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Slander Of Dasam Bani On Spn


Inder Singh
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Ok, come and talk on SPN and share Inder Singh ji. I will open up a new thread so we can discuss this and learn. No abuse or personal insults again please. This will mean closing off the thread and being placed back on moderation. I know this is an emotive issue for many but lets not allow emotion to come in the way of learning and sharing in the quom.

You have been taken off moderation.

But please accept that there will be others who do not share your opinion, live with it. Put you case forward and leave it at that. Horse and water remember. I will be asking questions too as my curiosity about the granth has grown of late.

Be cool! lol

http://www.sikhphilosophy.net/dasam-granth...html#post105155

The floor is yours Inder Singh ji.

Thanks for the invitation.

You have to preach for orderly conduct to your two mentors especially Waheguruseeker backed by anthonia ji. Their main job is scare away those who hold different opinion by bullying and deleting their posts.

Have you not seen posts of khalsa fauj who abuse dasam granth sahib there. Will you be able to rein him in? It seems Aman singh ji is taking some action in this regard. let us see.

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Ok, come and talk on SPN and share Inder Singh ji. I

Dalsingh101 ji

This reminds another thing. Remember i asked you about anthonia, adminitrator was a sikh or not. You replied she is sikh.

I know she is american. You meant that she has adopted sikhism. What you meant by that? Does she look like a sikh? Has she taken a sikh name?

My sources point otherwise.

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Ok, come and talk on SPN and share Inder Singh ji. I

Dalsingh101 ji

This reminds another thing. Remember i asked you about anthonia, adminitrator was a sikh or not. You replied she is sikh.

I know she is american. You meant that she has adopted sikhism. What you meant by that? Does she look like a sikh? Has she taken a sikh name?

My sources point otherwise.

Brother look at the picture in the post. Does that guy look Sikh? His name is Herman Singh.....lol

So let us not judge by names (PS that guys brother has an even more English name!)

Aad paan ji has helped me discover aspects of bani that I never knew myself. Together we did an online study of the animal references in SGGS ji. If you look in the SPN gallery you will see them. You will also note that I/we freely use DG references in the posts. And that was a long time before any of this controversy started. That should show you how much respect I have for the granth. Studying the references to the natural world was a really rich and rewarding experience for me and relighted my love of our heritage in a new direction. I thank her for that.

Come and post brother, I want you to share your knowledge with me on SPN. Debating open heartedly with others is the best policy. I will guarantee that no one will insult Dasam Granth with no consequence but please be open minded yourself. I think without the anger you could do a lot to spread your knowledge.

In days were I see the vast majority of people from Sikh backgrounds totally unaware of their heritage and using SGGS ji to solely bow too and focus their attention in the Gurdwara without caring for the contents, I believe discussions like this are so important.

:)

post-8327-1246370099.jpg

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I have not read anything in spn but from the posts of both pro and anti desam granth posts there is lack of understanding and clarity on following points this confusion is created by both the lobies particularly kala afghanas.

MAIN POINTS

1 It is right true gurgadi was given to GURU GRANTH EVERY BODY FORGETS CONCEPT OF GURU PANTH IN FORM OF PANJ PYARAS THE PHYSICAL FORM OF GURU WHY WE OFFER KARAH PRASAD TO PANJ PYRAS IT is the recoginition of guru panthand GURU GRANTH is accopnied by panj pyras.

2 DO NOT CONSISDER TEACHINGS OF DESAM PITA DIFFERENT FROM THE OTHER GURUS IT IS THE ACCOMPLISHMENT OF MISSION STATED BY GURU NANAK EVERY GURU IS KNOWN NOT BY HIS NAME BUT BY NANAK AS IS EVIDENT FROM NAME NANAK APPEARS AT THE END OF WAK OR HUKUM.

3 Dal Singh it is true sikhs before DASAM PITA were sikhs but without code or rehat although all all sikh GURUS AND THEIR FAMILY MEMBERS WERE KESHADHARI SIKHS EVEN THIER ATTENDANTS WERE KESHADHARIS AS EVIDENT from ANY OF THE WALL PAINTINGS IN DURBAR SHIAB AND LOCKS OF KESH OF GURU AMARDASS ARE PRESERVED IN GURDWARA CHUBARA SHAIB IN GOBINDWAL SHAIB.

4 SIKH REHAT MARYADA BASED UPON REHATNAMAS of sikh scholars during the times of desam pita is great testimony to concecpt of rehat .Without rehat one cannot be sikh.

5 JAP SHAIB, SWYIAS , 10 SWWIYAS PART ONE ,PART 2 33 SWIYAS ,AKAL USTAD , CHUPAI SHAIB BOTH , ARDASS R WRITTEN BY GURU GOBIND SINGH JI THERE SHOULD NOT BE ANY ANY DOUBT ABOUT IT.THOSE DOUBTING IT R ENEMIES OF KHALSA.

AREA OF COTROVERSY

TITLE IN SOME BIRS DASAM PITA JI BANI IS WRITTEN OR BACCHITAR NATAK IS WRITTEN OLDEST BIR IS WITH BUDDHA DAL IAM NOT SURE BUT IT IS WITHOUT TITLE .Perhaps my friend Jassa can throw some light on it.

2 Second cotradiction is BANI WHICH CAN BE TERMED AS ANTI PANTHIC SUCH AS TRIYA CHIRTYA,HAKKIYAT, RAM AVTAR, KRISHNA AVTAR IN WHICH WRITER OR POET IS SHYAM. 33 SWWIYASSES AND OTHER SWIYAASES CONTRADICTS BOTH RAM, KRISHNA AND OTHER GODS CAN GURU JI COTRADICTS HIMSELF ANSWER IS NO THESE MAY BE WRITTEN BY SOME OF COURT POETS OR SOME CURRENCY WHICH IS TO BE ESTABISHED BY REASEACH NOT BY NAME CALLING OR THREATENING EACH OTHER.

3 THRID CONTRADICTION IS TAPSYA OR TAP HOW CAN GURU JI DO RITUALS HIMSELF WHEN HE HIMSELF REJECTS THESE PRACTICES IN SWIYAAS WHICH IS PART OF NITNEM OF AMRITDHARI SIKH.

4 HOW CAN GURU JI JUSTIFIES USE OF LIQUOR OR BHANG OR OPIUM IN SOME OF THE VERSES AND CAN BE DISGRACEFUL TO WOMEN AS IN SAME REHATNAMA HE PROHIBITS SIKHS FROM HAVING SEX OUTSIDE WEDLOCK.AND FROM TAKING ANY INTOXIANTS

THIS ISSUE CAN BE SOLVED AFTER SITING TOGEATHER AND HAVING OPEN MINDED DISCUSSIONS AMONG LEARNED PERSONALTIES NOT BY SELF STYLED SCHLOARS LIKE KALA AFGANA, OR SPOKESMAN PEOPLE.

SO BE BEWARE OF SOCALLED SCHLOLARS WHO R BENT UPON DEVIDING PANTH IAM WRITING IN CAPS FOR UNDERSTANDING.

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Brother look at the picture in the post. Does that guy look Sikh? His name is Herman Singh.....lol

So let us not judge by names (PS that guys brother has an even more English name!)

But when you adopt another religion you leave behind your old beliefs. you go through a ceremony to commit to your new faith. That is what all american sikhs do.

Let us leave the name thing behind on your suggestion. What about her looks. Does she look like a sikh.

She diplays picture of Gurinder singh from UK who has done his master's in dasam Granth and castigates him for being a mona. What authority she has to preach to others when she herself is a moni ( bob cut).

Please do not tell me that having rehat is irrelevant. had she been a conforming sikh she would have some ethics and would not have lied a number of times during my interactions. Religion is not for discussion only . Religion means truth and truthful living.

So you admit that she does not look like a sikh.

.

Aad paan ji has helped me discover aspects of bani that I never knew myself. Together we did an online study of the animal references in SGGS ji. If you look in the SPN gallery you will see them. You will also note that I/we freely use DG references in the posts. And that was a long time before any of this controversy started. That should show you how much respect I have for the granth. Studying the references to the natural world was a really rich and rewarding experience for me and relighted my love of our heritage in a new direction. I thank her for that

What aspects of bani > That is there no naam simran , gurmantra and amrit vela in sikhism.

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UK Gupt Kaur, Dal Singh

Prakash of Guru Granth Sahib and Guru Dasam Granth Sahib should be done in every gurudwara how it use to be done before. This is not Beadbi of our eternal Guru, Sri Guru Granth Sahibji maharaj. It would be Beadbi if Guru Dasam Granth Sahib jis prakash was done without the presence of Guru Granth Sahib. Simple

And may I add when I write Guru Dasam Granth Sahib it means, that this is the granth of Guru Gobind Singh ji and that why

"Guru Dasam" is written as a prefix.

And I regonize Guru Granth Sahib as my Guru and as the Guru of all humanity.

I was listening to Katha by Giani Anoop Singh from the Bir Ras Darbar programme he says Guru Granth sahib ji tells us how high or low our souls can go and what has happened and can happen. i.e Maharaj tell us about the history of soul in this world. Guru Dasam Granth Sahib also tells us how high or low our bodies can go and what has happened and can happen.

For the history of Guru Dasam Granth Sahib ji please with an open mind listen to this on the following link

iT IS NOT POSSIBLE NO OTHER GRANTH CAN BE PLACED ALTHOUGH SOME OF BANIS OF DASAM PITA IS PART OF NITNEM THIS WILL GO AGAINIST THE COCEPT OF REHAT MARYADA
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2 Second cotradiction is BANI WHICH CAN BE TERMED AS ANTI PANTHIC SUCH AS TRIYA CHIRTYA,HAKKIYAT, RAM AVTAR, KRISHNA AVTAR IN WHICH WRITER OR POET IS SHYAM. 33 SWWIYASSES AND OTHER SWIYAASES CONTRADICTS BOTH RAM, KRISHNA AND OTHER GODS CAN GURU JI COTRADICTS HIMSELF ANSWER IS NO THESE MAY BE WRITTEN BY SOME OF COURT POETS OR SOME CURRENCY WHICH IS TO BE ESTABISHED BY REASEACH NOT BY NAME CALLING OR THREATENING EACH OTHER.

There is a bani named Chaubis avtar. Ram vatar and krishan avtar form part of that.

THese banis are adapted by Guru ji. That means these have been altered by Guru ji to give these a sikh stance. in otehr words characters of Ram nad krishna have been altered and they have been brought under the command of Akal pourakh.

Charitropakhayan are myths that have been retold by guru sahib to impart a moral lesson.

Have you raed yudh parbandh from krishna avtar that form major part of krishna avtar. it is not from Bhagvat purans. It is totally new wriutten by guru sahib. In that Kharag singh catches krishan by hair and floors him but out of mercy do not kill him

Had you raed thses banis you would have not wild guessed.

3 THRID CONTRADICTION IS TAPSYA OR TAP HOW CAN GURU JI DO RITUALS HIMSELF WHEN HE HIMSELF REJECTS THESE PRACTICES IN SWIYAAS WHICH IS PART OF NITNEM OF AMRITDHARI SIKH.

Sikhism does not call meditation or tapasya a ritual. naam simran is tap.

4 HOW CAN GURU JI JUSTIFIES USE OF LIQUOR OR BHANG OR OPIUM IN SOME OF THE VERSES AND CAN BE DISGRACEFUL TO WOMEN AS IN SAME REHATNAMA HE PROHIBITS SIKHS FROM HAVING SEX OUTSIDE WEDLOCK.AND FROM TAKING ANY INTOXIANTS

These are myths to impart a moral lesson. There are good men and bad men. So are there are good women and bad women. These are tales of trickery and are in mantri bhup dialogue format. Nowhere and say nowhere it encourage what you are saying above.

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What aspects of bani > That is there no naam simran , gurmantra and amrit vela in sikhism.

Whether anyone said that or not, that is not what I believe. Forget all this nonsense and come and share your knowledge on Dasam Granth.

Gurdasia veer has already got me going "wow" from a post.

Anything done wrong by anyone is known by God. So be cool.

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Hawk 13 writes ram avtar not being written by guru sahib

quote

RAM AVTAR, KRISHNA AVTAR IN WHICH WRITER OR POET IS SHYAM.

hawk ji please raed the following is fromram Avtar

ਸ੍ਵੈਯਾ ॥

स्वैया ॥

SWAYYA

ਪਾਂਇ ਗਹੇ ਜਬ ਤੇ ਤੁਮਰੇ ਤਬ ਤੇ ਕੋਊ ਆਂਖ ਤਰੇ ਨਹੀ ਆਨਿਯੋ ॥ ਰਾਮ ਰਹੀਮ ਪੁਰਾਨ ਕੁਰਾਨ ਅਨੇਕ ਕਹੈਂ ਮਤਿ ਏਕ ਨ ਮਾਨਿਯੋ ॥

पांइ गहे जब ते तुमरे तब ते कोऊ आंख तरे नही आनियो ॥ राम रहीम पुरान कुरान अनेक कहैं मति एक न मानियो ॥

O God ! the day when I caught hold of your feet, I do not bring anyone else under my sight; none other is liked by me now; the Puranas and the Quran try to know Thee by the names of Ram and Rahim and talk about you through several stories, but I do not accept any of their opinions;

ਸਿੰਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਸਾਸਤ੍ਰ ਬੇਦ ਸਭੈ ਬਹੁ ਭੇਦ ਕਹੈ ਹਮ ਏਕ ਨ ਜਾਨਿਯੋ ॥ ਸ੍ਰੀ ਅਸਿਪਾਨਿ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਤੁਮਰੀ ਕਰਿ ਮੈ ਨ ਕਹਿਯੋ ਸਭ ਤੋਹਿ ਬਖਾਨਿਯੋ ॥੮੬੩॥

सिम्रिति सासत्र बेद सभै बहु भेद कहै हम एक न जानियो ॥ स्री असिपानि क्रिपा तुमरी करि मै न कहियो सभ तोहि बखानियो ॥८६३॥

The Simritis, Shastras and Vedas describe several mysteries of yours, but I do not agree with any of them. O sword-wielder God! This all has been described by Thy Grace, what power can I have to write all this?.863.

ਦੋਹਰਾ ॥

दोहरा ॥

DOHRA

ਸਗਲ ਦੁਆਰ ਕੋ ਛਾਡਿ ਕੈ ਗਹਿਯੋ ਤੁਹਾਰੋ ਦੁਆਰ ॥ ਬਾਂਹਿ ਗਹੇ ਕੀ ਲਾਜ ਅਸਿ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਦਾਸ ਤੁਹਾਰ ॥੮੬੪॥

सगल दुआर को छाडि कै गहियो तुहारो दुआर ॥ बांहि गहे की लाज असि गोबिंद दास तुहार ॥८६४॥

O Lord ! I have forsaken all other doors and have caught hold of only Thy door. O Lord ! Thou has caught hold of my arm; I, Govind, am Thy serf, kindly take (care of me and) protect my honour.864.

Note the name in DOHRA. What is that? How it is different from sikh thought.

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