The Real Truth....let The Brainwashing Begin....

[Ksinghni]

wjkk wjkf!!!

sangat jee,

i believe everyone will benefit from reading an email below of how exactly the narinder grewal cult start their brainwashing...

the questions are from someone who wanted to ask 'dassandas' (aka Surinder) some questions...the answers from surinder are in red...he types back in capitals....

waheguru!!!

wjkk wjkf!

IK OANKAAR SAT NAAM SATGUR PARSAAD> DHAN DHAN PAAR BRAHAM PARMESAR JI> DHAN DHAN GUR-GURU-SATGUR-GURBANI-SAT SANGAT-SAT NAAM> > GURU PYARE I JEE:> > GOD BLESS YOU WITH THE GUR PARSAAD AND REMOVE YOUR DUBIDHA, DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS.> >

For a very long time, I have hoped to speak to someone about my feelings and thoughts and the way that i am. In Sangat, I said that I still feel that I have so many questions but felt that until I meet Babaji, they won't go away and that i feel held back. Naamjeevan and the sangat suggested that i try and speak openly in sangat or that if I have any questions, to ask you or Babaji directly if I felt more comfortable. Therefore with great humility, I wanted to ask if you would mind answering some questions so I can put things away and move on in my life and most importantly on the true path.> >

IT IS A REAL GOOD THING TO SPEAK OUT AND SEEK FOR THE TRUTH – THE ETERNAL TRUTH – WHICH IN ITSELF IS A GUR PARSAAD AND ETERNAL BLESSING, HIDING IS NOT GOOD, STRIKING A BALANCE BETWEEN THE INSIDE AND OUTSIDE BASED ON THE TRUTH – THE ETERNAL TRUTH IS THE BEST THING THAT CAN HAPPEN TO YOU, THAT IS ALL BANDGI ABOUT – INSIDE IS AS OUTSIDE – INSIDE IS PURE PIOUS TRUTH AND OUTSIDE IS SAME AS INSIDE, SO TAKING OUT YOUR ILLUSIONS, DELUSIONS AND DOUBTS IS BANDGI, WHICH IS AGAIN A GUR PARSAAD – THE ONE WHO KILLS ALL HIS DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS AND GETS OUT OF DUBIDHA – DUALITY BECOMES DHAN DHAN – WE CAN SAY SUCH A PERSON BECOMES A BRAHAM GYANI – JIVAN MUKT – SANT. SO UNLESS YOU REALIZE AND START WORKING ON DELETING YOUR DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS, HOW CAN YOU GET THERE, INLIGHT OF THIS DIVINE WISDOM YOUR STEP FORWARD IN THIS DIRECTION IS COMMENDABLE, YOUR COURAGE IS COMMENDABLE, TO OPEN UP YOURSELF AND BECOME INTERNALLY NAKED BEFORE THE SAT SANGAT IS THE PATH TO ETERNITY, SO YOU CAN ASK AS MANY QUESTIONS AS YOU HAVE WITHOUT ANY HESITATION AND WITH THE GUR PARSAAD YOU WILL BE ABLE TO REMOVE ALL YOUR DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS.> >

My name is ***** kaur and I am blessed to be married to Bin. By being in his familiy, my eyes, mind and soul have been opened to so many different things, most significantly meeting Babaji's sangat, the true sangat of Maharaj. My background however, is a lot more orthodox where my mum's side of the family are all AKJ and thereofre my upbringing was strongly tied to those beliefs. S> Since meeting with Naamjeevan and the sangat, I have realised so many false ideas including the necessity of the hair etc. I have recently told my parents that I have cut my hair. they reacted badly but since have come around slowly. Although, I stongly believe that hair is not necessary to reach Parbrahm, I cna't explain in my mind why there were so many shaheeds who would rather die than cut their hair if there was no spiritual meaning to it eg Bhai Taru Singh ji. I asked Jaspal Ji this question who said it was in demonstration to be free to choose to keep it or cut it, in protest for freedom. I can understand this idea but part of me questions and wants to know, is this the truth? how can the whole world be so misguided if this was the truth?? My fear is I believed what i was told before in the sikh world, which i know to be false, but is this the truth as well or do i just wnat to believe. I just want to know what is the real truth. Was our history all a lie?? Was everything i was taught false???> >

WE HAVE BEEN PREACHING PURAN BANDGI – AND WE REPEAT – PURAN BANDGI – THAT IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE UNDERSTOOD BY THE SAT NAAM PARIVAAR, IF THEY HAVE NOT UNDERSTOOD BEFORE. AND PURAN BANDGI HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE OUTSIDE DRESS AND OUTSIDE COMPLIANCE AND OUTSIDE RITUALS, IT IS THE INSIDE PILGRIMAGE, PURAN BANDGI IS THE CLEANSING OF YOUR HIRDA, PURAN BANDGI IS THE INTERNAL COMPLIANCE – COMPLIANCE OF PANJ DOOTS AND ASA TRISHNA MANSHA – DESIRES, PURAN BANDGI IS A COMPLIANCE OF WINNING OVER THE MAYA, PURAN BANDGI IS THE JIVAN MUKTI AND BECOME A SANT HIRDA, PURAN BANDGI IS THE COMPLIANCE OF THE ATAM RUS – THE HIGHEST AMRIT – THE BRAHAM GYAN AMRIT – THE HIGHEST AMRIT, PURANBANDGI IS ABOUT ACHIEVING PARAM PADVI AND BECOME ONE WITH THE ALMIGHTY, AND IN SUCH A BANDGI THERE IS NO PLACE FOR ANY KIND OF DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS, DELUSIONS AND OR DUBIDHA. THE SHAHEEDS DID SO BECAUSE THEY WERE SERVING THE TRUTH AND DIDN'T BOW TO THE UNTRUTHFUL. DID ANYBODY TELL YOU TO CUT YOUR HAIR? OR IT WAS YOUR OWN FREEDOM THAT PROMPTED YOU TO DO SO, CAN YOU COMPARE YOUR CUTTING OF THE HAIR WITH THE SHAHEEDS? ARE THESE THE DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS THAT ARE BOTHERING YOU? DO YOU WANT TO MOVE ON THIS PATH TO PURAN BANDGI – COMPLETE TRUTH? THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FOLLOWING A TRADITION AND FOLLOWING WHAT IS THE ETERNAL TRUTH – IS IT MORE IMPORTANT TO FOLLOW THE TRADITIONS OR FOLLOW THE ETERNAL TRUTH? IF THE TRADITION WAS THE TRUTH THEN EVERYBODY SHOULD BECOME A SANT – IS IT TRUE? HAS IT HAPPENED? AT LEAST HAS IT HAPPENED AROUND YOU?> > >

Another thing that plays on my mind is the importance of the Guru Granth Sahib Ji. Throughout my life, Bani has saved me in so mnay ways, given me support when i needed it the most. I feel the most connection with God when i sing His praises. Some of the sangat call the Guru Granth Sahib a "book". A book of information, poetry, a simple "book". I feel hurt when they say this. I think Guru's Bani has so much power that shouldn't we refer to it with reverence and respect, for example, I have the utmost respect for urself and BabaJi and would feel so wrong to call u anything other than with repectful name. Am i wrong in my feelings?? am i still being too hard core??? Please help me understand as I do feel hurt about this.> >

GURBANI IS THE GURU – GURBANI IS "SAT", THAT IS WHY IT IS GURU, BECAUSE SAT IS THE GURU, DOING WHAT GURBANI IS TELLING YOU TO DO IS THE KEY TO SUCCESS, AND WHO IS TELLING YOU TO STOP RESPECTING GURBANI, OR STOP PRACTICING GURBANI, YOU CAN CALL GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI AS GURU ONLY IF YOU ARE DOING WHAT THE GURU IS TELLING YOU TO DO, AND THAT IS THE HIGHEST RESPECT YOU CAN GIVE TO YOUR GURU – BY FOLLOWING HIS WORDS AND THE WORDS ARE GURBANI. WHEN YOU PRACTICE GURBANI IT BECOMES YOUR WISDOM, IF YOU DON'T PRACTICE GURBANI THEN IT IS JUST A PIECE OF DIVINE KNOWLEDGE AVAILABLE TO YOU AND NOTHING MORE THAN THAT. AND WHEN YOU PRACTICE GURBANI IN YOUR DAILY LIFE THEN YOU ONE DAY WILL BECOME WHAT GURBANI WANTS YOU TO BECOME. SO WHO IS RESPECTING GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI MORE? THE ONE WHO PRACTICES AND BECOMES GURBANI OR THE ONE WHO FIGHTS OVER MAINTAINING THE TRADITIONS. EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS AROUND YOU GIVES YOU A DIVINE MESSAGE – IF YOU REALIZE THIS DIVINE MESSAGE THEN YOU BECOME DHAN DHAN- IF YOU FIGHT WITH IT THEN YOU LOOSE – BECAUSE EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENS IS THE HUKAM. PLEASE AGAIN KEEP IN YOUR MIND THAT WE ARE TALKING OF PURAN BANDGI – AND YOUR DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS AND DELUSIONS CAN ONLY GO WITH THE GUR PARSAAD. YOU WILL HURT YOURSELF BEYOND ANY KIND OF MEASURABLE PROPORTIONS IF YOU WASTED YOUR LIFE IN FIGHTING WITH THESE KIND OF ILLUSIONS, DOUBTS AND DELUSIONS. IF PRACTICED - GURBANI HAS THE SUPER DIVINE POWER TO SAVE YOU TO THE HIGHTS OF THE SPIRITUAL WORLD AND MAKE YOU A PURAN BRAHAM GYANI.> >

Another question I have is why do we say Satnaam instead of Waheguru?? I haven't been able to truely understand the reason. Please could u explain.> >

SAT IS THE NAAM AND WAHEGURU IS THE MAHIMA OF SAT NAAM – AND SAT NAAM IS GUR PARSAAD. THERE HAS BEEN SEVERAL GUR PARSAADEE WRITING ON THIS TOPIC POSTED ON THE WEBSITE, WHICH YOU CAN READ AND UNDERSTAND. HARJIT JEE PLEASE SEND HER THE LINKS TO THESE WRITINGS. ALL THE ANSWERS TO ALL YOUR QUESTIONS HAVE ALREADY BEEN ANSWERED IN THESE GUR PARSAADEE WRITINGS WITH THE GUR PARSAAD – ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS READ THEM AND PRACTICE THEM.> >

there is so much that holds me back from completely releasing from my old path and completly believing in this one. I feel I need to understand why everything I grew up with was false eg importance of a turban. beard, not eating meat, 5 kakaar... why were we told it was necesssary??? (even though i know that it is not needed) etc. I need to believe that this path is truely the "truth". I feel i need to be able to tell my family why I don't believe in what they believe and can tell them in complete confidence the reasons why. I know logic is the truth but how does our history tie into this.> >

PLEASE LOOK AT YOUR OWNSELF AND DO A SELF ASSESSMENT BETWEEN WHAT YOU WERE AND WHAT YOU ARE NOW AND WHY WERE YOU ATTRACTED TO COME AND JOIN THE SAT NAAM SAT SANGAT. YOUR QUESTIONS ABOUT EXTERNAL COMPLIANCE AND THE IMPORTANCE OF INTERNAL COMPLIANCE HAS ALREADY BEEN TALKED ABOUT. NOBODY IS STOPPING YOU FROM FOLLOWING THE EXTERNAL COMPLIANCE, BUT WE ARE TELLING YOU TO START WORKING ON THE INTERNAL COMPLIANCE. YOU DON'T NEED TO TELL ANYBODY ABOUT WHAT YOUR BELIEFS ARE BUT YOU NEED TO PROVE IT TO THE GOD THAT YOU HAVE A FULL AND COMPLETE FAITH AND TRUST IN HIM, THAT YOU ARE DEVOTED TO HIM, THAT YOU HAVE GIVEN YOUR TUNN MUNN AND DHAN TO HIM IN ALL PRACTICAL WAYS IN YOUR LIFE, THAT YOU HAVE COMPLETELY SURRENDERED TO THE GUR AND GURU, AND THAT YOU ARE PRAYING FOR THE GUR PARSAAD OF PURAN BANDGI – NAAM SIMRAN, NAAM KI KAMAI, PURAN BANDGI AND SEVA – PARUPKAAR AND MAHA PARUPKAAR. WHEN YOU REACH THE PURAN BANDGI STAGE – THEN IT WILL BECOME GOD'S RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE THE REST OF THE WORLD BECOME AWARE THAT THERE IS A SANT SITTING BY THE NAME ISMINDER JEE. THERE IS NO LOGIC BEHIND DIVINITY – THERE IS NO LOGIC BEHIND DIVINE POWERS. IT IS ALL GUR PARSAAD. SO IS IT MORE IMPORTANT TO CONVINCE YOUR FAMILY OR ENHANCE YOUR FAITH AND TRUST, DEVOTION AND LOVE TOWARDS GUR AND GURU.> >

Please forgive me for my ignorance. I feel very stupid as everyone around me has let go and moved on and I still feel stuck. Please forgive me, i am truely a fool but please bless me so i can understand and move on and believe with all my heart. If u wouldn't mind, can I ask u questions if I have any in the future also? I would feel so blessed and grateful that I feel like crying. I feel like i want someone to say to me that what I believe now is the real "truth" and the past was not real becuase of these reasons....Please again forgive me.> > PLease accept my humble dandouth to ur beautiful blessed charan, Satnaam...Satnaam....> > Thank you.> > ******* Kaurr> >

AS LONG AS YOU ARE TRAPPED IN THE DOUBTS, ILLUSIONS, DELUSIONS AND DUBIDHA YOUR PROGRESS WILL BE VERY VERY SLOW, AS SOON AS YOU COME OUT OF THESE DOUBTS AND DUBIDHA THEN YOUR SPIRITUAL PROGRESS WILL BE UNBELIEVABLE, AS LONG AS YOU KEEP ON ENHANCING YOUR FAITH AND TRUAT AND YOUR DEVOTION AND LOVE AND AS LONG AS YOU KEEP ON GIVING YOUR TUNN MUNN AND DHAN TO THE GUR AND GURU YOUR SPIRITUAL PROGRESS WILL BE UNIMAGINABLE. YOU CAN ASK AS MANY QUESTIONS AS YOU HAVE, DON'T HIDE ANYTHING, SHARE YOUR THOUGHTS AND QUESTIONS TO GET AN ANSWER AND WE WILL TRY TO HELP YOU.> > THANKS TO ALMIGHTY A ZILLION TIMES FOR GIVING US AN OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK TO YOU.> > GOD BLESS YOU WITH THE GUR PARSAAD OF NAAM SIMRAN, NAAM KI KAMAI, PURAN BANDGI AND SEVA – PARUPKAAR AND MAHA PARUPKAAR. ONE LAST THING DHAN DHAN BETI NAAMJIVAN JI IS A DHAN DHAN SANT AND OUR HEAD IS UNDER THE DUST OF HER FEET FOREVER, SO PLEASE TAKE FULL ADVANTAGE OF HER SANGAT, SHE IS SITTING SO CLOSE TO YOU AND SHE IS ACCESSIBLE TO YOU ON A 24 HOURS BASIS.> > DASSAN DASS>

[Harjeet.Singh]

I think these people have devised there own "random word Generator (which refers to God)" Seems to me there tactic, is to just talk crap then throw in a few "IK OANKAAR SAT NAAM SATGUR PARSAADs"

They say they speak the truth with no evidence. Then during a middle of a sentance they will add in some more God-refering words to make it believable, using there "random word Generator (which refers to God)"

"IT IS A REAL GOOD THING TO SPEAK OUT AND SEEK FOR THE TRUTH – THE ETERNAL TRUTH – (whilst discussing among themselves, they will think, "yes now is a good time to use a random praise" "IK OANKAAR SAT NAAM SATGUR PARSAAD"

"WE HAVE BEEN PREACHING PURAN BANDGI – AND WE REPEAT – PURAN BANDGI – THAT IS WHAT NEEDS TO BE UNDERSTOOD BY THE SAT NAAM PARIVAAR and we will repeat puran bandi and we will repeat this again and again puran bandgi puran bandgi, HEY ARE YOU BRAINWASHED YET? "lets throw in some more ik onkaars" WE HAVE BEEN PREACHING PURAN BANDGI – AND WE REPEAT – PURAN IK OANKAAR SAT NAAM SATGUR PARSAAD"

WE WILL NOT STOP TILL YOU ARE BRAINWASHED, puran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAADpuran bandi puran bandi IK ONKAAR SATNAM GUR PURSAAD"

ok EnOuGh Of ThAt.

The ingredients to there brainwashing is repitition of statements, and of random praises to God, and

Reverse psychology . Blend these together, and you have............. a New follower.

For example, the use of the word dassan das. They think they are eliminating the ego, by refering to themselves as God's slave rather than "I" or "me"

But they are still talking about themselves, and putting themselves in the context. They really mean "I" or "me" But because they have have used "das" instead of "I" people are falling for it.

a real "das" would rarely mention themselves, but they would show that they are infact "das" by actions and humility. Just calling yourself "das" doesn't really mean you are. This is why it is reverse psyschology.

[dalsingh101]

If you are brutally frank you should realise that the real problem lies in the stupidity of people in the quom, in that they are duped by such people. Nothing else.

[Singhstah]

OH NO, GOD WILL STRIKE YOU NOWW!! RUNNNNN!!

[supadupa]

The award of The King of the Moorakhs goes to........

Narinder Grewal - Moorakh extrodinaire!

[Jaspaul Singh]

this guy is still around?! The last I heard of him and his cult was toronto sangat raiding his home here...... so im assuming he hasnt stepped down

[dalsingh101]

Some Panjabis are so gullible to people pretending to be mahapurshes, it's not funny. If it isn't one dera sant, than it is another.

What is the underlying reason for this naievity? Is it the quick fix thing, where they think prostrating themselves infront of such a person will bring quick results in terms of what they want?

I know one otherwise "clued up" fellow, who followed a dera sant who made him quit meat and alcohol (fair enough) on the promise that he will have a son. Two girls later, the guy is somewhat miffed.......

Dera sant gets out of it saying.....you are not doing something right, everytime. The same guy suggested and blessed a marriage (sanjog) between the daughter and son of members of the sangat. Cue two years later, they had the most bitterest divorce and are not talking to each other. The father does not even see the son and the wife has remarried.

[singh_comradz]

I remember watching a video a 5-6years ago from gta in which narinder grewal was sitting on a couch with some of his chelay (so called singhs and kaurs) sitting around him.

In the video, grewal used obscene language against Guru Nanak Dev Jee and Guru Granth Sahib Jee Maharaaj.

Apparently this video was distributed to sangat in canada and people exposed him as a result.

Not sure if theres any more copies still going around.?

n.b. grewals meant to be living in the luton area and has trimmed his beard since. I have a recent pic of him which I'll try and upload

more info on him

http://www.sikhsentinel.com/sikhsentinel03...indergrewal.htm

[S1ngh]

So i guess he is back on his internet thingy.. Whats the use of him signing this contract: http://www.sikhsentinel.com/sikhsentinel03...s%20GuruDum.pdf

[Azaad]

so hes in luton now??