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Eating Food With/prepared By Gursikhs Only?

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Guest confusedsingh

Need some advice please. I have seen here that Gursikhs expected to only eat food prepared by other Gursikhs and in the company of other Gursikhs. What if one's own family (parents, siblings, other relatives) are not Sikh at all and are atheist/agnostic- do you eat with them and the food prepared by them or not?

What about eating out whilst travelling?

Thanks.

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vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

To help with this question, go back to Guru Nanak Dev Ji's experience with Bhai Lalo. He ate with Bhai Lalo, not because Bhai Lalo was a 'Sikh' or a particular caste, but because he was an honest, humble person with a beautiful soul.

To say that Sikhs should only eat from the hands of other Sikhs is the same as saying Brahmins can only eat from Brahmins. This completely erases the values of Gurbani. True Sikhs do not segregate people based on their religion or their caste or their nationality or any other thing.

What we do is use our Bibek Buddhi (discriminatory intelligence) to keep the company of those people who reflect the values of the Guru i.e. honesty, integrity and humility. It is very naive to assume that all Amritdharis hold these values and therefore we must eat only from Amritdharis. There will be many non-Amritdharis and non-Sikhs who actually live a better 'Sikh' jeevan than Amritdharis do.

Btw, the two quotations you have linked refer to immoral people and those who have dishonoured their Guru. This is not the same as good people or those who are attempting to follow their faith.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji didn't eat with Malik Bhago because his food was a direct consequence of bad actions, not because he was not of the same religion/status as Guru Nanak Dev Ji. It's hard to understand how we have gotten to the stage where we think that Guru Nanak Dev Ji would have said 'I won't eat with you Bhai Lalo because you are not a Gursikh like me.'

These are merely my opinions, on the basis of what Guru Ji has shown me through their ten jeevans and Gurbani. There will be many who disagree, but where I see Guru Ji's values being misrepresented, resulting in our youth being misled, it is necessary to speak.

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

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Need some advice please. I have seen here that Gursikhs expected to only eat food prepared by other Gursikhs and in the company of other Gursikhs. What if one's own family (parents, siblings, other relatives) are not Sikh at all and are atheist/agnostic- do you eat with them and the food prepared by them or not?

What about eating out whilst travelling?

Thanks.

Amritdharis should only consume food prepared by amritdharis. Why? Coz that way we'l know the food was prepared according to rehat and not joota. E.g. If you eat out at a restaurant, bhind the scenes we dont know if they wash their hands, if they cook meat products and veg with same utensils, whether they taste the food for seasoning with the same cooking spoon etc... Whereas with an amritdhari, we know they wouldn't do this.

Ur family- as long as you know they prepare the food according to rehat its fine. Or learn how to cook veerji. Its a great skill to have, fun too. You've just got to ensure your food is not joota. If your chips have been fried in the same oil as fish/chicken then they're not consumable.

If your travelling- again do your best to ensure your foods not joota. Eat from vegy eat outs...errm buy the ingredients and cook yourself.

Also agree with the post above. Its not about not eating someones food coz theyre not of the same status or religion. I wouldnt eat food prepared at my muslim friends house coz 'joot' is not even in their vocab! So unles im towering over him whilst he cooks for me, i just wouldnt take that chance. Doesnt mean ive got something against him. I consider my muslim mates my brothers n sisters.

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To say that Sikhs should only eat from the hands of other Sikhs is the same as saying Brahmins can only eat from Brahmins. This completely erases the values of Gurbani. True Sikhs do not segregate people based on their religion or their caste or their nationality or any other thing.

Why is it that Amritdharis can have the Jhoota of other Amritdharis, but need Pesh if they intentionally have the Jhoota of non-Amritdharis, then?

Disappointing to see the Rehat of Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj ridiculed and labelled as against the values of Gurbani.

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Okay, I am really confused about this topic as well.. but about jhootha there is a shabad from Gurbani:

http://www.sikhitothemax.com/Page.asp?SourceID=G&PageNo=&ShabadID=2010

ਦੂਧੁ ਤ ਬਛਰੈ ਥਨਹੁ ਬਿਟਾਰਿਓ ||

The calf has contaminated the milk in the teats.

ਫੂਲੁ ਭਵਰਿ ਜਲੁ ਮੀਨਿ ਬਿਗਾਰਿਓ ||੧||

The bumble bee has contaminated the flower, and the fish the water. ||1||

ਮਾਈ ਗੋਬਿੰਦ ਪੂਜਾ ਕਹਾ ਲੈ ਚਰਾਵਉ ||

O mother, where shall I find any offering for the Lord's worship?

ਅਵਰੁ ਨ ਫੂਲੁ ਅਨੂਪੁ ਨ ਪਾਵਉ ||੧|| ਰਹਾਉ ||

I cannot find any other flowers worthy of the incomparable Lord. ||1||Pause||

So pretty much this states that pretty much everything is 'jhootha' and we cannot really claim anything as 'pure' or 'sucha' in that means..but i do believe in proper sanitation

and also I am questionable about the fact that amritdharis should only eat from amritdharis.. what difference does that make if we say that god resides in all of us.. and this is another shabad that kinda states that all the stuff we do to attain 'purity' is worthless..Isn't that the same thing that the bramins did?

ਅਭਾਖਿਆ ਕਾ ਕੁਠਾ ਬਕਰਾ ਖਾਣਾ ||

They eat the meat of the goats, killed after the Muslim prayers are read over them,

ਚਉਕੇ ਉਪਰਿ ਕਿਸੈ ਨ ਜਾਣਾ ||

but they do not allow anyone else to enter their kitchen areas.

ਦੇ ਕੈ ਚਉਕਾ ਕਢੀ ਕਾਰ ||

They draw lines around them, plastering the ground with cow-dung.

ਉਪਰਿ ਆਇ ਬੈਠੇ ਕੂੜਿਆਰ ||

The false come and sit within them.

read the whole shabad..

http://www.sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=1738

If your mind is strong then why does it matter who prepared your food.. and logically there is no way that the food that we eat only comes in contact with amritdharis only and what makes you think that washing it makes it any 'pure' (not referring to sanitation)? you do not know where it was sitting and who packed it..and i guess we can argue about this all we want.. everybody has different mentality on this issue...I think if your naam-simran is so strong these things shouldn't mean anything to you..

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Why is it that Amritdharis can have the Jhoota of other Amritdharis, but need Pesh if they intentionally have the Jhoota of non-Amritdharis, then?

Disappointing to see the Rehat of Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj ridiculed and labelled as against the values of Gurbani.

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

Pesh is required for Bujjar Kurehits. These are listed in the Rehat Maryada. Eating food prepared by non-Amridharis is not one of them. If you think differently, then you are entitled to your own opinion.

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

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vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

Pesh is required for Bujjar Kurehits. These are listed in the Rehat Maryada. Eating food prepared by non-Amridharis is not one of them. If you think differently, then you are entitled to your own opinion.

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

REHAT

sMinAwsI bYrwgI jyvY AOr audwsI XogI qyvY jMgm vwmI Avr ju koeI qW kw jUTw kbI n lyeI ]

sa(n)niaasee bairaagee jaevai aar oudhaasee yogee thaevai ja(n)gam vaamee avar j koee thaa(n) kaa joot(h)aa kabee n laeee ||

Hermits, renouncers, Udhasis and Yogis; Celibates and other sects and faiths; never eat from the same plate.

Rehatnama Bhai Nand Laal Jee

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vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

Pesh is required for Bujjar Kurehits. These are listed in the Rehat Maryada. Eating food prepared by non-Amridharis is not one of them. If you think differently, then you are entitled to your own opinion.

vaheguru ji ka khalsa vaheguru ji ki fateh

You did not read what I wrote. I stated that Pesh is needed if one eats the Jhoota of a non-Amritdhari. The Sikh Rehat Maryada of the SGPC/Akal Takht states clearly:

"

q. The following individuals shall be liable to chastisement involving automatic boycott: One who eats/drinks Left-overs of the unbaptised or the fallen Sikhs;

The point I made is that you are very keen to state that "true Sikhs do not segregate others based on religion" - here we have in the SRM a clear example of a distriction drawn between Amritdharis and non-Amritdharis. All Amritdharis are infact compelled to share Amrit and drink from the same vessel - yet it is clear from even the Akal Takht Rehat Maryada that it is wholly unnacceptable to do the same with a non-Amrtidhari.

Please explain - why is it compulsory to drink from the same vessel with fellow Amritdharis in the Amrit Sanchar, yet a serious offense to share the same vessel with a non-Amritdhari?

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No single rehat can be or should be evaluated in a vacuum. Rehat is a big package and all rehats are connected to each other. Bibek is one of those rehats. Every physical act that we do has a spiritual impact to some extent. For this reason Guru Sahib gave us rehat such as not to look at women with lustful eyes, listening to Gurbani only, doing good things with hands and going to Gurdwara instead of clubs and bars. This is why external rehat is very important but it is not fruitful if not combined with internal rehat. Eating food from Amritdharis only is not brahminism because it is not a matter of superiority but matter of how food is prepared that is acceptable to a spiritual human being. Gurbani says that any food that brings “vikaar” or impacts mind to fall under the influence of five vices should not be consumed. Hence, food prepared by non-Amritdhari will have effects of vikaars because they do not adhere to Gurmat standard of preparing food.

Take an example of Amrit. It is prepared by five rehatvaan gursikhs while reading Gurbani, concentrating fully on Amrit and then making an Ardaas. Five non-Amritdharis can follow the same rehat but they cannot make an Amrit simply because they lack rehat in their own lifestyle and they do not have the Guru’s authority. Guru Ka Langar is also prepared by gursikhs in similar way otherwise it is not acceptable. Degh prepared by a non-Amritdhari is not acceptable in Gurdwara. Since, every house of a gursikh is ‘dharamshaal’ then food prepared in it must be Guru Ka Langar. It follows that it must be cooked following the same maryada. This is why every gursikh is told not to have roti beti di saanjh with “sir gum” (monay), “nari maar” (those who take intoxicants), “kuri maar” (those who practice female infanticide), and dehdharis (those who follow human gurus). This rehat is always given at Amrit sanchaar. I do not know why this is widely ignored by gursikhs these days. Gursikhs are not supposed to eat food for taste only but to satisfy huger needs. This is why Guru Sahib in Gurbani gives the hukam to eating and sleeping less. Gursikhs are not supposed to eat food prepared by monay because they do not recite Gurbani and instead engage in idle gossip and slandering. Eating out is worse because those making food may not be washing hands after a smoke or restroom break. Mind of those who eat such food gets affected from such misdeeds. It definitely has a spiritual impact. Even if monay follow the complete rehat, it is still not acceptable because it is not guru ka langar so why should a Sikh eat food that is not accepted to Guru Sahib?

When I say only food prepared by Amritdharis should be consumed, I do not mean those who take Amrit and never keep rehat. They are hypocrites and manmukhs. A gursikh by default keeps rehat otherwise he/she is not a gursikh. This is why bibekis always keep caution and do not eat food prepared by those whom they do not know because a person externally may look like a complete gursikh but may not be one in actual sense. Remember, Ajit Poohla looked like a real nihung.

An interesting point was brought up regarding Guru Sahib keeping bibek. While it is true that Guru Sahib leads by example, it does not mean that He must be held to the same standard. Guru Sahib cannot get affected by any type of food but this is not to say that He never kept bibek. In fact, in Guru Nanak Chamatkaar Bhai Veer Singh clearly writes in many sakhis that Guru Sahib did not accept just anyone’s food but only from those who had reformed themselves to follow the true path. Guru Sahib would give Naam to a devotee and then eat food prepared by him. Guru Sahib rejected the food of Bhoomiya thief but when he became a Sikh, his food was accepted. Guru Hargobind Ji ate food prepared by a Sikh who earned his bread by hard honest work. Guru Gobind Singh Ji did not accept water from someone who had never done seva and in one sakhi did not eat food from someone who had not taken Amrit. Since all Gurus are the same spirit, it means that Guru Gobind Singh Ji did not do anything against Sikhi and followed the same principles taught by previous Gurus. This means all preceding nine Gurus must have kept bibek. The point being that an Amritdhari is supposed to earn his living through honest means and follow rehat. This means not selling tobacco, liquor or meat. When all Sikhs start doing this, we will not see few groups of Sikhs not eating from other Amridharis or at Gurdwaras. Bibek must be kept along with all other rehats such as simran, seva etc. We all need to understand rehat first and not criticize other gursikhs for following more rehat. We should not justify our weakness by demeaning those who keep full rehat because rehat pleases Guru Sahib. It is up to us how much we want to follow rehat. Those who do not want to keep bibek are welcomed to do so but please do not criticize other gursikhs for it. They do not do it due to superirotiy but to please Guru Sahib. Guru Rakha

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Guest confusedsingh

Thank you all for the healthy discussion on this subject of food (pun not intended).

I can see two sides to this- whist the Rehat argument is sound, I think what is being said by other side is that this needs to be handled with great care so as not to make the refusal to eat food with/prepared by non-Gursikhs become a ritual or be perceived as an elitist action. Indeed that is a risk with rehat- becoming a ritual and Guru Nanak ji has made it very clear that rituals will get us nowhere.

In my case, what fault is it of my elderly parents that I cannot eat their food? Yes, I prefer to cook and eat my own food only and almost 98% of the food I eat, I prepare myself (I'm also a health freak and indeed a far from being a vegetarian, I'm a pure vegan (no animal sourced food whatsoever) so my diet is very restrictive), but doesn't it hurt a mother's feelings that her son refuses to eat roti made by her and instead he makes his own roti when he visits them? What of other relatives, does one simply forgoe all relations? I am the only Sikh in my entire family. Whilst I strive to have them eat my own food rather than vice-versa, should I refuse to dine with them because they don't live up to the standards that I have adopted?

As Bijla Singh ji rightly points out, no single rehat can be considered in vacuum (and it needs to be considered in context of Gurbani also). Showing compassion for others is a great virtue as is humility and killing ego. Rehat such as the one relating to food, like other rehat hukamnamas, serves a practical purpose in guiding physical actions which are linked to spiritual impacts. So striving as great extent as possible to eat with/food prepared by Gursikhs whilst respecing family relations (if they go to the extent of cooking in clean vessles to my strict dietary requirements) I think is okay because you are making a positive effort to balance the spiritual impacts of various physical actions and are actively thinking about it and even maybe having a positive impact infuence on others :-)

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REHAT

sMinAwsI bYrwgI jyvY AOr audwsI XogI qyvY jMgm vwmI Avr ju koeI qW kw jUTw kbI n lyeI ]

sa(n)niaasee bairaagee jaevai aar oudhaasee yogee thaevai ja(n)gam vaamee avar j koee thaa(n) kaa joot(h)aa kabee n laeee ||

Hermits, renouncers, Udhasis and Yogis; Celibates and other sects and faiths; never eat from the same plate.

Rehatnama Bhai Nand Laal Jee

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Guest Balveer Singh

Love for our Guru, is love for his creation, therefore love for humanity and its true intentions when offering food. 

A general statement that requires some caveats, ref meat, egs etc

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On 8/21/2012 at 4:39 PM, Guest confusedsingh said:

Need some advice please. I have seen here that Gursikhs expected to only eat food prepared by other Gursikhs and in the company of other Gursikhs. What if one's own family (parents, siblings, other relatives) are not Sikh at all and are atheist/agnostic- do you eat with them and the food prepared by them or not?

What about eating out whilst travelling?

Thanks.

how can you tell if someone is gursikh just by seeing if they are wearing bana?

On 9/19/2020 at 10:11 AM, Guest Balveer Singh said:

Love for our Guru, is love for his creation, therefore love for humanity and its true intentions when offering food. 

A general statement that requires some caveats, ref meat, egs etc

Sorry I don't understand what you mean by caveats?

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On 9/21/2020 at 5:24 PM, ipledgeblue said:

Sorry I don't understand what you mean by caveats?

Exceptions.

Like, "If you were 5 mins from death, and a small cube of sugar would save your life, would you accept it from someone who, in normal circumstances, you'd shun as unacceptable, or would you adhere to your principles and embrace death?"

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6 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

Exceptions.

Like, "If you were 5 mins from death, and a small cube of sugar would save your life, would you accept it from someone who, in normal circumstances, you'd shun as unacceptable, or would you adhere to your principles and embrace death?"

Say Vaheguru before you hand me that!

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