Jump to content

Kirtan


chatanga
 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 32
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

this topic is moving towards people as individuals, wheras i was hoping it would stay more on various organisations within the panth. a person can have issues with opther people in the same jatha etc, but what im asking for opinions on is other jathas or samprdaye within sikhi, and how they differ from one another , and whether that has any bearing on whether we would attend thier programmes to listen to kirtan.

a friend of mine has said he not going to the rainsbhai at wednesfield gurdwara cos of some of the views or practices of the akj. i told him that i dont agree wiv some of the views of the akj, but the rainsbhai will be spiritually rewarding, and i might go.

Now i am putting the jutti on the other foot and asking members of various jathas/samprdayes on this forum, would you go to a kirtan event of a jatha/samprdaye who's views you dont agree wiv?

ie wud you go to a kirtan event by nihangs ? or akj? or namdharis ? if you dont agree wiv their views?

or would you look to your own spiritual progress?

also looking at someones jeevan , coudl that really help? if someone looked at the jeevan of Nihang Niddar Singh and said " i aint listening to kirtan from him..."

or similarly if some one said he duznt belive in this or that so i aint going to that programme where they practise this...."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I dont believe that we should limit who sings bani on stage. Look at Guru Nanak dev ji sachay patsha, he sang kirtan with a Muslim on rabab.

No matter what faith or what creed they could be christain, hindu, jew, somalian, muslims anything it doesnt matter but the fact of the matter is they can only sing bani... if they go on a next tangent then obviously they would have to be banished...

Ive heard many namdharis do kirtan at our gurdwaray... and to tell you the truth its the only kirtan thats made me feel connected to sachay patsha... *Admin Edited*

If i offended any one im sorry but thats what i believe!

Fateh

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To be honest I think I probably would go. At our Gurdwara when someone from the sangat with a cut beard comes on stage to do kirtan I don't walk out, because it's kirtan. Often these members of the sangat are non- veggies, but that doesn't mean I walk out.

I guess ppl see it as a different thing when it's an organisation, not just an individual. If the whole kirtan darbar was being done by a certain organisation that openly declare anti-gurmat stuff I may not go, but I wouldn't walk out.

Just my views - sori if i sed anyfink wrong blush.gif

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i would...id go to any jatha event aslong as its sikhi related..and only sikhi based things are happenig..if we belonged to the Khalsa Panth insted of a jatha or organisation this problem wudnt realise..simply beacuse we would have soo much nimarata..even though we dnt agree with their views..we respect them...and treat them as bro and sis!!

bhul chuk maaf

vahegurooo jee ka khalsa

vaheguroo jee kee fatehhhh

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The way I see it is that those that do Kirtan Seva do have an effect on the Sangat, whether we realize it or not. The effects on the Sangat can be visual and spirtual. For example if a non-Sikh or patit is doing Kirtan that can have an effect on the Sangat that it is ok to cut one's hair and more so the children and youth can get a negative impression and feel that if a non-Sikh or patit is accepted by the Sangat to lead it in Kirtan then they can also follow that path. Spiritually, if someone is of Chardee Kala and is an Amritdharee GurSikh with lots of Kamaee then some of that GurSikh's spiritual power will also be passed to the Sangat. If someone of no Spiritual power or Kamee, in the case of Namdharees they don't even believe Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji, then only negative vibes will be passed to the Sangat, whether they realize it or not. So it's not about judging others, we all have faults, but doing Kirtan Seva is a privilege, not a right, and only those who are proper Sikhs should lead, and this according to Akhal Thakat Marayda, not AKJ or anyone else. Nowadays everywhere you look anyone and everyone does Kirtan, there are no rules and no one really cares. Even at our local Gurdwara non-Sikhs do most of the Seva. That's just the way it is.

So who does Kirtan is a big deal, it's not about passing judgment, but doing what is right. That is right which benefits the Sangat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We owe it to Sikhi to put the right representatives of the Panth on stage. And that may mean not allowing someone who drinks or someone who is a dehadari follower or performs kes katal or has some vocal anti panthic views.

Ultimately its down to responsibility. Now when we are presenting kirtan or katha to the sangat than we need to ensure that we are encapsulating as much of the Panthic package as we can. Within the Gurdwara Sahib the person performing kirtan/katha has been put on the stage of Sikhi and at that point in time that person is a minister for the Guru. The sangat are focusing their energy on this individual and are looking up at this individual. Often we become mesmerized and awestruck by the person performing kirtan/katha, that’s how powerful that person can be on the stage of a Gurdwaea

If we did give our stages to naamdharis. radhosoamis, niddar singh, a mona, someone with outspoken anti panthic views etc then it is pretty irresponsible of us.

For guidelines we have guidance from Sri Akal Takht Sahib to accept what is deemed panthic and you will find almost all gursikhs, kirtanya, kathakaars, learned scholers, jathabhandis, sampardays will acknowledge and respect those guidelines.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To be honest I think I probably would go. At our Gurdwara when someone from the sangat with a cut beard comes on stage to do kirtan I don't walk out, because it's kirtan. Often these members of the sangat are non- veggies, but that doesn't mean I walk out.

I guess ppl see it as a different thing when it's an organisation, not just an individual. If the whole kirtan darbar was being done by a certain organisation that openly declare anti-gurmat stuff I may not go, but I wouldn't walk out.

Just my views - sori if i sed anyfink wrong blush.gif

Last year when Baljeet Singh Gurmeet Singh came to do keertan, i was asked to play tabla. Initially i accepted, because after hearing them do keertan and their katha, i thought, eh they arent like most mainstream naamdharis, maybe they are different.

Id heard all the accounts of them leaving and wearing sidhiya dastaaran...

anyways, on the sunday they did asa di vaar at West Ealing gurdwara,i was supposed to play, but my gurubhai came down instead and as he had been accompanying for the week, they suggested he should accompany.

then this happened http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showto...mp;#entry229569

they missed the tukh out completely. under normal circumstances namdharis recite that tukh as:

neel bastr leh kaprey fareh(instead of pehrey), turkh patani amal geya (instead of keeya)

if you check the thread i posted at the time, ull see two mp3s attatched. one at west ealing where they missed the tukh out, and an older recording where they change the bani.

Ever since this happened, ive totally gone off them. I cant listen to them, because in my heart i always remember what happened that day, and i thank maharaj i was not on the stage playing tabla with them

However the difference between naamdharis and monai is that, naamdharis distort bani, whereas monai just plain dont follow it. However monai do not do parchar saying that there are living gurus and that gurbani is like this, naamdharis do....

muslims killed us, hindus killed us, but they are not as bad as the naamdharis.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

the story behind the neel bastr leh kapre peharay and paharay is a long going arguement... some mainstream sikhs also believe the shabd is neel bastr leh kaparay paharay... apparently the sakhi is in siri sau sakhi! Im not sure abt it but i have a copy and will check!

Also they would never ever ever ever in 10000000000000000000 years wear 'sidhiya' pugha... and they will always be in namdhari bana(kurtha pajama/ kurtha kachera).

They would never wear the colour black or anything like that aswell... they are namdhari dont get them wrong! And they only make compositions in kerva on their tapes because it what the target audience wants... a nice easy beat where u can nod your head to...

The raag gian and taal gian they have is amazing you wont even begin to believe their knowledge people who listen to raag kirtan will understand this. Ive had many people who do not like raag kirtan come up to me and say vahh these people are excellent in kirtan... but then the namdhari issue comes up! i personally dont see it as a problem... And who ever said 'muslims killed us, hindus killed us, but they are not as bad as the naamdharis.' is ignorant because namdhari helped in the struggle for India's freedom... i dont want to make this a debate about khalistan or anything like that but kirtan wise to tell you the truth its either namdharis or bhai balbir singh/ Bhai avtar singh i would listen to! Nothing wrong with others but these are the ones who still sing dhrupads, sing in different tala and raga and understand what raagmala is trying to say and the importance of raag!

Thats my two pence!

Fateh

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share


  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • yeh it's true, we shouldn't be lazy and need to learn jhatka shikaar. It doesn't help some of grew up in surrounding areas like Slough and Southall where everyone thought it was super bad for amrit dharis to eat meat, and they were following Sant babas and jathas, and instead the Singhs should have been normalising jhatka just like the recent world war soldiers did. We are trying to rectifiy this and khalsa should learn jhatka.  But I am just writing about bhog for those that are still learning rehit. As I explained, there are all these negative influences in the panth that talk against rehit, but this shouldn't deter us from taking khanda pahul, no matter what level of rehit we are!
    • How is it going to help? The link is of a Sikh hunter. Fine, but what good does that do the lazy Sikh who ate khulla maas in a restaurant? By the way, for the OP, yes, it's against rehit to eat khulla maas.
    • Yeah, Sikhs should do bhog of food they eat. But the point of bhog is to only do bhog of food which is fit to be presented to Maharaj. It's not maryada to do bhog of khulla maas and pretend it's OK to eat. It's not. Come on, bro, you should know better than to bring this Sakhi into it. Is this Sikh in the restaurant accompanied by Guru Gobind Singh ji? Is he fighting a dharam yudh? Or is he merely filling his belly with the nearest restaurant?  Please don't make a mockery of our puratan Singhs' sacrifices by comparing them to lazy Sikhs who eat khulla maas.
    • Seriously?? The Dhadi is trying to be cute. For those who didn't get it, he said: "Some say Maharaj killed bakras (goats). Some say he cut the heads of the Panj Piyaras. The truth is that they weren't goats. It was she-goats (ਬਕਰੀਆਂ). He jhatka'd she-goats. Not he-goats." Wow. This is possibly the stupidest thing I've ever heard in relation to Sikhi.
    • Instead of a 9 inch or larger kirpan, take a smaller kirpan and put it (without gatra) inside your smaller turban and tie the turban tightly. This keeps a kirpan on your person without interfering with the massage or alarming the masseuse. I'm not talking about a trinket but rather an actual small kirpan that fits in a sheath (you'll have to search to find one). As for ahem, "problems", you could get a male masseuse. I don't know where you are, but in most places there are professional masseuses who actually know what they are doing and can really relieve your muscle pains.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use