CHAAR SAHIBZAADE (Guru Gobind Singhji's four sons) - movie

[Jonny101]

Veer ji

I was under the impression that Guru Har Gobind ji started training of Sikhs in the martial arts during his time am I wrong?

Veerji, today there are two schools of thought. In India Nihangs practice Gatka and say it is from the time of Guru Sahib. Then there are some western born Nihangs in the UK whose Ustad Niddar had started a martial art called Hindu-Sikh SV and says he is the only one in the whole wide world to know this secret martial art and says this is the real martial art of the Gurus. Formerly his martial art was called Chatka Ghatka. But then one of his followers read Giani Gian Singh's Panth Prakash and read the word Shastar Vidya and thought why not rename it Shastar Vidya.

[jkvlondon]

Veerji, today there are two schools of thought. In India Nihangs practice Gatka and say it is from the time of Guru Sahib. Then there are some western born Nihangs in the UK whose Ustad Niddar had started a martial art called Hindu-Sikh SV and says he is the only one in the whole wide world to know this secret martial art and says this is the real martial art of the Gurus. Formerly his martial art was called Chatka Ghatka. But then one of his followers read Giani Gian Singh's Panth Prakash and read the word Shastar Vidya and thought why not rename it Shastar Vidya.

honestly when anyone starts bigging themselves up you just know that their claims are fake examples coming to mind 'Sri Sahib, leader of the sikh dharma in the west Yogi Harbhajan and this guy Niddar 'Singh' who by other peoples accounts has made some really outlandish claims and wants to say what we have and are is just Sanathan Dharma , he has also sidetracked the youth into destructive practises. They tend to have unsavoury intentions which come to light later.

BTW Bhenji not veer

[Cisco_Singh]

Gatka is not referred to in any historical texts or puratan granths. Sit down and watch gatka practioners and notice what they are actually doing..ask them why their weaponary is all over length, the wrong weight and utilised in the wrong manner.

They also have no concept of unarmed combat , weapons disarming etc. Why do they perform circus tricks like chopping up melons etc blindfolded ? These are just entertainments to please crowds.

There are no well known martial artists anywhere in the world that endorse or recognise gatka as a combat art.

It is a very great discredit to try and suggest the combat arts of puratan Singh's were anything like the circus acts of gatka practioners.

[Jonny101]

Gatka is not referred to in any historical texts or puratan granths. Sit down and watch gatka practioners and notice what they are actually doing..ask them why their weaponary is all over length, the wrong weight and utilised in the wrong manner.

They also have no concept of unarmed combat , weapons disarming etc. Why do they perform circus tricks like chopping up melons etc blindfolded ? These are just entertainments to please crowds.

There are no well known martial artists anywhere in the world that endorse or recognise gatka as a combat art.

It is a very great discredit to try and suggest the combat arts of puratan Singh's were anything like the circus acts of gatka practioners.

Maybe the term Gatka is not the proper term to use but you can't say something is false. Even Niddar used to originally call his martial art as Chatka Gatka before renaming it into SV and later added Sanatan Hindu Sikh to the title and began claiming it is a old Hindu Martial art. He even created a false history for his martial art which he plagiarized word for word from the history of Kalaripayattu the South Indian martial art. Then there is absolutely no one else in world to confirm his martial art is authentically puratan because he is only only practitioner of this art. Even Nihangs of India who can trace their lineage to his Gatka ustad practice what we all know as Gatka.

Niddar's martial art is such that you can train for a decade from when you are young to finally become middle aged and yet still you are not an ustad in the martial art. But during puratan times Singhs who were mostly peasants from the villages would probably just get a month's training before seeing battle and in battle they would get most of their martial art training as practical hands on experience. Even today guerrilla groups, militant groups only give you a month's training before sending you off to the battle field.

[Cisco_Singh]

Ignore Nidar Singh, no one mentioned him . refer to this recent article on puratan sikh weaponary also refer to panth prakash, suraj prakash, sarbloh granth, dasam granth and historical accounts of Sikh combat and warfare methods.

http://tisarpanth.blogspot.co.nz/2014/11/dressed-to-kill.html?view=magazine

I have never seen gatka practioners display any such knowledge of how to employ weapons such as katar, pesh kabz, chakar , bagh naka, khanjar etc. Even the weapons they do use are as mentioned the wrong weights and lengths. They deliberatey make them lighter so they can swing them around like circus clowns. If you ever handle puratan khandas etc you will notice how heavy they are there method of usage is not like gatka exhibitinists try to show.

Sikhs went up against some of the finest swordsmen in persia in Ahmed shah abdalis troops . they didnt defeat them by swinging sticks...or using gatka..anyway this is going way off topic.

[Singh559]

For those who have seen the movie

The part that made me most emotional was when the younger Sahibzade wanted to hug Sahibzada Baba Ajit SIngh Ji prior to the big battle of Anandpur Sahib. That moment hit me the hardest. Vaheguru

Despite knowing the history and being a young adult I still got a lot from the movie despite noticing the glaring historical inaccuracies. This wasn't a historical documentary, but a movie depicting actual historical events so I tried not to focus objectively. When will this be released to blu-ray and DVD? I will buy multiple copies and give them out as gifts.

[Cisco_Singh]

Agreed definitely one to buy on bluray/DVD and give out as gifts. I watched Sikh channel show on Sunday night where they were interviewing people at star city Birmingham before and after they watched the movie. The shocking thing was that many youth admitted before watching the film they didnt know the story of the chaar sahibzade before watching the film.

Some of these people were in there late teens and maybe 20's.Some young girls etc.. What have their parents been doing all this time ?? Obviously failing to teach their kids any Sikh history. No wonder we have issues with interfaith marriages, rejection of Sikhi image etc..We have been raising a whitewashed generation devoid of any Sikhi knowledge...

[jkvlondon]

Agreed definitely one to buy on bluray/DVD and give out as gifts. I watched Sikh channel show on Sunday night where they were interviewing people at star city Birmingham before and after they watched the movie. The shocking thing was that many youth admitted before watching the film they didnt know the story of the chaar sahibzade.. What

Some of these people were in there late teens and maybe 20's.. What have there parents been doing all this time ??

simple balle balle shava shava

[Jonny101]

Ignore Nidar Singh, no one mentioned him . refer to this recent article on puratan sikh weaponary also refer to panth prakash, suraj prakash, sarbloh granth, dasam granth and historical accounts of Sikh combat and warfare methods.

http://tisarpanth.blogspot.co.nz/2014/11/dressed-to-kill.html?view=magazine

I have never seen gatka practioners display any such knowledge of how to employ weapons such as katar, pesh kabz, chakar , bagh naka, khanjar etc. Even the weapons they do use are as mentioned the wrong weights and lengths. They deliberatey make them lighter so they can swing them around like circus clowns. If you ever handle puratan khandas etc you will notice how heavy they are there method of usage is not like gatka exhibitinists try to show.

Sikhs went up against some of the finest swordsmen in persia in Ahmed shah abdalis troops . they didnt defeat them by swinging sticks...or using gatka..anyway this is going way off topic.

It's hard to separate Niddar Singh from this issue since he is the central figure in all of this. He has made some tall claims which cannot be verified nor authenticated. He has plagiarized other martial arts and incorporated it into his SV to make it look very sophisticated. It's very easy to say Gatka practitioners are circus clowns or sword swingers, if one were to say this to a Nihang in India, he would probably get decapitated for such an insult using those same so called circular "circus" movements.

You mentioned Abdali, but why do you ignore that in guerrilla fighting hand to hand combat is a small portion of fighting. Most of the fighting that guerilla fighters would do were with their guns and using their archery skills. After killing a whole lot of Afghans, the Singhs would retreat back into the darkness of the forests to again launch their hit and run tactic. This way they killed their enemy with a thousand cuts until the Afghans lost all appetite to fight the Sikhs.

When Baba Deep Singh Jee made his way to Amritsar to liberate Darbar Sahib, along the way which ever village he passed by, he would be joined by Sikhs who would want to fight the Dharm Yudh against the Malech occupying our holiest shrine. You think all of these Sikhs from the villages that joined Baba Deep Singh Jee had the time of day to learn the kung fu skills displayed by Niddar?

[savinderpalsingh]