white people will be important. The idea was warmly received by my classmates and teachers. In the editing stage subtitles will be added to the movie in English. But I have run into 4 problems. 1.) I need footage, an establishing shot, of Darbar Sahib in India showing Sikhs wearing Kirpan. These Sikhs can be anyone from sevadars to Granthis to devotees. 2.) I need footage, extremely good footage, of Sikhs playing gatka with real shastars. Please avoid providing any footage with Sikhs dressed in Western style clothing. 3.) I need good army or military music to go with my movie. 4.) I need footage of Puratan Singhs fighting with swords and a picture of Guru Hargobind Sahib Ji with his two kirpans and Guru Gobind Singh Ji asking for a head to create the Khalsa. Can anyone tell me where I can acquire the above from for free please? Once my movie is finished I will upload it onto Youtube and provide links. Thank you very much.

Are there any specifications for wearing Kirpans for amritdhari, as in it cannot be rusted etc. My one is a bit rusted, scratched.

For Sale, Is a Wootz Gold Khanjar. With more recent gold work, and slabs. the blade has some pitting on it. Asking Price: £250 NEW PRICE: £200 AntiqueCollections@hotmail.co.uk www.antiquecollectionsuk.blogspot.com I am willing, for a quick sale to sell both gold pesh kabz and khanjer/kirpan for £300 in order to make room for more stock! Thanks

For Sale, a Beautiful Newly Made (looks like an antique, is infact newer) Damascus Pesh Kabz, with Gold Koftgari Work. Very Nice!!! 26cms long - not too big, not to small! Pictures say a thousand words!!!! It is also has this feature of having a small bell king of thing in the handle, which makes a sound, seen im some antiques. Price: £100 including shipping to UK. To buy contact me: AntiqueCollections@Hotmail.co.uk Thanks Jas, AntiqueCollections@hotmail.co.uk www.AntiqueCollectionsUK.blogspot.com Pls Note: The Spear Head on the Blog is now on SALE! for £250!

SPECIAL DISCOUNT TO SIKH SANGAT MEMBERS!!! in panjabi: website deh priceaa(n) goreh vaasteh hun, sikhaa(n) vasteh discount milda ay (around 10%)! out of all sales i also give daswandh! Hey Guys, Just wanted to let everybody know that I have a new Blog spot/Website which I will be selling Antiques from. www.AntiqueCollectionsUK.blogspot.com I will update it regularly, and have got stock which still needs to be put on. I Specialise in Indo Persian Arms, particularly Gold and Silver koftgari pieces, and wootz arms. Comming Soon: Wootz Pesh Kabz with new gold work and swollen tip, Dhals, Khanjar - Bichuaa (on ebay atm) - arrow with full shafts - also have a few newly made pieces. Already on the Site: Rare and unique Spear Head, Gold and Silver WOOTz Pesh Kabz, Gold Tulwaar. The Dagger was Sold a few days ago. All info is on the site, any offers/purchases please contact me: antiquecollections@hotmail.co.uk, payment can be via Paypal, Bank Transfer - and I have a EBAY account, to sell through. Thanks, Jas Antique Collections Blog: www.AntiqueCollectionsUK.blogspot.com PhotoBucket: http://s1106.photobucket.com/home/AntiqueCollections/index Ebay: AntiqueCollectionsUK Paypal: AntiqueCollections@hotmail.co.uk