Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Guest KopSingh

I can see the arguments of why a "Sikh" channel shouldn't cover them, but we, the Sikh Nation, made a historic mistake in the early '50s by pushing away all the "dalits" from the UP and Rajasthan areas who were willing to align to Sikhi, as in theory Sikhi gives them equal status. The population of UP alone is 200 million - 20% of India's population. A potentially massive number of Sikhs.

i think u may mean the dr ambedkar situaion with the dalits, who could of potentially become sikhs, but ppl like gandhi were tryna stop him, also from what ive read in terms of our leader at the time, the jatts were scared of then becoming a minority, which would of seen, the majority sikh population consist of mostly "lower caste" background ppl. wat i dont get is, WHY did they need someones permission 2 convert 2 sikhi? they shudda jus got on with it, rather than consult with stupid panthic leaders of the time.

SUCH STUPIDITY, its unreal from our leaders, they let us down during partition (ppl like baldev singh wil NEVER b forgiven), and they let those poor dalits down too. consequently ambedkar n only some of his followers became budddhists.

regarding ravidasis, they make me laugh coz i've never heard of a "jatt" gurdwara, yet they have made "chamaar/ravidasi" gurdwara, BTW before any1 says im being discriminatory im of neither community, thatt why my name is kopSINGH. also how can ravidasis now try n create their own religion? its a joke ting, coz surely they shuda created the "ravidasi religion" when n after ravidas was around, rather than jus come up with their own scriptures/slogans etc. which i believe is more of a political strengthening move as oppose 2 a spiritual movement!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I was talking about the Dr Ambedkar situation. Sikhs need to be humble and, whilst we may not actively seek to convert people, if they are coming to Guru's dwara (door), we should be there for them with open arms. We need to drop our egos, as per Guru Ji's Hukam, and then our jeevans will have much more influence on the world.

The Gurdwara system is completely failing in Parchaar in terms of its output of Sikhs. Most young Sikhs join with Guru Ji either through the internet or camps such as Sikhi Camp or Khalsa Camp. The Ravidassias like Guru Granth Sahib Ji's message, but are put off by the hypocrisy of "Sikhs" allegedly living the message. We, as a community, need to put these things right.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest KopSingh

Sikhs need to be humble and, whilst we may not actively seek to convert people

wat the hell r u on about? we dont actively seek converts? erm yes we do, sikhi IS a missionary religion, but such is the crap state of our organisations n our set up, our vichaaar 2 non-believers is terrible. It was the british who made sikhs believe we r not a missionary religion. during the british rule of india, sikhi had the most number of converts, and we had the highest growing population, and we were even outbreeding muslims too. if we dont seek converts, then wat is KHALSA MISSIONARY COLLEGE's all over the world? WHY did guru nanak go around the world 2 spread the message. Ur type of ppls attitude n assumptions is y r religion aint spreading, come on man wake up. Guru AmarDas when given guruship, his 1st action was 2 send some of his chelay (followers) 2 go n spread the message. WHATS the point in havin a gem like Sikhi and our guru, and keepin it away from others like a secret, how do we help other spiritualy starvin ppl? we dont shove it down ppls throat n cuss other religions like christians/muslims do.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Right then, its settled. Lets contact every publisher thats got a book on sikhism out there and tell them to recall the books because they need amending. Where they say Sikhism is a religion with 10 Gurus and the 11th being sri guru granth sahib ji, it should now read as a total of 14 gurus as all the different 'castes' need to elevate the bhagat that was from their caste to a position of 'Guru'. Don't worry though, its only 'semantics'. Apparently.

The chamars need to elevate bhagat ravidass to Guru. Thus the julahe Sikhs will need to elevate bhagat Kabir to the position of Guru, because he was a julaha and the jatts will need to elevate bhagat dhanna to the position of Guru.

I'll get the ball rolling by contacting the calandar printers. They'll need to re-set their printing machines.

The fact is that the word Guru has multiple meaning. NO ONE is trying to add Bhagat Ravidas to the orthodox line of 11 Sikh Gurus - NO ONE! People want to rant and rave about a non-issue like gossip mongering aunty ji's with nothing better to do.

They should try focusing their attention to one of the myriad genuine problems we have in the panth - not petty issues.

Some of you petty people are clowns. Tomorrow you'll be hooking me up for calling my (deceased) paternal grandfather 'Baba ji' because some bozo may feel like I am trying elevate him to the levels of Baba Nanak or something ridiculous like that. Or like my nana would call any teacher that would teach someone a skill over a period of time, the pupil's 'guru' - for the benefit of some of you people -he WAS NOT equating these teachers to our line of Gurus when he did this!

Furthermore, you could call all of the Bhagats in our Guru Maharaj 'Gurus', when we take the original meaning of the word into account. They all teach us, they all bring us out of darkness into illumination.

That's what I'm trying to get at. Stop this petty squabbling over semantics without taking context into account.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I think where possible we should continue to promote unity amongst each and every community within Dhan Dhan Shri Guru Granth Sahib Ji as the issue of bhagat and Guru is being aggressively manipulated by the anti-Sikh agencies.

Recently I watched a UK based Ravidassia (sect) programme state that they only had ONE Guru (bhagat Ravidass ji) and that they should only celebrate this birthday and not like the others (Sikh) who had a birthday every other day!

Soon this section of the Ravidassia community will launch their own Skytv channel "Kanshi TV" http://www.gururavidassguruji.com/kanshitvmayjunejuly.htm whereas I've got nothing against this the militant "Chamar power" songs and speeches are defiantly Politically and Religiously uncomfortable for the future of Punjab

Link to post
Share on other sites
whereas I've got nothing against this the militant "Chamar power" songs and speeches are defiantly Politically and Religiously uncomfortable for the future of Punjab

So it's okay for one group to bang on about their own rural caste but once the underdogs start doing it it becomes 'politically and religiously uncomfortable' - you can't see any hypocrisy in that?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

This is hardly "Jatt hogya sharabi wedding songs" more like caste battle cries - don't confuse underdogs with malicious intent, actually dalsingh101 who do you think they are singing about...... Jatts are not the only section of the Khalsa Panth

Link to post
Share on other sites

these guys may seem docile but they are crazy look at history from panj pyareh till beant singh who killed indira gandhi. they seem to have a thick skin and higher threshold before becoming aggressive but as history proves when they raise their fists it will be remembered.

anyway I dont think there is anything to worry about from these people as they dont seem to step out with any malice in them which is surprising considering the hard time they have had through history.

its not like they are turning hindu/muslim/christian or whatever but focus their belief on bhagat ravidas who has an important place withing our religion too.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

So it's okay for one group to bang on about their own rural caste but once the underdogs start doing it it becomes 'politically and religiously uncomfortable' - you can't see any hypocrisy in that?

Do you even know the first thing about Punjab ? I really don't think yopu do.

90% of songs about jatts have been written by people who are not jatt.

90% of songs about jatts have been sung by people who are not jatt.

100% of the epic stories of Punjab, about jatts, such as Heer Ranjha, Mirza Sahiban etc were written by people who were not jatt.

Is it the fault of the jatt sikh that non-jatts, throughout Punjab's history, have chosen to make the lead characters in their stories and songs about them ?

Whether we are talking about songs or plays, the fact is that its about Punjabi Folklore. 'Punjabi Folk' has tradition and history behind it. There is no tradition and history behind what the chamars are doing now....i.e singing songs about themselves and declaring themselves a separate religion from Sikhism. Everything about that is devisive and artificial.

You need to learn the basics of Punjabi folk's history Dal Singh. For example, when Waris Shah wrote Heer Ranjha, the reason he made both lead characters Jatts is because it was common feeling at that time for non-sikhs to associate Sikhism with jatts. i.e because it was at the time that the Sikh misls were taking over Punjab the non-sikhs saw it as the rural bumpkin jatts taking over. Thus, the tradition started whereby the 'jatts' were used as a synonym for 'Sikhs'. In fact, even many of the even older Persian accounts of Sikhs mistakingly sometimes refer to the Sikhs as the 'jatts'.

Your misguided notions fella, are clearly based on hatred as much as they are from jealousy.

Link to post
Share on other sites

West London Singh.......

Boring standard pro caste apologism...

zzzzzzz....

Singhs have NOTHING to worry about from Chamars....the casteist fudus who've been giving them a hard time have though (and rightly so in my opinion).

All Sikhs have to ask ourselves. Can we honestly put our hands on our hearts and say that all of our society been true to this vision of our beloved Baba Nanak?

ਸਾਚਾ ਸਾਹਬੁ ਏਕੁ ਤੂ ਹੋਰਿ ਜੀਆ ਕੇਤੇ ਲੋਅ ॥੩॥

You are the One True Lord and Master of all the other beings, of so many worlds. ||3||

ਨੀਚਾ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਨੀਚ ਜਾਤਿ ਨੀਚੀ ਹੂ ਅਤਿ ਨੀਚੁ ॥

Those who are lowest of the low class, the very lowest of the low;

ਨਾਨਕੁ ਤਿਨ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ਸਾਥਿ ਵਡਿਆ ਸਿਉ ਕਿਆ ਰੀਸ ॥

Nanak seeks the company of those. Why should he try to compete with the great?

ਜਿਥੈ ਨੀਚ ਸਮਾਲੀਅਨਿ ਤਿਥੈ ਨਦਰਿ ਤੇਰੀ ਬਖਸੀਸ ॥੪॥੩॥

In that place where the lowly are cared for-there, the Blessings of Your Glance of Grace rain down. ||4||3|

Truth is that some of our people have been behaving DISGRACEFULLY towards so called 'lower castes', the opposite of what Guru ji is talking about above.

Link to post
Share on other sites

West London Singh.......

Boring standard pro caste apologism...

zzzzzzz....

Singhs have NOTHING to worry about from Chamars....the casteist fudus who've been giving them a hard time have though (and rightly so in my opinion).

All Sikhs have to ask ourselves. Can we honestly put our hands on our hearts and say that all of our society been true to this vision of our beloved Baba Nanak?

Truth is that some of our people have been behaving DISGRACEFULLY towards so called 'lower castes', the opposite of what Guru ji is talking about above.

sikhs have nothing to worry about from ravidas dharm?...did they not commit beadbi of our sri guru granth sahib and take bhagat ravidas bani out?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • No. But it’s an interesting thread and still relevant. There’s not a massive amount of other active threads on this site Are there any Sikh schools in America or Canada (wherever you’re from ) ?
    • I think it's this one https://www.hulldailymail.co.uk/news/hull-east-yorkshire-news/worry-over-horrendous-deliberate-fly-1234647
    • https://ommcomnews.com/india-news/offensive-photo-shoot-at-kartarpur-annoys-sikh-community Offensive Photo Shoot At Kartarpur Annoys Sikh Community   Offensive Photo Shoot At Kartarpur Annoys Sikh Community By OMMCOM NEWS On Nov 29, 2021    Share New Delhi:  A clothing brand recently came under fire after an alleged photo shoot at the Kartarpur Gurdwara in Pakistan. In the shoot, a Lahore-based model can be seen bareheaded, posing for the camera, compromising the sanctity of the place, Express Tribune reported. Pakistan Federal Information Minister Fawad Chaudhry and members of the Sikh community expressed annoyance over the fashion photoshoot at the Kartarpur shrine, Pakistan Observer reported. Chaudhry slammed the designer and the model for the photoshoot. “The Designer and the model must apologise to Sikh Community #KartarPurSahib is a religious symbol and not a Film set,” he wrote on Twitter. Manjinder Singh Sirsa, the President of Delhi Sikh Gurdwara Management committee, also condemned the act, calling it “desecration”. “Pakistan court issued arrest warrant of star who did dance video at Mosque; same must be done against this woman from Lahore as an example of treating all religion at par.” “Otherwise, any talk of respect for Sikhism is hollow,” he said. In another tweet, Sirsa commented: “Such behaviour and act at the pious place of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji is totally unacceptable! Can she dare to do the same at her religious place in Pakistan? Imran Khan and the government of Pakistan should take immediate action to stop this trend of treating Sri Kartarpur Sahib as a picnic spot by Pakistani people.” Meanwhile, the clothing brand, Mannat, has issued a clarification on the matter. The Instagram page has since removed the controversial posts and released a statement, the report said. “The pictures posted on our accounts are NOT part of any shoot done by Mannat Clothing. These pictures were provided to us by a third-party (blogger) in which they were wearing our dress. Please note that Mannat has absolutely NO role in deciding how and where the pictures were taken,” the statement read. “However, we accept our mistake that we should not have posted this content and we apologise to every single person who was offended by this. All the holy places are very sacred to us.” “The pictures and posts have been removed from all our media channels. Again, we apologise wholeheartedly for hurting the public sentiment. Believe us when we say we had no such intention.” On the other hand, Pakistan Punjab Police in a statement said that they are investigating all aspects related to this incident and strict legal action will be taken against those responsible. “Management of the concerned brand & model are being investigated. Worship places of all religions are equally respectable,” reads the statement, as per the report.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use