Queue Systems In Gurdwara

[Adhyatma]

Rather than arguing over the way of doing thing, the "system" as we call it. To me it is some what irrelevant. What we should question is that is the Langar reaching the people that may benefit from it? The poor ? Less fortunate amongst us?

The Gurdwara should reach out to people in society and make them aware that the Guru's Kitchen is for them, not just for Sikhs.

[Whitehorse]

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[Bundha]

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That's the most sensible thing you've said !

[whyhellothere]

Only Five, kindly copy and paste instructions in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or rehit that backs up your point that I'm doing nindya of Guru Sahib's way of serving the sangat.

Were you there in the 1600's when the sangat was being served? Do you have any concrete evidence of the way in which the sangat was served and whether the methods ever differed.

How exactly is serving sangat in a line going against the principles of khalsa? The khalsa is pure of heart and loves god, how can standing humbly and waiting for holy langar ever change that?

Give me concrete backed up answers then maybe I'll begin to take your comments seriously.

P.s You were being sarcastic, read your post again.

P.P.S If you see a sevadar so close to the food then bring them up on it, don't tell me about it, however the same risk of 'spit' is also posed by sevadars serving the sitting sangat so your argument on that point is pretty weak.

[whyhellothere]

Rather than arguing over the way of doing thing, the "system" as we call it. To me it is some what irrelevant. What we should question is that is the Langar reaching the people that may benefit from it? The poor ? Less fortunate amongst us?

The Gurdwara should reach out to people in society and make them aware that the Guru's Kitchen is for them, not just for Sikhs.

And I totally agree with you. I saw some people a few weeks back in a Gurdwarra who were clearly in need of a free meal and it warmed my heart to see them receiving food from Guru Ji's kitchen. I wish more people like that would come in because that kind of seva is really great.

[Only five]

Only Five, kindly copy and paste instructions in Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji or rehit that backs up your point that I'm doing nindya of Guru Sahib's way of serving the sangat.

Were you there in the 1600's when the sangat was being served? Do you have any concrete evidence of the way in which the sangat was served and whether the methods ever differed.

History tells us that Langar is served where the sangat sits down on the GROUND and waits for sevadaars to come around with the food. Sri Harmindar Sahib is a perfect example of this history our Gurus started. Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji made it mandatory for those that want to meet the Guru, they must first eat langar as equals and then have the darshan of Guru Sahib. This did not stay as such later on. But Guru Sahib did not change how langar is served.

How exactly is serving sangat in a line going against the principles of khalsa? The khalsa is pure of heart and loves god, how can standing humbly and waiting for holy langar ever change that?

It is seen from the point of Guru Sahib and not the sangat. Guru Sahib wanted to instill humility and compassion, contentment, love, patience in the sangat and this does not happen when you recieve Guru ka langar at the same level. When we receive Parshad in Darbar Sahib the person gets down on one knee or two knees and recieves the Parshad with grace and humility. When in the langar hall you have people standing in line that point is not established because the server and reciever are standing as equal, when it is suppose to be recieved with grace. When you recieve the langar, your mind should be saying a Sikh is not serving this langar to me, but it came from Guru Sahib and when I receive something from Guru Sahib i get down on my knee or be sitting lower. When a person from the sangat wants a parshada, they never can recieve it by standing up equal to the sevadaar. I have seen many times and even said myself when a person try's to recieve at the same level to lower down and recieve Guru Sahib's blessing with grace. Langar is not just a meal to be eaten because stomach is hungry or a unfornate person comes in wanting food. It's to instill virtues in us.

If you want more reasons then read my other post. No point on repeating things over and over.

P.P.S If you see a sevadar so close to the food then bring them up on it, don't tell me about it, however the same risk of 'spit' is also posed by sevadars serving the sitting sangat so your argument on that point is pretty weak.

There is no spit going in that direction because the langar is held to the side. But when you stand infront of it, then the langar is being spat on, without question. People are coughing on it, laughing(spit) over it. This is liminated when the langar is served to the sangat and no lines, which don't have the grace and humility.

[whyhellothere]

they must first eat langar as equals

We do eat langar as equals, sitting on the floor while being served doesn't automatically make you an equal, it's the act of eating with others which shows equality.

Guru Sahib wanted to instill humility and compassion, contentment, love, patience in the sangat and this does not happen when you recieve Guru ka langar at the same level.

And that's where our opinions differ, you see I and many others believe it does and that is why langar is served like this in so many gurdwaras. The majority of the sangat who are okay with langar being served at the same level are not crazy, do you really think an act opposed to our gurus ideals and teachings would be allowed in so many gurdwaras?

But like I said if you want to change things around by all means go ahead, put the effort in to make the change you believe in and if it works then that's okay aswell.

[autiegirl1980]

Forgive me for being naive, as I am still learning.

But, I'm not sure I understand what is so wrong with the line system. I mean, I do understand that the act of serving everyone itself is important.

I suppose I'm having difficulty distinguishing the original way of doing things... from just working together.

For instance, when I make meals at my house, everyone helps. It's very rare for just one person to be cooking and bringing it to everyone, as everyone wants to help one another out. If I am cooking, then usually everyone is fumbling over one another to help out, lol. My daughter usually helps put the plates together, and my son sets them on the table, then we all go sit together to eat.

I don't force anyone to do this, we just never have been ones to let one person do all the work (unless it comes to cleaning the house, lol, then the kids have a million reasons why they cannot )

Now, I do realize it's not a matter of what goes on in the household (the topic of this thread, I mean), but I do know that when those things do not happen in my house, then everyone tends to demand more from me, rather than being grateful for getting a plate at all. ...and of course, I would do it regardless, but it would wear on me over time, that is for sure. I don't do it just to be thanked, I do it because it is my job as a mom, of course, and because I love them. But it is different when it just comes to be expected rather than seen as something nice. It becomes a demand rather than actually wanting to do it, and seems to lose some of the meaning behind it when that happens.

I am not sure I understand how people going to stand in line to help reduce footwork for the people serving is such a bad thing. It seems to me they are simply helping one another out, which is a good thing, right?

[Bundha]

I am not sure I understand how people going to stand in line to help reduce footwork for the people serving is such a bad thing. It seems to me they are simply helping one another out, which is a good thing, right?

I didn't realise that the people in line were there to help reduce the work of the people serving?

Unlike a mom or dad who has to cook and serve, the people serving in langar do not have to do it. It is their sharda to do sewa that prompts them to serve so there is no need to help reduce their footwork as I am sure they would be more then willing to move around the langar hall doing sewa of the sangat.

It all boils down to this - what you think of the people who are standing in line.

Are they just ordinary normal people who can be herded into lines and then as on a conveyor belt move them along so that at the end of the line they carry their langar to a place to sit and eat. If you feel this is what should happen then who am i to judge.

Or.

Do you regard these 'people' as Guru-roop-sadh-sangat.

In which case they are the form of your Guru, in which case how can you ask them to stand in line? If a special guest comes to your home would you not with great respect and reverance ask then to sit down and wait on them hand-and-foot? This is the same with Guru-roop-sadh-sangat, you would ask them to sit and then bring the food to serve them.

That is the difference, take your choice.

[autiegirl1980]

Hmmm, I wasn't thinking of it quite like that. I was just confused as to how it was being viewed overall, wasn't really understanding, so needed it put into perspective a little bit better Thank you.