Someone on Akj forum Supports Prof Darshan Singh

[GPS]

Kulpreet and hs ( harpreet singh) are the main anti Gurmat people who are controlling taht site and are carrying out a compaign against dasam granth, akal takhat and psoting pro sarna posts. Kulpreet belittles Bhai sahib Bhai randheer singh ji agreat gurmukh of Kahlsa panth.AKJ jatha is basically Bhai randhir singh ji jatha.

[hargurus]

Vaaheguroo jee kaa Khaalsaa! Vaaheguroo jee kee Fateh!!

Veer Jasdev Singh, Toronto, alerted me to this thread and requested that I provide some clarification. AKJ.org's stance has been very clearly stated since more than two years ago in: http://www.akj.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3774&p=11615&hilit=dasam+granth#p11615 . The sevaa team at akj.org has been rigorously holding this position and has denied all those hell-bent on using this issue to tear the Panth apart. My most humble benatee to all those who care about the Panth is to focus on our common agendas that are really critical for us. I believe no one will dispute the urgency of these agendas yet most of our energies are being spent elsewhere. Please Singho, let's not make it so easy for dokhis of the Panth to detract us. For example, following the Ludhiana Kaand everyone in the Panth was so focussed on freeing our Panthic institutions from the grips of the Badal family. How quickly have they (the Badal's) turned us against each other instead!

Some will, no doubt, find something in my reply to try and paint me non-akj or anti-panthic etc, my only reminder to them is that, Gursikho, i am a very small, insignificant, bhullar Sikh of the Guru; before you throw a stone at me watch out for the incoming rockets from the dokhis (#1 is Badal responsible for the Ludhiana Kaand). Can we band together to first tackle their challenge? The SGPC elections are almost upon us. Please.

We were blessed yesterday to listen to this appeal by students of our Khalsa Montessori School:

Vaaheguroo, only this spirit will bring us back together. Please consider. Please.

Vaaheguroo jee kaa Khaalsaa! Vaaheguroo jee kee Fateh!!

[guruvah]

[dass]

umm i've read a few threads on there and for the most part they seem to put both views forward, perhaps they don't allow debate on specific baniya from dasam granth, but that is up to them, just as this site also stops certain threads etc, i've seen many ask the questiong about sant ji being alive and those threads do get stopped and censored, have your posts being to pro dasam granth, have you tried to justify everything per guru granth sahib ? or are these posts you put just the pro dasam granth views from panthic.org ? whether they allow them or not is their right, if you don't want to go there than don't. The dasam granth debate has gone on for too long there is so much more wrong with the panth at the moment but everyone has gone quiet on those issues, badal and makkar controlled sgpc for one, akal takhat maahaan taaa ??? Sant Ranjit singh dhadrianvala's diwan highlighted much that is wrong with our panth, false allegations, lack of pyar and willingless to listen to a different point of view on an issue, those views aren't nothing new either, they been their for centuries as well, whether I or you agree is neither here or there, the fundamental questions is whether akal takhat sahib are implementing their own hukamnamea?? I don't wish to here about who is panthic and who is not, one side claim they are the other do the same, being panthic is about your actions, your rehni behni, your sikhi, this site used be a good site but all I see now is hate hate hate, before we had some good discussions here but now we have people dictating, again I could leave and not bother but it is important to present the none bias view, perhaps when posing on akj.org you should try and put your point across with the aggresive tone you present here... remember mitha bolan can win over many...guru nanank dev ji did this time and time again...

[ikjot]

First of all, sorry to mods for starting a new thread about akj.org other day. I did not know that this thread existed already.

I wrote that post because I was pained to see that admins at akj.org had allowed a post on their site where a poster was comparing sikh lehar incident with 1984 pogroms and taking a cheap shot at panthic weekly. And then net nihung mocking the debate between tapoban singhs and naastik jeonwala. After getting lot of flak about it, they allowed Bhai Jugraj Singh ji's eyewitness accounts. Otherwise they don't allow anyone's post that they don't agree with.

And also when singhs want to post a link from other panthic sites that contains something very positive and uplifting, they will reject it outright saying it is their policy not to allow outside links. But when someone wants to take a cheap shot at another panthic site, they have no problem letting it up. Look at their double standard, they just put up a link to a blog by some sharonquinn.

Hargurus, please don't brush aside the issue here. We know badal is enemy. But we know about it, we can see that. But the enemies within us are more dangerous to the panth. I would like to ask you why akj.org is promoting sarna's convention on their site. Everyone knows he is not any better than badal. They are just puppets of congress and rss. If he has such a darad for the panth, why doesn't he do big conventions for 1984 sikh victims, show his big muscles to the GoI. Help them, rehabiliate them with mega amounts of income he has from dsgpc.

Dass ji, you are saying we shouldn't go to their site if we don't like it. Our answer to that is that they should stop using respected akj's name, make it their own personal site, we won't bother. If they use akj's name, they have to adhere to its principles. Akj sangat gave them power and akj sangat can take it away too. It is sangat's duty to watch what they are propagating on their site in the name of akj and warn.

Hargurus is appealing to us for the sake of little kids and we are appealing to you that stop putting doubts in young impressionable youth about our beloved Dasmesh Pita ji's bani.

Guruvah ji, you should ask other akj singhs who don't agree with what is going on that site to raise their voice and let these people know that they can't get away with all this. This is why cali singhs, tapoban singhs and lot of other akj singhs all over the world wants a strong gursikh like Bhai Mohinder Singh ji lead their jathabandi and bring it back to its old glory. May Guru Sahib bless them with more chardi kala.

Please sangat ji, lets keep our cool and keep the discussion productive.

[GPS]

Harpreet

You are not a bhullar sikh.It is you who is instigating and supporting anti dasam granth sentiment on akj.org site. Apart from that pro kala afghana and pro darshan singh sentiment is being promoted there. pro dasam granth posts in clarification are being disallowed.

Akj.org consitituion has been amended as below.Palusible doubts was not there and it has been added.Whom you are lying here.Can you clarify on this amendment in consitution which you are hiding.You are dishonoring Guru Gobind singh ji and founder of akj Bhai sahib Bhai randhir singh ji

“…many have raised what seem to be plausible doubts about some parts of The Dasam Granth that, they say, are not the Rachanaa of our Guru Saheb”.

If you have knowledge on Dasam Granth debate with us here.You disallow posts there whcih clarify point on dasam Granth.Bring your bully net nihung here for discussion on Dasam Bani . You will be given full respect and let us have discussion here on dasam granth sahib.

[GPS]

I am not from akj but i have very deep respect for akj and Bhai sahib Bhai randhir singh ji. I am aware that Akj always stood for bani of dasam Granth sahib.Howcome when akj india fully supports dasam bani without which there is no akj as all shashtars originate from Dasam Granth sahib, this harpreet has been able to hijack their original site.

How did it happen .How it can be corrected? Why do not you make india unit aware of that.Present controller is kala afghana/ragi darshan/missioanry chela and is promoting blasphemy there.This need sot be stopped as fair name of akj is being defamed.

Let us avoid supporting one or otehr akj faction.Let us also avoid saying anything against anyotehr jathebandi>let us concentrate on the issue how come anti panthic elements have hijacked that site where systematic anti panth ideology is being injected. Kulpreet is on record having raed and liked kala afghana literature.He is second man spreading venom on that site.

[GPS]

umm i've read a few threads on there and for the most part they seem to put both views forward, perhaps they don't allow debate on specific baniya from dasam granth, but that is up to them, just as this site also stops certain threads etc, i've seen many ask the questiong about sant ji being alive and those threads do get stopped and censored, have your posts being to pro dasam granth, have you tried to justify everything per guru granth sahib ? or are these posts you put just the pro dasam granth views from panthic.org ? whether they allow them or not is their right, if you don't want to go there than don't. The dasam granth debate has gone on for too long there is so much more wrong with the panth at the moment but everyone has gone quiet on those issues, badal and makkar controlled sgpc for one, akal takhat maahaan taaa ??? Sant Ranjit singh dhadrianvala's diwan highlighted much that is wrong with our panth, false allegations, lack of pyar and willingless to listen to a different point of view on an issue, those views aren't nothing new either, they been their for centuries as well, whether I or you agree is neither here or there, the fundamental questions is whether akal takhat sahib are implementing their own hukamnamea?? I don't wish to here about who is panthic and who is not, one side claim they are the other do the same, being panthic is about your actions, your rehni behni, your sikhi, this site used be a good site but all I see now is hate hate hate, before we had some good discussions here but now we have people dictating, again I could leave and not bother but it is important to present the none bias view, perhaps when posing on akj.org you should try and put your point across with the aggresive tone you present here... remember mitha bolan can win over many...guru nanank dev ji did this time and time again...

If we write in poitical language we are no different than makkar/Srana/Darshan/Badal.

The fact is they do not allow to highlight beauty of dasam Granth sahib writings its meaning and purpose.

All banis have deep meanings and who are they to contravane the official stance of their organization.

Either they follow their parent organization or split from them nd start anotehr sect.Ethics dictate that.

If they think they follow Gurmat then that is what they should do rather than justifying their actions by

jugglery of words.

[dass]

I was just talking to someone the other day and their first questions was why have this issue become such a hughe issue all of a sudden, even thought I explained the ins and outs as much as I knew, they were like but who actually read dasam granth other than our daily baniya ? I was like well prob only about 10% of the panth if that ? he then went onto say to me that we all know that we respect baniya of dasam granth, bhai gurdas ji vars, bhani nand lal jis swaivyea but the we only have one Guru, which is Guru granth sahib, again I concurred with him on this, so he said for me I bow down to Guru granth sahib and Guru granth sahib only, so why all the rulaaa about dual parakash of both granths ? he goes to me than never happened in the uk before has it ? to my knowledge it never did maybe some nihangs might off, but taksal never used to or akj, then he said to me that why would they chuck on prof darshan singh on this issues, i explained to him the gala that he had said and the way he had handled the peshi scenario, he was like okay perhaps he made a mistake there but to chuck him out of panth ?? i was like well those are the rulese, he goes we allow those that enough damage to panth to be like choudris of the panth but those that made sacrifices for it over the years get chucked out...

Now the point of emailing the above is that many in the panth are not even aware of this whole debate ? they worry more about their local community and their children straying from sikhi, but at the moment it like the be all and end all with some, of course you are going to get those who support darshan singh, that always happens, just as you got many who support badal, makkar, etc, you will get those who won't hear a word of discussion on probably the most controversial aspect of dasam granth, chittarpriaykan, there was a thread on this site with the english translations, not sure if it's here anymore but many just dissed that translation as one man's twisted view ? i did read it and found it hard to comprehend, I've also read the new punjabi version that has gone up and see a massive difference in translations, which one is correct ? panth has done the right thing by saying we won't do anything but the problem you have it those who have gone to far either way, dual parkash is not allowed but many are doing it ? what will panth do about that ? there are those who have distrubted keertan progs when someone quoted dasam granth ? what will panth do about them ?

You get my drift, it's all well and good giving out hukamnamea but the reality is implementation ? that is the problem with panth at the moment, we close our eyes to those issues and worry about some posters on akj.org supporting darshan singh... make's you wonder what will become of the panth.., there is a hughe need for the way we do things to be assessed and corrected with consulation in the form of sarbat khalsa...

[GPS]

I was just talking to someone the other day and their first questions was why have this issue become such a hughe issue all of a sudden, even thought I explained the ins and outs as much as I knew, they were like but who actually read dasam granth other than our daily baniya ? I was like well prob only about 10% of the panth if that ? he then went onto say to me that we all know that we respect baniya of dasam granth, bhai gurdas ji vars, bhani nand lal jis swaivyea but the we only have one Guru, which is Guru granth sahib, again I concurred with him on this, so he said for me I bow down to Guru granth sahib and Guru granth sahib only, so why all the rulaaa about dual parakash of both granths ? he goes to me than never happened in the uk before has it ? to my knowledge it never did maybe some nihangs might off, but taksal never used to or akj, then he said to me that why would they chuck on prof darshan singh on this issues, i explained to him the gala that he had said and the way he had handled the peshi scenario, he was like okay perhaps he made a mistake there but to chuck him out of panth ?? i was like well those are the rulese, he goes we allow those that enough damage to panth to be like choudris of the panth but those that made sacrifices for it over the years get chucked out...

The opinion does not address the issue at hand. Let us focus on blasphemy being promoted by those who are controlling akj.org site. Do not divert th topic.

but many just dissed that translation as one man's twisted view ? i did read it and found it hard to comprehend, I've also read the new punjabi version that has gone up and see a massive difference in translations, which one is correct ? panth has done the right thing by saying we won't do anything but the problem you have it those who have gone to far either way, dual parkash is not allowed but many are doing it ? what will panth do about that ? there are those who have distrubted keertan progs when someone quoted dasam granth ? what will panth do about them

?

That thread is still on.If you are interested to contribute please come forward and give your views in relevant section.

You get my drift, it's all well and good giving out hukamnamea but the reality is implementation ? that is the problem with panth at the moment, we close our eyes to those issues and worry about some posters on akj.org supporting darshan singh... make's you wonder what will become of the panth

..

Those who know akj traditions , do not disown Dasam Granth.There is no existence of akj without dasam granth as all shashtras , sarbloh, khalsa salutation from there.

Those who dishonor personality of Bhai sahib Randhir singh ji and disown Dasam granth are fakes and are not akj.

Request to Moderators

Singh sahibs, this thread's purpose is to expose anti gurmat elements who are eroding credibility of a staunch sikh organization of panth by promoting blasphemy on their website as fifth columists.Please do not allow people biased motives to hijack this thread a sits puprose will not be served.