Possible Conversion

[DalbirSingh]

Take care Muslims might kill you, Muslims have to stone people to death for leaving the religion of Islam.

[Guest Singh]

Here some excerpts from a respected Gursikh in Canada. It answers one of the posters who have claimed that being a good/true Muslim is enough to attain Vaheguru. I suggest that our Muslim friend join the Tapoban.org site and ask for Kulbir Singh's advice.

SSS jeeo,

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I have always been a believer that Sikhi says that if you are a Hindu be a good Hindu, if you are a Muslim follow Islam with full devotion etc etc. Is this a naive interpretation of Sikhi?

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I have heard of this too but I have never found a single reference in Gurbani that backs up this claim that a Hindu should become a good Hindu and a Muslim should become a good Muslim. Instead, Guru Sahib has clearly mentioned that the ways and methods of achieving Vaheguru mentioned in the Vedas and Katebas (the 4 books of Semitic religions) are not perfect and don’t lead one to Vaheguru.

Gurbani clearly mentions that without the Satguru, no one has attained Vaheguru. Guru Sahib would have started a reformist movement if they were in agreement to this principle you have mentioned but instead they started a new religion. They started the new Gurmat religion because the deficiencies in other religions were not possible to clear through a reformist movement.

If you do some research on the archives of this forum and the old forum of this site, you will find detailed analysis on this subject.

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Does this mean that those who belong to other religions cannot attain Vaheguru while they follow that path?

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Sikhi preaches that certain faiths take you only thus far but no other path except Sikhi takes you to Vaheguru. In Savaiye Siri Dasmesh jee has clearly mentioned that he has analysed all religions but none of them reaches Vaheguru:

ਸਾਰੇ ਹੀ ਦੇਸ ਕੋ ਦੇਖਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਮਤ ਕੋਊ ਨ ਦੇਖੀਅਤ ਪ੍ਰਾਨਪਤੀ ਕੇ ॥

So clearly Satguru jee is stating that he has seen all ਮਤ (religions) but none of them is of Vaheguru. You can’t get a clearer message than this.

There are 5 Khands of this creation and the highest one is Sachkhand. This is where Gursikhs reside. Some religions go as far as Dharam Khand that contains Hells and Heavens. Others take you to Gyan Khand that may have places like Baikunth etc. Some rare Bhagats who while doing bhagti of Kirtam Naam realize the oneness of God may reach Karam Khand. Anything above Karam Khand is the authority of Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee. Please read books of Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee for more details.

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What are your views on "Interfaith" in the context of this thread?

--------

With the emergence of atheism in the world with renewed vigour, it has become increasingly important that religious people unite on common issues. Recently such unity amongst different religions was displayed when religious people opposed the gay marriages. On issues like abortion etc. religious people can form a united platform. In any case, Sikhi believes in living in harmony with all people. Sikhi does not believe in imposing your views on others and also preaches freedom of all religion. This is why our 9th Guru Sahib sacrificed their human body. They sacrificed their human body for the freedom of religion. In this particular case they sacrificed for Tilak and Janju of Hindus but I am sure they would have done it for Mussalla (mat on which Muslims pray) and Tasbee (mala that Muslims use to japp), had these items been in trouble.

Kulbir Singh

[Tera]

_The answered_ - SCYS (Sikh Community & Youth Services) are based in Radford, Nottingham and we would be more than willing to sit down and talk to you. Please either PM me your contact details so we can arrange a time to meet or leave them via the SCYS website: www.scys-notts.co.uk/contact-us/

Looking forward to hearing from you.

[Gurmat Sangeet]

_The answered_ this is the wrong forum to ask theological questions on, as most of the posters on this forum are "kids"

i would highly reccomend and suggest www.sikhawareness.com it has more spiritual and theological discussion, rather than the gossip mongering that occurs here.

May Akaal (God) light your path, and offer you peace and contentment.

[Only five]

Here some excerpts from a respected Gursikh in Canada. It answers one of the posters who have claimed that being a good/true Muslim is enough to attain Vaheguru. I suggest that our Muslim friend join the Tapoban.org site and ask for Kulbir Singh's advice.

SSS jeeo,

-----------

I have always been a believer that Sikhi says that if you are a Hindu be a good Hindu, if you are a Muslim follow Islam with full devotion etc etc. Is this a naive interpretation of Sikhi?

------------

I have heard of this too but I have never found a single reference in Gurbani that backs up this claim that a Hindu should become a good Hindu and a Muslim should become a good Muslim. Instead, Guru Sahib has clearly mentioned that the ways and methods of achieving Vaheguru mentioned in the Vedas and Katebas (the 4 books of Semitic religions) are not perfect and don't lead one to Vaheguru.

Gurbani clearly mentions that without the Satguru, no one has attained Vaheguru. Guru Sahib would have started a reformist movement if they were in agreement to this principle you have mentioned but instead they started a new religion. They started the new Gurmat religion because the deficiencies in other religions were not possible to clear through a reformist movement.

If you do some research on the archives of this forum and the old forum of this site, you will find detailed analysis on this subject.

-----------

Does this mean that those who belong to other religions cannot attain Vaheguru while they follow that path?

----------

Sikhi preaches that certain faiths take you only thus far but no other path except Sikhi takes you to Vaheguru. In Savaiye Siri Dasmesh jee has clearly mentioned that he has analysed all religions but none of them reaches Vaheguru:

ਸਾਰੇ ਹੀ ਦੇਸ ਕੋ ਦੇਖਿ ਰਹਿਓ ਮਤ ਕੋਊ ਨ ਦੇਖੀਅਤ ਪ੍ਰਾਨਪਤੀ ਕੇ ॥

So clearly Satguru jee is stating that he has seen all ਮਤ (religions) but none of them is of Vaheguru. You can't get a clearer message than this.

There are 5 Khands of this creation and the highest one is Sachkhand. This is where Gursikhs reside. Some religions go as far as Dharam Khand that contains Hells and Heavens. Others take you to Gyan Khand that may have places like Baikunth etc. Some rare Bhagats who while doing bhagti of Kirtam Naam realize the oneness of God may reach Karam Khand. Anything above Karam Khand is the authority of Siri Guru Nanak Dev jee. Please read books of Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh jee for more details.

-------

What are your views on "Interfaith" in the context of this thread?

--------

With the emergence of atheism in the world with renewed vigour, it has become increasingly important that religious people unite on common issues. Recently such unity amongst different religions was displayed when religious people opposed the gay marriages. On issues like abortion etc. religious people can form a united platform. In any case, Sikhi believes in living in harmony with all people. Sikhi does not believe in imposing your views on others and also preaches freedom of all religion. This is why our 9th Guru Sahib sacrificed their human body. They sacrificed their human body for the freedom of religion. In this particular case they sacrificed for Tilak and Janju of Hindus but I am sure they would have done it for Mussalla (mat on which Muslims pray) and Tasbee (mala that Muslims use to japp), had these items been in trouble.

Kulbir Singh

Singh you distorted what I said to prove your point. Kulbir Singh, if we are speaking about the same person is well respected individual. Can you give us the intrepretation of this Shabad by Guru Nanak Dev ji.

This Shabad is by Guru Nanak Dev Ji in Raag Maajh on Pannaa 140

sloku mÚ 1 ]

salok ma 1 ||

Salok, First Mehla:

imhr msIiq isdku muslw hku hlwlu kurwxu ]

mihar maseeth sidhak musalaa hak halaal kuraan ||

Let mercy be your mosque, faith your prayer-mat, and honest living your Koran.

srm suMniq sIlu rojw hohu muslmwxu ]

saram su(n)nath seel rojaa hohu musalamaan ||

Make modesty your circumcision, and good conduct your fast. In this way, you shall be a true Muslim.

krxI kwbw scu pIru klmw krm invwj ]

karanee kaabaa sach peer kalamaa karam nivaaj ||

Let good conduct be your Kaabaa, Truth your spiritual guide, and the karma of good deeds your prayer and chant.

qsbI sw iqsu BwvsI nwnk rKY lwj ]1]

thasabee saa this bhaavasee naanak rakhai laaj ||1||

Let your rosary be that which is pleasing to His Will. O Nanak, God shall preserve your honor. ||1||

[Singh132]

Only five,

Read the shabad. Guru Sahib has repeatedly re-defined religious terms. In Sukhmani Sahib he re-defined terms like Pandit, Baishno, etc. These were all religious paths. Same in the shabad you have pasted. If a follower of those faiths were to accept Guru Sahib's advice then they would no longer be Muslims but be following the path of Gurmat. Once a Muslim has replaced the foundations of his faith ie. Koran, Kaaba, Mosque,fasting etc. with Guru Sahib's listed alternatives (mercy, faith, modesty, God's bhana/hukam) , he is no longer following Muhammed's Islam but instead has adopted Gurmat.

[Only five]

Only five,

Read the shabad. Guru Sahib has repeatedly re-defined religious terms. In Sukhmani Sahib he re-defined terms like Pandit, Baishno, etc. These were all religious paths. Same in the shabad you have pasted. If a follower of those faiths were to accept Guru Sahib's advice then they would no longer be Muslims but be following the path of Gurmat. Once a Muslim has replaced the foundations of his faith ie. Koran, Kaaba, Mosque,fasting etc. with Guru Sahib's listed alternatives (mercy, faith, modesty, God's bhana/hukam) , he is no longer following Muhammed's Islam but instead has adopted Gurmat.

Now that's what I have been saying the whole time. Become a True Muslim. Look up the defintion of Muslim. Guru Nanak Dev ji redefined being a Muslim in the shabad. That's why Guru Nanak Dev ji says become a True Muslim.

Remember Dhanna Jatt, who met the Lord by having complete faith. Shabad Guru is all around us, is in us, is in the written form as Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji. The Shabad Guru is in many forms. We humans are moorakhs to think Shabad Guru is ONLY in the form of Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji today.