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Why Are So Many Moderate Sikhs Against Khalistan


hgsingh
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I totally disagree with this. In this day and age, the Akal Takhat Jathedar must be diplomatic, mature and peaceful. A Jathedar that actively campaigned for Khalistan would be a disaster for the Kaum. The Sikhs paid a heavy price and Punjab suffered tremendously during the last Khalistan morcha.

At present, times are relatively peaceful. Now is the time to re-group and grow stronger. For that we primarily need peace and stability.

you are saying the shaheeds did in vain in the last morcha?

They've been regrouping for 20+years. You want another 20+, 100+ 1000+ years?? Those who dare, win.

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, what's FAR more troubling to me is the fact that if you go to a random village in Punjab today you will have difficulty finding a man under the age of 50 with his kesh intact. That image is far more damning to me than an image of the destroyed Akal Takht. Buildings have been destroyed and rebuilt before. But walking around Punjab struggling to see any non-trimming young sardars, I can't help but feel "this is the image that really captures the irreversible damage that's been done".

Don't forget the main reason for this is because the Indian Government picked up, tortured and kiled, those young men who would have been 50 with kesh today. Since that time of the genocide in the 80s & 90s young men are still put off from keeping their case. Some mothers are still frightened to start their children off on the Sikhi path with Kesh in Punjab for fear of the Police killing them one day like they killed Shaheed Jaspal Singh Ji a couple of weeks ago, and how they totured the Young Nihang Singh last week, and the others they have arrested and tortured who have not been caught camera over the last couple of weeks. Or the mothers are scared of their children becoming leaders and being arrested, like our leaders today!

Until we have self rule, the central government will still be able to ensure there are hardly any Keshdharis are in Punjab - FACT!!

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How about lack of leadership? We cant even run our own gurdwaras, how will we run a country. Our current Sikh politicians are the most corrupt, who will we follow?

can sikhs run a country if they can't run a gurdwara

thats THE MOST CRAPPEST ARGUMENT, Muslims run their mosques well, yet their countries r terriblly run, so where is ur argument going? so your/indian ppls argument is crap, simple!

I WILL TELL U GUYS ALL STRAIGHT NOW, id rather have khalistan now, full of corrupt leaders, rather than just b a part of india. atleast in khalistan we can have a arab-spring type of revolution n kick the leaders off their perch. But in india, if we try a revolution in panjab now, WHAT HAPPENS? BRAHMINS come poking their noses in, and bring their tanks/artillery. Atleast in our OWN country WE CALL THE SHOTS!! end of.

if badals were the prime ministers of khalistan, they'd have been assasinated by now! there wud b no brahmins in delhi for them 2 suck up too. dera babas like ram rahim/noormahelia etc who currently have brahmin backed z-list security wud of been ak-47'd long time ago, any sikh here who thinks we can flourish as a part of india in the nxt 20-40+yrs is havin a laugh.

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you are saying the shaheeds did in vain in the last morcha?

They've been regrouping for 20+years. You want another 20+, 100+ 1000+ years?? Those who dare, win.

Did they die in vain? Depends on which way you look at it. If you mean did their sacrifice result in Khalistan, well then clearly not. What about the innocent people who died that didnt care about Khalistan or any other cause and just went about their daily lives? Did they die in vain? Yes they did since I'm sure that they would have prefered to have lived, rather than being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

In answer to your question about re-grouping. Yes I want a long time before anyone thinks about starting this kind of morcha again. Where is the evidence that kharkoos have been regrouping? My understanding is that the Kharku groups are now pretty much disbanded. Punjab is not ready for armed struggle. The carnage this time will be tenfold worse than last time and Punjab will be taken back into the dark ages.

Besides, the term, 're-grouping' doesnt only refer to the re-building building of military muscle, though that is part of it. It also refers to Panthic infrastructures being strong. Schools, Colleges, Universities, Media, Gurdwareh, representative organisations and most importantly the collection of large amounts of revenue. The ideological groundwork in terms of religious and political parchaar must also take place at a grass roots level and that will take decades to achieve. All this 'who dares wins nonsense' and other war mongering strategies are not going to get us anywhere.

Peace is the top priority right now. We need to increase the number of Sikhs, increase the parchaar of Sikhi and make Sikh institutions strong. That can only happen in times of peace. Then, perhaps in about 50-100 years we can look at the next step on the ladder. Although personally, I think it will take alot longer.

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Did they die in vain? Depends on which way you look at it. If you mean did their sacrifice result in Khalistan, well then clearly not. What about the innocent people who died that didnt care about Khalistan or any other cause and just went about their daily lives? Did they die in vain? Yes they did since I'm sure that they would have prefered to have lived, rather than being at the wrong place at the wrong time.

I agree with Pedrorizzo, as what he is saying, is that if some Sikhs ask for Khalistan rather than live as slaves under the Brahmin/central government controlled Police and Army in the Punjab, the central govt brahmins are black mailing us even today, in that, Pedrorizzo is saying that they will rape and kill innocent Sikh Girls, Sikh Boys, Sikh Women and Murder Sikh Men, AGAIN!. Like the rest of us Pedrorizzo admits that india raped and murdered Sikh Children, Women and Men (.25 million) back in the 80s and 90s because they wanted the Sikhs to remain as their slaves. Pedrorizzo is just saying that the indian/Brahmin government are sill rappist and murderers in waiting and that we should be very careful and get much more organised before we try and fight our way out of this exploitation and slavery as otherwise he fully believes that the indian govt/brahmins will kill even more innocent Sikhs!

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Fair points but next time there's a march for a Sikh cause (and NOT a nagar kirtan where people turn up regardless of adherence and love for Sikhi) such as the recent events surrounding Bhai Balwant Singh, you go tell every mona to pi55 off back home because they're not needed. If they refuse you give them a thrashing as well.

I agree with you absolutely and completely about Sikhs adhering to the rehat of kesh, but your attitude won't get us anywhere. If monas have fallen by the wayside it's up to us to bring them back. Would you kick your own brother to the curb if he hit hard times?

All of Mankind is the brotherhood; our brotherhood - let's begin considering people born into Sikh homes as our brothers shall we?

Bro these r not my points but these r contents of Rehatnama dictated by Guru Gobind Singh ji and use of word Sirgum by Guru Nanak dev ji .Those mona sikhs r welcome who r out of ignorance went the other way or swayed by others Bhai Rajnona has given the direction but others who has bad intention have adopted dehdharis or cuts hair just to call them modern take the example of a girl being a sikh who demeaned sikhi in reality show of MTV in roadies should not have any place in our fraternityand these kind of people have no regard for sikh saheeds.

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You are right that a lot of monas are hardcore Khalistan supporters.

I think it's great that they have some sense of religious/national pride. But I must admit that it really pisses me off on many levels.

If they feel so strongly about Khalistan, they should grow out their hair. They want political autonomy for their religion while simultaneously contributing to the religion's death.

If they were in Delhi in November 1984, nothing would have happened to them. If I saw them on the street, I'd assume they were Hindus. If they feel so proud, why are they afraid to show who they are? It just really baffles me.

It shouldn't baffle you. Like I said, if I had to do a rough estimate of the most ardent 'Khalistan' supporters I have ever encountered, I would have to say up to 90% of them are moneh. It shouldn't baffle you because the desire to be free....the desire to not be occupied by a foreign people....is a universal desire of all mankind that transcends all boundaries such as level of faith etc.

If you look at freedom movements worldwide, they only work when the movement has the support of the ordinary (not very religious) man or woman. Lets look at the Iranian example for example. The revolution worked not because the majority of people were ultra-religious. It worked because it had the support of ordinary university professors, teachers, bank clerks etc. People who wern't especially religious but did not like (among other things) the way that their human right to practice their religion was being curtailed by the shah. Thats how revolutions work. Thats how independence movements become successful.

What you need to understand is that there are things beyond pure Sikhi at play here. Punjab never was part of India and never should be part of India. Just because a mona isn't that religious it doesn't mean the internal fire / desire to be free has been extinguished. He or she is still a son / daughter of the soil of Punjab. He or she is still being occupied by a nation that tricked their way into occupation by telling lies in 1947.

Like I said....india needs kicking out of where it clearly doesn't belong....and that independent nation of ours needs to simply be called 'Punjab', rather than Khalistan. When we demand 'khalistan' it conjures up images in peoples minds of an unrealistic fantasy demand. But an independent 'Punjab' has historical truth to back it up. It makes it harder for our enemies to dismiss it.

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Bro these r not my points but these r contents of Rehatnama dictated by Guru Gobind Singh ji and use of word Sirgum by Guru Nanak dev ji .Those mona sikhs r welcome who r out of ignorance went the other way or swayed by others Bhai Rajnona has given the direction but others who has bad intention have adopted dehdharis or cuts hair just to call them modern take the example of a girl being a sikh who demeaned sikhi in reality show of MTV in roadies should not have any place in our fraternityand these kind of people have no regard for sikh saheeds.

I know, brother. But we musn't let bitterness get in the way of helping others. People are looking for excuses to say "Singhs aren't welcoming and inclusive so why should I bother with becoming one of them if they display the worst traits of a person who purports to follow God?". Although they will come to realise that to become Sikh isn't of concern to anyone but the person who wishes to do so. However at the beginning of embarking on that particular journey most people are looking to belong and be accepted.

There's a difference between those guys who mock and belittle Sikhi, and those monas who are clueless (in the nicest way possible) and curious about Sikhi but need a helping hand to move forward and understand the concepts of the faith. There's also a third group who are mona but have intense love for the faith and know a fair bit about our scriptures and customs but just can't seem to make that jump to keeping kesh. We must be able to distinguish between the three types. To dismiss them all as heretics is not the way forward.

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