Some Bibian Won't Keep Their Head Covered In Langar Hall

[santsevak]

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh.

I wanted some feedback from the sangat here on an issue of maryada.

In a gurdwara sahib somewhere in Canada, there appears to be an unexpected controversy going on. The gurdwara sahib is located in an old church with the langar hall in the basement beneath the darbar hall.

Without going in to much of the political history, mainly becuase I am not familiar with it, what is happening is that a few older senior ladies (one or two at the most, I think) are refusing to keep their head covered in the langar hall.

The problem arose in the recent few months when the new president requested the persons in question to do so. And it appears this was specially prompted from younger kids when they were told to keep their heads covered and they refused pointing to the seniors complaining that if they don't get to cover their heads, why should the kids be forced to do so?

The ladies' stance is that they have never covered their head in the past, and it being *their* gurdwara (apparently they helped establish it), they are not going to start now. Further, they argue that it is worthless to stick to older traditions and that one needs to change with modern times. They even indulge in ragging the new administration members by teasing them to be Talibans for trying to enforce such "dictatorship rules on women" (this really <Edited> me off actually, now the senior members are behaving like immature non-Sikh kids who do not know any better?).

BTW, this started only a few months ago when a new president came along. The recent history is that the current administration is composed of many people who are not from within the older "core" group which have been running the gurdwara sahib since it was established.

So, dear sangat, what are you views on this? The more verbal this discussion is, the better. I realy want insights in to whatever the sangat thinks either way. Let me start by saying that it is my understanding that our head should be covered in the main areas of a gurdwara sahib. And if I were to argue with the dissenting sangat above, I would pose a counter question to them: would they be willing to continue their practice if they visit any other gurdwara in the world, maybe perhaps Harminder sahib?

Bhull chuk ke khima,

Chardi kala.

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ke Fateh?

[Guest shastr]

i thought a guru ka sikh was supposed to keep his head covered 24/7. despite where he or she might be.

(now watch, those who dont keep their heads covered all the time, or those who cant handle this type of rehat will ask for panktis from sri guru granth sahib ji stating word for word that you have to keep ur head covered at all times. lol )

[EKONAM]

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh.

I wanted some feedback from the sangat here on an issue of maryada.

In a gurdwara sahib somewhere in Canada, there appears to be an unexpected controversy going on. The gurdwara sahib is located in an old church with the langar hall in the basement beneath the darbar hall.

Without going in to much of the political history, mainly becuase I am not familiar with it, what is happening is that a few older senior ladies (one or two at the most, I think) are refusing to keep their head covered in the langar hall.

The problem arose in the recent few months when the new president requested the persons in question to do so. And it appears this was specially prompted from younger kids when they were told to keep their heads covered and they refused pointing to the seniors complaining that if they don't get to cover their heads, why should the kids be forced to do so?

The ladies' stance is that they have never covered their head in the past, and it being *their* gurdwara (apparently they helped establish it), they are not going to start now. Further, they argue that it is worthless to stick to older traditions and that one needs to change with modern times. They even indulge in ragging the new administration members by teasing them to be Talibans for trying to enforce such "dictatorship rules on women" (this really <Edited> me off actually, now the senior members are behaving like immature non-Sikh kids who do not know any better?).

BTW, this started only a few months ago when a new president came along. The recent history is that the current administration is composed of many people who are not from within the older "core" group which have been running the gurdwara sahib since it was established.

So, dear sangat, what are you views on this? The more verbal this discussion is, the better. I realy want insights in to whatever the sangat thinks either way. Let me start by saying that it is my understanding that our head should be covered in the main areas of a gurdwara sahib. And if I were to argue with the dissenting sangat above, I would pose a counter question to them: would they be willing to continue their practice if they visit any other gurdwara in the world, maybe perhaps Harminder sahib?

Bhull chuk ke khima,

Chardi kala.

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ke Fateh?

[EKONAM]

DON'T BE A BAMUN ......

READ THE ASA DI // .......

"DOEE DOTI BASTAR KAPATUN ...JA E JANS BRAMUN KARMUN SAB FORKT KARMUN"

IF YOU THING BY KEEPING 2 KASHRA (DOTI) AND KEEPING YOUR HEAD COVERED IS SPRTIAL GAIN THEN YOU ARE DO FORKT( NONTHING BUT BAMUN VAAD) BECAUSE A BAMUN STILL GRAMS HIS DOTI AND COVERS HIS HEAD .

COVERING YOUR HEAD WHILE EATING OR WHILE COOKING ONLY STOPS OUR LONG HAIR FROM ACCIDENTLY ENTERING THE FOOD......NONTHING ELSE SO IF YOU HAVE YOUR HAIR NEATLY TIED BACK....

NONTHING WRONG WITH THAT

GROW UP!!!!!

[santsevak]

DON'T BE A BAMUN ......

READ THE ASA DI // .......

"DOEE DOTI BASTAR KAPATUN ...JA E JANS BRAMUN KARMUN SAB FORKT KARMUN"

IF YOU THING BY KEEPING 2 KASHRA (DOTI) AND KEEPING YOUR HEAD COVERED IS SPRTIAL GAIN THEN YOU ARE DO FORKT( NONTHING BUT BAMUN VAAD) BECAUSE A BAMUN STILL GRAMS HIS DOTI AND COVERS HIS HEAD .

COVERING YOUR HEAD WHILE EATING OR WHILE COOKING ONLY STOPS OUR LONG HAIR FROM ACCIDENTLY ENTERING THE FOOD......NONTHING ELSE SO IF YOU HAVE YOUR HAIR NEATLY TIED BACK....

NONTHING WRONG WITH THAT

GROW UP!!!!!

um ... ooookaay .... if that were assumed to be true, then it shouldn't be necessary for any males to have their head covered either as long as their hair is properly trimmed or tied in a ponytail, etc., should it?

You would agree to this too, would you not? From your reasoning you appear to take covering one's hair in a gurudwara langarhall purely a hygiene issue. Correct?

[Guest shastr]

lol. ekonam ji, u post gurbani panktis that have nothing to do with the topic. we have been given dastaar for a reason. it doenst take a genious to figure that out. and plus, if u lived life like a real singhni, like they really shoudl be, we wouldnt have to worry about this topic, cuz puratan singhni's used to all tie dastaars. like mata bhag kaur, mata sahib kaur, mata ajit kaur, mata sulakhani ji, mata gujar kaur ji. they used to all tie a dastaar.

as stated in rehitname "saabat soorat dastaar sira"

(plz dont go looking for gurbani pankti's that prove puratan singhni's wore dastaars, cuz u wont find any)

oh and how old are u ekonam ji? just wondering.

[santsevak]

DON'T BE A BAMUN ......

READ THE ASA DI // ...

er .. also, Ekonam ji, please check if your caps lock key is it stuck?

Do you realize that using all caps is akin to shouting online? I have noticed that kids (pre-teens to early teens) or new internet users are usually the ones not aware of this "Netiquette". Please take this as kind advice if that is the case.

Chardi kala.

[Papi]

Ah the god old comeback "in puratan times everyone tied dastaar, everyone was a very chardikala sikh..." Let's be realistic here, we only hear about the good ones, as we should. Rest assured, there's good and bad apples everywhere.

asi apna itihaas aap hi kharaab kari jaaney aa, doojea nu ki kehna...

PS. The poll does not make sense, everyone is suppose to cover their head everywhere in the Gurudwara, not just the langar hall.

[santsevak]

Ah the god old comeback "in puratan times everyone tied dastaar, everyone was a very chardikala sikh..." Let's be realistic here, we only hear about the good ones, as we should. Rest assured, there's good and bad apples everywhere.

er .. Papi ji, I am not sure where you are coming from, care to elaborate?

PS. The poll does not make sense, everyone is suppose to cover their head everywhere in the Gurudwara, not just the langar hall.

Let me rephrase my motivation for the poll. I wanted to see what the sangat thinks about the specific question that I did the poll for, since that is the main point the seniors were arguing with. I wanted to see what was the general consensus about this point of view and/or what were the views of people who were not in support of this (I have only one sample here, but there is no reasonable justfication over there).

At the same time, I see why you are wondering regarding the poll, since the answer is obvious (to most Sikhs I know, at least) and the poll query appears to be reduntant. But this is the exact point the dissenting seniors were arguing with, stating it was a "dictatorship" in the gurdwara and that such "edicts" were just "talibanizing the gurdwara".

But what was heartening, in my experience of watching this unfold, was that the younger generation who comes to the gurudwara was all in agreement for covering one's head and only the old timers were the problem. It appears to me the old timers are just taking insult in having to conform to the universally accepted protocol. Why? I can't say for sure.

These are the situations where I long for the nihang Singhs that we see in Harminder Sahib who command and threaten people to follow proper protocol ... a Nihang shouting commands at you with a burcha in his hand can be an intimidating scene

[Papi]

Thanks for the explanation, I stand corrected. As far as the unfortunate situation is concerned, it is our job to let people know about our Customs and practices. If they choose not to follow them, that is their choice. I suppose in cases where beadbi may happen due to this, stronger actions may be executed. However, for what seems to me to be rather a small issue, let them be. They know deep down that they are wrong, but being a typical Punjabi are refusing to admit it.

er .. Papi ji, I am not sure where you are coming from, care to elaborate?

It was not pointed at you