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Does anyone know which of these sampardas would accept students, to learn Gurmat from there Sampardas.

1. Which Deras accepts new students, any contact information would be great.

2. What qualification you need and what kind of course is it and how long.

3. What kind of granths they teach and what do they emphasize.

any information would be great.

im asking because there seems to be very little information on this.

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1. As far studying from nirmale goes there are couple of options

a) you can try going to original bhindran at boparaie for vidya, they are upsamparda's of nirmale, at this point mehta does not have same capacity/calibre of gurmat vidya compare to bhindran based on understandable circumstances during dharam yudh morcha.

b) you can also try going to sant jagjit singh ji harkhowale- saltunpur lodhi dera, there are rooms right across where students stays but be forewarned, students come and go, sant jagjit singh ji harkhowale are very very strict, out of 20 students, only 1 or 2 survive being in the dera because of very disciplined schedule. I was there back in 2010. I only saw about four young students left engaging in kirtan, gurmat vidya and there are other top students which stays with baba ji. The problem with punjab, any lazy kid who does not want to work, their families leave their kids at the dera where they think they can live comfortable life/eat langar without work or anything, and once they are tired of that kind of life style, they run away so because of that some of sikh samparda's dera are very strict to filter incompetent/lazy/ double dip type students, students have to proof themselves they are worthy of attaining vidya- don't expect learning from them right away- you going to have get up 2 am, do lot of seva/simran before they teach you stuff.

c) you can also trying going to sant hari singh ji randhawale, apparently they have a school as well where they teach vidya.

d) another option is directly from nirmale hq- nirmal panchayati akhara at patiala.

e) you can learn vidya from gyani sher singh ji budda dal

You may want to contact kam1825 member on this forum, he is best person to ask.

2. I think basic gurmukhi knowledge and punjabi linguistic knowledge, most of sanskrit stuff and steeks is already been translated to gurmukhi..so you should be fine if you have basic grasp of punjabi dialect..best person is to ask - kam1825 on this member regarding specific duration of course etc

3. Nine granths are there as pre-requisite according to taksal (please see kam1825 post) but it may vary from different samparda's depending on student area of focus.

In order to be gyani in Sikh Theology and have understanding of gurbani you need to have through understanding of nine granths before hand.. The nine granths are


Chanaka Raajneeti
Sarkutavali
Bhavrasamrit
Vichar Mala
Vairag Shatak
Parbodh Chandar Natak
Adhiatam Parkash
Birti Parbhakar
Vichar Sagar

These are only taught in Bhindra now all this vidiya has not existed at Mehta since Sant Jarnail Singh Ji stopped teching during the Dharam Yudh Morcha. Thse granths are needed as the basis to understand gurbani then further work can be done by learning the Vedant Paribhasha, Upnishads, Moksh Panth Parkash, Adhyatam Parkash, etc

Only after these are studied should you start on the gazals of bhai nand lal and the works of Bhai Gurdas Ji.

Giani Harbhajan Singh Ji Dhudhike Wale and Baba Hari Singh Ji Randhawe Wale are possibly the best ustaads at the moment for all these granths as many of the other ustaads have only worked up to vichar sagar and not even heard of the birti parbhakar.

They are taught before you start any gurbani, they are your foundation to understanding gurbani, they dont effect the arths but are the foundations fr it. They are your early schooling. It is the same as if you ever wanted to do a degree you need your years of schooling before to understand the details to something like astronominal aeronuticals or quantam gravity physics. The Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the most difficult of any granth as it is easy to read but the meanings are an endless ocean and without the necessary pre education you cant fully comprehend the teachings in either Gurbani or Ithaas.

Chanak Raajneeti was written around 2000 years ago
Sarkutavali was written by Pandit hardayal who was linked to Guru Amardas Ji's lineage
Bhavrasamrit was by Pandit Gulab Singh Nirmala
Vichar Mala by Anath Das Udasi
Vairag Shatak by Bharthari who was one of the Sidhs who met Sri Guru NanakDev Ji
Parbodh Chandar Natak by Pandit Gulab Singh Nirmala
Adhiatam Parkash by Pandit Sukhdev Singh Nirmala
Birti Parbhakar by Pandit Nischal Das
Vichar Sagar by Pandit Nischal Das

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Does anyone know which of these sampardas would accept students, to learn Gurmat from there Sampardas.

1. Which Deras accepts new students, any contact information would be great.

2. What qualification you need and what kind of course is it and how long.

3. What kind of granths they teach and what do they emphasize.

any information would be great.

im asking because there seems to be very little information on this.

What knowledge do they have, that Guru Granth Sahib doesn't?

They are fringe groups. Closer to Hinduism.

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1. As far studying from nirmale goes there are couple of options

a) you can try going to original bhindran at boparaie for vidya, they are upsamparda's of nirmale, at this point mehta does not have same capacity/calibre of gurmat vidya compare to bhindran based on understandable circumstances during dharam yudh morcha.

b) you can also try going to sant jagjit singh ji harkhowale- saltunpur lodhi dera, there are rooms right across where students stays but be forewarned, students come and go, sant jagjit singh ji harkhowale are very very strict, out of 20 students, only 1 or 2 survive being in the dera because of very disciplined schedule. I was there back in 2010. I only saw about four young students left engaging in kirtan, gurmat vidya and there are other top students which stays with baba ji. The problem with punjab, any lazy kid who does not want to work, their families leave their kids at the dera where they think they can live comfortable life/eat langar without work or anything, and once they are tired of that kind of life style, they run away so because of that some of sikh samparda's dera are very strict to filter incompetent/lazy/ double dip type students, students have to proof themselves they are worthy of attaining vidya- don't expect learning from them right away- you going to have get up 2 am, do lot of seva/simran before they teach you stuff.

c) you can also trying going to sant hari singh ji randhawale, apparently they have a school as well where they teach vidya.

d) another option is directly from nirmale hq- nirmal panchayati akhara at patiala.

e) you can learn vidya from gyani sher singh ji budda dal

You may want to contact kam1825 member on this forum, he is best person to ask.

2. I think basic gurmukhi knowledge and punjabi linguistic knowledge, most of sanskrit stuff and steeks is already been translated to gurmukhi..so you should be fine if you have basic grasp of punjabi dialect..best person is to ask - kam1825 on this member regarding specific duration of course etc

3. Nine granths are there as pre-requisite according to taksal (please see kam1825 post) but it may vary from different samparda's depending on student area of focus.

Thanks for the great information. Does Baba Jagjit Singh Ji also teach the same 9 granths to beginers or his course different. Also, how long do you have to stay with baba Ji.

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Before you jump into the knowledge boat ask yourself why do you want to gain knowledge on various scriptures? These other scriptures to have a lot of knowledge and then again they also have a lot of hocus pocus stuff.

When reading Gurbani I get the urge to read more about Hindu, and Muslim scriptures because Gurbani mentions them, but so far the best thing i have found is to look up the reference Gurbani is speaking about and then keep continue on reading Gurbani. If i can't find a reference then I rely on Gurmukhs katha, like Sant Baba Gurbachan Singh Ji Maharaj. 99% of the time either one answers the question about the reference. Also look to Sri Dasam Granth Sahib ji Maharaj if you're trying to understand the reference.

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i only listend to baba jagjit singh for the last couple of days and already hes made me see my downfallss.....thats the job of a sant/mahapursh...its gurprad that i listended to his katha as i was stuck in my own illusion of what sikhi is.. sikh is universla/beant.....only five dont take the mick...lets put it this way what do you want to achive throught sikhi?mukht?gyan?yodha?shaster vidya/everything?,,,,,,,,,????if you think you know everything then get on speeches and help sangat......helpl us all....to meet god and meditate on him is an easy theory but to put it into practice is a whole different ball game...lol..reading dasam granth on a literal level is easy even goreh do it.. to put it into arth .. its next level...you need a teacher....only five- as you talk about hocus pocus read jaap sahib properly....paaji with original post listen to neo singh seems like he actually cares about sinhgs...sorry neo singh for past comments if they offended you...fateeeh

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Thanks for the great information. Does Baba Jagjit Singh Ji also teach the same 9 granths to beginers or his course different. Also, how long do you have to stay with baba Ji.

Not sure, I can pm you their number.

What knowledge do they have, that Guru Granth Sahib doesn't?

No one is disputing the authority or knowledge of sri guru granth sahib ji. For some, english translations of sri guru granth sahib ji does not cut it anymore they want to further study and there is nothing wrong with studying further only if one desires. If worldly school requires a teacher/tutor to help students understand material in the test books such as math calcus, physical, sql etc then there are no exceptions in sikh spiritual school. Contemplation/meditation and studying scriptures are two very different things. In sikhi, spiritual school of thought orders such as nirmale, taksal encourages both- it goes hand in hand. However, just like everything else you will always find people who idiolizes vidya so much so much they forget all about internal sikhi- meditation, seva, vichar, bibek etc...as such mindset focus is entirely on writing books, try to win theological debates in academia or big smagams/akharas, join scholary culture of sikhi- their study of gurmat end up being road block itself and they get trapped in it..vidya could become road block in sikhi if caution is not used...so nothing wrong with learning vidya, one just need to learn self-reflect/be honest with themselves and use caution, don't get trapped in vidya. Sikhi is double edge sword..!!


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i only listend to baba jagjit singh for the last couple of days and already hes made me see my downfallss.....thats the job of a sant/mahapursh...its gurprad that i listended to his katha as i was stuck in my own illusion of what sikhi is.. sikh is universla/beant.....only five dont take the mick...lets put it this way what do you want to achive throught sikhi?mukht?gyan?yodha?shaster vidya/everything?,,,,,,,,,????if you think you know everything then get on speeches and help sangat......helpl us all....to meet god and meditate on him is an easy theory but to put it into practice is a whole different ball game...lol..reading dasam granth on a literal level is easy even goreh do it.. to put it into arth .. its next level...you need a teacher....only five- as you talk about hocus pocus read jaap sahib properly....paaji with original post listen to neo singh seems like he actually cares about sinhgs...sorry neo singh for past comments if they offended you...fateeeh

I have no clue why you are jumping up and down for........

If you want gyan then go for it. If you want to discuss what Sikhi is about then start a new thread. If you have something against Gurmukhs doing katha, then go battle them. If you got something against me saying Hindu scriptures do have hocus pocus stuff like animal sacrifice then........... :omg:........you just found out!!!

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No one is disputing the authority or knowledge of sri guru granth sahib ji. For some, english translations of sri guru granth sahib ji does not cut it anymore they want to further study and there is nothing wrong with studying further only if one desires.

Bhaji, then why not learn Gurmukhi?

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Maharaj is amazing..........................read the Hukamnama from Sri Darbar Sahib for December 31, 2012. Talk about who has gyan in this world..............satguru only says Guru Sahib knows

Here is the english translation:

RAAMKALEE, FIFTH MEHL:

It is beyond the three qualities; it remains untouched. The seekers and Siddhas do not know it. There is a chamber filled with jewels, overflowing with Ambrosial Nectar, in the Guru’s Treasury. || 1 || This thing is wonderful and amazing! It cannot be described. It is an unfathomable object, O Siblings of Destiny! || 1 || Pause || Its value cannot be estimated at all; what can anyone say about it? By speaking and describing it, it cannot be understood; only one who sees it realizes it. || 2 || Only the Creator Lord knows it; what can any poor creature do? Only He Himself knows His own state and extent. The Lord Himself is the treasure overflowing. || 3 || Tasting such Ambrosial Nectar, the mind remains satisfied and satiated. Says Nanak, my hopes are fulfilled; I have found the Guru’s Sanctuary. || 4 || 4 ||

http://www.sgpc.net/hukumnama/jpeg%20hukamnama/hukamnama.pdf

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baba jagjit singh ji does teach these granths if students wish to learn them. there are also recordings of them on gurmatveechar.com.

imo, if you really want to learn vidya you are better off first listening to lots of katha, b/c the gian is provided for you in easily digestible form. especially katha of Guru Granth Sahib ji before reading and learning these granths. then the granths help expand upon knowledge gained from Bani.

they are not all from hindu dharm. some of them are written by great sikhs of the past and so are entirely sikh. others are from the past and maharaj saw enough UNIVERSAL value in them to have them translated, and panthic sikhs of great stature saw enough value in them to make them part of a regular curriculum for kathakars.

Bani has deeper and deeper levels of meaning, some that students cannot access b/c they lack the spiritual level. so some of these granths are written by people at higher spiritual levels and expand upon and teach some of the deeper meanings.

other granths help you conduct yourself in the world and help you be aware of those who might take advantage of you or your koum (chanakya), others create detachment from the world (vairaag shatuk). These are things that are not only needed by Hindus, but by Sikhs as well.

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Does anyone know which of these sampardas would accept students, to learn Gurmat from there Sampardas.

1. Which Deras accepts new students, any contact information would be great.

2. What qualification you need and what kind of course is it and how long.

3. What kind of granths they teach and what do they emphasize.

any information would be great.

im asking because there seems to be very little information on this.

Bhaji some Sikhs do go to Deras to learn Kirtan and kathain thier holidays, you can just turn up if you want but its better to have a recommendation as they can be wary of people who come to cause disruption. So if you already know someone who can tell the Dera Mukhis you want to learn there its fine. Otherwise just turn up, and tell them your intentions. They are there to help you.

There is no formality except Maryada, i know in the Taksals you have to obey the rules, otherwise you get thrown out no messing.

Good on ya, that you are willing to makew this step.

Before you jump into the knowledge boat ask yourself why do you want to gain knowledge on various scriptures? These other scriptures to have a lot of knowledge and then again they also have a lot of hocus pocus stuff.

Knowledge is important on spiritual matters, but can you tell us which of these other scriptures you have read and what is hocus pocus and what is knowledge, so that us others dont get going down the wrong path?

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