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Queue Systems In Gurdwara


MentalSingh
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There is a reason why it is said Sangat and Pangat and the above images illustrate this very well.

....the langar is now so over the top with at least 4 dishes and sweets in most temples .....

Shows your level my friend, when is Gurdwara called a "temple" ???

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There is a reason why it is said Sangat and Pangat and the above images illustrate this very well.

Shows your level my friend, when is Gurdwara called a "temple" ???

http://www.sikhiwiki...ndex.php/Pangat

It is customary for diners in the Guru ka Langar to sit side by side in a pangat or row when food is served to them by sevadars or volunteers. The institution of Guru ka Langar itself thereby came to be referred to as pangat. Another reason for the popularity of the term probably is its alliterative and sonorous affinity to sangat or holy congregation, another basic institution of theSikhs.

I feel you guys are making an unnecessary issue out of Langar. We need unity and have to change stuff that needs to be changed, we have to learn to stop making debates over small things. There should be meaning in what you do, don't do it just because you think or feel something should be a certain way. At any rate your thinking in how something should be could be wrong as well...

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I think people are failing to understand that if we do not do the basics correctly then how are we going to tackle the bigger issues. We need to spend time getting the basics correct and then build on the solid foundations again which have been lost. It's about getting the little things right.

Don't change the subject. There's nothing wrong with "queue" langar distribution as it is also correct. If you want to call it something holy as Guru Ka Langar as such, that's your choice. Apply what you're saying to yourself first, don't impose on others if you aren't sure of such things yourself...

There's a rehit maryada for Sikhs and hukams given to us by Guru Gobind Singh Ji, those are the 'basics'.

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As is often the case, the discussion descends into simple generalisations with examples to suit one or another point of view.

Mentioning harmandir sahib as an example, is like using Mecca as an example of a mosque and St Peter's in the Vatican as an example of a church.

I am not disputing the importance of langar. I think it is an extremely important aspect of sikhism in what it symbolises and also what it means for sikhs in everyday life.

This discussion was started by someone criticising the fact that sangat (in many gurdwaras) are made to form a queue for langar.

My view (and of course, other views are available), is that this is a very trivial issue with respect to what langar is.

Two years ago people were discussing whether to have chairs in langar halls and now it is queuing. What will it be next?? Perhaps, whether their should be a quota for roti??

The substantive issue with langar is that it has gone from a simple meal that the community share to an extravagant feast....and for some people, it has now become the main reason why they attend.

and to Mr Bundha....a temple is a place of worship/house of God. Is that not what a gurdwara is??

MentalSingh - apology accepted.Thanks

and yes, if in a professional capacity I did work for a gurdwara, I would invoice them.

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Okay, this is my two-cents and I am most likely wrong so please do forgive me for any mistakes I will most likely make.

There is nothing wrong with the queue system in Gurudwara Sahibs. In most Gurudwara Sahibs around the world, outside of India, it is the most used method because it works the best. The sangat all heads for the langar at the same time and usually there is not enough space for everyone to be seated at the same time. So usually with the queue system, by the time the people in end of the line get to the front, the people infront are done and space has openned for more people to sit. In India there is no rush for everyone to sit down at same time because langar is served through out the day. So its not everyone coming in at the same time.

Also to be noted is the space limitations. There is just not enough space for multiple people to walk up and down the aisles serving. Harmandir Sahib has huge langar halls, we just don't have that here.

I don't think you can call this method wrong because there are sevadars standing serving the food to the people in the queue and then we do have a couple sevadars serving the sangat, when people need more water, roti, dal and etc. It is not like buffet, each person doing their own thing, no seva being done.

I think instead of finding faults, we should look at the feelings behind what is being done.

Also, I use to go to San Jose Gurudwara sahib as a kid and unless I am mistaken they use to have a queue system. And now with a bigger Gurudwara Sahib with more space, they don't have a queue anymore. I might be mistaken, I have only been to the new one once and that was during weekday, so please correct me if I am wrong.

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As is often the case, the discussion descends into simple generalisations with examples to suit one or another point of view.

You have lost the idea of Guru Ka langar. Only person supporting their own point of view is yourself.

Mentioning harmandir sahib as an example, is like using Mecca as an example of a mosque and St Peter's in the Vatican as an example of a church.

Mentioning Sri Harmindar Sahib is the correct example because that's what you call Guru Ka Langar. The Sangat are taken care of by the Guru. Guru Ka Langar is not something you come and eat and leave. The seva involved in preparing and then doing the seva of serving Guru Ki Sangat and then eating as one is the true practice of Guru Ka Langar.

I am not disputing the importance of langar. I think it is an extremely important aspect of sikhism in what it symbolises and also what it means for sikhs in everyday life.

You have failed to understand what even Guru Ka langar is.

This discussion was started by someone criticising the fact that sangat (in many gurdwaras) are made to form a queue for langar.

This is not one view and you have another. The person who started this topic gave the correct definition of Guru Ka Langar.

My view (and of course, other views are available), is that this is a very trivial issue with respect to what langar is.

What Guru Ka Langar is, very clear cut and does not need to be discussed and is not trivial You wish to make it trivial to express your backward views here.

Two years ago people were discussing whether to have chairs in langar halls and now it is queuing. What will it be next?? Perhaps, whether their should be a quota for roti??

The fact you bring this issue up in this dicussion, shows you do not understand what Guru Ka Langar is. It shows something else about you, but i'll leave that part out of the discussion.

The substantive issue with langar is that it has gone from a simple meal that the community share to an extravagant feast....and for some people, it has now become the main reason why they attend.

And the adding of the chairs and tables, and then making lines for Guru Ka Langar have added to the issue of a more lavish meal.

and to Mr Bundha....a temple is a place of worship/house of God. Is that not what a gurdwara is??

A temple is a place of worship of A God(jews, hindus). It shows the lack of worship to THEE God. Why do you think Harmindar Sahib is not called just Mandir(Temple). The Har(God) infront of Mandir means it is the place of worship of Sri Waheguru ji. A Gurdwara is a place of worship of Sri Waheguru ji. You can not call a Gurdwara a Mosque and a Mosque a Gurdwara. Just like how you can't call a Gurdwara a temple.

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Okay, this is my two-cents and I am most likely wrong so please do forgive me for any mistakes I will most likely make.

There is nothing wrong with the queue system in Gurudwara Sahibs. In most Gurudwara Sahibs around the world, outside of India, it is the most used method because it works the best. The sangat all heads for the langar at the same time and usually there is not enough space for everyone to be seated at the same time. So usually with the queue system, by the time the people in end of the line get to the front, the people infront are done and space has openned for more people to sit. In India there is no rush for everyone to sit down at same time because langar is served through out the day. So its not everyone coming in at the same time.

Why do you think that is, that everyone heads to take the Langar, because they know themselves that sevadaars are going to be waiting for them to form a line, (take as much as you need now because surely getting served afterwards is nearly impossible). The line format gives an excuse for not to doing the seva that is needed. In every Gurdwara in the west there is always a shortage of people doing the seva. Everyone does their own thing and leaves. Now say the same people that want to eat the langar have to serve the food to each other, does that not build a bond in the sangat and creates the sevadaars needed for the seva? The langar Hall has become a place for women and grown men to gossip. Now say we go back to the system where Guru Ka langar is served to the people sitting down. You need more sevadaars and more room for people to sit. This process kills the gossip happening in the sangat because either the person gossiping will feel guilty of letting people sit without Guru Ka Langar or they will have no shame and just leave or be asked to leave because the space is needed for the sangat waiting to eat Guru Ka Langar.

Also to be noted is the space limitations. There is just not enough space for multiple people to walk up and down the aisles serving. Harmandir Sahib has huge langar halls, we just don't have that here.

Actually by going back to sangat sitting down and sevadaars come arounding to give langar, you will have more space. The sangat have to work together in this process. If they don't then no one will serve or eat the langar. The more sevadaars the more the opportunity to do seva and more space for people coming in to eat langar. No one puts it on another to do the seva. Everyone or near to everyone has to do their part in making it work.

It has become a fashion show at the weddings. You have hired people serving the langar. The royal kings(the guest at the wedding) come sit down and expect to be served Langar and if they are not then you get the gossiping that the groom and bride could not even afford proper caters for them. Ask a person at the wedding to help out and the first thing they say, is im wearing a suit, implying it is expensive and i don't want to make a mess out of it, by serving Guru ka Langar. Say we get rid of the line system and now this same royal king has to serve the sangat himself/herself and maybe, just maybe this royal king/queen will understand humility for one second. In the line system everyone is caught up in their own world.

I don't think you can call this method wrong because there are sevadars standing serving the food to the people in the queue and then we do have a couple sevadars serving the sangat, when people need more water, roti, dal and etc. It is not like buffet, each person doing their own thing, no seva being done.

It is like a buffet, because you know the chance of getting langar once you're sitting down is very low. And people throw the langar away because in the line process they believe they can eat everything they take, but at the end they don't. Grown men and majority of the time woman do this. And they have no shame on bringing their plate still full with food, only to be thrown away.

I think instead of finding faults, we should look at the feelings behind what is being done.

It's about putting in place the correct system where it represents Sikhi.

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That is so ridiculous.

Could it be that the queueing system allows large numbers of people to be served quickly in langar halls which can get very crowded??

Guru Ka Langar is not about speed and eating. This is not a reception. it is a Gurdwara where you come to learn, whether that be in Darbar Sahib or in Guru Ka Langar. What is the Gurdwara running a free fast food place?

Could it be that from a food hygiene perspective (an issue that was perhaps less important many hundreds of years ago), serving food from one position (by as few people as possible) means there is less chance of contamination with germs, etc?

Yeah, having a guy standing over Guru Ka Langar for an hour or more and talking to his buddy beside him is much cleaner. All that spit coming out of a person while they talk is very clean. And then you have others standing in line, while they get to the food, talking to the sevadaars and you get a flavor of their spit aswell. And hygiene was less important. Are you kidding me. Where does this backward thinking come from. Have you taken the time to read Gurbani. The Gurus were all for keeping everything clean for people like you in their sangat. It was germ free. And even some sangats free of you. Must have been a relaxed and happy sangat then.

Using your principle, why doesn't the gurdwara set up a home delivery service for langar!! Why make people travel to the gurdwara. Wouldn't that be the ultimate form of sewa!

The queue systems has created the catering system. Hiring sevadaars for the royal kings. Using the Guru's system we have people sitting down and beginning to understand that I have to do seva aswell otherwise those serving me might not have someone serving them. It creates more compassion and humility in a person, but i guess in your mind that is a bad thing.

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