Jump to content

Why Wasn't A Women Appointed A Guru?

Guest Question

Recommended Posts

Guest Question

Sangat Ji

I had a question from a guy i know, i did not know how to answer

He asked at the time of the gurus why was no women appointed guru, why were they all men. If we believe a man and women and equal why did no woman get Guruship....?

I am lost on how to answer fully, the obvious answer is it was the Devin will of Waheguru.....the ultimate , the none questionable .....my saviour!

However this gentleman is not so convinced in this answer and i need to give him a fuller answer...I hope some one will be able to help me.

Thank you

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh!

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest _japmans_

i think it has to do heavily with the contextual atmosphere of Sikhi in India at the time of our Guru Sahibaan.

Woman was an inferior gender at that time. The appointment of a female Guru would likely not have been received in the same light as a woman being appointed to a high political power today.... in fact, had there been a female Guru at the times of our Gurus, i would suggest that it would have turned many people AWAY from Sikhism.

Even today we don't have absolute equality between man and woman, though i would posit that it's a better situation today (in most parts of the world) than it was back then... We are in the midst of turning our world into one that practises gender equality, but we are not there yet.. and Guru Nanak preached this message almost 600 yers ago, and others before him tried to as well (i'm thinking Ancient Greece)... there is no overnight solution... I'm pretty sure a female Guru might have destroyed "credibility" of Sikhi in the eyes of many of the followers.

Link to post
Share on other sites

This came to my mind as well. The answer is pretty simple.

Our Gurus came at a time when women and so-called lower castes were oppressed. One might wonder why were the Gurus born into so-called high caste Kshatriya families. Gurbani speaks strongly against castes and stresses the equality of genders. Imagine if our Gurus were born into so-called lower castes, or if any of the Gurus were women. Would this message have such a strong impact? Would anyone bother listening to a "lower caste" preaching against caste? Would anyone bother to care about a woman preaching gender equality? But no! Here we had MEN of "HIGHER" castes spreading the message of gender equality and condemning the caste system. This was a shock for the rotten society of those times and was a massive revolution in itself, and thus it took India by storm and hit the minds of everyone like a thunderbolt. People were like "THESE MEN ARE SPREADING THE NOTION THAT GENDERS ARE EQUAL"..."THESE HIGH CASTE KSHATRIYAS ARE SPREADING THE MESSAGE OF THE USELESSNESS OF THE CASTE SYSTEM". This had a profound effect on the psyche of all classes (castes) of Indians. The so-called lower castes who had been suppressed saw hope, and the fanatical higher castes also woke up to reality. Those woman oppressing men got a jolt when they saw these MEN speak out against the idea of considering women as inferior or impure. High castes spoke against castes. Men spoke in favor of respecting women. This was something totally new and unheard of. The message of gender equality and equality of all mankind might not have had such a profound impact if our Gurus were women or from so-called lower castes. But this is just my way of looking at it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

according to Bhai Gurdas ji...

dhichai poorab dhaevanaa jis dhee vasath thisai ghar aavai||

Liabilities of the previous births have to be settled and the thing goes to the house it belongs to.

bait(h)aa sodtee paathisaah raamadhaas sathiguroo kehaavai||

Now Guru Ram Das, a Sodhi emperor, seated on the Guru-seat is called the True Guru.

pooran thaal khattaaeiaa a(n)mrithasar vich joth jagaavai||

He got dug the complete Holy tank and here settling down at Amritsar, he spread his light.

oulattaa khael khasa(n)m dhaa oulattee ga(n)g samu(n)dhr samaavai||

Wondrous is the play of the Lord. He can cause Ganges running in opposite direction merge in the ocean.

dhithaa leeeai aapanaa anadhithaa kashh hathh n aavai||

You get your own, given nothing cannot bring to you anything.

fir aaee ghar arajanae puth sa(n)saaree guroo kehaavai||

Now the Guruship entered the house of Arjan (Dev) who, to say was the son, but, he proved through his good deeds to be worthy of the Guru-seat.

jaan n dhaesaa(n) sodteeou horas ajar n jariaa jaavai||

This Guruship would not go beyond Sodhis because none else can bear with this unbearable.

ghar hee kee vathh gharae rehaavai ||47||

The thing of the House should remain in the House.(47)

what i understand from this...

the Guruship was all predetermined by Waheguru, based on past karams. being Guru was at times an unbearable task. think of Guru Arjan Sahib on the tava, Guru Har Krishan ji saved so many lives from disease but did not save his own (though he could have), Guru Teg Bahadur gave his life for Sikhi and freedom. Guru Gobind Singh ji gave his entire family for Sikhi...

only the Gurus preordained by Waheguru could endure such things. the fact that they were men or women is irrelevant. caste, name, sex, race... none of these things matter in sikhi.

hukam rajaaee chalanaa naanak likhiaa naal ||1||

O Nanak, it is written that you shall obey the Hukam of His Command, and walk in the Way of His Will. ||1||

all the matters is God's will.

oh, and he probably thought about all the stuff Mehtab mentions about culture, religion and society at the time. :) it's cool how waheguru always knows just the right thing to do. :)

Link to post
Share on other sites

One Thing if you have noticed...Maharaj Ji, In Gurbaani uses the word Mahalla Pehla or Dooja...so on...

The word Mahalla means 'Woman'...So Our Gurus called themselves Women of the Lord...

It is believed in Sikhism that the only man is LORD himself and the rest (humans and animals and whatever else) are women...that's why in Gurbaani sometimes we come across the word "Pir"...Pir Means Husband...And it is used for god.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 5 years later...

We need to ask the True God for factual answer that why no Women Guru? I am not satisfied with all above quotes. Some says women were same like lower cast and Gurus were higher cast. But it could be some political reasons which we are not aware of. Instead of saying all upon Waheguru's will, better try to find out the real reason. What about Gurus' wives? they were not lower cast!!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

We need to ask the True God for factual answer that why no Women Guru? I am not satisfied with all above quotes. Some says women were same like lower cast and Gurus were higher cast. But it could be some political reasons which we are not aware of. Instead of saying all upon Waheguru's will, better try to find out the real reason. What about Gurus' wives? they were not lower cast!!!

it was all gurus hukam !!

do you have any idea how much bhagti it takes for a pair to have such a holly spirit to take birth from that womans womb?

just like a king cannot come in a dirty home

same goes for vessel and the male

they do lot of bhagti and a good holy spirit takes birth from a holy womb cleaned by spirituality

guru teg bahadur ji did 26 years of tap before guru Gobind singh ji were born

and it would be pure stupidity to say why guru was not a female.

no one knows it was guru's will.

there were many bhramgiani women too . a lot spiritualy active then males in guru nanaks court

but who can question it? when you start questioning the choices guru's made

thats part of your stupidity , nothing else

i see id's like these digging old topic trying to stir up commotion ,

while al you did just made an account and straight away posted on this topic? aa hi mileya si?

wish mod's would keep a close eye in future on these mischievous accounts

Link to post
Share on other sites

Read about Bibi Bhani. She was the closest women to attain Guruship but she herself decided otherwise.. :) And why do we need a woman when we have Guru Harkrishan Sahib ji! He was the youngest Guru ever. :) That always proofs that we seen anything equally.. :) Read up the about the big Kaurs in itheaas

Link to post
Share on other sites

Why are people questioning Hukam? The Gurus became so because God willed it, the Gurus Deserved to be Gurus. Read about Lava and Kush. Who are we to questions Gods will and in some cases, come up with sexist answers.

Our karam is based on our deeds earned, therefore we get what we deserve. There were female bhagats during the gurus times, but as Harasharanji said, we are all one, with no identity of caste or greed we're all of the same light of Truth. So when we're all equal, a woman can be a Guru.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Terry Milewski has targeted Sikhs for decades now.  I still remember his "somosa politics" garbage piece to paint us as terrorists/supporters over a decade ago. He, along with notorious sellout Ujjal Dosanjh, and National Posts's Jonathan Kay are a trio who go to great lengths to knock us down in the public's eyes. They will list off all the usual GOI propaganda points and barely mention the atrocities we've had to face.  They want to instigate us, annoy us, shame us, and make it seem perfectly acceptable to tarnish a small minority community with no nation state to call home. Try it with the Palestinians, we should ask these bastards. They wouldn't dare. Other thing is, Milewski knows our reaction pattern to his same old garbage. He relies on us to protest so he can have a few minutes of attention and sell a few books.
    • Terry is from England   wiki Terry Milewski (born 1949) is a Canadian journalist, who was the senior correspondent for CBC News[2] until his retirement in 2016.[3] Terry Milewski Terry Milewski at University of Regina. Born 1949 1949/1950 (age 70–71)[1] Nationality English, Canadian Education Shrewsbury School Occupation Journalist Employer CBC News Children 2 Milewski has reported in television, radio, and print media, from many places around the world. Assignments have included Ottawa, Calgary, Jerusalem, Europe, the Middle East, South America and the United States. He emigrated to Canada from the United Kingdom.     Early lifeEdit Milewski's parents immigrated to the United Kingdom before he was born. His father was a Polish medical student who fled Warsaw to serve with the 7th Armoured Division in North Africa.[4] He completed his training in Edinburgh, where he met Milewski's mother, who was the daughter of an Egyptian doctor and a Scottish mother. She grew up in an upper-class family in Alexandria and attended boarding school in Scotland as a child. She was disowned for marrying a non-Muslim.[4] Milewski was educated at Shrewsbury School, where he won the school's upriver swim.[4] He dropped out of the University of Oxford after a six-month illness and later left Keele Universityafter he was caught sunbathing in the nude.[4]    
    • You don't have to but i don't see anything wrong if they asked you to do so. I went for this for some scan and i didn't remove it.  I doubt they or you will have to take off keski for this. 
    • Depends on your level. If you are PRO then go for known brand Nagi or Yamuna etc.  If you are at the beginner level then any good regular harmonium is good. Always buy a new one and make sure to get it set by someone professional or a known ragi person in your area. (like a tune up - not sure if needed but i did). Try Ebay, you can find some harmoniums there.
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use