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Enemies Of The Panth


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There are other sects as well. The Nirankaris, whose ideological differences with the Sikh community led to 13 people being killed in a clash at Chowk Mehta in Amritsar in April 1978; the Namdhari sect that has followers in the state but has remained largely non-controversial; the biggest of them all, the Radha Soami sect, which is headquartered at Beas near Amritsar and has more than 100 million followers all over the country and the world.

A brief profile of the controversial sects:

Dera Sachkhand:

Set up over 70 years ago in Ballan village near Jalandhar, 150 km from here, by Sant Pipal Singh, this sect largely has followers from lower castes of Sikhs. The sect follows the ideals of Guru Ravidass, a 14th century preacher.

The sect leaders have been placing the Sikh holy book, Guru Granth Sahib, in their gurdwaras and religious ceremonies, much to the annoyance of the Sikh clergy and community. The Sikhs object to their holy book being placed equally with leaders of this sect.

Many villages and towns in Punjab have two gurdwaras - one for the upper caste Sikhs and another for those from lower castes. The sect has its following entirely from the lower caste Dalit Sikhs.

Dera Sacha Sauda:

Headquartered in a sprawling campus on the outskirts of Sirsa town in adjoining Haryana, 300 km from Chandigarh, Dera Sacha Sauda has been the most controversial amongst all sects in recent years.

It has a following of 20 million people in various states and over three million in Punjab. Most of the followers are people from lower castes and the lower strata of society. The sect has found a lot of acceptability amongst women and families as it preaches against drugs and alcoholism - a big menace in Punjab and Haryana.

Its head, Gurmeet Ram Rahim Singh, enjoys Z-plus security cover from the Haryana government despite being charged by the Central Bureau of Investigation (CBI) on two counts of murder conspiracy and one count of rape of a 'sadhvi' (female disciple).

He has been involved in a major controversy with the Sikh community since April 2007 after he attired himself on the lines of 10th Sikh guru, Gobind Singh, during a sect ceremony. His action led to large scale violence in Punjab, Haryana, Jammu and other places.

He moves around in a fleet of bulletproof Lexus' and other luxury vehicles. He has survived assassination attempts in the past. Despite the controversies around him, the sect leader continues to enjoy popularity among his growing number of followers. He is on the hit-list of Sikh terrorists.

The sect was set up in 1948 by Shah Mastana who came from Baluchistan area (now in Pakistan). Shah Mastana was succeeded by Shah Satnam Singh and Gurmeet Ram Rahim Singh succeeded him after a controversy. The sect is known for its social work, like coming forward to help victims of the tsunami and the Gujarat earthquake.

Divya Jyoti Jagran Sansthan (DJJS):

Led by godman Ashutosh, it is based at Nurmahal town near Jalandhar. It was founded in 1983 and now has followers not just in India but also amongst NRIs in the US, Canada and Germany. The sect ideology is based on 'brahm gyan' (divine knowledge). It has also undertaken several social projects, including one for inmates of Asia's largest prison - the Tihar jail in New Delhi.

The sect has been involved in several controversies, especially with the Sikh community, on ideology. The sect leader is on the hit-list of Sikh Militants. Sect followers have even attacked media offices in Jalandhar in recent months.

Baba Bhaniarewala sect:

It is headed by a self proclaimed 'baba', Piara Singh Bhaniarewala, and based in village Dhamiana in Punjab's Ropar district. His followers are also mostly from the Dalit Sikh community. He has been involved in various controversies with the Sikh community as he compares himself to the Sikh gurus.

He and his followers have been accused of burning Guru Granth Sahib ji, in recent years. His controversial book "Bhavsagar Granth" was banned in Punjab and he was arrested in 2001 when it was published.

Bhaniarewala, 51, a former faith-healer and government employee, has survived several assassination attempts in recent years.

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Are AKJ enemies of the Panth because they question Raagmala section of Guru Granth Sahib Jee?

Thus questioning the entiriety of Guru Jee.

Will this post get deleted because Sikhsangat admin are biased?

May be your an enemy of the panth casue you have no clue about SIkhi casue if you did you wouldn't post such a childish imature post , oh am i being biased

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Guest confusingh
Are AKJ enemies of the Panth because they question Raagmala section of Guru Granth Sahib Jee?

Thus questioning the entiriety of Guru Jee.

Will this post get deleted because Sikhsangat admin are biased?

May be your an enemy of the panth casue you have no clue about SIkhi casue if you did you wouldn't post such a childish imature post , oh am i being biased

Not really, an interesting post in fact other than the pointless element of sarcasm used.

We can't be immune from criticism if we are of a Jatha, its known the AKJ believe parts of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj not to be real and not composed by Maharaj ji or any Bhagats as such. I'm interested in what the AKJ say because they do back up their arguments, however I don't really think anybody should question Maharaj's authenticity without conclusive evidence.

A point from the AKJ people should look at is perhaps there interpretation of SANT, not as in regards to these people who sit in lavish and luxurious Dere and sangat give their money to and get told they get this many people to take amrit, AKJ do not believe the term sant refers to any human as such and that we shouldn't give the title to people, they also correctly identify how the term sant came from Sat. (sanskrit) and is often used in reference to the Gurus themselves and in plural to Sangat, the interpretation of this has been bang on by the AKJ, and good on them for bringing Sangat some informative, well backed up, and correct interpretation of Bani.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

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Are AKJ enemies of the Panth because they question Raagmala section of Guru Granth Sahib Jee?

Thus questioning the entiriety of Guru Jee.

Will this post get deleted because Sikhsangat admin are biased?

May be your an enemy of the panth casue you have no clue about SIkhi casue if you did you wouldn't post such a childish imature post , oh am i being biased

A point from the AKJ people should look at is perhaps there interpretation of SANT, not as in regards to these people who sit in lavish and luxurious Dere and sangat give their money to and get told they get this many people to take amrit, AKJ do not believe the term sant refers to any human as such and that we shouldn't give the title to people, they also correctly identify how the term sant came from Sat. (sanskrit) and is often used in reference to the Gurus themselves and in plural to Sangat, the interpretation of this has been bang on by the AKJ, and good on them for bringing Sangat some informative, well backed up, and correct interpretation of Bani.

sa(n)th prehalaadh kee paij jin raakhee haranaakhas nakh bidhariou ||3||

He preserved the honor of Saint Prahlaad, and destroyed Harnaakhash with his nails. ||3||

I used to think the same untill i came across this Pankti. Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj referrs to Prahlaad as a Sant. Also, just because the word "Bhai Sahib Bhai" is used instead of Sant, people still follow these "Bhai Sahib Bhai's", even more than one may follow a Sant.

Its sad as there are many people who lie just to get there point across. Or, possibly because they don't listen to Katha they just don't know.

Anyway, lets not go off topic!

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What About Baba Deep SIngh .Baba Zorawar singh, Baba Ajeet singh, Baba Jujhar singh , Baba Fateh SIngh , Bhai Mani singh Bhai Daya SIngh Bhai Himat Singh , Bhai mokham singh, Bhai dharam SIngh , Bhai Sahib SIngh, Bhai Mani SIngh ... just to name a few ...hmm where these Gurmukh pyara nto worthy of the title " Sant Mahapursh 108 Bramgiani "

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What About Baba Deep SIngh .Baba Zorawar singh, Baba Ajeet singh, Baba Jujhar singh , Baba Fateh SIngh , Bhai Mani singh Bhai Daya SIngh Bhai Himat Singh , Bhai mokham singh, Bhai dharam SIngh , Bhai Sahib SIngh, Bhai Mani SIngh ... just to name a few ...hmm where these Gurmukh pyara nto worthy of the title " Sant Mahapursh 108 Bramgiani "

Firstly Veer Confusingh why are you bringing up sants again? maybe you should first return back to the questions I asked you. The only people who agree with anything near to your defintion is Kala Afghana etc. Veer Dharamjudh has also presented you with another example.

Veer Taranjeet Singh If you look at your examples again you will realise that you used to names 'Baba' and 'Bhai'. Why not include: 'Bhagat' 'Gurmukh' 'Gursikh' etc. Your point is irrelvant. by saying they are not worthy of the title sant you are inferring that the word 'baba' is lower. Then why did Bhai Gurdas jee say, 'jithi Baba Pair tarai pooja asan tapaan soya'? I can remember reading Bhai Randheer Singh jee had great respect for Sant baba Teja Singh Mastuana, maybe you can shed more light on this?

When AKJs are the first to question the views of those who are against Dasam granth jee, then its natural others will question their views on raag mala which is questioning the Guru Granth Sahib jee. So people will feel double standards. However I think we have to rethink the use of the term enemies. Guru jee says, 'naa koo baree nahee bigana, sagal sangh ham kou ban ayee'. Its one thing to defend ourselves against Dehdhari, Kala Afghanas, RSS etc, but we should not compromise gurmat in achieving our objectives. The way we are acting we dont need to worry about RSS, Dehdhari etc, we will end up destroying each other. I dont think AKJs can be included in the category of RSS, Dehghari gurus etc, on this point of raag mala they have just failed to understand it. This is one Kamhee when you blindly follow a group.

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Guest confusingh

I'm not getting in to this debate AGAIN,

simple as this, if you want me to explain PM me, I'll be more than happy to disprove the incorrect interpretation.

sa(n)th prehalaadh kee paij jin raakhee haranaakhas nakh bidhariou ||3||

He preserved the honor of Saint Prahlaad, and destroyed Harnaakhash with his nails. ||3||

It is in the term of the characteristc, Prahlaad being 'true' and 'real' not a title at all, how have you come to this conclusion, haven't you given any thought to the semantics of this term and the context in which it is used? there is no use of the word as a title within Bani, this has been interpreted incorrectly by many people and therefore has led to a chain of Sants coming out of all corners of Panjab.

As I said, I'm not going off topic and don't wish to further this debate, if you don't get it still, PM me i'll try my best to explain.

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If you are going to hatemonger, at least get your facts right.

NAME: NAMDHARIS

REASONS:

twisting Gurbani – Actually, Namdhari are known for having an extremely high puratan standard of Shud Gurbani Ucharan. Sants such as Baba Jageet Singh Harkowal Vale and Baba Hari Singh Randhava Vale have high regard for Namdhari Samprada. Their puratan NITNEM is similar to the Nihangs, and they recite Akaal Ustat, Chandi di Vaar, Ugardanti etc. There is much we can learn from them in the field of Gurbani ucharan. Aside from the ‘neelai’ matter in Asa Di Vaar, which they back up via a saying recorded of 10th Master Sri Partap Suraj Prakash (rightly or wrongly – the point being the change was not intitiated by them – it was present amongst Nirmala thought already), I have not come across any other change in meanings. Regarding interpretation – anyone who has listened to kathha of 2 people from the same jathaa, let alone from different jathaas, know that it can vary between person/goup.

misguiding our Panjabi Brothers and Sisters into cultism – This is rubbish, Namdhari are not a conversion seeking group. They have a large self sustaining community which has been around for 150 years. They have their own take on history and prophecy (which they are born into), but outside of that they keep many valuable maryadai alive. They do not seek converts – they only tell their point of view – this makes them different from the aforementioned cults.

Using the True Gurbani Shabads to attract people – In case you missed a trick, as per Khalsa of old – the Namdhari grant respect to both Aad Guru and Dasam Guru Granth Sahib. These remain the nucleus of Namdhari parchaar – to their sangat! They are not interested in attracting people – they have no need to. Unlike mainstream Sikhs, Namdhari generally remain devote in their Sampyada, nearly all of them being amritdhari and keeping rehit. There numbers are not dwindling.

only to misguide them away from the Khalsa Panth – See above.

living "satgurus" have higher status than Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji – Yes this is a subject of contention. But in reality they treat their Guru as anyone would a Sant – as a teacher and guide – who gives guidance over life and ensures their rehit is strictly adhered too. It is unfortunate that this one difference separates what would otherwise be a highly pristine group in terms preserving Sikhi of old i.e. Gurus kirtan, simran, shudh ucharan, NITNEM etc. We hope and pray that if we keep our arms open, one day our Namdhari brothers will unite with us under the glory of Aad Guru Granth Sahib. If we keep separating and hating, instead of seeing their many goods, we will simply force them to hate us back and further evolve their movement when their prophecy does not manifest.

change of the 5 K's (no kirpan) – Actually, Baba Ram Singh is the one who preached all Singh to not remain unarmed after the British banned kirpans post 2nd Anglo-Sikh war. He himself carried a laathi and asked all other Singhs to do the same. He put the kirpan in the Kanga (as a symbol) and replaced the gatra with a woollen maala. This was only ever supposed to be a temporary measure – like when you have to take off your kirpan on a place (many Singhs without knowning it use the Namdari kanga (with kirpan in it) to somehow keep their 5 kakaar intact. Its simply a case of an un-reverted change. Its pathetic even mentioning it. Seva Panthi, Nirmalai and Udasin who formed the parchaarak, academic and sant group of the old Khalsa were not 5 kakaari, even though 10th Master started the Nirmala and seva panthi movement. Its pathetic to even mention this.

Indian Government fund this groups activities – This is the standard unchecked response by our uneducated youth today. Just because they may have seen a photo of a politician paying his respects to Baba Jagjeet Singh at Bhaini Sahib, its automatically assumed they are funded. They don’t need to be funded, they have an economically successful sangat all around the world as well as India – their land has been theirs when they were fighting the British and giving unparalleled shaheediyan during a time most Sikhs were broken down. Nonsense.

SO YOUR SAYING YES THEY DO BELEIVE LIVING SATGURU'S?

YES THEY HAVE SUBSITUTED THE KIRPAN (REAL SHASHTAR) FOR A MICKEY MOUSE KANGA WITH A TINY KIRPAN PRINTED ON IT?

I AGREE THE BABBAR AKALI MOVEMENT AGAINST THE BRITISH WAS LEAD BY THE NAMDHARIS, AND YES THEY GAVE MANY SHAHEEDIYAN, AND WENT TO KAAL PAANI AGAINST THE BRITISH. BUT THE TOPIC IS HERE ABOUT THE WRONG PARCHAR.

I FOR ONE WOULD BE WEARY OF ANY OF MY BROTHERS OR SISTERS GOING TO THESE PEOPLE.

YES THEY DO READ GURBANI BUT THE CONCEPT OF KHANDE BAATE THE AMRIT, GURU GOBIND SINGH JI MAHRAAJ INITIATED HAS BEEN CHANGED. HENCE THEY CAN NEVER BE KNOWN AS PART OF THE KHALSA.

YOU HAVE BASICALLY AGREED WITH EVERYTHING, YET MARKED IT AS A DISAGREEMENT?? WEIRD??

I AM CORRECTING U DO NOT CONFUSE BABBAR AKALI MOVEMENT WITH KUKA MOVEMENT.WHILE KUKAS ATTACKED MUSLIM BUTHERS AND ADOPTED HINDU RITUALS. THE BABBAR AKALI MOVEMENT WAS LED AND CONSISTED OF AMRITDHARI SIKHS ONLY AND MOST POWERFUL MOVEMENT TILL 1947 WHILE ARMED MOVEMENT LED BY BHAGAT SINGH ENDED SOON BUT THIS MOVEMENT CONTINUED TILL END ,SOME OF THEIR LEADERS LIKE BABU SANTA SINGH,KISHAN SINGH GARGHAJ WERE FROM GADAR MOVEMENT WHO DUE TO CHEATING BY LEFT MINDED GADARS AND DEMEANING ATTITUDE THEIR ARYA SMAJI LEADERS FORMED THEIR OWN ARMED GROUPS THEIR WAY OF FUNCTIONING WAS EXACTLY LIKE BABAR KHALSA INTERNATIONAL . THEIR LEADERS BANTA SINGH CREATED SUCH SCARE AMONG THE BRITHERS THAT ON MANY OCCASIONS RAIDING POLICE AND ARMY MEN FLED ON HEARING JUST JAIKARA OF THAT GREAT SINGH WHO ATTAINED SAHIDI WHILE FIGHTING FOR48 HOURS AND BRITISHERS WERE SO MUCH SCARED OF BANTA SINGH THAT THEY BURNED THE BUILDING AND DID NOT DARE TO MOVE INTO TILL MANY HOURS AND IT WAS BELIEVED THAT GREAT SINGH WAS CREAMATED BY HIS MEN.ANOTHER SINGH WAS SANTA SINGH SECOND WHEN MOST OF THE BABARS WERE DEAD THAT GREAT SOORMA DESETED HIS ARMY UNIT AND STARTED PUNSHISING THE PERSONS WHO ACTED INFORMERS AGAINIST BRITISHERS WHEN ARRESTED HE WAS SENT TO KALA PANI BUT HE ESCAPED HE WAS SENT TO KALA PANI 7 TIMES BUT EACH TIME HE ESCAPED. SANTA SINGH WAS THE ONLY PERSON WHO DID NOT BECOME STOOGE OF BRITHISHERS DURING KALA PANI AND NOTORIUS JAILER USED HAVE DREAMS OF BABA JI, HE ESCAPED AND KEEP ON KILLING BRITISH OFFICIALS AND IN 1940 HE WAS SURROUNDED AND HE FOUGHT LIKE A SOORMA AND KIILED 20 SOLDIERS WITH HIS DOUBLE BARREL SHOTGUN AND ATTAINED SAHIDI, DUE TO THIER COURAGE THE BRITHERS MADE SANTA BANTA JOKES WHICH UNFORTUNATLY ADOPTED BY CRAZY MAN KHUSWANT SINGH AND UNGRATEFUL HINDUS.

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Another anti sikh body and perhaps most dangerous is BHARAT VIKAS PARISHAD social action group of RSS their braches are in allover punjab and rural areas their cadre r retired civil and police officers plus senior retired judges they made their image by doing social work by distributing essentials gets patronage from administartion. some of their members r in fact devoted sikh officials who for the sake of social work have joined themtheir megazines protrayed DASAM PITA AS HINDU AND IS MISLEADING.

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    • yeh it's true, we shouldn't be lazy and need to learn jhatka shikaar. It doesn't help some of grew up in surrounding areas like Slough and Southall where everyone thought it was super bad for amrit dharis to eat meat, and they were following Sant babas and jathas, and instead the Singhs should have been normalising jhatka just like the recent world war soldiers did. We are trying to rectifiy this and khalsa should learn jhatka.  But I am just writing about bhog for those that are still learning rehit. As I explained, there are all these negative influences in the panth that talk against rehit, but this shouldn't deter us from taking khanda pahul, no matter what level of rehit we are!
    • How is it going to help? The link is of a Sikh hunter. Fine, but what good does that do the lazy Sikh who ate khulla maas in a restaurant? By the way, for the OP, yes, it's against rehit to eat khulla maas.
    • Yeah, Sikhs should do bhog of food they eat. But the point of bhog is to only do bhog of food which is fit to be presented to Maharaj. It's not maryada to do bhog of khulla maas and pretend it's OK to eat. It's not. Come on, bro, you should know better than to bring this Sakhi into it. Is this Sikh in the restaurant accompanied by Guru Gobind Singh ji? Is he fighting a dharam yudh? Or is he merely filling his belly with the nearest restaurant?  Please don't make a mockery of our puratan Singhs' sacrifices by comparing them to lazy Sikhs who eat khulla maas.
    • Seriously?? The Dhadi is trying to be cute. For those who didn't get it, he said: "Some say Maharaj killed bakras (goats). Some say he cut the heads of the Panj Piyaras. The truth is that they weren't goats. It was she-goats (ਬਕਰੀਆਂ). He jhatka'd she-goats. Not he-goats." Wow. This is possibly the stupidest thing I've ever heard in relation to Sikhi.
    • Instead of a 9 inch or larger kirpan, take a smaller kirpan and put it (without gatra) inside your smaller turban and tie the turban tightly. This keeps a kirpan on your person without interfering with the massage or alarming the masseuse. I'm not talking about a trinket but rather an actual small kirpan that fits in a sheath (you'll have to search to find one). As for ahem, "problems", you could get a male masseuse. I don't know where you are, but in most places there are professional masseuses who actually know what they are doing and can really relieve your muscle pains.
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