Why Are Sikh People So Against Radha Soami Path

[Singh559]

worn off.

[VanHelsingh]

An eye-opener of a post from Paneer Monster.

Usually I'm of the frame of mind of live and let live (as long as beadbi isn't occuring or there's no intentional distortions designed to erode the very foundations of the Sikh faith) but as Paneer Monster brilliantly highlighted, such people turn to these sects out of desperation or, in some cases, laziness at not wishing to learn of the gem of a faith we already have.

I do agree there are those at the top of the Sikh faith who have a lot to answer for, but we can't blame others for our personal failings. There comes a time when, as individuals, we have to step-up and make the right choices.

[Mand5]

to be honest ive read everyone's comments and thank you for all the hate comments as the gurus would be so proud.

and to me the sikh bible is merely just a book or call an a to z guide to get back home, ive not once been disrespectful towards the sikh path nor would i ever as i too

am sikh. ive been following the sikh path since 12 and now im 33 and yes i think i do know what im talking about some of yous say ive disrespected the sikh pathbut read your own comments and see how you too have disrespected the rs path, beleave it or not i went to one of your sikh schools guru gobind khalsa college in chigwell and boy that was an eye opener to the bad thing sant baba amar das ji the fonder of this school now they took 1000s of sikh people and the early years that school was run hardly anyone got a good education explain that to me cos i too can go on n on about how they got it wrong plus they had the sikh bible in school and they were carrying on like that, now how bad is that, you call your sikh bible your 11guru lol its not me whos brainwashed mate,

you people have not studied the sikh bible properly yourselfs, ive been on the rs path for over 15 years n now i was given the gift of life the five holy names(naam) best thing ive ever done in mylife no way ever do i beleave ive been brainwashed,you people wanna disrespect me go for it for i wont disrespect back merely just give you a few home truths,

for one if the rs path was fake and present and past living masters(teachers) were fake too then one why is it that its run and more successful then the sikh path why hasnt it floped like other paths have?

and some of you people have been so rude towards the rs path how on earth can you call yourselfs sikhs when all your 10 not 11 gurus would be so so disappointed,

and this is where we get it all wrong that we think this earth is our true home when all the 10 gurus message was to show us the way bak Home not do what sikhs have been doing is making a foundation on earth all your answers are in the sikh bible but all you guys do is sit there infront of the bible lishening but yet not understanding one thing at all, you got the cheek to say im brainwashed when its your people who have changed the sikh teachings and brainwashed you lot, look deeper in the bible and you will clearly see that it says you need to seek a living master or teacher and one who has the five not 4 not 3 but five holy names now if that is what is writen why are sikhs not folloring that well cos for one thered be no need for temples because the true kindom of heaven is within each and everyone of us, the same message is in every bible out in all paths i call it paths cos thats what they were ment for but people take over and turn it into a religion only to control people, never has the masters of the rs path say that they are god nor did the 10 gurus say they were gods they were messagers from god just like the rs masters and if any of you lot wanna take this further then talk to baba ji himself and you will get the answers, n not im not trying to compare not murge the to paths together and baba ji doesnt just talk about sikhs so get over yourselfs they talk about all paths,why have i come on here thats right to defend my master cos none of yous have the right to disrespect like that and im quite sick n tired of all the stupid comment you people right, and you sikhs have over the years lishen carefully to what the rs masters satsangs and copied yourselfs and then made out we already knew this what a lot of nonsence, i too could go on n on n on like ariston.

the rs path has been going on for over 150 years whys hasnt it flopped if its fake and why havnt the sikh comumity taken him out like the other if you sikhs are so aginst the rs path then bloody do sumthing about it rather then chatting actions are alot more effective or are you sikh warriors scared.

well its true you lot are just full of words but no actions cos the way you lot say that rs path has copied n taken so much from sikh path how can you lot just sit there and do nothing,

im not gonna leave anymore comments here as its a waste of efford where i could be useing my time to better use.

and as for you paneer monster you havnt a clue go back to baba ji and ask questions on wat ive spoken about and plus you need to shutup with your fake arss comments thinking you know what your talking about you havnt a clue mate, not a clue so if you think im not going to insult you ur wrong with the stuff you have put on here ur a <banned word filter activated> with a capital D

how you think you know what your talking about makes me laugh you need to just jog on mate,and take your fake arss comments with you dont you ever disrespect my master like that oh and you want my number you mug jog on think before you speak ahhhh how sweet you wanna help me n ma family from getting brainwashed loooooool dont make me laugh mate.

and this is to all the sikh people the bible was created for mandkind not for sikhs alone and if you lot wanna point the finger at rs path and other paths first point at yourselfs, dont jugde others when you are not perfect cos if one was perfect he wouldnt be here he would be at home with the lord

ENJOY :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2:

MAND5 OVER AND OUT

PEACE

[Into the Light]

what i've noticed is that while there still maybe alot of elders that are Radhasoami...but their kids who are born/bred in UK question Radhasoami-ism and find it flawed...hence why i know of sooo many kids who don't want to associate or go to their satsangs in Bedford like their parents do and now call Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee their Guru (whether they're even kesdadhri or not).

I think the elder generation are uneducated and follow anything that walks, but their own next generation will come back into Gurmat...and i'm seeing that first hand happening now - i know of too many examples!

[singher23]

That dude is lost. Forget him

[N30S1NGH]

I usually like to look at the root of problem. The reason why people are going more towards other pseudo cults like radhaswamis is because lack of bhramvidya in the panth as i posted earlier - http://www.sikhsanga...a-in-the-panth/ ..it's replaced by bhandi parchar - abhramic version of Vahiguroo/God, rational, missionary, bhausari thought which shoved sikhi in a tunnel. This is single handly an number one cause of people are swaying away from sikhi because of our parcharaiks and parchar.

While political activism is good and have very special place in sikhi as dharam and rajneeti are not seperated they are together. I feel we have gone way overboard with political activism in gurdwaras to the point that we have forgotten spiritual sikhi (adhyatamic sikhi- sant aspect in panth) which is main layer of one's life. It's from sant aspect of one's life(dya, bhramgyan, sam dristhi, satogun) sipahi is born not the other way around..as i mentioned earlier - sipahi spirit in sikhi should be born, properly controlled, preserved and nurture from sant spirit not from sheer tamogun..sheer tamogun makes one rakshash and khalsa is not rakshash.!!

Anyway, parchariks have gone way overboard with doing parchar of sipahi aspect in sikhi i.e - dhaadi varan/katha of our warriors, our guru sahiban..showing only one aspect- sipahi aspect of our guru sahib- For eg- Potral of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji as only an warrior, not divine majestic master and giver to people from all walks of life..there were reasons why there are 52 poets in guru maharaj darbar, there was reason why guru gobind singh maharaj was divine master and giver of raag vidya to all, there was a reason why guru gobind singh maharaj created taksal , nirmale, sevapanthis (scholary knights in the sikhism), there was a reason why sri guru gobind singh ji wrote majestic gurbani in true poetic form such as - jaap sahib, sri akaal ustat showing sargun and nirgun beauty of Vahiguroo and there was a reason why bhai nand lal wrote deep spiritual craving poetry towards majestic divine sri guru gobind singh ji so our pendu bandai don't potray sri guru gobind singh according to their own mindset and according to their own little tunnel version of sikhi..!!..but everything happened opposite in the panth..!!

We didn't even get the basic and extremely important matter right. We failed to provide theological explanation of what is Vahiguroo in sikhism and let alone mystic layer of sikhi. Most of our parcharaik(missionary etc type) have used abrahamic, semetic version of god in Sikhism to explain Vahiguroo...people need to do their own research on sargun nirgun aspect of vahiguroo (this is what most sikh theology is based on)..On this forum we had a deep vichar with bijla singh ji on it - http://www.sikhsanga...irgun-nirankar/ ..people can read upon it and do their own search..!!

There is no bar set for our parcharaiks in the gurwdaras. So any joe blow comes along do parchar with their own mindset/bibek buddhi to make a quick buck.

Gyani thakur singh ji patialawale himself said in japji sahib katha that i can go deep but people who are listening are complaining that there is no bir ras in the katha, even sangata are addicted to bir ras katha which are being feed everyday in the gurdwara without keeping balance.

The reason our people are attracted to radhaswamis is our parcharik fault and our fault of failing to demand some depth- ask parcharak questions, ask committe vales collectively as sangat to have question and answers sessions with our parcharaiks..radhaswamis steal stuff from our mystic traditions and mix it little bit brand it and present to normal joe with fancy terms- normal joe blow gets totally blown off with mysticism..while radhaswamis steal stuff from our mystic tradition/layer our parcharaiks are still stuck at the shariat layer of dharam and feed shariat layer of dharam all day long without going to depth to sangat. Normal joe in sangat thinks with ignorance- looks like this is sikhi and search somewhere else to fulfill their curiosity or get peace. Our parchariks have shoved sikhi in a tunnel and bought beautiful divine path of sikhi down to mere "dhadi varan, sakhiyas', sikhitothemax translations'

Ang- 1083

saraa sareeath lae ka(n)maavahu ||

Let your practice be to live the spiritual life.

thareekath tharak khoj ttolaavahu ||

Let your spiritual cleansing be to renounce the world and seek God.

maarafath man maarahu abadhaalaa milahu hakeekath jith fir n maraa ||3||

Let control of the mind be your spiritual wisdom, O holy man; meeting with God, you shall never die again

Sorry don't want make this too long, each one of us and parcharak have moral and spiritual duty to explore sikh deep within both internally and externally. In Akaal ustat-

In the Akal Ustat (within Dasam granth sahib) are 10 'Dohras' (Verses) from 'Ank' (Number) 201 to 210. Within these verses, Guru Gobind Singh Ji has posed a number of questions. These questions are meant to be pondered over and answered by each 'Gursikh' (searcher of spiritual truth) be they of whatever religion.

Tav Parsad [With the grace of the Almighty]

Dohra (name of verse)

Once Siri Atma [Primal Atma (self)/God] spoke to the mind.

That Who’s glory shines every where is the master of the world.

Say then, how is this glory manifested in all its varieties?'

'Akal Ustat', Dasam Guru Durbar

The mind to whom the 'Atma' (soul) is speaking to above is that of mankind. That question, which has been asked, its answer is what is understood as Naam Simran in sikhi. The questions the Guru asks here after this question, and their answers in fact, answer this above great question.

Questions-

(2) What is the form of 'Atma' (True self)?

(3) What is the thought behind creation?

(4) What is 'Dharma'?

(5) What is 'Karma'?

(6) What is creation?

(7) What is life?

(8) What is death?

(9) What is heaven?

(10) What is hell?

(11) What is cleverness?

(12) What is stupidity?

(13) What is 'Tark' (reasoning)?

(14) What is not 'Tark'?

(15) What is slander?

(16) What is praise?

(17) What is sin?

(18) What is 'Dharma'?

Some of the questions are asked twice by the Guru. Here, the Guru desires a different answer to previous answer. Each question and its answers are inter-linked to each other to produce a whole picture of Sat Guru, meaning the ideology and philosophy of Sat Guru which should appear at the end of answering all the questions.

(19) What is Yoga?

(20) What is enjoyment of worldly pleasures?

(21) What is action?

(22) What is inaction?

(23) What is hard work ?

(24) What is controlling the senses?

(25) Who is a warrior?

(26) Who is giver of charity?

(27) What is 'Tantra'?

(28) What is 'Mantra'?

(29) Who is poor?

(30) Who is a King?

(31) What is happiness?

(32) What is sadness?

(33) Who is ill?

(35) Who is affectionate?

(36) What is essence of affection?

(37) Who is satiated?

(38) Who is healthy?

(39) What is thought behind creation?

(40) What is creation?

(41) Who is defiled?

(42) What is creation?

(43) Where is action superstition?

(45) Where is superstition destroyed?

(46) Where is happiness of consciousness?

(47) Where is knowledge of that which we can not grasp with our minds?

(48) What is 'Naam'?

(50) What is self-control?

(51) What is knowledge and ignorance?

(52) Who is ill?

(53) Who is a worrier?

(54) Where is Dharma lost?

(55) Who is a warrior?

(56) Who is beautiful?

(57) What is secret of being at one with 'Sat Guru'?

(58) Who is the charitable one?

(59) Who is wise?

(60) What is knowledge?

(61) What is ignorance?

Here the questions end.

It must be noted that many of these questions can be interpreted and rephrased in a different manner, therefore one would derive at a different answer. For example, question (3) can be interpreted as:

(3) Where are thoughts of creation contemplated?

Question (7) can be thought of as asking:

Where is death?

Most of the questions can also be coupled to form one question. For example:

Question (5) and (6) can be combined to form:

What is the Karma of Dharma?

This coupling of questions alters their numbers. Hence, Sikh 'Gianis' (interpreters of scripture) tended not to give a particular number count of these questions.

[Paneer Monster]

to be honest ive read everyone's comments and thank you for all the hate comments as the gurus would be so proud.

also thank your pakhandi baba for his hate comments on dasam bani, bhai gurdas sahib vaaran, sikh history etc

and to me the sikh bible is merely just a book or call an a to z guide to get back home, ive not once been disrespectful towards the sikh path nor would i ever as i too

thats right, to you GURU granth shaib ji maharaj is just a book... to us, your baba is a pakhandi fraud. to a SIKH we believe in 100% of the Gurbani within Guru Granth Sahib JI including "bani guru guru hai bani vich bani amrit sare" - your pakhandi baba picks and chooses what parts to preach to you. we believe in Gurbani 100%... so, your question was, "why are sikh people so against radhasoami path?"... you should ask yyourself "why doesnt radhasoami preach all of GURBANI? why did they remove Guru Granth Sahib Ji from becas in the 70's? Why is BEAS RS headquarters currently under the name of Guru Granth Sahib ji Maharaj?

am sikh. ive been following the sikh path since 12 and now im 33 and yes i think i do know what im talking about some of yous say ive disrespected the sikh pathbut read your own comments and see how you too have disrespected the rs path, beleave it or not i went to one of your sikh schools guru gobind khalsa college in chigwell and boy that was an eye opener to the bad thing sant baba amar das ji the fonder of this school now they took 1000s of sikh people and the early years that school was run hardly anyone got a good education explain that to me cos i too can go on n on about how they got it wrong plus they had the sikh bible in school and they were carrying on like that, now how bad is that, you call your sikh bible your 11guru lol its not me whos brainwashed mate,

You my friend can not take the truth... tell me, where have i lied? the truth hurts. i use to think think like you. i understand that it hurts when we diss your baba, because you believe he is god... but you must understand ... he isnt. my family use to say the same to me. they use to say "just looking at him all your sins are vanishing". seriously wize up... its a cult. dont make the mistake your elders have made. remember, the first radhasoamis use to matha tekhna to guru granth sahib ji... so they clearly were believers that Guru Granth Sahib ji is not "meerly a book" as you put it. if gurbani (guru granth sahib ji) means nothing to you... stop reciting it with your filthy mouths at haynes park. You brainwashed looneys do not even pronounce gurbani properly. radhasoami's believe bulle shah is a "pooran guru"... its like everyone and everyone is a pooran guru. its pathetic. Loook at your faith with an open mind. you came here asking why dont sikhs like rs.... you know the truth is,... rs is attacking sikhi (just like how you are).... answer me this... why does your pakhandi baba keep sikh apperance?? he even wears a kara. the mans a joke. what has he done for the world? Look at the change our Satguru Sahibs have brought to the world... what has your baba done? even NASA scientiests draw wizdom from guru granth sahib ji... who draws wizdom from your baba apart from uneducated and simpltons, and afew hippies in uk adn america?

you people have not studied the sikh bible properly yourselfs, ive been on the rs path for over 15 years n now i was given the gift of life the five holy names(naam) best thing ive ever done in mylife no way ever do i beleave ive been brainwashed,you people wanna disrespect me go for it for i wont disrespect back merely just give you a few home truths,

you have already disrespected Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj - reread your posts. This is the Same Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj that LEGALLY owns the land where your rs headquarters is in beas. Ask your baba who his land belongs to. it legally belongs to guru granth sahib ji maharaj because beas was initially for sikh prachar.

for one if the rs path was fake and present and past living masters(teachers) were fake too then one why is it that its run and more successful then the sikh path why hasnt it floped like other paths have?

more successfull then the sikh path? LOL you are wrong. STUDY SIKH HISTORY THEN STUDY RADHASOAMI HISTORY. your founders enjoyed tobacco beedi and hukka. our guru nanak dev ji maharaj brought GURBANI and Truth to this world. what have your lot brought? so theyve opened afew hospitals, so has the nhs here!! what real things have your tobacco smokers done for the world? look at the influence our Guru Sahibs have had in their existance... how much influence does your baba have? all they have is money. as for the growth of radhasoami there is also a growth of militant islam - that doesnt mean they are truthfull paths. Sikhs have a loving and caring simpole nature... your baba abuses this.

and some of you people have been so rude towards the rs path how on earth can you call yourselfs sikhs when all your 10 not 11 gurus would be so so disappointed,

Guru Nanak Dev Ji maharaj exposed pakhandi brahmins... in the saem way we expose your millionaire pakhandi baba.

and this is where we get it all wrong that we think this earth is our true home when all the 10 gurus message was to show us the way bak Home not do what sikhs have been doing is making a foundation on earth all your answers are in the sikh bible but all you guys do is sit there infront of the bible lishening but yet not understanding one thing at all, you got the cheek to say im brainwashed when its your people who have changed the sikh teachings and brainwashed you lot, look deeper in the bible and you will clearly see that it says you need to seek a living master or teacher and one who has the five not 4 not 3 but five holy names now if that is what is writen why are sikhs not folloring that well cos for one thered be no need for temples because the true kindom of heaven is within each and everyone of us, the same message is in every bible out in all paths i call it paths cos thats what they were ment for but people take over and turn it into a religion only to control people, never has the masters of the rs path say that they are god nor did the 10 gurus say they were gods they were messagers from god just like the rs masters and if any of you lot wanna take this further then talk to baba ji himself and you will get the answers, n not im not trying to compare not murge the to paths together and baba ji doesnt just talk about sikhs so get over yourselfs they talk about all paths,why have i come on here thats right to defend my master cos none of yous have the right to disrespect like that and im quite sick n tired of all the stupid comment you people right, and you sikhs have over the years lishen carefully to what the rs masters satsangs and copied yourselfs and then made out we already knew this what a lot of nonsence, i too could go on n on n on like ariston.

you say "sikhs changed the sikh teaching" yet you radhasoami's call Guru granth Sahib Ji a "sikh bible". You are brainwashed! show me, where in history was Guru Grnath Sahib Ji called "sikh bible" - your pakhandi baba is feeding you crap and your spitting it out here. You are telling us to look at gurbani sahib.... gurbani sahib says BANI GURU GURU HAI BANI VICH BANI AMRIT SARE - explain this. Where does Guru Granth Sahib Ji say we need to believe in a pakhandi baba who gives us a naam of 5 names? it doesnt. ALSO REMEMBER RADHASOAMI BEAS IS IN THE NAME OF GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI AND NOT SIKH BIBLE. <banned word filter activated>.

you say "10 gurus are messengers of god just like rs masters". Look at the achievement of guru nanak dev ji maharaj... challenged ruler and tyrant BABABR... Guru Hargobind Sahib fought 4 great battles against injsutice. What has your pakhandi baba done for all the innocent 250,000+ punjabis that have been killed and tortured by the indian government? this is also documentated by established human rights bodies... what the hell does your baba do apart from sit on his fat <banned word filter activated> and living off his sangats money. if ur baba was the symbol of truth why doesnt he speak out against injustices?

research Sikhi... thats what I did. Reasearch gurbani Sahib with an open mind. clear your mind of radhasoami and sikhi adn anything else. Study gurbani, study the lives of our Satguru sahibs.... then you will have realisation beyond 5 words. YOU ALSO FORGOT TO MENTION, CANDIDATES WHO WANT NAAM NEED TO APPLY VIA AN APPLICATION FORM.

you have only come on this forum to promote your radhasoami fanatism, i can assure you, no one here will take to your fake "sant mat"... so take your preaching elsewhere.

the rs path has been going on for over 150 years whys hasnt it flopped if its fake and why havnt the sikh comumity taken him out like the other if you sikhs are so aginst the rs path then bloody do sumthing about it rather then chatting actions are alot more effective or are you sikh warriors scared.

This means nothing. child abuse has been going on since the begining of kaljug also - its bad but people still do it. also tobacco is an ancient tradition, that your first 2 baba's use to enjoy. also, im alittle confused, are you inviting sikh sangat to come and shoot your living guru / perfect master / god? you should know at beas, sikhs are searched before entering. kirpan wearing sikhs are often not allowed in. (i know, i use to go there).

well its true you lot are just full of words but no actions cos the way you lot say that rs path has copied n taken so much from sikh path how can you lot just sit there and do nothing,

nope - i preach against radhaosami wherever i go. its poison also, im not doing anything, im hitting you back with factual info, none of which you have denied!

im not gonna leave anymore comments here as its a waste of efford where i could be useing my time to better use.

yes, go back to the hole you came out of and recite your fake naam. one radhaosami book said (in other words) the masters <banned word filter activated> smells of roses LOL so in addition to everything else, you have <banned word filter activated> sniffers amongst your community. wake up. i actually might make a sight on radhaosamis. i have all the books, cassets and vhs's here in the basement. i think i will, espose radhasomais to the world.

and as for you paneer monster you havnt a clue go back to baba ji and ask questions on wat ive spoken about and plus you need to shutup with your fake arss comments thinking you know what your talking about you havnt a clue mate, not a clue so if you think im not going to insult you ur wrong with the stuff you have put on here ur a <banned word filter activated> with a capital D

i know truth hurts. are you done crying yet? seriously... open your eyes!!! your master is a phoney. i know its hard to come to terms with - honestly i do. i know your thinking "but our family believe he's satguru".. and i know it gets real personal.... i know u think he gives you salvation... its hard... but look at the posibility of him being fake. i know im Dashing, with a capital D - thank you.

how you think you know what your talking about makes me laugh you need to just jog on mate,and take your fake arss comments with you dont you ever disrespect my master like that oh and you want my number you mug jog on think before you speak ahhhh how sweet you wanna help me n ma family from getting brainwashed loooooool dont make me laugh mate.

well... i tried. i know its hard to accept. another thing radhasoami's say is "naamdhari baba can only take people to 4 khands, but our master can take poeple to 5 khands" ... trust me... i know your community better then you do.

and this is to all the sikh people the bible was created for mandkind not for sikhs alone and if you lot wanna point the finger at rs path and other paths first point at yourselfs, dont jugde others when you are not perfect cos if one was perfect he wouldnt be here he would be at home with the lord

Guru granth sahib ji is for humanity... has a message of equality, tolerance, and God realisation. that does not mean we have to tolerate the likes of your fake baba who is currently occupying lands that belongs to guru granth sahib ji. you ask your baba this, in 1976 why was Guru Granth Sahib Ji no longer parkash at Beas????

ENJOY :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2: :biggrin2:

MAND5 OVER AND OUT

PEACE

i thought you would finish by saying "radhasoami" LoL

[Paneer Monster]

what i've noticed is that while there still maybe alot of elders that are Radhasoami...but their kids who are born/bred in UK question Radhasoami-ism and find it flawed...hence why i know of sooo many kids who don't want to associate or go to their satsangs in Bedford like their parents do and now call Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee their Guru (whether they're even kesdadhri or not).

I think the elder generation are uneducated and follow anything that walks, but their own next generation will come back into Gurmat...and i'm seeing that first hand happening now - i know of too many examples!

you are partly correct... this is also having a damaging affect on sangat... some radhasoamis realise that radhasoami is a backward cult... but they dont come back to sikhi... their faith is damaged and they become athiests. its very sad. radhaosami is a poison. I try to save as many poeple as i can. they dont even want to do vaheguru mantra (mantra of our guru sahibs)... they say "we have our own mantra". its a very hard, long and draining process to deprogram the way they think.

i also agree that the newer generation of sikhs are more political then spiritual... we need to take both to the highest hight.

[chatanga]

if we look deeper into the sikh bible

it is clearly writen that you have to search for a living spiritual teacher

Can you show us please where you have seen this?

[Singh559]

True post N30Singh, Sant Maskeen Ji mentioned this in one of the kathas I was listening to where Sant Maskeen Ji talks about Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji and looking at the spiritual side of Guru Sahib and comparing what it means to look Guru Sahib from the outside and what it means to look at the inside. The explanation was beautiful. :