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Kachi Bani


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^^In reference to what??

In general...GURBani is not "Kuchi"; many a time I have heard people refer to "dharne", some dhadi vaars etc as kuchi baani and they say it should not be sung...but in effect those things are NOT Gurbaani in the first place...I hope I have made sense or someone else can elaborate as I have to rush off and pack my dad's suitcase!

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kachi bani is referred to any religious hymns we sing in front of guru sahib that is not in gurugranth sahib

I don't understand why people refer to any praise of Guru Sahib or History of Sikhi as 'kachi' .. if it's sung with love for Guru Sahib .. it's not kachi .. It's pure.. from the heart..

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I was going to start a similar topic. Many may say its all about how much love you sing it with, like Princess said, I agree with it to an extent. If you do your research, the common languages at the time of our gurus were mostly (persian and urdu; arabic script) due to the invasion of mughals, they enforced their language, culture, and religion on the general public, hence punjabi was rarely used. One of the reasons why Guru Gobind Singh jee user Persian to write the fatehnama and zafarnama was so the mughals could understand. It was freethinkers like Guru Nanak Saheb, and other poets like Bulle Shah, Waris Shah who fought to keep our language/culture/religion alive through this oppression. Point is in sikhi, guru saheb wrote gurbani in many languages and praised akaal purkh in many ways to show there's not only one way to praise him. In Sri Guru Granth Saheb jee, there are references to many dialects, sanskrit, persian, urdu, so there isn't only ONE way.

There's an argument for and against it, and I'm sure it has been discussed before. In Guru Gobind Singh jee's divaan there use to be many singers and poets, especially during his stay at Paonta Saheb where guru sahib called poets from banaras and other parts of India to share the best of their literary works. They shared poems on topics related to love, hate, war, deceit, religion, etc. in hazooree. But also remember this was before Guru Saheb gave gurgaddi to Guru Granth Saheb jee.

I'm gonna quote Princess on this,

I don't understand why people refer to any praise of Guru Sahib or History of Sikhi as 'kachi' .. if it's sung with love for Guru Sahib .. it's not kachi .. It's pure.. from the heart.

So can someone explain what Guru Sahib jee is saying here, I've heard some mis-translate this shabd to suit their argument:

ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂਬਿਨਾਹੋਰਕਚੀਹੈਬਾਣੀ॥

Saṯgurū binā hor kacẖī hai baṇī.

Without the True Guru, other songs are false.

ਬਾਣੀਤਕਚੀਸਤਿਗੁਰੂਬਾਝਹੁਹੋਰਕਚੀਬਾਣੀ ॥

Baṇī ṯa kacẖī saṯgurū bājẖahu hor kacẖī baṇī.

The songs are false without the True Guru; all other songs are false.

ਕਹਦੇਕਚੇਸੁਣਦੇਕਚੇਕਚੀਆਖਿਵਖਾਣੀ॥

Kahḏė kacẖė suṇḏė kacẖė kacẖīʼn ākẖ vakẖāṇī.

The speakers are false, and the listeners are false; those who speak and recite are false.

ਹਰਿਹਰਿਨਿਤਕਰਹਿਰਸਨਾਕਹਿਆਕਛੂਨਜਾਣੀ॥

Har har niṯ karahi rasnā kahi­ā kacẖẖū na jāṇī.

They may continually chant, 'Har, Har' with their tongues, but they do not know what they are saying.

ਚਿਤੁਜਿਨਕਾਹਿਰਿਲਇਆਮਾਇਆਬੋਲਨਿਪਏਰਵਾਣੀ॥

Cẖiṯ jin kā hir la­i­ā mā­i­ā bolan pa­ė ravāṇī.

Their consciousness is lured by Maya; they are just reciting mechanically.

ਕਹੈਨਾਨਕੁਸਤਿਗੁਰੂਬਾਝਹੁਹੋਰਕਚੀਬਾਣੀ॥੨੪॥

Kahai Nānak saṯgurū bājẖahu hor kacẖī baṇī. ||24||

Says Nanak, without the True Guru, other songs are false. ||24||

English translate mis-interprets this shabd and we take the english translation to be the right one and misinterpret the shabd. Guru Saheb is referring to gurasa (gurmat) as gurbani and manmat (kachi bani), the baNee that doesn't do praise of akaal purkh is kachi baaNee. Har har nit kareh rasna kaheya kachu naa jaaNee as they may chant the praises of akaal purkh, but they don't know what they're saying like in this translation, guru saheb is not referring to the har jas keertan, because he already said kaljug meh keertan pardhana| but in reality guru saheb is referring to their consciousness, is their mind in the right place, they may say har har, but do they know what they're saying? Its no use if you don't know what you're saying, he goes onto say, chit jin kaa hir laya, hir laya means robbed by maya, they're just reciting mechanically like many do our nitnem including me, so this shabd is not referring to those who sing other songs of praises other than gurbaaNee.

This can be true with keertan in today's day, we can sing to the tune of shabad because we like the tune, even though we don't know what the baaNee is saying, this is where gursikhee gursikh kamaave tuk comes, if you want to truly earn the sojhi of gursikhee analyze your every action in this lifestyle that you have chosen and start analyzing gursikhee and gurbaaNee. So ultimately, guru saheb is saying ALL other songs that don't praise akaal purkh are false.

An argument against it could be that the bhagats and fakirs sang in the praise of akaal purkh, and these praises are included in Guru Granth Saheb jee, we don't consider them as our Guru, but we sing that baNee because it was approved by Guru Saheb, other baNee that was not approved by Guru Saheb we shouldn't sing. Its like saying, Gurujee, I want to express myself better to akaal purkh than you have done in GurbaaNee, I want to sing this composition by so and so, instead of singing what's written in Guru Granth Saheb isn't that doing beadbi to Guru Saheb? So I don't think its right to sing songs of praises other than gurbaNee, but as long as its according to gurmat, I don't think its wrong either.

Bhul chuk muaf.

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kachi bani is referred to any religious hymns we sing in front of guru sahib that is not in gurugranth sahib

I don't understand why people refer to any praise of Guru Sahib or History of Sikhi as 'kachi' .. if it's sung with love for Guru Sahib .. it's not kachi .. It's pure.. from the heart..

Bani from SGGS is called "GUR"Bani not "My or Your"Bani, whenever something not gurbani its (to simply put) kachi bani. Its ok as long as it refers to gurbani and not something we make up. The issue is that most of the so called kachi bani that people sing today is not kachi bani or bani at all, they fall under the category of babani kahani. Babanis Kahania are to remind us of our past but not to guide us of our future. Hope that helps.. (kinda sleepy so can't really post a lot.. :D )

Best eg is can think is:-

Gurbani:-

slok mÚ 5 ]

sulok mu 5

Shalok, Dakhanay Fifth Mehl:

pihlw mrxu kbUil jIvx kI Cif Aws ]

pehilaa murun kubool jeevun kee shadd aas

First, accept death, and give up any hope of life.

hohu sBnw kI ryxukw qau Awau hmwrY pwis ]1]

hohu subhunaa kee raenukaa tho aao humaarai paas

Become the dust of the feet of all, and then, you may come to me. ||1||

Kachi Bani:-

pehilla maran kabool kar jeevan ki chad aas tu, ve mereya manna, jeevan ki chad aas tu, ve mereya manna. Pehle ban charna di thood tu, fir aai mere dwaar tu, ve mereya manna|| -taken from sant bhupinder singh's diwan at vill thikriwal year 2001
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Guest _Mastana_

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa!

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

Temporary ji, Dhaarna is not kuchi bani - it's the same as katha but done musically. I know there are people who don't agree with katha either, that's their loss.

The aim is to explain the Shabad in language that makes it easier for Sangat to understand. In most cases, after singing the Dhaarnna, the Kirtanee will read out the actual Shabad.

Gurbani clearly states what kuchi bani is - the post by Talikhaak above is a good example. If you look at the WHOLE shabad and not just 1 line.

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Us speaking is Kachi ''bani'' as everyone likes to put it, even when doing kirtan when they say dhan sri guru granth sahib jee, that to an extent is ''kachi bani'' also its not written in guru granth sahib jee, so it seems the ppl who make the fuss do it aswell. lol.

as i always put it, kaljug is strong, ppl are loosing the plot and rejecting everything, hence the leaders have fallen, the jathedars are falling and everything to an extent is a shambles.

maharaj jee kirpa karan

sant jarnail singh jee used to singh, sir javeh to jaaveh, etc etc . . .and used to inpsire the whole panth with the darnas, katha. . .maharj kirpa karan and we get to see them days once again

Fateh

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