Labour Is Pro-Sikh

[randip singh]

Evidence For This:

Calls for investigations into 1984 Massacre of Sikhs signed by mostly Labour MP's

http://www.parliament.the-stationery-offic...109/109we43.htm

Annex A

EARLY DAY MOTIONS (EDMS) RELATING TO SIKH HUMAN RIGHTS TABLED IN THE HOUSE OF COMMONS IN THE LAST 12 MONTHS

1.  The following four Early Day Motions (EDMs) have been raised in the last twelve months in the House of Commons concerning the genocide of Sikhs in June 1984, the November 1984 pogroms against tens of thousands of innocent Sikhs and abuse of Sikh human rights by the Indian authorities over the last twenty years.

EDM 664—20th Anniversary of the Storming of the Golden Temple Complex

  That this House notes with sadness the 20th anniversary of the June 1984 assault by the Indian army on the Golden Temple complex, the Sikhs' holiest shrine, where sacred buildings and historic artefacts were destroyed or damaged beyond repair; further notes that the unprecedented action using artillery and tanks took place on one of the most important days in the Sikh calendar, when there were huge numbers of pilgrims in attendance, which resulted in thousands of innocent Sikhs being killed in cold blood, many with their hands and feet bound, including women and children; is appalled that scores of other Sikh Gurdwaras were stormed by the Indian army throughout Punjab and that thousands of Sikhs were arrested, tortured, and killed, including children; recognises that these actions by the Indian authorities continue to have an immeasurable impact on Sikhs throughout the world; and extends its sympathy and support to the law-abiding, hard working, and well respected international Sikh community.

EDM 663—Violation of human rights of Sikhs in India

  That this House notes and applauds the efforts of human rights activists in India to highlight atrocities, including false imprisonment, torture, deaths in custody, extra-judicial executions and disappearances, perpetrated against Sikhs in the last 20 years; further notes that it is estimated that over 250,000 Sikhs have been murdered and/or disappeared since June 1984; is deeply concerned that 20 years later the Indian Government continues to deny full access to Punjab to international human rights groups and to the UN Rapporteur on Torture; regrets that thousands of families are still waiting to know the fate of relatives who have disappeared; and calls on the Prime Minister, on behalf of the estimated 700,000 Sikhs in the United Kingdom, to lead the international community in demanding full access to Punjab to international human rights groups and the UN.

EDM 662—20th Anniversary of November 1984 attacks on Sikhs

  That this House notes with sadness the 20th anniversary of the November 1984 pogrom against thousands of innocent Sikhs in a matter of days in cities across India; further notes that Sikhs became the target of organised violence with murderous gangs swarming into Sikh houses, hacking the occupants to pieces, chopping off the heads of children, raping women, tying Sikh men to tyres set aflame with kerosene and pulling Sikh passengers from public transport to be lynched or burned alive; recognises that Amnesty International in a memorandum to the Government of India, complained that far from being spontaneous expressions of popular grief and anger as made out by the authorities, the killings were the outcome of a well organised plan marked by acts of both deliberate commission and omission by important politicians of the Congress and by authorities in the administration; believes that investigation and criminal proceedings are long overdue; and calls upon Her Majesty's Government to take the lead in the international community to establish an independent UN inquiry into the failure of successive governments in India to take sufficient actions against those responsible for the events of November 1984.

EDM 1890—Anniversary of anti-Sikh pogroms

  That this House remembers with sadness the 20th anniversary of the November 1984 anti-Sikh pogroms when thousands of innocent Sikhs were killed or injured across India; notes with pleasure the many positive changes that have since taken place in India where the current Prime Minister is a Sikh; and expresses the hope that the Government of India will continue to pursue the path of reconciliation in relation to those events by instituting an inquiry into them that can bring closure to the victims and relatives of those who suffered at that time.

2.  135 different opposition and backbench UK MPs from across the political spectrum supported these EDMs demonstrating considerable concern by elected representatives and calling for action from the UK Government and the international community.

3.  At the end of the 2003-04 Parliamentary Session the motions had been signed by 71 Labour MPs, 39 Conservative MPs, 20 Liberal Democrat MPs, two Ulster Unionist Party MPs, one Scottish National Party MP, one Plaid Cymru MP and one Independent Conservative MP. In addition, the Sikh Federation (UK) has received letters and messages of support from over 40 members of the Labour Government, including Cabinet Ministers, Junior Ministers and Parliamentary Private Secretaries that are unable to sign EDMs due to Parliamentary protocol.

4.  Given this level of Parliamentary interest and support it is most disappointing that the Annual Report on Human Rights 2004 remains silent on the abuse of Sikh human rights.

Labour MP Valerie Davey asks questions over 1984 Genocide again

http://www.valeriedavey.labour.co.uk/ViewPage.cfm?Page=13961

Constituents attended Westminster as part of the Sikh Federation Lobby to raise a range of issue including the issue of justice for the victims of the November 1984 massacres.

Labour MP's support Sikhs Wearing the Kirpan

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=2005-03-17.221670.h

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire, Lab/Co-op) Hansard source

To ask the Secretary of State for Health what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

Rosie Winterton (Doncaster Central, Lab) Hansard source

The Department values the diversity of all its staff and has a policy to ensure that no member of staff will be discriminated on the grounds of their faith. Subject to health and safety considerations, Sikh employees of the Department can wear the Kirpan.

So how idiots can claim Labour is racist against Sikhs is beyond me? @

In fact Labour represents the Sikh values of:

8 VIRTUES TO COMBAT THE 5 EVILS

Wisdom (gyan) : is the complete knowledge of a set of religious principles. It can be achieved by hearing good, thinking good and doing good. A man of wisdom tries to achieve a high moral standard in his life and interaction with others. According to Sikhism, the first steps to wisdom is to consider oneself as an ignorant person who has to learn a lot in life.

Truthful Living (sat) : This is more than 'truth'. It means living according to the way of God i.e. the thoughts should match the words that a person speaks and his actions should also match his words. Truthful living brings a person closer to God.

Justice (niaon) : means freedom and equal oppurtunities for all. Respect for the rights of others and strict absence of attempts to exploit a fellowbeing. Sikhism forbids the desire to loot anothers property. It also strictly instructs the Sikhs to show respect even for the women and children of an enemy.

Temperance (santokh) : means self control which has to be developed through meditation and prayers. A Sikh has to banish evil thoughts from his mind by constantly repeating Gods name and reciting prayers. Torture to the body to develop self-control is not advocated in Sikhism.

Patience (dhiraj) : implies a high level of tolerance and empathy for others. It requires control over ones ego and willingness to overlook anothers weakness or mistakes. It requires that a Sikh should be strongwilled, but kind hearted.

Courage (himmat) : means bravery i.e. absence of fear. It is the ability to stake ones life for ones convictions and for saving others from injustice or cruelty.

Humility (namarta) : is a deliberate denial of pleasure at one's own praise and admiration. It means underplaying ones own strengths and respecting the abilities of others. It is the antidote to 'ahankar'

Contentment (sabar) : means refraining from worldly fears and submitting oneself to the will of God. The typical worldly fears can be fear of death, poverty, disrespect and defeat. It is this virtue that has given the Sikhs the moral strength to withstand the various atrocities committed on their community in the last three centuries.

wheras Tories definitely DO NOT espose these virtues..........they are a racist party out to screw the poorer sections of society.......... :<Edited>:

[JagtarSinghKhalsa]

The claim is NOT Labour is racist, but the Labour GOVERNMENT is racist.

Labour MPs, especially where there are large numbers of Sikhs, have been supportive on many issues. In terms of % of MPs that have supported Sikh issues from the three main parties - 1984, separate monitoring etc. the Liberal Democrats have been the most supportive, Labour and Conservative have been neck and neck. Given that Labour Ministers - Cabinet and Junior, PPSs etc. are unable to sign Early Day Motions - it would have to be assumed Labour has been more supportive.

Please read the Press Release below again, it was written to pressurise the Labour GOVERNMENT into action before the election. Sikhs are meeting a Labour Cabinet Minister later today to push Labour into action.

The Sikh Federation (UK) will unashamedly challenge any GOVERNMENT - Labour, Conservative etc. for greater Sikh rights!

PRESS RELEASE - SIKH FEDERATION (UK)

Issued - 15 April 2005

[To coincide with Michael Howard's visit to the Sikh Gurdwara in Gravesend]

LABOUR GOVERNMENT IS RACIST

The estimated 700,000 British Sikhs are honest, hard working, law-abiding citizens that the Labour Government is ignoring and taking for granted.

The Labour Government has failed to give fair treatment to Sikhs, despite them being the largest and most distinct ethnic minority in the country and being recognised for over 20 years as a separate race and ethnic group by the highest legal authority in the country. (Note 1)

Since the introduction of the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000 the Labour Government has ignored Sikhs and failed to ensure fair treatment as regards the provision of public services, such as health, education, employment etc. (Note 2)

The Sikh Federation (UK), the first and only Sikh political party, launched in September 2003 to encourage British Sikhs to engage more proactively in the political process has stated:

"The Conservative Party and the Liberal Democrats have made it clear that it is official party policy to support the separate recognition and monitoring of Sikhs by public bodies. We also have cross-party support from over 200 MPs, including many Ministers, however time is running out for the Labour Government which has to date ignored British Sikhs and our elected representatives. We are grateful for support from many individual MPs - Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrats, SNP, PC etc. but Labour is taking a big risk in denying Sikhs the right to fair treatment as recognised by law."

"Lawyers have suggested the Labour Government if prosecuted could be found guilty of racism in failing to require public bodies to separately monitor Sikhs for the purposes of the Race Relations (Amendment) Act. We feel the time is right for the Labour Government to respond to legitimate Sikh demands for fair treatment. Given the situation with Rover in the West Midlands the Sikh vote will be more important than ever."

Gurjeet Singh

National Press Secretary

Note 1: Sikhs were recognised as a distinct race and ethnic group in Mandla v Lee (1983) in the House of Lords. Race Relations legislation can therefore be used to protect Sikhs from racial discrimination.

Note 2: A petition signed by over 150 Sikh organisations was submitted to 10 Downing Street in July 2002 by a cross-party selection of MPs, led by Oliver Letwin MP, Simon Hughes MP and Labour MPs from Sikh constituencies in London, the West Midlands and the East Midlands.

For further information visit www.sikhfederation.com

[JagtarSinghKhalsa]

Labour Government Accused of Racism towards Sikh Community

Sunday 17th April, 2005

Fauja Singh - Panthic Weekly Staff

London (KP) - The British Sikh Community is estimated at 700,000-who are contributing to the Social and Economic success of the British nation through their honest, hard working, and law-abiding ethics. The Sikh community topped a recent survey carried out comparing communities living in UK and their prosperity. Even though the Sikhs in UK are contributing so much to the wider community through economic, as well as social success, they still face racism from the highest level, claims the Sikh Federation (UK).

The Sikh Federation has said the Labour Government is ignoring and taking for granted citizens of the Sikh Community. "The Labour Government has failed to give fair treatment to Sikhs, despite them being the largest and most distinct ethnic minority in the country."

The Sikh Community has been recognised for over 20 years as a separate race and ethnic group by the highest legal authority in the country. After Mandla v Lee (1983) in the House of Lords, Sikhs have had this recognition in Race Relations legislation, it should therefore be used to protect Sikhs from racial discrimination. Yet in practise, Sikhs are still not categorised and monitored as a separate ethnic minority.

In 2002, Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000 was introduced by the Labour Government, Sikhs feel the Government has failed to ensure fair treatment in regards to the provision of public services, such as health, education, employment etc. This is after a petition backed by over 150 Sikh organisations and a selection of cross party MPs was handed into 10 Downing Street in July 2002.

The Sikh Federation (UK) has made a statement in which they have said: "The Conservative Party and the Liberal Democrats have made it clear that it is official party policy to support the separate recognition and monitoring of Sikhs by public bodies. We also have cross-party support from over 200 MPs, including many Ministers, however time is running out for the Labour Government which has to date ignored British Sikhs and our elected representatives. We are grateful for support from many individual MPs - Labour, Conservative, Liberal Democrats, SNP, PC etc. but Labour is taking a big risk in denying Sikhs the right to fair treatment as recognised by law."

The Sikh Federation have gone on to say: "Lawyers have suggested the Labour Government if prosecuted could be found guilty of racism in failing to require public bodies to separately monitor Sikhs for the purposes of the Race Relations (Amendment) Act. We feel the time is right for the Labour Government to respond to legitimate Sikh demands for fair treatment. Given the situation with Rover in the West Midlands the Sikh vote will be more important than ever."

It seems the Sikh vote is more important than it has ever seemed in a general election. Sikhs throughout the UK will need convincing by the Government to vote labour, as they feel let down and betrayed by Labour, who have been in power for over 8 consecutive years, and have failed to recognise the basic needs of the Sikh Community.

Fauja Singh can be reached at fauja.singh@panthic.org.

[randip singh]

Hi Jagtar Singh,

let me quote the following from the above article;

  At the end of the 2003-04 Parliamentary Session the motions had been signed by  71 Labour MPs, 39 Conservative MPs, 20 Liberal Democrat MPs, two Ulster Unionist Party MPs, one Scottish National Party MP, one Plaid Cymru MP and one Independent Conservative MP. In addition, the Sikh Federation (UK) has received letters and messages of support from over 40 members of the Labour Government, including Cabinet Ministers, Junior Ministers and Parliamentary Private Secretaries that are unable to sign EDMs due to Parliamentary protocol

71 Labour MP's supported the motions about Sikh Human Rights, as opposed to 39 Conservatives and only 20 Liberal-Democrats.

On top of this 40 Labour Cabinet Ministers, Juniour Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries have lent their support to the Sikh Federation (UK).......that is 111 Labour MP's.............more than all the other parties put together............SO YOU HAVE DELIBERATELY SKEWED THE FIGURES....... @ .......The question should be asked Bro are you a Tory Boy or a Lib-Dem Supporter........... .....

CLEARLY LABOUR SUPPORTS SIKHS......... :TH: ...........and to add to this in Birmingham the Labour MP Khalid Mahmood was 100% behind the Sikhs after the "Behzti" incident..............

All I ask is for the facts to be presented acurately............ :e:

I am unashamedly a Socialist and a Labour supporter and always will be and from my experience they have been the one party that has consistently been behind ethnic minorities like Sikhs...............unlike the racist Tories and the wishy washy Liberals..............

[JagtarSinghKhalsa]

71 Labour MP's supported the motions about Sikh Human Rights, as opposed to 39 Conservatives and only 20 Liberal-Democrats.

On top of this 40 Labour Cabinet Ministers, Juniour Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries have lent their support to the Sikh Federation (UK).......that is 111 Labour MP's.............more than all the other parties put together............SO YOU HAVE DELIBERATELY SKEWED THE FIGURES....... @ .......The question should be asked Bro are you a Tory Boy or a Lib-Dem Supporter........... .....

CLEARLY LABOUR SUPPORTS SIKHS......... :TH: ...........and to add to this in Birmingham the Labour MP Khalid Mahmood was 100% behind the Sikhs after the "Behzti" incident..............

All I ask is for the facts to be presented acurately............ :e:

I am unashamedly a Socialist and a Labour supporter and always will be and from my experience they have been the one party that has consistently been behind ethnic minorities like Sikhs...............unlike the racist Tories and the wishy washy Liberals..............

94096[/snapback]

Please read the message carefully the reference in the message was to the PERCENTAGE of MPs from each of the three main parties.

HERE ARE THE FACTS

State of the parties at the Dissolution of Parliament - 11th April 2005

Labour 408, Conservative 160, Liberal Democrat 54

Scottish National Party/Plaid Cymru 9 (SNP 5/PC 4)

Democratic Unionist 7, Ulster Unionist 5, Sinn Fein 4

Social Democratic & Labour 3, Independent 2

Independent Conservative 2, Respect 1

Speaker & 3 Deputies 4

Total 659

The 71 Labour MPs, 39 Conservatives and 20 Liberal-Democrats was not the final position - this was the position in November 2004 when the above article was written. The final number of MPs supporting 1984 motions was 162 with a large increase in Conservative numbers following the Sikh Lobby Day on 11 November 2004 and the issue of the report titled: "The November 1984 anti-Sikh pogroms: Twenty years on a call for action."

The split between the three main parties was as follows (allowing for the 40 Labour Cabinet and Junior Ministers):

Labour (71 + 40) = 111 (27%)

Conservative 63 (39%)

Liberal Democrat 23 (43%)

In number terms Labour was the largest, however in percentage terms it was the smallest (even after allowing for Labour Cabinet and Junior Ministers)

Just for the record I am NOT a member of either the Conservative or Liberal Democrat parties. However, the Sikh Federation (UK) is working for greater Sikh rights and working with all the main political parties - it is inevitable that the GOVERNMENT in power has to be challenged if you are trying to get changes to policy that will benefit the Sikh community.

I hope you will agree the facts have been presented accurately.

[randip singh]

You heard the phrase there are Lies , Damn lies and then Statistics.............add to this Liberal Democrats too............. :e:

:cool: No you have NOT presented the facts acurately Governemnt Ministers and Labour Party MP's were greater in number ffor their support for Sikhs than any other party....................maybe you don't understannd the concept of democracy but last time I checked 111 is greater than 63 + 23 (which = 86).................and your statistical spin on the figures is a joke...........

................. in the other post you said the Labour Government was Racist.............this is clearly a DAMN LIE..........

40 Governemnt Labour Ministers have lent their voice of support to Sikhs yet you claim they are racist............. .................I don't know what your agenda is mate but it is clearly anti-Labour Party and is based on LIES........... :doh: @

Here's some more info on the Kirpan issue which Labour HAS supported.........and also about torture by the GOI against Sikhs...............

http://forums.waheguroo.com/lofiversion/index.ppa/t9955.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office, what the Office's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Parliamentary Secretary, Department for Constitutional Affairs, what the Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Defence, what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Deputy Prime Minister, what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, what her Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Health, what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department, what his Department's policy is on the wearing of the Kirpan by Sikh employees.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office, how many people currently employed by the Civil Service state their religion as Sikh.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, what recent discussions he has had with representatives of the Indian Government on the UN Convention against torture.

David Taylor (North West Leicestershire): To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, what representations he has made to the Indian government concerning the recent violent attacks on members of the Sikh community of Chattisgarh.

Here's to another Labour Victory and the Sikh Paanth Moving Forward NOT Backwards!

[kurtas]

Hi Jagtar Singh,

let me quote the following from the above article;

  At the end of the 2003-04 Parliamentary Session the motions had been signed by  71 Labour MPs, 39 Conservative MPs, 20 Liberal Democrat MPs, two Ulster Unionist Party MPs, one Scottish National Party MP, one Plaid Cymru MP and one Independent Conservative MP. In addition, the Sikh Federation (UK) has received letters and messages of support from over 40 members of the Labour Government, including Cabinet Ministers, Junior Ministers and Parliamentary Private Secretaries that are unable to sign EDMs due to Parliamentary protocol

71 Labour MP's supported the motions about Sikh Human Rights, as opposed to 39 Conservatives and only 20 Liberal-Democrats.

On top of this 40 Labour Cabinet Ministers, Juniour Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries have lent their support to the Sikh Federation (UK).......that is 111 Labour MP's.............more than all the other parties put together............SO YOU HAVE DELIBERATELY SKEWED THE FIGURES....... @ .......The question should be asked Bro are you a Tory Boy or a Lib-Dem Supporter........... .....

CLEARLY LABOUR SUPPORTS SIKHS......... :TH: ...........and to add to this in Birmingham the Labour MP Khalid Mahmood was 100% behind the Sikhs after the "Behzti" incident..............

All I ask is for the facts to be presented acurately............ :e:

I am unashamedly a Socialist and a Labour supporter and always will be and from my experience they have been the one party that has consistently been behind ethnic minorities like Sikhs...............unlike the racist Tories and the wishy washy Liberals..............

94096[/snapback]

You are socialist ? Then what you doing backing Labour ? "New" Labour are an extension of Tory rule. Nothing has changed for the ordinary man and the Labour Government lies and deceit over Iraq shows they are no better than their predecessors.

They have had 2 terms in power yet only bothered to do anything about the Kirpan issue recently. Smacks of vote capturing method to me. They have lost much of the Muslim vote and now to capture Sikh votes announce a few measures to win votes.

As for all the motions etc about human rights abuses. They really mean nothing when the Labour Government is openly trying to win arms orders for India.

[gupt_paapi]

fateh jii

i have a lil feeling that this will turn into yet anova division loll

lyk "labour voting jatha v's lib-dem-voting jatha".

Stop having a go at eachother n just present you views plz. IF no1 agrees wid u, try 2 see wot THIER point is. REMEMBA maybe ur right.. maybe ur rong. but people tend 2 forget the "maybe ur rong" part.

bhul chuk maaf ji

FATEH!

[randip singh]

You are socialist ? Then what you doing backing Labour ? "New" Labour are an extension of Tory rule. Nothing has changed for the ordinary man and the Labour Government lies and deceit over Iraq shows they are no better than their predecessors.

I am a A Socialist and Labour represents a spectrum of views ranging from the far left to the center left of politics.................essentialy as IFS figures have confirmed ................it is the party of wealth redistribution.............

Maybe you're a wishy washy confused Liberal or a Tory boy..............so you would not understand that..........

As for Iraq..............not to sure about that..........as for deciet...........any governenment is as good as the intelligence it has...............Hutton clearly directed to failures in intelligence....................my own personal feeling is that Sadam had to be taken out of the equation in the Middle East either way.........so the fact he is gone pleases me................. :TH:

They have had 2 terms in power yet only bothered to do anything about the Kirpan issue recently. Smacks of vote capturing method to me. They have lost much of the Muslim vote and now to capture Sikh votes announce a few measures to win votes.

What about all the hospitals and schools they have built?...........reduced waiting lists?..........more doctors?.............more dentists?.............

At least they are raising the Kirpan issue....................and after September the 11th and the stabbing of several kids in schools i.e. Damilola Taylor etc............the issue of knives is a hot potatoe no matter what the political spectrum............

I as a Sikh have reservations about it..................so what are politicians going to do?..............

As for Sikh votes..............they are a mere pin prick in the political arena.................the Muslims are about 2 million strong wheras we are about 0.5 million.............so if they wanted to ..........they could do nothing for us...........but they still are raising issues such as Sikh Human Rights abuses by the GOI............ ...........

SO GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT SUNSHINE!

As for all the motions etc about human rights abuses. They really mean nothing when the Labour Government is openly trying to win arms orders for India.

94138[/snapback]

Actually Human Rights do mean something despite selling of arms..............any governement be they Liberal, Labour or Tory would sell arms..................so stop being so naive..........

K SINGH,

A lie was perpertrated in the form that Labour Governemnt is racist against Sikhs despite 40 Ministers in the Labour Government and a further 71 Labour MP's supporting Sikhs...................I am just tackling lies and smears posted here by those with a vested political interest.............

[kurtas]

You are socialist ? Then what you doing backing Labour ? "New" Labour are an extension of Tory rule. Nothing has changed for the ordinary man and the Labour Government lies and deceit over Iraq shows they are no better than their predecessors.

I am a A Socialist and Labour represents a spectrum of views ranging from the far left to the center left of politics.................essentialy as IFS figures have confirmed ................it is the party of wealth redistribution.............

Maybe you're a wishy washy confused Liberal or a Tory boy..............so you would not understand that..........

As for Iraq..............not to sure about that..........as for deciet...........any governenment is as good as the intelligence it has...............Hutton clearly directed to failures in intelligence....................my own personal feeling is that Sadam had to be taken out of the equation in the Middle East either way.........so the fact he is gone pleases me................. :TH:

They have had 2 terms in power yet only bothered to do anything about the Kirpan issue recently. Smacks of vote capturing method to me. They have lost much of the Muslim vote and now to capture Sikh votes announce a few measures to win votes.

What about all the hospitals and schools they have built?...........reduced waiting lists?..........more doctors?.............more dentists?.............

At least they are raising the Kirpan issue....................and after September the 11th and the stabbing of several kids in schools i.e. Damilola Taylor etc............the issue of knives is a hot potatoe no matter what the political spectrum............

I as a Sikh have reservations about it..................so what are politicians going to do?..............

As for Sikh votes..............they are a mere pin prick in the political arena.................the Muslims are about 2 million strong wheras we are about 0.5 million.............so if they wanted to ..........they could do nothing for us...........but they still are raising issues such as Sikh Human Rights abuses by the GOI............ ...........

SO GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT SUNSHINE!

As for all the motions etc about human rights abuses. They really mean nothing when the Labour Government is openly trying to win arms orders for India.

94138[/snapback]

Actually Human Rights do mean something despite selling of arms..............any governement be they Liberal, Labour or Tory would sell arms..................so stop being so naive..........

K SINGH,

A lie was perpertrated in the form that Labour Governemnt is racist against Sikhs despite 40 Ministers in the Labour Government and a further 71 Labour MP's supporting Sikhs...................I am just tackling lies and smears posted here by those with a vested political interest.............

94164[/snapback]

I think it is a case of you being a wishy washy socialist. "New" Labour has nothing to do with socialism. As for distributing wealth, yes they have done a great job at making the rich even richer. Whilst people working in the public sector are faced with drastic changes to their pensions, MPs under Labour have had their accrual rate altered so they accrue pensions at an even higher rate, judges who invariably come from the upper classes will not be hit by new capping rules on pension funds. So all in all yes a great job "New Labour" have done in making the rich even more better off.

Look at the statistical facts quoted by another veer and you will see that in % terms Labour are not as pro Sikh as you like to pretend.

As for Iraq etc if you seriously believe that it was all down to intelligence failures then you are living in dream land.

As far as arms sales go if a government is serious about human rights abuses then they would use sanctions to block sales as has been the case against the Chinese for a while. Early day motions are nothing as nothing comes about from them.

Strange how Labour forgot the Kirpan issue right until an election was called. Reminds me of the way Blair raises the Palestine issue whenever he is going to do anything in Iraq then forgets about it after everyhting is done and dusted.

So please GET YOUR FACTS RIGHT SUNSHINE before you don the role of a "new" Labour spin doctor.