Bhia Gurdas--Meaning Of Waheguru Is It Wrong

[harryss]

Bhia Gurdas's Vaar 1 of Pauri 49

This vaar has in it that vishnu hari ram gobind in it that they are satguru 

Satguru Vishnu

Satguru Hari

Satguru Ram

Satguru Gobind

why does it say that? Please explien

Vaar 1 Pauri 49 Waheguru mantar

ਸਤਿਜੁਗਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਵਾਸਦੇਵ ਵਵਾ ਵਿਸਨਾ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ ।

satijugi satigur vaasadayv vavaa visanaa naamu japaavai|

In Satyug, Visnu in the form of Vasudev is said to have incarnated and ‘V’ Of Vahiguru reminds of Visnu.

Line 1

ਦੁਆਪਰਿ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਹਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਸਨ ਹਾਹਾ ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵੈ ।

duaapari satigur haree krisan haahaa hari hari naamu japaavai|

The true Guru of dvapar is said to be Harikrsna and ‘H’ of Vahiguru reminds of Hari.

Line 2

ਤੇਤੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਰਾਮ ਜੀ ਰਾਰਾ ਰਾਮ ਜਪੇ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਵੈ ।

taytay satigur raam jee raaraa raam japay sukhu paavai|

In the the treta was Ram and ‘R’ of Vahiguru tells that rembering Ram will produce joy and happiness.

Line 3

ਕਲਿਜੁਗਿ ਨਾਨਕ ਗੁਰ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਗਗਾ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਨਾਮੁ ਅਲਾਵੈ ।

kalijugi naanak gur gobind gagaa gobind naamu alaavai|

In kalijug, Gobind is in the form of Nanak and ‘G’ of Vahiguru gets Govind recited.

Line 4

ਚਾਰੇ ਜਾਗੇ ਚਹੁ ਜੁਗੀ ਪੰਚਾਇਣ ਵਿਚਿ ਜਾਇ ਸਮਾਵੈ ।

chaaray jaagay chahu jugee panchaain vichi jaai samaavai|

The recitations o f all the four ages subsume in Panchayan i.e. in the soul of the common man.

Line 5

ਚਾਰੋ ਅਛਰ ਇਕੁ ਕਰਿ ਵਾਹਗੁਰੂ ਜਪੁ ਮੰਤ੍ਰ ਜਪਾਵੈ ।

chaaro achhar iku kari vaahaguroo japu mantr japaavai|

When joining four letters Vahiguru is remembered,

Line 6

ਜਹਾ ਤੇ ਉਪਜਿਆ ਫਿਰਿ ਤਹਾ ਸਮਾਵੈ ॥੪੯॥੧॥

jahaa tay upajiaa dhiri tahaa samaavai ॥49॥1॥

The jiv merges again in its origin.

Line 7

I though we are to believe that Guru Nanak is Guru of all the ages

ਸਤਿਗੁਰੁ ਮੇਰਾ ਸਦਾ ਸਦਾ ਨਾ ਆਵੈ ਨਾ ਜਾਇ ॥  

Saṯgur merā saḏā saḏā nā āvai na jā▫e.

My True Guru, forever and ever, does not come and go.

ਓਹੁ ਅਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਹੈ ਸਭ ਮਹਿ ਰਹਿਆ ਸਮਾਇ ॥੧੩॥ 

Oh abẖināsī purakẖ hai sabẖ mėh rahi▫ā samā▫e. ||13||

He is the Imperishable Creator Lord; He is permeating and pervading among all. ||13||

my qustion is

1.Why does it say that Hari ram gobind vishnu are satguru

2. Also should we believe in these as our gurus and the works that were written about them, Gita

3.  If these are just the names of God, then how is it that in satjug vishnu lived and trata lived ram. so we

can conclude that they are referring to the hindu gods and goddess and they can't refer to God.

Please help me answer these questions. 

[GPS]

harryss ji

What is your opinion? It will be nice to know that.

[Balbir Singh]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!

Dear all and harryss Jee!

Guru Gobind Singh Jee wrote about Chaubis Avtaar. Bhai Gurdaas Jee mentioned only four of the Avtaars and suggested first letters of their Names to add that created the word 'Vahiguru'.

Did Bhai Gurdaas Jee do partiality in choosing Names?

Perhaps somebody from the lineage of Bhai Gurdaas Jee may give answers to your questions.

Balbir Singh

[MokhamSingh]

Vishnu = the preserver of everything.

Hari = Makes everything green i.e. produces/creates everything.

Gobind = Go + bind. Go = land etc. Bind = the support of.

Ram = Ramiah hoyiah = infused with everything.

All these names are of the creator i.e. Waheguru.

[harryss]

thats what i thought it meant to but it says satguru ram's name was jupped

and vishnu's 

in the same pauri of Bhia Sahib he says kaljug nanak gur gobind gaga govind nam japaavi

Bhia Sahib mentions that Guru Nanak is the Guru of Kaljug. And it mentions 

Vasdev was the satguru of satgur

harikrishna was the satguru of duaapar

ram was the satguru of trata

and Guru Nanak Satguru of Kaljug

Maybe im not understanding Bhia Sahib's meaning of these lines.  please help me answer these questions.

[Bijla Singh]

Read Bhai Veer Singh's veechar on this pauri. It was discussed on this forum a while ago but I can't find it anymore. I think the database got deleted or something so I can't find my old topics and posts.

[Mehtab Singh]

Gobind = Go (creation) + Bind (seed) = cause behind entire creation = Akaal Purakh

Please correct if wrong

[GPS]

harryss ji

There was an article in "The Sikh Review" of Oct 2002 about Bhai Gurdas dian Vaaran.

You can view that here.It may help you.

http://www.sikhrevie...pdf/index2.html

Waheguru Mantra: 49

In this pauri Bhai Gurdas described the evolution of the word Waheguru, its four letter denoting the four yugas. The Gurbani had yet to be compiled and the Sikhs were only writing some Gurbani Shabads for their personal use. The masands and manjis were provided with small collections of shabads in the form of small pothis. The Gurus did not encourage others to write about the day to day happenings connected with the Gurus and the Sikhs, because this would have led the Sikhs away from Gurbani. The examples of the Ramayana, the Mahabharta and the Shariat were in front of the Gurus. The Hindus were not learning or studying the religion described in the Vedas, Shastras, Puranas and Simritis but were fond of the Ramayana. Similarly, the Muslims were not trying to understand the True Islam explained in the Quran but were fighting for the Shariat. The Gurus stopped everyone from writing of their day-to-day worldly history, because it would have resulted in something akin to Ramayana and would have taken the Sikhs away from Gurbani.

Other topics discussed by Bhai Gurdas in his Vaars

Bhai Gurdas writes in praise of the Creator describing His attributes in the Gurbani, but does not give any Gurbani quotation. He discusses, the Guru and his disciples and creation of Panth of Gurmukhs.

He eulogizes the Gurus, life being led by Guru-faced Sikhs, relation between the Guru and the Word, similarity between the Guru and the True Sikh and discusses in detail qualities of a Sikh. He describes the difference between the Guru-oriented - gurmukhs and self-oriented-manmukhs. He discusses the daily routine of gursikhs, their virtues and their conduct in the world in several Vaars.

He discussed in detail Hinduism, Islam, their sects and beliefs without criticising or finding faults in them.

He discusses the five evils of the human mind responsible for its degradation. In place of the five evil thoughts of lust, anger, greed, infatuation and ego, the Guru oriented or Gurmukhs, imbibe Truth, Contentment, Compassion, Duty and Fortitude. He praises the value of Sadh Sangat, or the Holy Congregation.

He relates several stories from epics concerning Dhruv and Prahlad, Rajas Ambrik, Bal, Janak and Hari Chand; the episode of Draupdi; Krishna and Sudama; the story of Ahilya and Gautam Rishi; the conversion of Balmik from dacoit to saint; the liberation of Ajamal, Ganika and Pootna, the evil women.

He praises the various Bhagats: Jaidev, Naam Dev, Trilocha, Dhanna, Beni, Kabir and Rama Nand and Sain, etc. He describes briefly the ten incarnations of Vishnu, and the stories of Mahadev (Shivji), Indra, Brahma, Narad and other Rishis. He mentions their ego in showing miracles.

He discusses the division of four varnas and how these are clashing with one another. Only Gurmukhs are above caste, belonging to one caste; they are ever imbued with the love of the Lord. He describes evolution of human life as the Supreme Being among the 84-lakh species on this earth. Without True Guru (Satguru), man keeps groping in the dark, ever engrossed in the distraction of the world, like family relations, business, pilgrimages, holy baths, worship of gods and goddesses and charities.

Listening to the Word of the Guru in the holy congregation (Sadh Sangat), the Gurmukh is ever attuned to the Lord, detached from the world like lotus in water. The Gurmukh loses ego, and ever accepts the Will of the Lord. Involved in the Creation and filled with lust, anger, opposition, greed, infatuation, deceit and ego, the manmukhs (self-oriented), go astray. Again and again, Bhai Gurdas praises gurmukhs, their humility and their ever remaining attuned to the Lord while earning their livelihood, serving the Sadh Sangat or holy congregation and doing good in return for evil. The gurmukhs are without ego and do not indulge in greed even in dreams.

[mohinder pal]

Satguru can come in any religion. Kabirji got Naam simran from Ramanandji. Kabirji was from Neech Kul and Ramanand ji was from Brahman Kul. This is very Interesting sakhi How Kabir ji convinced Ramanandji to give Naam. Kabir ji recieved Akaashbaani that even though You have recieved Vast from Akal, but without Guru or Satguru, you are not complete. Even avattars had to do Guru Dharan.<BR><BR>Kabir ji checked out all the daily routines of Guru Ramanand ji Secretly; What time He gets up, What time he take Ishnan; and so on. One day knowing that Ramanand ji would come from this place in amritvela to do ishnan. Kabir ji layed down in between the path pretending to be sleeping; When Ramanandji passed from that road. Ramanand ji saw one man sleeping inbetween the raod in the early morning. Ramanandji placed his feet on the face of Kabir and Said''Wake up Oh Mortal, Recite Ram Ram". and this is How Kabir ji recieved Naam from Guru Ramananad ji. <BR><BR>in SGGSJI, Kabir ji is consisdered one of the Shresht Bhagat from all bhagats(even GuruRamanand ji is consisdered second even though He was the Guru of Kabir ji .<BR><BR>So it all about VAHO VAHO GOBIND SINGH APE GUR CHELA

[Balbir Singh]

Pray Truth for all and say Satsriakaal!

Dear all and harryss Jee!

Some story tellers promised that Bhai Gurdaas Jee's poetry is the key to understand Granth Saahib. This key has been locked now by strange translations.

You asked "1.Why does it say that Hari ram gobind vishnu are satguru"

Perhaps the translator or your mind said it so. Can someone please suggest where to find Satguru Hari Ram Gobind Vishnu and that also without loosing Satguru Granth Saahib Jee?

harryss Jee wrote "thats what i thought it meant to but it says satguru ram's name was jupped and vishnu's in the same pauri of Bhia Sahib he says kaljug nanak gur gobind gaga govind nam japaavi Bhia Sahib mentions that Guru Nanak is the Guru of Kaljug. And it mentions Vasdev was the satguru of satgur harikrishna was the satguru of duaapar ram was the satguru of trata and Guru Nanak Satguru of Kaljug

Maybe im not understanding Bhia Sahib's meaning of these lines. please help me answer these questions"

Everyone should seek the Satigur of him, I feel. Are you looking for my Satigur?

Mehtab Singh Jee wrote "Gobind = Go (creation) + Bind (seed) = cause behind entire creation = Akaal Purakh"

May I ask from which algebric equation or dictionary these meanings are derived?

Mohinder Pal Jee wrote "So it all about VAHO VAHO GOBIND SINGH APE GUR CHELA"

Many Sikhs these days are trying to follow the writer to become APE GUR CHELA.

Balbir Singh