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Dashan Das's Followers


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B 'Darshan Daas follower'1 Jee,

Both have a role to play. Sant get us to Jap Naam and God gives us Mukhti.

That is true, but the physical form of a Sant that is referred to in Gurbani at times is the one who enlightens people to follow Gurmat, receive Amrit and reiterate the name of Vaheguroo. A Sant is one that attaches a being to worship the one Akaal Purakh and accept Sahib Sree Guroo Granth Sahib Jee Maharaaj as their one and only master, the living SathGuroo, not attach any person to their own feet and to worship them.

Someone who labels themselves as a Sant, distorts Sikhi and attaches people to their own feet to be worshiped, is not any Sant in Sikhi, but a Gudhaar Pappee of the Panth!

These organisations and those who head them are not faiths or “ways of living” (what Radha Soami's claim), but cults funded and supported by enemies of the Panth.

Please do not cause confusion and misunderstanding by trying to compare a Manmukh self-proclaimed “SathGuroo” to Vaheguroo Dhe Pyare Sant Mahapurkhs of the Sikh Panth.

d_oh.gifVaheguroo Jee Kaa Khalsa, Vaheguroo Jee Kee Phateh!!! d_oh.gif

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but to activate it we require the Guru Manter from one who is already attached.

sir,

I can tell from your post that either you are very brainwashed or refuse to see the truth which you keep exposing in your posts. You are on the right track but refuse to listen to your own words.

You say that one needs gurmantr to contemplate or experience Naam. What do you think The shabads from Sri guru granth sahib are? They are Dhur ki Baani, God's own worsd, what gurmantr are you searching for? The gurmantr you are looking for is used from Sri Guru Granth sahib by your "masters" and fake gurus. How are thes modern sadhus masters when they give you Gurmantr from Sri Guru Granth Sahib?

And I agree the concept of Naam is etrnal and is not limited to Sikhi. However, who gave the saints like bhagat Kabir Ji their due respect? Sikhs carry the baani of al the bhagats on their heads and bow to it. Sri Guru nanank Dev ji made sure that Bhagat kabir Ji's baani and other bhagats baani was worshipped by all and their names are attributed to the resepctive baanis. Our Guru Sahibs had no ill intentions whereas fake masters today use baani from sri guru granth sahib and make people bow to them.

Sikhs do not need to be taught how to resepct saints. We carry the saroop of Guru maharj on our heads, we wave a chaur sahib like over it like a King and people like you cannot teach sikhs how to respect saints. Saints are human beings, baani is God's light. Who respects the shabad more than sikhs, no one.

peace.

I'm done. It is in waaheguru's kirpa. some of us find the real satguru and others will go from door to door begging, not realizing the shabad guru is right there in front of them.

Fateh!

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but to activate it we require the Guru Manter from one who is already attached.

sir,

I can tell from your post that either you are very brainwashed or refuse to see the truth which you keep exposing in your posts. You are on the right track but refuse to listen to your own words.

You say that one needs gurmantr to contemplate or experience Naam. What do you think The shabads from Sri guru granth sahib are? They are Dhur ki Baani, God's own worsd, what gurmantr are you searching for? The gurmantr you are looking for is used from Sri Guru Granth sahib by your "masters" and fake gurus. How are thes modern sadhus masters when they give you Gurmantr from Sri Guru Granth Sahib?

And I agree the concept of Naam is etrnal and is not limited to Sikhi. However, who gave the saints like bhagat Kabir Ji their due respect? Sikhs carry the baani of al the bhagats on their heads and bow to it. Sri Guru nanank Dev ji made sure that Bhagat kabir Ji's baani and other bhagats baani was worshipped by all and their names are attributed to the resepctive baanis. Our Guru Sahibs had no ill intentions whereas fake masters today use baani from sri guru granth sahib and make people bow to them.

Sikhs do not need to be taught how to resepct saints. We carry the saroop of Guru maharj on our heads, we wave a chaur sahib like over it like a King and people like you cannot teach sikhs how to respect saints. Saints are human beings, baani is God's light. Who respects the shabad more than sikhs, no one.

peace.

I'm done. It is in waaheguru's kirpa. some of us find the real satguru and others will go from door to door begging, not realizing the shabad guru is right there in front of them.

Fateh!

I couldn't have said it better myself!! :TH:

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  • 4 weeks later...

Nirvair Khalsa Ji,

Quote:

That is true, but the physical form of a Sant that is referred to in Gurbani at times is the one who enlightens people to follow Gurmat, receive Amrit and reiterate the name of Vaheguroo. A Sant is one that attaches a being to worship the one Akaal Purakh and accept Sahib Sree Guroo Granth Sahib Jee Maharaaj as their one and only master, the living SathGuroo, not attach any person to their own feet and to worship them.

But my dear Nirvair Khalsa Ji,

Firstly, at no point have I lectured to you but merely endeavored to give a fuller meaningful reply that I hope adds some value to the debate. Please do not make claims that I am distorting Sikhi, if there are alternate meanings, then lets please hear them.

Whilst I agree that a Sant is one that attaches worship to God and not himself I disagree on other points

1) What you seem to be missing is that it is the SGGSJi that is directing us to go to Sants / Sadhs, why would it do that if all that was meant to happen was for the Sant / Sadh to send us straight back to the SGGSJi??

Just to take one quote from many as to why the SGGSJi directs us to go to the Sant / Sadh….

‘Sadh sang bhae aagiaakaaree, Saadh sang gat bhaee hamaaree’ (In the company of Saints, we become capable of obeying God’s commandments. In the company of Saints we are eternally delilvered.)

2) It is the SGGSJi that affords Sant / Sadhs the treatment as if they are on a par with God. I know Sikhs have a hangover about matha tekking to Saints, but it is the SGGSJi that says 'Charan Sadh ke dhoe dhoe peeo, Arap sadh kau apana jeeo' (Wash the feet of holy Saints and drink the wash, dedicate your life to the holy Saint)

3) Clearly, the status being afforded to the living Guru / Saint / Sadh in the SGGSJi and in the Bani of Saints not included in the SGGSJi is to treat them on a par with God. But more importantly, your view of what a Saint should do is not supported by the SGGSJi. It is completely at odds with what is written in the SGGSJi.

Quote:

Someone who labels themselves as a Sant, distorts Sikhi and attaches people to their own feet to be worshiped, is not any Sant in Sikhi, but a Gudhaar Pappee of the Panth!

4) You seem to be missing that Sants come from all backgrounds. Muslim, Hindu, Sikhs etc. Just because the SGGSJi has been installed it does not mean that they are papee for doing what culturally has gone on for 1000s of years and has the stamp of approval of SGGSJi.

Quote:

These organisations and those who head them are not faiths or “ways of living” (what Radha Soami's claim), but cults funded and supported by enemies of the Panth.

I speak for Maharaz Darshan Das Ji. Anybody with half a brain who bothers to do a little study on his material & miracles performed can only come to one conclusion that the Man is a Prophet of God.

5) Ps I noticed you didn’t refer to me by my name. What a joke I must say, you might have a point if the Singh name was something Sikhs could claim a right to. Singh was in use for 100’s if not 1000’s of years before Sikhs came to be. Sadly, it is quite typical for people of all religion to reduce common heritage to a state of personal wealth.

mann_kaum_layee_qurbaan

Quote

sir,

I can tell from your post that either you are very brainwashed or refuse to see the truth which you keep exposing in your posts. You are on the right track but refuse to listen to your own words.

We both know that is not true. There may be fake masters, but that is not a reason for ignoring what is clearly stated in the SGGSJi.

Quote:

You say that one needs gurmantr to contemplate or experience Naam. What do you think The shabads from Sri guru granth sahib are? They are Dhur ki Baani, God's own worsd, what gurmantr are you searching for? The gurmantr you are looking for is used from Sri Guru Granth sahib by your "masters" and fake gurus. How are thes modern sadhus masters when they give you Gurmantr from Sri Guru Granth Sahib?

Again, these are not reasons for not doing what is stated in the SGGSJi. It is no good ignoring other sections of the SGGSJi. Bani should be read in unison.

As for modern Sadhus, it is nonsensical to imply that post installation of SGGSJi there can never be any further Sants / Sadhus who are enlightened Mahapurash.

Peace.

Fateh.

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The 10th Guru said that he will make ‘One fight against Sava Lakh’, yet when he left Anandpur and was attacked he barely managed to save himself. It is ironic is it not to claim the strength of lions and yet not be prepared to go back and even save members of your own family, let alone your followers’. How can anyone claim faith in such an individual??

lol let me point something out ji.

a) They were attacked by surprise. The Mughal emporer had broken his oath on the QURAN and attacked the Singhs from behind.

b) Why wasn't Guru Ji's Army completely destroyed in one instance if each Singh couldn't fight Sava Lackh soldiers???

c) He accepted Waheguru's Sweet Will when his 2 younger sons were shaheed. And he HIMSELF sent his sons into battle to marry death - Will ur maharaaz do that?

He didn't protect his family. Infact, he SACRIFICED them for the KAUM.

Let me tell you a quick Sakhi...

After Chamkaur Sahib's battle, Guru ji walked on the battlefield, looked at his sons dead on the ground and walked on. Deya Singh called Guru Ji from behind and said "Guru Ji! Wont you even cover your sons' bodies? I shall do it then.."

Guru Ji said "No Deya. If you going to cover my sons' bodies, then you'll have to cover the rest of the Singhs's dead bodies."

Deya Singh Ji was in tears and said "but people will think - Guru Ji didn't even care about his own sons!"

Guru Ji replied "I dont care whatever poeple say.. But whatever happens, I don't want poeple to say - The Guru thought his sons were different and his Sikhs were different. I see no difference between them. I don't want Sikhi to be stained with this, so Deya Singh Ji, don't cover Sahibzaades' Bodies."

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In reply to the above quote, want to add that Guru Ji did have one sikh fight sava lakh. Guru Ji did not 'barely manage to escape' but left under the hukam of the Panj Pyare (correct me if I am wrong) which means Guru Ji was going to stay and then maybe even fight. When one understands that Guru Ji treated their family and sikhs as one then one begins to understand why I claim to have faith in and love for Guru Ji ( not any normal individual I don't think).

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In reply to the above quote, want to add that Guru Ji did have one sikh fight sava lakh. Guru Ji did not 'barely manage to escape' but left under the hukam of the Panj Pyare (correct me if I am wrong) which means Guru Ji was going to stay and then maybe even fight. When one understands that Guru Ji treated their family and sikhs as one then one begins to understand why I claim to have faith in and love for Guru Ji ( not any normal individual I don't think).

lol let me point something out ji.

Learn to read between the lines. That was put up to silence that prat persona who seems to have nothing original to say but uses his brain when it suits him.

If you have something to say against the points made above, then lets please hear them???

Fateh

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I don't see what the issue is. It is clear that militant SIkhs havn't been involved in shooting innocent religious leaders in the 80's-90's, and don't see why they would now. The Link in my previous post sheds some light on why they might have decided to get rid of him. You have completly ignored that.

159827[/snapback]

i do apologise, i havent ignored ur post above.

u have pointed out on why they have shot Darshan Das, but in the minds of the killers he was guilty so for that reason they shot him. and this belief of the killers and those behind it, is a personal belief and not based on solid fact ...ie: that he was bad mouthing Sikhi. so therefore in ur peoples eyes he was shot cos he was guilty of watever the rumours are....but the FACT is that.... you dont no that for a FACT....

apologies LK if that sounds abit wishy washy... its the end of the day!

Darshan das was shot as he was aginst the so callled khalistanism at that time.

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WJKK WJKF

well i dunno much about this guy.....havent really even heard of him...but i went to google and typed in his name and i went onto one site....and there was a pic of this so called maharaj and below da pic it sed "nanak naam chardi kala"....and below that it sed click here for "blessings"....LOL so i clicked on it and you see da pic changin and its da same maharaj but this time he's holding his hand up....you know how there are pics uv guru nanak dev ji and he has his hand to the side with a mala around it....same way he had his hand like that(no mala though)and there were flowers fallin down and below him it said "nanak naam chardi kala,tere bhane sarbat da bhala"....and on top it said get online ashirwaad..... LOL.gif it was so funny....LOLz...wow i actually got a blessing from some maharaj LOL.gif ...ok i jus thought it was kinda weird and dumb and funny...no offence...but like....they call him "satguru darshan dham"....wow....LOLz...he calls himself satguru.....who da heck duz he think he is?or was? :@ anywayz...bhul chuk muaf ji

WJKK WJKF

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Lion(LK)King

Yeah ok, well I don’t purport to be an expert on Banis and page references. The point is that you know it is there.

In response I have read it many times. A Sadhu is Sadhu (a holy man), that is the common language meaning of the word. You don’t need to go to Punjab University for that. Ask anyone on the street and you will get the same response. In the English translations of Gurubani it has been misstated as meaning Sadh Sangat. But even if you accept it is Sadh Sangat, a Sadh again is a holy person. Sadh in actual fact is someone who has done Sadhnah (Baghtee).

Also, take this translation from – http://www.srigranth.org/servlet/gurbani.gurbani?S=y

Maajh, Fifth Mehl: 5. - p. 101

naam a-ukhaDh mo ka-o saaDhoo dee-aa.

The Holy Saint has given me the Medicine of the Naam.

In this instance it has been translated correctly. If the word means general congregation then why is it understood to be different in common language?

It is not the Namdharies, Radhaswamies or Darshan Dassis who are twisting Gurubani, the onus is on the Sikhs to explain why this is being misread. If Sikhs want Sadhu to mean Sanghat because it is more in line with their beliefs, that’s fine. But please don’t accuse others of twisting Bani.

1- Nanakian philosophy (Gurmat) is completly different from Hindu mythology.. Just because Guru Ji used the word Singh -lion lol doesn't mean he copied it from an avtar of Vishnu. Jesus Christ, what's next - why was Guru Harkrishan Je's name Harkrishan.. the name probably exists in the vedas... does tha mean he's a vedist?

Nothing nonsensical about what I have stated. The point I make is that when something new comes out, there will always be some resonance from the past. The same is true about Sikhism and the point is made to those who accuse others of using their religion when much in their own beliefs has been taken from the past.

With regards to Singh / Lion, I won’t debate this as it is fairly common knowledge that the whole concept of Singh comes from Narsingh. Not just the name but from what happened historically. Please do you research. Just as the VULNERABLE child Saint Parladh was saved by Righteousness in the form of Vishnu manifesting as NarSingh to destroy the evil of Harnahshak, in the same way G. Gobind Singh Ji said my followers will be Singhs & take on the mantle of protecting the needy, the vulnerable, the Saints etc.

Also, to make references such as Hindu mythology denounces others beliefs as mere myths. I don’t think that is right. Especially, as the Guru (10th), acknowledges the 24 Incarnations.

2- The bani of Bhagat Kabir Ji per say, is not in Guru Sahib.. Only Dhur Ki Bani by Gurdev Pita ji can be found in Maharaj.

nonsensicle arguments.

Please revise.

Sorry I don’t understand what you mean by that?? This further illustrates the point that I make above -

The Bani was revealed to Kabir and forms part of his substantial holy book referred to as the Granthvali. Sections of Kabir’s bani are repeated in the SGGSJi. It is the Sikhs who claim that you can only be a liberated Sikh upon taking Kandeh dhar Amrit and yet this is not supported by the scriptures of non Sikh contributors, (even if you claim it is supported in the Bani of the Gurus).

So who is twisting whose religion / scriptures??

mann_kaum_layee_qurbaan

Outside of sikhi, people can do what they want, they can have a plant as a guru for all sikhs care.

People outside of sikhi have no right to lecture sikhs on who their master's can be.

You do your thing and let sikhs do their thing.

I am merely responding to claims by Sikhs. With that thought in mind remember it is Sikhs;

who disrupt our meetings. In the 1980’s in Derby I think, an unarmed sevak for no reason at all had his nose half sliced off with a sword attack. No doubt that Sikh will be receiving a gold medal from the Guru.

sher_panjabi

'Baani Guru, Guru hai Baani. Vich Baani Amrit saarey…

The Word, the Bani is Guru, and Guru is the Bani. Within the Bani, the Ambrosial Nectar [God's Name] is contained.' [Ang 982]

But of course the Bani is the Guru, after all it is a revelation of God. The Ambrosial Nectar is realised by some through kirtan.

That is not the issue here.

The question in play is where does Naam come from? Naam that enables us to attach ourselves to the subtle ‘Unhad Bani’ (the manifestation of Shabad Guru). Historically, it has come from Living Saints. Sikhs claim that for them it comes from the SGGSJi and accuse others of being fake, pakandi and all the rest of the garbage. But the onus is on Sikhs to explain why the opposite is stated in the SGGSJi??

The position of Sikhs can only be explained by misinterpreting words like Sadhu, Sadh & Sant etc.

Pakandi Baba

Hilarious is your utter ignorance. I tell you what, let me re-read a section of history to you with your blissful blinkered ignorance.

The 10th Guru said that he will make ‘One fight against Sava Lakh’, yet when he left Anandpur and was attacked he barely managed to save himself. It is ironic is it not to claim the strength of lions and yet not be prepared to go back and even save members of your own family, let alone your followers’. How can anyone claim faith in such an individual??

I think you get the point.

Guru Fateh.

BHAJI THIS is first time i logged on to this forum, the above example tht u hv given to Pakandi baba ws so impressive. i m a follower of Maharaz Darshan das & i m proud 2 say as i wud nt b wht i m today if i wudnt hv followed him. One simple example to all of my friends is that its upto u, how u find him(God) .....he is everywhere .....if Dhanna Jatt can find him from a Mitti da bawa........then ucan too.

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