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Guru Nanak Gudwara Smethwick Major Beadbi


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Lol you are again coming up with weak arguments.

1) You are clearly missing the message Baba Nanak was trying to portray.

Yes it is okay for us to point our feet towards Guru Ji, if we are loving him entirely in our heart and as everything and everyone including the slanderer and the saint, including the Idol that is Kaaba and Satan himself. God is restricted to no place, hence the reason the Gurus said every thing they see is pure. When you point your feet to the end of your bed at night you are pointing it right in the Gurus Face- there is no denying this truth. The Gurmukh does not need to face a certain way to experience God, we do not need to sit to the east or west and the worship does not need to be done in a gurdwarra when the Guru is all pervading- We are able to remember and feel him within and without us 24/7- hence the gurbani truths that the gurmukh lives in remebrance of God day and night.

It is a love beyond the confines of imagery, and fear- beyond the shackles of logic which is the sole thing that holds us here in the cycle of births and deaths. It cannot be explained, only experienced.

My friend, when you are attached to imagery, you see things as bad and good, when you are attached to God, you see every action and every little thing as hukam and as perfect.

When the moghuls plagued the earth, they were actually God himself- Gurbani calls them the messenger of death- sent by god himself.

Listen carefully....

Our beloved Gurus were not attached to imagery. They had the Power of God for they were merged in Him. If they wanted the moghuls dead they would have died in an instant with one inner command or raise of the hand- millions upon millions of moghuls would have dropped dead for no reason at the Command of Guru Gobind Singh Ji.

But He let them live.

Why?

Because he respected Gods Hukam- the law of hukam is that every single little thing is God's will and command according to karma. The rapist rapes because of karma, the murderer kills because of karma, the celebrity is famous because of karma- there is no pity in this game, there is compassion, but no pity, for everyone earns what they reap- it is God's law.

What you see with the foolishness of the meat and alcohol in party halls is God's khel at work. Alcohol causes mental illness and hinders the path of Sikhi in a spiritual sense, it also attracts demons and negative energies in the khel so it should not be served. Meat heightens the five theives so should only really be eaten by high level truth seekers and warriors who can handle it and have taken steps to kill the mind i.e the five theives, hence jhatka.

When you are attached to imagery and get angry and fuelled up at people and things, you are feeding your theives. A gurmukh calmly accepts it as hukam internally, for they know everything around them is false imagery. The gurmukh speaks the truth to the wrong doers calmly and takes action if need be- all with a calm heart, remaining in the balanced state of Truth- they recognise the wrong doing as gods hukam and perfect according to karma, so don't get overly flustered, then take righteous action and speech to remedy the situation.

At the moment, a few elderly people sitting on chairs to remeber God and hence bringing the light of his Knowledge into this darkest age known to mindkind(in the khel) should really be seen as a pro. Yes if people are acting st*pid and drinking in the gurdwarra etc then calmly go militant on them, but to single out people sitting and meditating on Truth is utterly ridiculous and yes, very much laughable.

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These were probably for people who struggle to sit on the floor due to some disability such as old people, disabled people etc. don't blow it out of proportion.

Some peoples views on here are Foolish and laughable to say the least. Firstly, when Baba Nanak went to Mecca, he faced his feet towards the Kaaba. This was not just because the kaaba is a rock or an

Mandela has received information that on Sunday 28th August 2011 a major beadbi took place during a wedding in the main Darbar Sahib upstairs. The sangat during the wedding managed to take chairs into

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Ok kool :D

Just to add I thought jhatka meat was a Hindu ritual? regardless of what went on we are not living in war times... vegetarian food is widely available.

''Sitting on a cushion, a distinctive seat, a chair, a stool, a cot, etc. or in any distinctive position in the

presence of the Guru Granth or within the congregation is contrary to gurmat (Guru’s way)''

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WJKK WJKF

Try asking somebody with a disability like myself what its like sitting on the floor.

With waheguruji's kirpa I am able to sit for a bit, but why should I have to leave the gurdwara just because I cant sit on the floor for more than 5mins?

I dont think people with disabilities take advantage of the chairs, the gurdwara I go to there is one or two at the back, so its not a distraction either. I dont like chairs at the front either as it doesnt look nice, but if somebody is unable to sit for long and wants to listen to path then they should not be forced to leave. That is totally unfair and discrimination.

Its hurts me to hear some of the posts on here. Obviously these people dont know as they dont have disabilities. If somebody looks normal from outside it doesnt mean they are healthy and can do acrobatics, or are flexible in any way.

I try to sit against the wall on the side when I cant sit with crossed legs. I dont like doing this, and I dont like sitting on chairs, I try to sit as long as I can but that does me more damage.

So why should I sit at home on my own depressed, nowhere to go and cry, whilst those of you who dont agree with chairs or benches, have the privilege of enjoying your lives, being able to go where u want when u want, and then belittle the disabled, and think we are nothing and shove us wherever u want and do watever u want.

Why?? coz you dont have a disability?

There are young generationm aswell as elder generation with disabilites and health conditions, which a lot of people do not realise, for whom going to the gurdwara would be the only place they would go and their hearts fill with joy of being able to go to wahegurujis house without being shoved around.

How can the disabled and elderly be in sangat, when they are not given the chance.

Everybody is going to go old one day, and when one is unable to function properly WHY SHOULD THEY BE STOPPED FROM GOING DUE TO LACK OF FACILITIES.

Thankuji for listening.

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Try asking somebody with a disability like myself what its like sitting on the floor.

With waheguruji's kirpa I am able to sit for a bit, but why should I have to leave the gurdwara just because I cant sit on the floor for more than 5mins?

I dont think people with disabilities take advantage of the chairs, the gurdwara I go to there is one or two at the back, so its not a distraction either. I dont like chairs at the front either as it doesnt look nice, but if somebody is unable to sit for long and wants to listen to path then they should not be forced to leave. That is totally unfair and discrimination.

Its hurts me to hear some of the posts on here. Obviously these people dont know as they dont have disabilities. If somebody looks normal from outside it doesnt mean they are healthy and can do acrobatics, or are flexible in any way.

I try to sit against the wall on the side when I cant sit with crossed legs. I dont like doing this, and I dont like sitting on chairs, I try to sit as long as I can but that does me more damage.

So why should I sit at home on my own depressed, nowhere to go and cry, whilst those of you who dont agree with chairs or benches, have the privilege of enjoying your lives, being able to go where u want when u want, and then belittle the disabled, and think we are nothing and shove us wherever u want and do watever u want.

Why?? coz you dont have a disability?

There are young generationm aswell as elder generation with disabilites and health conditions, which a lot of people do not realise, for whom going to the gurdwara would be the only place they would go and their hearts fill with joy of being able to go to wahegurujis house without being shoved around.

How can the disabled and elderly be in sangat, when they are not given the chance.

Everybody is going to go old one day, and when one is unable to function properly WHY SHOULD THEY BE STOPPED FROM GOING DUE TO LACK OF FACILITIES.

Thankuji for listening.

Mandela feels for your situation and yes there should be facilities for your kind but just like tables and chairs was implemented for people like you but if you got to your local Gudwara you will see majority of able bodied people sitting on them. Once they get abused it will continue for years on end.

Also for many years sangat has been going to the Gudwaras all over the world why all of a sudden have we seen this beadbi happing in our Gudwaras. Mandela feels this a direct attack on Sikhi values.

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"My kind" ??? And wat is that supposed to mean, I'm no different from you, just coz i have a disability. ANd wat kind are u exactly? Wat if u had the disability then how would u feel if u were not able to go to gurdwara without everybody looking at you. We get enough discrimination from some members of sangat, NOT saying all, few who are ignorant of the rest of the world.

Gurdwara is not only for healthy people, anybody can go to the gurdwara. How do you they are able bodied? and wat is the definition for able bodied?

It is not beadbi to me, you have ur opnions, I have my own. So I will stick to my own.

Dont be ridiculus its not an attack on sikhi values,,, Its people like "ur kind" that deters disabled people and people with health conditions from going to the gurdwara.

I agree if one does not need to sit on a chair then they shouldnt, so wat are the ones that want to go to gurdwara and be able to stay there longer, wat are we supposed to do?

Especially if they are young, even the elderly, are we suppose to rot away at home, coz our lives are already full of dukh? Are we suppose to listen to be quiet and not say anything which will help us in order for us to have wat u have and reap when u go to the gurdwara? And listen to "ohhhhhh eh tha bechari de karm ha, gurdwara nai jaa sakdi"

Wat a load of nonsense....I feel that before now gurdwaras have been denying that right for disabled people to go to the gurdwara....

Why should one go when there is no facility for them? Answer that?

You're not the one that has to live with the disability so its easy for u to say wat u are saying, but there are thousands out there, for whom the chairs are a godsend and i fully support them for those that need them.

Thats the only reason i go now, as I feel secure that if I am wobbly or my co-0ordination is not rite on one day, i know i can sit on a chair, even downstairs in the langar hall, without being harassed.

The beadbi im feeling is ur attack on disabled people.

The gurdwaras should have a structure where they can implement how they are to be used.

I could argue to if i wanted to, about gyms being built in gurdwara premises, for those that are healthy, so nothing for the needy???

And wat about the gareeb, and the needy?? Wats provided for them?

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Mandela ji you have more gian than me, if you feel that strongly about sikhi values please answer me this.

Kere guru ji ne parampara chalaiyi c ke apaaj lokhaa di madat karni?

(which guruji started the method of helping the disabled?)

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This has been discussed before, I stand by my opinion that the disabled, elderly and all others who can not physically sit on the floor should be able to sit on a bench or chair as long as it is lower than Maharaj SGGS Ji. I've noticed some people have an issue with those who can't physically sit on the floor, sitting higher than the sangat. As long as they are lower than SGGS Ji what's the problem? I have mentioned before the kirtani jatha's sit on a raised platform, the response was well they are spreading gurmat and imparting knowledge so we should show respect to them. This is true, BUT we should also show respect to those who can't physically sit on the floor. I mean majority of kirtanees can sit on the floor as they do on a raised platform, so those who want darshan of maharaj why can't they?

Only when you or one who is close to you can not sit physically or comfortabally without extreme pain on the floor, will you think that it's wrong. As long as the person is showing respect is lower than maharaj, then what is the problem?

OFCOURSE lazy, arrogant people should not abuse this. Satkar to dhandhan SGGS Ji is upmost. But just put yourself in the place of someone who wants to be in darbar of SGGS Ji but can't sit on the floor.

Please state why you disagree with this view, as someone does as they have -ve this post. I ain't bothered about the -ve but atleast explain why you feel my view is wrong.

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If those chairs are disabled peope then it should be excused. But Gurdwaras should provide facilities which have well thought to accommodate the disabled community.

And lastly why does Mandela speak as the third man?

It'd almost like listening to 'Smiegel' from 'Lord of the Rings' speaking! Master 'Smiegel' wants the Precious!

Sorry Blud I'm jus playin!

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Thankuji Balait da sher, and Gurdssingh, ur posts have given me confidence to go to gurdwara more..

i dont wish to have these disabilities, because of my karms I am like this, I dont wish to sit in chairs in front of Sri Guru Granth Sahibji, but when I cannot sit on the floor the need will arise.

"

I always say to god, why cant i be like "normal" people and be able to sit for longer, be able to do this and that, cry to god, but its all my karms. And everybody is not "normal".

I noticed in the pictures that Mandela has put up, that there are people standing behind Guruji too and at the side, that doesnt mean they have less respect than those that are sitting down, they are not sitting either, in fact standing behind them. So i cannot judge how decide how Guruji wants me to be.

I am like this and try my best, but god has made me like this, sorry but i cant change myself.

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i feel pity on your immaturity.

And no i dont understand because you are misunderstanding.

haven't got energy to argue with you. Rab da nau leleni, tade vangar lokha nu koi fedha ni samjone da ke sanu kio lor hai chairs di.

You expressed your opinions and i did mine as i will carry on not only for myself but for every disabled in the world.

I am not schooling you. Not my fault if you dnt understand others have views too and not everybody is like you.

I won't say sorry as nothing to be sorry about.

I will carry on doing gurujis darshan and if that means i need assistance with it so be it.

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i had one Singh telling me that he felt that a disabled person must have done something wrong in their past life and is therefore not worthy of sitting in the Sangat of Guru Jee....Vaheguroo

I suppose Guru Nanak Dev Jee visiting people with leprosy and helping sure their disease is just a myth...fore they surely don't deserve mukhti?!?

I just wonder what Bhagat Puran Singh would think of these comments from Sikhs today?

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Look at wat Guru Harkrishan ji did, the sick were healed in their presence.

And Guru Nanak ji helping sick people is not a myth, they could do anything they wanted.

If god wants they can do anything, its all up to them. Not to people to say who is and who is not worthy of sitting in their presence.

Look out how much Bhagat Puran Singh ji has done, selfless service to humanity, "he would wander here and there finding the injured, physically handicapped persons, taking them to the hospital. He also took care of them as his pocket and capability allowed. Once, he even washed the clothes of an old, poor beggar who was suffering from diarrhea"

In 1947, Bhagat ji founded the institute called Pingalwara meaning "the home of the crippled" with a few discarded crippled or sick patients. The word "Pingal" means "Cripple" and "wara" mean "home".

From 1947 till 1958, Bhagat Puran Singh did not get a permanent dwelling. He could be seen outside the chief Khalsa Diwan, post offices, railway stations or under the tree outside the office of the Civil Surgeon. He would wander in the streets, asking for donations to help the needy. Some people offered to help him, but most of the others kept themselves from donating towards the noble cause.

At last, he founded 'The All India Pingalwara Charitable Society' whose annual budget at that time was 12.5 million rupees and got it registered. Even today, this institution, headquartered at Tehsilpura, Grand Trunk road, Amritsar, works for helping the poor, the diseased and the physically and mentally handicapped. He died in 1992.

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This is now creeping into many Gurdwars, even Soho Road Nishkam Gurdwara now has chairs along the back of the darbar sahib.

People sitting infront of Akaal saroop Guru Granth sahib Ji is a definate no no, doesnot matter whether people are old or

disabled - either lower the floor at the back or place them in a separate room with a window.

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