Kirpan And Aeroplane

[Guest PRITAM SINGH KHALSA]

I never said you couldnt read JapJi alday long, non stop.

Imeant you have to read JapJi in the morning= You do have to read at certain times.

You can read Sohila all day long also but you MUST read it before bedtime.

You can read what ever you want however many times you want on your own time, but on GuruJis time you must read the precribed Bani.

He said you dont have to read at certain times because its an insult to have to read a certain times.

I dont care about "kirtan" part of the debate.Yes I know some of the Nitnem banis come from Dasam Granth. I was saying reading Asa ki // would take forever if you didnt read it from a Gutka{ which is shortened} meaning Rag Asa is the full Asa but we read a certain part of it because of the topics it covers Do you read also Asa ki //?

He was saying Guru Nanak had no part of its writing, when in fact he starts the first few headings.

He said 4th-5th Guru wrote it so Nanak didnt so the story is invalid.{which is not true, on his behalf}

I for sure read the Full 40 pauris of Anand Sahib and tell the Granthi while blessing Prashad to read the whole 430 pauris or it is invalid, in this case why dont we read JapJi to "Nanak bhagat sada vigas, sunia dukh papka naas" and stop and go to the end and read the last Salok.{{this is the same as shortening Anand Sahib. We insult Guru Amar Das Ji be shortening his bani and saying pauri 6-39 arnet good enough to recite or that we are too lazy and shorten it.

You guys dont understand the debate and I very much so read the full 40 pauris of Anand Sahib.

Conclusion: You can read anything {banis} on your own time with no problem, but you must recite the prescribed banis at a certain time.

He said Nanak wasnt apart of Sohila. When he starts it. Do you know the story of how Kirtan Sohila came about and who GuruJi was speaking to?

You all should learn the stories behind the banis it would help you everyday and in the back of your minds you would know more about what you are reading when you are reciting them.

[Guest PRITAM SINGH KHALSA]

It is the most harmonious Naad ever uttered. It multiplies the aura to the sensitivity of protection that it eliminates any negativity for miles and miles. When you are endangered by any species of direct or indirect source; when you want to protect yourself with the surrounding of the entire magnetic field of the earth, recite Kirtan Sohila before bed. It is a cure for Insomnia!

Heres 1 tiny segment of one part of the story that I was saying on the 2nd or 1st page of this thread. It tells about the forcefield you have around your body so you dont need to feel afraid while sleeping. But you must recite fully aware and do Ardass fully aware for it to work properly.

[Guest Narinder Singh]

For all the people not sticking to the topic at hand, please stop or create a new topic.

[Lionchild]

For all the people not sticking to the topic at hand, please stop or create a new topic.

lol, yeah... sorry, everyone back on topic

[MAX]

Man i hear some weird sakhis sometimes, this was one of them. The two Khalse wore their hair down and did rituals??? Hmmm, Guru Gobind Singh Ji said that a Sikh does not perform rituals even by MISTAKE, and ur telling me that Sikhs completely abandoned their kakkars and performed Hindu rituals to read a few religious texts? Those are not characteristics of the Khalsa I've heard of. Why didnt Sikhs use this strategy when a price was put on their head and they were living in jungles? Sikhs chose to die than abandon their saroop blessed to them.

When I go to functions in the Mandir of my Hindu friends, ringing the bell does not suddenly turn me into a Hindu.

But I am showing my respect towards their faith.

Chill.

And how are Sikhs marching into someone elses world? This is my world, and this is my country, im not a freakin outsider.

Marching into a temple sacred to a group of people with your arrogance in your hands is the most un-Khalsa-like thing you can do.

France is racist, dont gimme none of that preventing anti-religious attacks garbage. I think being attacked for what u believe in is better than not being able to practice what u believe.

France has the right to be what they want to be.

Why do u Sikhs wear kirpaans? Why did Guru ji gave it to us? What has it been used for? Imagine if there were a few Amritdhari Sikhs carrying kirpaans flying on the highjacked planes on 9/11, things would've been a little different dont u think?

Yeah. But the question is "what are you gonna do about it?". Are you gonna sit there, moaning? Are you gonna go out and act like a hooligan whilst convcing yourself that you're being a 'good Sikkh'? Or are you going to start an initiative to educate Westerners about the nature of Sikkhism?

Most of u guys have made really good points, but MAX, sorry, u dont make any sense, i think u have a real serious case of Sikhbarringarmsphobia.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

"Think" what you want. The truth doesn't change that you are highly misinformed about both myself and the true nature of what you perceive to be 'your religion'. With all due respect, my friend, I feel you need to broaden your horizons. Read more, learn more, live life. Realise that reailty is not the world that has been made for you since the year dot.

[Guest PRITAM SINGH KHALSA]

To me you sound Hindu. and not Sikh

My mom trys to have me go to her church. I respect it but I wouldnt go to their functions.

She wouldnt ever go to the Gurdwara so why would I bow to her church.

Sikhs respect other religions but dont go and take part of one.

People justify Hindu things with Sikhi and its not true.

Guru Gobind was an idol breaker so why would he have two men go into a mandir and forget ONE GOD.

He would tell them to respect but not bow down to their ways.

[Lionchild]

To me you sound Hindu. and not Sikh

My mom trys to have me go to her church. I respect it but I wouldnt go to their functions.

She wouldnt ever go to the Gurdwara so why would I bow to her church.

Sikhs respect other religions but dont go and take part of one.

People justify Hindu things with Sikhi and its not true.

Guru Gobind was an idol breaker so why would he have two men go into a mandir and forget ONE GOD.

He would tell them to respect but not bow down to their ways.

but you YOU are a sikh/muslijm/hindu... metaphorically speaking... :e:

i go and help my grandmom (not related) in her church, even though she doesnt go to mine.. i do not view other peopels faiths as below mine... i love my enemies as much as my friends, and i help others regardless of their "religion" we are one, and we should help out others even if they don't help us!

In regards to idol worship, your right pritam... how many people actually now why they bow down to guru granth sahib ji? some people just do it to "worship" it, but in reality, it's just done out of respect... around here, we are wrestling with that issue...

[Guest Narinder Singh]

Man i hear some weird sakhis sometimes, this was one of them. The two Khalse wore their hair down and did rituals??? Hmmm, Guru Gobind Singh Ji said that a Sikh does not perform rituals even by MISTAKE, and ur telling me that Sikhs completely abandoned their kakkars and performed Hindu rituals to read a few religious texts? Those are not characteristics of the Khalsa I've heard of. Why didnt Sikhs use this strategy when a price was put on their head and they were living in jungles? Sikhs chose to die than abandon their saroop blessed to them.

When I go to functions in the Mandir of my Hindu friends, ringing the bell does not suddenly turn me into a Hindu.

But I am showing my respect towards their faith.

Chill.

If a Hindu pandit came to a gurdwara and bowed down in from of Sri Guru Grant Sahib, id think he's a phony pandit by bowing down to teachings he doesnt believe in, i would have a lot more respect for a Hindu pandit who refused to. If a Sikh did not believe in Hindu rituals (ringing of bells), but performed the rituals anyway, he would also become a phony in my eyes. Why must a person from a different faith take part in the rituals and prayers of another faith to show respect?

And how are Sikhs marching into someone elses world? This is my world, and this is my country, im not a freakin outsider.

Marching into a temple sacred to a group of people with your arrogance in your hands is the most un-Khalsa-like thing you can do.

Arrogance? Have Sikhs ever told non Sikhs to change their look when entering a gurdwara? All we ask of them is to cover their head and be free from all intoxicants, but ur talking about Khalses adandoning their identities, their saroop that is never meant to be comprimised, would a Sikh ever tell a Brahmin to take off his Jenuo, or remove his tilak? Who are the arrogant ones here, the Sikhs or the ones who wouldnt let the Sikhs enter?

France is racist, dont gimme none of that preventing anti-religious attacks garbage. I think being attacked for what u believe in is better than not being able to practice what u believe.

France has the right to be what they want to be.

True, but i had a hard time believing that a Sikh was defending Frances' system by trying to make sense of their policy.

Why do u Sikhs wear kirpaans? Why did Guru ji gave it to us? What has it been used for? Imagine if there were a few Amritdhari Sikhs carrying kirpaans flying on the highjacked planes on 9/11, things would've been a little different dont u think?

Yeah. But the question is "what are you gonna do about it?". Are you gonna sit there, moaning? Are you gonna go out and act like a hooligan whilst convcing yourself that you're being a 'good Sikkh'? Or are you going to start an initiative to educate Westerners about the nature of Sikkhism?

U dont know me or what i do or dont do to educate others about Sikhi, so making assumptions. The 5 k's are all for practical use, they're not symbols, the kirpaan is one of the five k's, now u decide, is it a symbol that can be put aside if it may offend a few people or a part of a Sikhs body that he or she cannot live without? And if we educated westerners about Sikhi the way u think we should, they'd think we're sword carrying posers that perform rituals of another faith and actively take part in their form of worship to show respect.

Again, i believe that most of u had convincing arguments, and i agree with most of them, but max, u sound a bit wishy washy to me with ur strange sakhis and ur ringing of bells.

[The Khalsa Fauj]

[MAX]

To me you sound Hindu. and not Sikh

My mom trys to have me go to her church. I respect it but I wouldnt go to their functions.

She wouldnt ever go to the Gurdwara so why would I bow to her church.

That kind of point-scoring, 'opposing team' mentality has no place in Sikkhism.

Sikhs respect other religions but dont go and take part of one.

People justify Hindu things with Sikhi and its not true.

Guru Gobind was an idol breaker so why would he have two men go into a mandir and forget ONE GOD.

He would tell them to respect but not bow down to their ways.

"Forget"? We're not goldfish, Pritam

I went to a Church once and observed all their codes of conduct. I've been to Hindu mandirs whenever friends have functions there and do the same. All of my non-Sikkh friends (apart from the Muslim ones... ) comes to the Gurudwara on functions and bow their head in front of the Guru Granth Sahib.

Guru Gobind Singh Ji opposed idol worship, yes. But paying your respects to someone else's religion doesn't suddenly mean you're worshipping multiple Gods.

One should have enough confidence and clarity of their own beliefs to be able to do such things. It's like homophobes who make a conscious note not to associate with, respect, or 'act' like gays because they are themselves insecure about themselves on the inside.