Homosexuality in Sikhism

[Khalsa4ever]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

Actually, its been documented (i believe) that in the original darbaars of the gurus, families used to sit TOGETHER: ie: no guy/girl separation.

Bhul Chuk Maph

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

[DhadiMania]

I do wanna say though, that if we had Gays in the sangat, that would be a very bad bad BAD thing.

i am not sure who wrote this, but there was someone (well a group) of gay gursikhs who do mass loads of paath (was it you Singh who said this).

anyway, they dont bother coming to gurdwara because they may be actually be beaten up.

remember, dharam raj will not call upon you and say "ah bhai sahib, you have done alot of paath, and your straight, you are mukath now."

he wont say "bhai sahib, lots of paath, sewa, just one thing, your gay, now dont look at me in that way or you wont get mukti. come to think of it, your gay, so chaurasi for you again!"

regards to the above, even if there were no gays in sangat, people will still be eyeing each other up. gay or not gay. you'll still have the 5 vices whereveer you go, and the mssion is to kill them in one life.

The reason that the girls sit on one side and the guys sit on the other is so that the guys don't "mess" with the girls sitting next to them, in which case they would be furthered from God

would you say that for langar? where girls and boys sit together? (well used to in the old days, i think there are some gurdwaras that do this still).

vedanti has said gays is wrong. but its law of nature, the sunrises, the sunsets, man cannot stop it, even if he tried. similarly, your either born gay or your born straight (some cases bisexual). it is said that the reason why one is gay is because in many joons they were of a different sex (so a girl you is a lesbian was a boy in so many of her previous janams) however, now a girl, she has got used to what she liked in the previous janam, hence some of what you did and liked in previous janam follows you into a current janam.

i am not saying its good to be gay, nor am i saying its wrong

gustaphi maaf

[Bhajneet]

I was just referring to the rehats, for those. Sorry, didn't know peeps would get so mad.

[Gupt daasan daas]

people think its natural but it isnt

bbe careful not everything scince tells u is right

its mostly guesses

so, while the kids a baby, he gets kaam by looking at guys?

half of the guys make a decision to go gay when their like 40]

it aint natural

its a decision

this is kaljug, wat u except

bhula chuka maf

[sher_panjabi]

" beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

attraction = illusion

some of us get trapped in the beauty of food, some of us get trapped in the beauty of clothes, for others its the beauty of men or beauty of women which they get caught in.

"Jio supnaa ar pekhnaa aise jag kau jaan. en mai kachh saacho nehee naanak bin bhagvaan"

"Recognise the world just as a seeing a dream. Nothing is true in it, O Nanak, apart from God alone."

Marriage to opposite sex = benefits:

1/ Balance Kaam

2/ Have kids (who will look after you and the Panth <_< )

3/ Spiritual partner - help you in Sikhi and following Guru's Hukam

4/ Physical partnership in life - women's virtues + man's virtues = advantage

Appreciate the world and everything but don't get caught into it.

Homosexuals to my understanding get caught up in the beauty of man/women (their own sex) - which = illusion of Maya

... not end of world... illusion of Maya is destroyed through:

1/ Gurbaani & Naam Simran

2/ Saadh Sangat & Sewa

3/ Waheguru's Kirpaa

We can either feed our illusion or we can try to get away with it. Feeding the illusion = through illicit films, television programmes which feeds images, sounds and thoughts to our minds... through listening to others talk about illicit things etc

Destroying it = hanging around with good Sadh Sangat, keeping in a spiritual environment, feeling Guru Ji and Waheguru's presence always

[ravindersidhu]

Gupt daasan daas and sher punjabi r right

[Deg_Teg_Fateh]

I dont get this...I mean, they havent yet shown any proof of defects or differences in the structure of the brain in gay people(from wat ive learnt), so why is it even being considered an okay thingi? (sorry if I offend neone). Its just personal choice since most of them reach puberty and then realize they are gay I would think its coz of the media and stuff. Then, wouldnt it be Kaam? And from the above post, It sure does explain that it is FORBIDDEN in Sikhi.

(we had a similar discussion in class a while ago, and my fellow Christian classmates said that it IS fully forbidden in Christianity as well, plus they brought quotes from the New Testament, cant rem the verse n chap tho)

Bhul chook maaf

[Khalsa4ever]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

I'm not going to put my vote either way, but I just have a couple points to consider. First, its true that most gay people probably only know they are gay after puberty... but then the same goes with heterosexuals (most kids don't have "attractions" to others). However, genes have been shown in various animals to determine sexual preference.

But whats true is that our purpose here is to rise above our desires and lusts. But does that mean heterosexuality over homosexuality? I don't know... like I haven't seen ANY gurbani which accepts one type of "preference" over the other... and I haven't heard any sakhis either which refer to this...

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

[kiran_k]

im sorry but homosexuality is not a "choice". Do you really think homosexuals would "choose" to be classed as abnormal from soceity, many homosexuals are cut off from their families as a result of their sexuality. Many are isolated from their communities and cultures because its been drilled into soceity that gays are "wrong" and "unnatural". do u really think homosexuals like being insulted by friends/family/others. dont you think if it was a choice they would choose to be straight, marry the opposite sex, have children, walk down the road holding hands with the person they love, be accepted by their families, rather than go through the hassle that homosexuals go through.

So if homosexaulity is a choice. Please tell me when all of you woke up and decided you were straight?

[Ambrosia]

What about Love....

If someone truly loves, then they dont care about the gender, form, shape, caste, creed, culture, religion, la la la of the person/people that they love. They just love them, however they are... without judgements, without limits and barriers and conditions.

I want to emphasize that Im not talking about lust here. I think, any relationship gay or straight that is based on lust, is not what Sikhism subscribes to. Therefore I'm talking about love.

I'm sure many would agree that the best partnership someone could have, is with someone that they love. In this way both can grow spiritually together, have full trust in one another, be best friends as well as perhaps lovers (note: lovers is different than lusters for a reason).

If someone ends up falling in love with someone of the same sex, I dont see the harm with it, as long as its not about lust. If the focus is spiritual, then let it be... let things happen as Guru Ji makes them happen (Know this well, He himself is all).