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Islam Spreading In Britain


BhaiSukhSingh
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We may have our differences with muslim, but we can appreciate the fact that they make their children into Pakke Muslims from the start. From childhood their children can do Namaaz and also fast. Sadly, we Sikhs have not done the same with our children. Our children can't even do proper Paath even in their late teens.

Muslims have the advantage of the Madrassa. Where ever they go they will always open up madrassaas to insure their children get proper religious training. We have no such facilities in the west. We should open small Taksals in the west. We have such a huge population of Sikhs in the English speaking world, yet we have not even been able to create a single Taksal in the west. It is needed more than ever.

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We may have our differences with muslim, but we can appreciate the fact that they make their children into Pakke Muslims from the start. From childhood their children can do Namaaz and also fast. Sadly, we Sikhs have not done the same with our children. Our children can't even do proper Paath even in their late teens.

Muslims have the advantage of the Madrassa. Where ever they go they will always open up madrassaas to insure their children get proper religious training. We have no such facilities in the west. We should open small Taksals in the west. We have such a huge population of Sikhs in the English speaking world, yet we have not even been able to create a single Taksal in the west. It is needed more than ever.

thats not the answer. most large sikh communities in UK cities have a punjabi school teaching Sikhi stuff. However if parents aren't interested in sending the children there whats the point?

additionally if you open a little taksal to teach children paath and they go home to their father drinking bicardi watching the footy with his mates and mum cooking meat watching bollywood dancing, children are understandably more likely to think their family culture is correct rather than the contradicting stuff they are being taught in a taksal. There is a much deeper rooted difference between the two religions/cultures than what your solution can provide, it may however be part of a larger campaign to tackle the situation.

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thats not the answer. most large sikh communities in UK cities have a punjabi school teaching Sikhi stuff. However if parents aren't interested in sending the children there whats the point?

additionally if you open a little taksal to teach children paath and they go home to their father drinking bicardi watching the footy with his mates and mum cooking meat watching bollywood dancing, children are understandably more likely to think their family culture is correct rather than the contradicting stuff they are being taught in a taksal. There is a much deeper rooted difference between the two religions/cultures than what your solution can provide, it may however be part of a larger campaign to tackle the situation.

opening up taksals is the only solution...small sikh learning centres..where sikhs can learn santhiya of gurbani..sikh philosophy..sikh history ..all from historical sikh granths...we are soo far behind musalman in the knowledge of our own dharam...if this is not sorted out this or next generation..then the gurdwaras we have now will start disappearing one by one

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opening up taksals is the only solution...small sikh learning centres..where sikhs can learn santhiya of gurbani..sikh philosophy..sikh history ..all from historical sikh granths...we are soo far behind musalman in the knowledge of our own dharam...if this is not sorted out this or next generation..then the gurdwaras we have now will start disappearing one by one

I agree. Those little punjabi schools are not good enough. We need real Taksals all over the western world from where we can create our own Gianis, Granthis, Kirtanis instead of importig them from India. Opening up Taksals in the west is the only solution from where Sikhs can get systematic religious knowledge. We spend so much hard earned millions of pounds/dollars creating lavish Gurdwaras in the western world, when in fact we need to create Sikh seminaries/taksals in the west. Sikhs who learn from such Taksals can then go and preach the word of the Gurus in English to the kids born and raised here in the west. This is very badly needed.

Not just in the west, even in India, we need many Taksals all over Punjab. Today we only have a few Taksals in Punjab itself, that is not good enough. We should have hundreds of such Taksals in Punjab alone if we want Sikhism to grow. Sikh awareness will only grow amongst the masses if knowledgeable Gursikhs are imparting systematic Gurmat knowledge all over Punjab through Sikh centers/Taksals. This can solve so many problems we are currently facing such as lessening the influance of kala Afghanis, Fake Gurudom.

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But do you guys know the fact that it is the muslim parents who teach namaaz to their children right from a very young age.

The muslim children as young as two or three years of age can speak verses from the quran which is in arabic.

These children did not learn this from anyone else but their own parents who put so much effort in this.

Can the same be said of Sikh parents. How will the children learn paath and know about our religion?

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Muslims should be praised as whereever they go they do tend to infuse the tennets and beliefs of Islam into their kids. Regardless of how religious a couple are they will in almost all cases send their children to after school classes to learn arabic and the koran. In the UK it is very rare to find a UK born muslim from what ever background who can not read arabic and the koran, and know various prayers by heart. They may not speak arabic in most cases but they can read it to a level required to read prayers. In larger cities with muslim populations a high majority partake in jummah namaz. Even in many work places and schools there will be a seperate prayer room with wudu facilities which nearly all muslims will use on Fridays.

The difference between muslims and Sikhs is that a muslim from even 'irreligious' (for want of a better word), background will go to mosque/ after school madraseh etc. So nearly all muslims will go and learn arabic and the koran, there dads will not follow sunnah and may do things that muslims shouldn't do i.e.drink, eat haram etc. There kids will be there along with kids whose dad will follow sunnah pray namaz 5 a day etc. Whereas with Sikhs more than likely it is only kids of couple who are already religiously inclined that you will find in Sikhi school. Whcih is like one day a week and one day a week is punjabi school. The two are mutually exclusive. Muslims go mosque school 5 days a week and it is arabic/muslim school not punjabi school and then on another day sikhi school . Nearly all muslims go to these schools but theres no waiting lists, need spaces etc. Whereas with us firstly there are from my experience age restrictions and a waiting list. Only in the larger Gurdwareh will you find proper organised teaching with the smaller Gurughars its all levels mixed in one class.

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Another thing is in loads of cities there are Islamic schools which kids attend full time. I know at least 3 in Leicester. Whereas with Sikhs schools to my knowledge only operate in London and Birmingham. More of these are needed. I know there is a Sikh school opening in Leicester next September, it's for primary school aged kids, but theres not much info out there about it, yet. On a personal note I will look into it and send my little gremlins there.

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I don't know where al this talk of 'madrassas' and 'classes in mosques' comes from. Most of my best friends throughout my life have been muslims and not one of them have ever been to classes in mosques or madrassas etc. They know their prayers and they know their faith because their parents taught them at home. As kids we would all ride our bikes outside and when the time came the muslim friends would go home because it was time for the whole family to pray together.

(granted though....this could be a London v up north thing, as most Pakistanis up north seem to be Kashmiri / Mirpuri whearas most of the Pakistanis around this manor are Punjabis just like us)

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WSL your from Osterley, in Hounslow and surrounding areas many muslims do go to mosque schools, as I have seen it. You see loads of young kids in a topi and juba with there koran in a satchel. For muslims it is better for them to pray in congregation than at home, Namaz is only like 10 - 20 mins 30 mins max if it's jummah and they do kuthbah and baienh..So most muslims do go to after school mosque classes to learn. Normally 5 - 6.30, when many parents are at work. Even in London, as I lived there for 6 years you see young muslims kids going to the mosque to have after school classes. Very rarely do muslims teach the kids at home, it's more likely at after school classes in the mosque.

Pakistani's may be the dominant muslim community in the UK, but only less than 15 % are non- kashmiri / mirpuri. Mirpuri is very similar to punjabi, it's just a differnet dialect of Punjabi. Also I only know of 2 places in UK where the majority of muslims in the area are not Pakistani i.e Tower Hamlets, Newham (East London) Bengali and Leicester majority of muslims are of Indian descent. Gujrati / Kutchi. Either from India or Africa (mainly Malawi or surrounding areas). It's a myth that Leicester is not home to a large population of muslims. Everyone thinks it's mainly Gujratis which is true but there loads of people of gujrati and kutchi descent in Leicester who are not hindu but muslim. There are more muslims than Sikhs.

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