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Can Non Amritdhari Person Recite "Waheguru"


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That i

That excellent veer ji

i wish if i could do what you do. I am amritdhari but frankly speaking i only do nitnem because i have to. i think 98% of time i feel the pressure of completing Nitnem . Its more because i have to.

I remember when i was non amritdhari then i was like you and used to do only some Paath but with love. Its gone now.

I don't know what happened but its true. i wish if could get that love back

I don't know what to do. I think i may done many bad karams thats its happenning.

You only get something back if you have lost it! But you have lost nothing!

To have become amritdharee is absolutely awesome and amazing. If you did vichar on the worth of you and your live as you migrated from non amritdhaee to amritdharee status, according to Gurmat philosophy of Amrit , becoming Amritdharee and living as an Amritdharee, you would be soooo blown away that you would be lost in bewilderment and shocked at what has struck you! Read absolutely slowly again the book you already have of Bhai Randheer Singh's life and you will realise this for yourself.

However becoming amritdharee is very unlike a quick drug fix that gives you instant 'highs'. At the root of amritdharee living lies a need for ghal kemaai. Becoming amritdharee is the beginning of the start of an ardous journey involving guerilla style daily personal warfare with the 5 inner dogs, the demon of ego, and the cousins of all of these and manmat , as well as rigid training to reach the goal of sant sipaheeness. In this journey, there will be highs and lows, periods of crying, ecstasy , joy but also periods of dryness and struggle and doubts. It is a path sharper than the edge of a sword and finner than a strand of hair. You gotta persevere.

Love and sharda, prem and bairaag, ras and anand are now your inheritance as you become an amritdharee. Any amount of these that you may have experienced in your pre amritdharee days were just a shadow and sign of what will REALLY come later after becoming Amritdharee as that Amrit slowly roots itself in your being as you water that plant within you daily and painstakingly. Love and its cousins once well rooted within you will become your best friends you cannot get rid off! haha, and embarass you and those around you because true Hari prem can grab you like nothing can , and possess you and use you like nothing can till you will echo what Gurujee says, ''koi akhe bhutna, ko khe betala, ...., bheya diwana sah ka Nanak baurana(SGGS, pg 991)''. Then you will realise that what you experienced in your preamritdharee days was a much shallower shade of vairaag and prem of an emotional kind like a short lived summer pansy. Emotions are clouds that blow around and create a drama in the sky and pre amritdharee love and sharda will be experienced usually with a lot of felt emotion. However, post amritdharee life can change season and become cold , dry, lifeless and unexciting where your ''ghal'' and kemaee'' make you feel you are dragging yourself uncomfortably through the Arctic! However do not worry because deep under the ground i.e in your being these things are quietly developing a powerful system of roots and when Gurujee sooner or later flips the season in your life, and a spiritual spring starts powerful shoots of these prem, sharda, anand and bairaag will sprout out followed by their hidden treasures of fruits and flowers!

Hence amritdharee living is a two way street. You need to focus on those steps you need to take, those new foundations and structures you need to lay down in your life and Gurujee will ''kot painda ageh hoe leth heh'' as promised in Gurbanee. Stop worrying too much about your spiritual eelings and emotions and just get on with it. Work out unemotionally how to sort out and improve your amritvela. Have a system in place to start reading the meanings of gurbanee in a daily structured way. Surround yourself with gurbanee translations, and myriads of books, cds, tapes etc on Sikhism , engage with other Sikhs about Sikhism(as I observe you are doing here), go to Sikh youth samagams and programmes, rehnsbhaees, gurudwara, kirtan, attend katha and kirtan programmes, do a lot of ardas, and keep inspecting your life so that you are doing sewa, simran , satsang , naam , dan , ishnan. Be relaxed too so you practising how to be in sehaj. Work out what you need to do , how to transform your life, and do it slowly and steadily and in time things will shine for you.

Your words remind me of my garden. When I bought my latest house, there was a garden that had been planted and looked after by an old English lady and it gave me instant joy!!! It was a country cottage garden full of beautiful flowers and plants and little secret paths. However as I settled in, Gurujee started giving me ideas of how beautiful it really could be and how it needed a 100% transformation! Now that wasnt easy because it involved a) quickly acquiring a lot of new knowledge about seasonal planting, and plants , b) a braveness to put in new things, c) money! d) a willingness to think out of the box! and e) patience! Right now as I am typing this I am looking at my garden that is getting transformed and there are new things there that are beautiful like my raspberry plants that are fruiting in late autumn and the little fogs in the newly constructed wild life pond. However there are big brown patches that need to be remodelled into long raised beds for growing onions, garlic , chillies, broad beans etc and then I need to create a long hedge of edible berries of all kinds . So I am not feeling that much of 'anand' concerning my garden right now because things have been dug up and everything is getting moved around but deep in my heart I am excited because Gurujee is giving me the foresight and mental pictures to see that come next spring and summer this garden will be something absolutely and insanely world apart! Now that joy will be a far better and higher class , more meaningful joy compared to the one I had on the day I bought my house and walked around my garden because that was an imcomplete, premature joy.

From my observation, it is complacency which is one of our biggest enemies. Reading nitnem like a parrot everyday, not ever bothering to get serious about understanding every single tuk of nitnem, never bothering to go crazy on reading lots of commentaries on Japjee, never sitting down, putting a verse of gurbanee in the brain , then asking God to show you wht It means and not meditating on it for an hour, repeating Waheguru arrogantly rather than slowing down and telling yourself that each time you need to focus on Guru within and say Wah, i.e Wah-Guru , and that each time you say wahguru /waheguruyou are addressing and praising Gurujee. Carelessness leads to an amritdharee becoming insular, parochial, narrow minded, bigoted, simplistic, a slave to his and own zezbad(emotions) , mechanical, robotic, and interpreting Sikhism as a formula. Religion of any kind can lead anybody to become one track minded, and full of hidden arrogance and hatred as you become a devotee of sanctity and suchamthai, rather than of sach.

So, instead of worrying about not feeling bairaag and ras in your heart , work hard on restructuring your life through Maharaj's apar kirpa so that in time your every word, thought and action will be Hari prem manifested!

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I need to up my sharda for sure. I guess because there's so much upheaval in my personal life I feel guilty that - on occasions - I'm going through the motions rather than "feeling" it, if anyone knows what I mean. There are times when I almost sing my paath from memory and it comes flowing out of me like a river. Then when my health takes a hit I feel so spiritually empty and faithless that I struggle to keep my eyes open when reciting Gurbani - sometimes its like an unintelligible mumble and I feel very ashamed later on.

Dearest Kaljugi jee, I relate to what you are saying very closely because I had 3 operations myself in the last few years where my life was like a yoyo and I experienced such sharp daily excruciating pains in a way I cannot explain ever. I could even sit, sleep, stand or walk because that pain was like a huge demon killing me wherever I turned! I even thought I was being punished and going to die. The pre and post medicines only played more havoc too.

However through this, Gurujee has taught me that Sikhi as I have explained just above this to another person on this thread, is a 2 way traffic. As long as our hearts are sincere, Gurujee himself is Master and Commander of our ship whether it is sinking or sailing! Life and Sikhi are like the waves of an oceon where pain and pleasure, anand and vairaag. and highs and lows are like the waves that take turns to rise and fall and yet strangely enough, are the same water! 'I' am going through the motions yes, but maybe thats fine too and part of Gurujee's kautak and choj to show me what it is without Him and to make my anand and sharda even more worth and of value when I hit my next high. If everything went right for me everyday then I could be in danger of slowly taking things for granted and becoming unexcited. However if prem and sharda, my close friends part from me certain days and i start missing them, I value them in my life even more! and work to keep them as my best mates! haha.

You cannot 'up ' your sharda because sharda is a gift of God, a best friend given by God to keep you activated and animated. In fact sharda is a very playful hide and seek friend! Now here, now not here, now there, now not there! And why? Because sharda is the one mate that is thrown by God into your life in order to constantly keep you playing the game of prem, and to keep you geologically active in your spiritual life so that your words, actions and thoughts burst out from your activated amrit -inner being like molten lava in a kind of spiritual volcano!

Sharda is like the hidden treasure of a tree that suddenly bursts out insanely beautiful flowers and fruits. A Sikh waters the plant of amrit within everyday painstakingly, sowing the seeds of Naam and Gurbanee and in return our Sacha Patshah 'Mali ' Gur Nanak hands him/her the fruit of sharda so you can engage in ''khel khel akhel khele'' as in you is created a 'chao' for prem kheln.

I cannot create sharda but i can beg to Gurujee to produce in me sharda, and I can lay such Sikhi foundations in my life which will seduce and induce sharda, not reduce sharda!

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@humkire

Thank you very mucch veerji , your posts gave me much to work on.

The reason i was having more love and sharda during Gurbani in pre-amritdhari days was that becasue at that time i has cut haris, i was eating non-veg and i knew that i was wrong. I knew that whatever i was doing , GOD is not happy with me . I knew i was at the bottom of the list of GURU ji. So at that there i had nothing for which i can do haume or ego. I used to one path in 1-2 weeks just so that may GOD washes my few sins. I did'nt knew what is concept of GOD , why to read Gurbani and what is MOKSHA. I was just reciting Gurbani so that GOD can forgive me for eating non veg and cutting my hairs. I used to love GOD because i know HE is only one who has helped me in my tough times.

The most imporatnt thing was i was not having any haume and everyday i felt like i am the dirtiest fellow in GODs list. But i loved GOD at that time.

But Since being Amritdhari and listening to all Vyakhya. I got more and more knowledge. But that Knowledge ulitmately gave me so much haume that now i am amritdhari i am above non amritdhari and i know stuff about sachkhand and all that. Now i feel someone special being amritdhari so that "nimana" feeling is gone and love is gone due to haume

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@humkire

Thank you very mucch veerji , your posts gave me much to work on.The reason i was having more love and sharda during Gurbani in pre-amritdhari days was that becasue at that time i has cut haris, i was eating non-veg and i knew that i was wrong. I knew that whatever i was doing , GOD is not happy with me . I knew i was at the bottom of the list of GURU ji. So at that there i had nothing for which i can do haume or ego. I used to one path in 1-2 weeks just so that may GOD washes my few sins. I did'nt knew what is concept of GOD , why to read Gurbani and what is MOKSHA. I was just reciting Gurbani so that GOD can forgive me for eating non veg and cutting my hairs. I used to love GOD because i know HE is only one who has helped me in my tough times.The most imporatnt thing was i was not having any haume and everyday i felt like i am the dirtiest fellow in GODs list. But i loved GOD at that time.But Since being Amritdhari and listening to all Vyakhya. I got more and more knowledge. But that Knowledge ulitmately gave me so much haume that now i am amritdhari i am above non amritdhari and i know stuff about sachkhand and all that. Now i feel someone special being amritdhari so that "nimana" feeling is gone and love is gone due to haume

Doing all kinds of manmatia things, then doing a few prayers, and feeling guilty as a lowly sinner , and all this making you feel tiny, worthless and small as you used to in your pre amritdharee days was part of the process of breaking you up to prepare you to receive Amrit in this one janam! That was its real purpose! rather than to make it some sweet memory of your days on earth when you were truly humble and filled with true sharda! Far from it! I will explain why.

A farmer has to use his agricultural tools to break up the hardened ground, then dig it in very deep, plough it, turn it over, get rid of all the weeds, then rake in good quality compost and manure, amend the soil, improve its drainage, mix everything up and then fence it up. Thats when on this weed free, nice and soft fertile soft soil , he sows his seed and in time those seeds become plants producing flowers, vegetables and fruits! . What a delightful sight, of a gardener's might, when it all works right! And so with Gurujee our Holy Blessed Gardener!!!! As Gurbanee says ''Satgur jagta he deo!'' Ever present Gurujee from generation to generation sows the seed of Sikhi into the hearts of the coming generation because Sikhi is eternal and ever growing! But to sow the seeds He needs to break you up else like hardened ground you would have rejected the seed of Amrit! Hence though with your hidden haumai you were doing very manmatia things. Gurujee started opening your eyes to your sin! And where did this sin come from? It came from your haumai! well tucked in, well hidden like the roots of a weed under the ground strangling the life out of your loved good plants without you realising it! And that prayers you did a little here and a little there was little doses of medicine given to help you amend your spiritual soil in that mighty preparation Guru was doing so that the day of Amrit would come nearer and nearer! In act this might have been a process that already started in your past few janams for all you know!

So do not be fooled into any allusion that somehow you were a very humble guy in your pre-Amritdharee days! Gurbanee makes it clear that humbleness is never man made, but a gift of God, and this gift comes increasingly more and more to those who truly truly truly start getting truly closer to God Guru. True humbleness would never have allowed you to do wrong things in the first place! That's the real power of true humility. Yes you did many wrong things but through God's grace some good things too like your prayers and your realisations about your wrong. That served its purpose of prepping you for the seed of Naam which now has been planted in you throuygh Amrit Pahul.

Now back to the second part of your story involving your post amritdharee days. As you rightfully said this is a period of soaking in katha, gyan , knowledge etc. And yes as you said this has led you to feel ''holier than thou'' and one step above others and feel haumai etc. T

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(in continuation of the above.......),

This post amritdharee feeling of haumai etc is nothing unusual because it is part of the process of your growing up as a mature amritdharee. As you see the difference in what you were and what you are, you will be differentiating and learning the art of discernment between pre and post amritdharee life. Sikhi knowledge whether it comes through path, kirtan , katha or simran is based on helping you develop true humbleness in your life and true love of God. Amrit is given to you to help you develop these blessings. If you read my other replies to you everywhere you have been posting about what you are going through, I have tried to explain that after taking amrit you will go through a very big transformation in your life. This may take a day or a lifetime, thats for Gurujee to decide not us. Y

You need to be patient and let it all happen for you slowly as you stay in Sikhi and water what has been planted within .

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(in continuation of the above.......), This post amritdharee feeling of haumai etc is nothing unusual because it is part of the process of your growing up as a mature amritdharee. As you see the difference in what you were and what you are, you will be differentiating and learning the art of discernment between pre and post amritdharee life. Sikhi knowledge whether it comes through path, kirtan , katha or simran is based on helping you develop true humbleness in your life and true love of God. Amrit is given to you to help you develop these blessings. If you read my other replies to you everywhere you have been posting about what you are going through, I have tried to explain that after taking amrit you will go through a very big transformation in your life. This may take a day or a lifetime, thats for Gurujee to decide not us. Y You need to be patient and let it all happen for you slowly as you stay in Sikhi and water what has been planted within .

Thank you very much veerji , that why i was thinking i didn't do anything wrong after being amrtidhari but why this all happened. But i got the idea.

Thank you again for your wonderful posts. I will print them and read them again. :)

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Mirror ji, we all go through tis experience but I believe books by Bhai Vir Singh and Bhai Randhir Singh can help you with that. Bhai Vir Singh’s way of explaining is very simple and easy to understand. Read Gurmukh Jeevan, Gurmukh Sikheya and Guru Nanak Chamatkaar.

As Bhai Vir Singh explains, before you begin Nitnem (morning, evening and night) sit down and for at least 5 minutes do gurmantar and consider it a time exclusively for your soul to attain inner peace. Sant Harnam Singh explains that if your mind wanders then do jaap loudly to make your mind listen to it. If it wanders more then do it a little louder and when it stops then you lower your voice. It is a battle with your mind. Then do Nitnem believing Guru Sahib is present with you and listening to you. During your day, always do gurmantar or Gurbani abhiyaas while you are doing your daily activities. Even if you get one minute do not spare it. Just keep at it. Increase your abhiyaas slowly. According to Bhai Vir Singh and Bhai Randhir Singh, this is the first step and always the hardest but once your mind stops wandering a little, the peace and rass obtained will be unlimited and unexplainable. Their suggestion is to keep going and keep at it while not overlooking other aspects of rehat. Also do Sukhmani Sahib even if you do a little of it every day. I’d recommend even taking a break from worldly activities like computer, tv, reading (except Gurbani and Sikhi books), eating out etc. or anything you can quit for a couple of days and you should feel the change. Guru Rakha

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Since being Amritdhari and listening to all Vyakhya. I got more and more knowledge. But that Knowledge ulitmately gave me so much haume

‘’Satgur sevn aapna te virle sansar, haumai mmta mar kheh har rakheya urdhar’’

(In this world rare are they who serve their True Guru. Having killed their haumai and wordly love they keep Har clasped to their heart)

( SGGS, Sri Rag, Mahla 3rd, ang 26th)

I needed to give you a more detailed explanation concerning post amritdharee haumai feelings so here it is.

You mentioned getting lots of gyan and your ego getting puffed. That can happen when we think a) we know more than others, and b) we feel we understand better than others. However when you really do start understanding gurbani, you will realise gurbani is not some religious readings and formulas that place you on a higher pedestal than others. Gurbani is Guru himself through the gyan of gurbani helping you to be transformed from an ego and ‘bikh’ driven manmukh to a humble ‘amrit’ driven gurmukh. Japjee, sukhmani sahib, and any other prayers in gurbani are not there to given you some false psychological satisfaction that you now are a religious person, but rather they help you search out all the hidden viruses and spiritual diseases in your inner that are linked to pride so that ‘i’ in you can decrease and God in you can increase.

Likewise doing or listening to kirtan is not about feeling you are holier than others . Rather, the tukhs and shabads being sung are totally oozing and bursting with Gurujee’s sikhiya to help to break your ego, to reduce you and your desires and needs, and to make you realise the real Doer of all is God. The shabads being sung help you to realise how to put right in the eyes of God everything you think, say and do, and how you interact with others, as well as what ought to be the new and real driving forces to help you reform the root of your personality and character in accordance to tat gurmat. Nitnem , kirtan , path are all various means of connecting you to gurbani because gurbani is Guru and Guru wants you to receive His beautiful blessings, plans and designs meant for you, by loving Him and understanding and following His sikhiya.

Katha on gurbani meanings, on gurmat philosophy, on Sikh history, on Gursakhiya is all meant to help you realise that humility is the hallmark of being a gurmukh. It is never about ‘I have heard the katha by so and so so now I am learned to debate and impress and am going up in the pack order! ‘. Rather katha is meant to encourage you that you have made the right choice in taking Amrit and that now you can serve God, Guru, Khalsa Panth and humanity in utter humbleness and love, and protect the weak and meek, and stand up against evil.

The flip side of taking Amrit is that you are now a humble servant and slave of Gurujee and committed to doing His sewa. The sewa of Satguru including wiping sangat’s shoes, washing juthe dishes after langar, cleaning gurudwara toilets etc etc is all meant to make you humble and give you utter joy. As time goes by, this will extend to more and more sewa for the sangat including helping out the elderly, giving the committee and granthi a helping hand, doing kirtan , and katha, looking after the needs of individual members of the sangat etc.

Sewa then extends even further out into society in general, like getting involved in your neighbourhood, getting involved in charity and voluntury groups, so that in the eyes of your neighbours, your community, your town and your country you start standing out as a very humble, loving caring, compassionate, kind, generous person who helps all, protects the vulnerable, speaks out against wrong, and is 100% green and eco friendly and protects the environment.

An amritdharee is never meant to be a person who segregates him/herself from society, becomes racist, looks down on others and loathes a hidden hatred for anyone in the name of religion, and indulges in mere surface psychological satisfaction by adhering to a set of dos and donts meticiously without letting the rehat and kehat of Gurujee to revolutionise your life so you become a dynamic, relevant, and indispensable part of the panth and of humanity.

The way a real amritdharee’s mind works is almost impossible for me to explain and describe or even understand myself! because it is insanely and incredibly mind blowing and out of this world! It is something like having 2 brains in one place! On one hand is the ‘you’ , the you that is getting retrained, reformed and transformed and beginning to see things from new angles including non physical angles which are beyond time, space and shape. Then there is Gurujee’s activated presence in you! because Amrit has been activated and poured into your inner consciousness and is been daily replenished through nitnem, simran etc. This presence can feel like a second brain within! and sometimes you can differentiate between these two, sometimes you cannot! It can get confusing! Very confusing!! Very very very confusing!!! Utterly confusing!!!! Then suddenly Not confusing! Gurbani says ‘shabad Guru, surat dhun chela’’ The Gurbani you read and sing does not remain a stranger on the outside! Gurbani is Guru and Guru internalises to become the voice of your conscience, guiding you, showing you, quietly talking to you , alerting you, waking you, loving you, Now I am reading Japjee! Now Japjee is being read in me! Now Japjee tukha in me are talking to my brain and showing me the next pauri(next step) I need to take in my life! It starts getting more, and more, and more, and more, infinitely more, interactive!

Amritdharee life and thinking is impossible to describe and it is almost a holy grail for the best of our parcharaks past, present, and future including those that get most frequently mentioned ranging from sants to scholars! A small peek into the incredibly exciting writings, (and the mind) of Bhai Gurdas and Bhai Nand Lal, two unparalled and outstanding examples of proper gurmukhs will tell you why. As they say an ideal mind is the devil’s workshop. A true gurmukh is so so so so soooooo busily involved at every level with his Gurudev that he has no time to listen to the voice of haumai! And even if he does accidently Gurujee slaps it off for him!

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WJKK WJKF saadh sangat ji ,

i have one doubt in my mind. We know that "Waheguru" is Gurumantra which is given by Panj pyares.

I have heard in many stories that Gurumantra only works if its given by the authority.

Now for non Amritdhari person Waheguru won't be a Guru Mantra. So does it mean that it wont benefit much.

Please clear my doubt

Why would anyone not be allowed to say one of gods names? We all are Him, we all belong to Him.

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