IS JAADU TUNA REALLY EXIST ?

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

I sincerely appreciate your attitude(always clearifying his extreme views) GuptUnknow ji :biggrin2:

You missed the point of what he is saying. He is saying that if it effects you, it is still within his will. Just like if someone were to get up and sucker punch me while I wasn't looking, it would still be within his will. If you are effected by it, it is still within his will, however that does not mean it doesn't exist. Veerji above was just pointing out the mere existance of it. Think we are in agreement here. Waheguru.

Problem here is that DasamSarblohGranth paints everything with same brush kala afghanis and missionaries.

ਕਹਿ ਕਬੀਰ ਅਬ ਜਾਨਿਆ ॥ ਜਬ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਤਉ ਮਨੁ ਮਾਨਿਆ ॥ ਮਨ ਮਾਨੇ ਲੋਗੁ ਨ ਪਤੀਜੈ ॥ ਨ ਪਤੀਜੈ ਤਉ ਕਿਆ ਕੀਜੈ ॥੩॥੭॥

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You won't believe anything unless you have experienced something yourself, witnessed something yourself or trust someone else's accounts of their experiences.

Many people (like some on this forum), are writing off and denying spiritual moments, JUST BECAUSE they themselves never experienced anything.

That's practically what atheism is all about. Anything and everything anti-spiritual/mystical, just because of a lack of personal experience.

It's typical missionary/tarksheel/kala-afghana mindset.

You guys really need to read more books and hear katha from Sants, Mahapurshs, BrahmGianis, etc.

He reads books and hear kathas of Sant, mahapurash, brahmgianis etc but mine is personal experience.

When it is paytime of your bad deeds people associate these things with jadu/tona, ghost, planetary position in your horoscope, vaastu dosh and so many things but they forget one thing its time to repay your bad karmas(deeds).

This shabad clearly mentions what kind of toona we should do to get Waheguru's grace.

No offence just my point of view.

this word ਕਾਮਣ means toona/tantar please do this toona.(tuk is bold)(please check mahankosh pg 1191 for ਕਾਮਣ)

ਸੂਹੀ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

Soohee Mehalaa 5 ||

ਗ੍ਰਿਹੁ ਵਸਿ ਗੁਰਿ ਕੀਨਾ ਹਉ ਘਰ ਕੀ ਨਾਰਿ ॥

The Giver has put this household of my being under my own control. I am now the mistress of the Lord's Home.

ਦਸ ਦਾਸੀ ਕਰਿ ਦੀਨੀ ਭਤਾਰਿ ॥

My Husband Lord has made the ten senses and organs of actions my slaves.

ਸਗਲ ਸਮਗ੍ਰੀ ਮੈ ਘਰ ਕੀ ਜੋੜੀ ॥

I have gathered together all the faculties and facilities of this house.

ਆਸ ਪਿਆਸੀ ਪਿਰ ਕਉ ਲੋੜੀ ॥੧॥

I am thirsty with desire and longing for my Husband Lord. ||1||

ਕਵਨ ਕਹਾ ਗੁਨ ਕੰਤ ਪਿਆਰੇ ॥

What Glorious Virtues of my Beloved Husband Lord should I describe?

ਸੁਘੜ ਸਰੂਪ ਦਇਆਲ ਮੁਰਾਰੇ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

He is All-knowing, totally beautiful and merciful; He is the Destroyer of ego. ||1||Pause||

ਸਤੁ ਸੀਗਾਰੁ ਭਉ ਅੰਜਨੁ ਪਾਇਆ ॥

I am adorned with Truth, and I have applied the mascara of the Fear of God to my eyes.

ਅੰਮ੍ਰਿਤ ਨਾਮੁ ਤੰਬੋਲੁ ਮੁਖਿ ਖਾਇਆ ॥

I have chewed the betel-leaf of the Ambrosial Naam, the Name of the Lord.

ਕੰਗਨ ਬਸਤ੍ਰ ਗਹਨੇ ਬਨੇ ਸੁਹਾਵੇ ॥

My bracelets, robes and ornaments beautifully adorn me.

ਧਨ ਸਭ ਸੁਖ ਪਾਵੈ ਜਾਂ ਪਿਰੁ ਘਰਿ ਆਵੈ ॥੨॥

The soul-bride becomes totally happy, when her Husband Lord comes to her home. ||2||

ਗੁਣ ਕਾਮਣ ਕਰਿ ਕੰਤੁ ਰੀਝਾਇਆ ॥

By the charms of virtue, I have enticed and fascinated my Husband Lord.

ਵਸਿ ਕਰਿ ਲੀਨਾ ਗੁਰਿ ਭਰਮੁ ਚੁਕਾਇਆ ॥

He is under my power - the Guru has dispelled my doubts.

ਸਭ ਤੇ ਊਚਾ ਮੰਦਰੁ ਮੇਰਾ ॥

My mansion is lofty and elevated.

ਸਭ ਕਾਮਣਿ ਤਿਆਗੀ ਪ੍ਰਿਉ ਪ੍ਰੀਤਮੁ ਮੇਰਾ ॥੩॥

Renouncing all other brides, my Beloved has become my lover. ||3||

ਪ੍ਰਗਟਿਆ ਸੂਰੁ ਜੋਤਿ ਉਜੀਆਰਾ ॥

The sun has risen, and its light shines brightly.

ਸੇਜ ਵਿਛਾਈ ਸਰਧ ਅਪਾਰਾ ॥

I have prepared my bed with infinite care and faith.

ਨਵ ਰੰਗ ਲਾਲੁ ਸੇਜ ਰਾਵਣ ਆਇਆ ॥

My Darling Beloved is new and fresh; He has come to my bed to enjoy me.

ਜਨ ਨਾਨਕ ਪਿਰ ਧਨ ਮਿਲਿ ਸੁਖੁ ਪਾਇਆ ॥੪॥੪॥

O Servant Nanak, my Husband Lord has come; the soul-bride has found peace. ||4||4||

If god is your husband don't worry about ਕਾਮਣ(toona)

[mohinder pal]

Jadu Tuna is very much exist. Kindly refer to Suraj Parkash Granth(composed by Bahi Santokh singh ji) where it is written Guru Nanak Dev ji visited those places where Magic was practised.

[Jonny101]

behan simran - jaddo tona shrap etc dont exist - this is all bull c*** , I am a medical doctor you can tell me what your symptoms are in a pm and I can help you with diagnosis / treatment.

to others please stop beliving in this garbage ..... it makes us look feeble minded and imbecile

veerji I can agree that most cases of jaddu tona shrap may be fake but to say they don't exist because medical science doesn''t agree with it is something else. Medical science does not agree that the Aatma or even Vaheguru exists yet we know they exist. So there are limitations in medical science which cannot comprehend the vast unseen spiritual world.

[panthicunity]

ਕਹਿ ਕਬੀਰ ਅਬ ਜਾਨਿਆ ॥ ਜਬ ਜਾਨਿਆ ਤਉ ਮਨੁ ਮਾਨਿਆ ॥ ਮਨ ਮਾਨੇ ਲੋਗੁ ਨ ਪਤੀਜੈ ॥ ਨ ਪਤੀਜੈ ਤਉ ਕਿਆ ਕੀਜੈ ॥੩॥੭॥

Veerji this line is about kabeer sahbib specifically realizing Waheguru and not jaadu tona

veerji I can agree that most cases of jaddu tona shrap may be fake but

to say they don't exist because medical science doesn''t agree with it

is something else. Medical science does not agree that the Aatma or even

Vaheguru exists yet we know they exist. So there are limitations in

medical science which cannot comprehend the vast unseen spiritual world.

Veer jhonny I mentioned that I am a doctor in reference to helping Simran

Guru nanak devji called all superstitions 'Bharam' - we listen in asa di vaar everyday - "sabo sutak bharam hai duja lage jaye"

Atma does exist but can't harm anyone - for desire to harm is a human attribute , not of atma's which is like an oceanic wave part of parmatma .....

BTW Thakur Singh was caught lying when he told the sangat some time in fall of 2012 that world would come to end on Dec 21 2012 - he said that without any gurbani/gurmat basis - just his own personal opinion - did a pretty job of scaring Sangat - we need to be aware of such 'sants'

[Jonny101]

Veerji this line is about kabeer sahbib specifically realizing Waheguru and not jaadu tona

Veer jhonny I mentioned that I am a doctor in reference to helping Simran

Guru nanak devji called all superstitions 'Bharam' - we listen in asa di vaar everyday - "sabo sutak bharam hai duja lage jaye"

Atma does exist but can't harm anyone - for desire to harm is a human attribute , not of atma's which is like an oceanic wave part of parmatma .....

veerji, we need to differentiate Bharam/superstitions from the spiritual world. It is good you believe in the atma and parmatma existence even though medical science does not support their existence. In the unseen spiritual world we know according to Gurbani there exists a vast myriad of entities other than atma which we cannot observe with the physical eye such as Bhoots, Prets, Pisaach, Jamdoots, Dharam Rai etc.

Superstitions that Guru Sahiban are talking about is such things like fasts, for example Hindu women keeping karva chauth for the long life of her husband but we know that such fasts cannot extend someone's life since date of death is already determined by Vaheguru and no amount of fasts will extend life beyond that date. Bhagat Kabir jee had to encounter many such superstitions one of which was common was that to die at varanasi the soul would go do swarg. But Kabir Jee taught that it is not the place of death but ones karams which determine where the soul will go.

[panthicunity]

Veerji as per gurbani Ghosts are people who have forgotten Akaal Purakh

ਜਿਸੁ ਬਿਸਰਤ ਤਨੁ ਭਸਮ ਹੋਇ ਕਹਤੇ ਸਭਿ ਪ੍ਰੇਤੁ ॥

jis bisrat tan bhasam ho-ay kahtay sabh parayt.

Forgetting Him, one's body turns to dust, and everyone calls him a ghost.

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ਹਰਿ ਕੇ ਨਾਮਹੀਨ ਬੇਤਾਲ ॥

har kay naamheen baytaal.

Without the Name of the Lord, the mortal is a ghost.

ਜੇਤਾ ਕਰਨ ਕਰਾਵਨ ਤੇਤਾ ਸਭਿ ਬੰਧਨ ਜੰਜਾਲ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

jaytaa karan karaavan taytaa sabh banDhan janjaal. ||1|| rahaa-o.

All the actions he commits are just shackles and bonds. ||1||Pause||

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ਨਾਵਹੁ ਭੁਲਾ ਜਗੁ ਫਿਰੈ ਬੇਤਾਲਿਆ ॥੨੪॥

naavhu bhulaa jag firai baytaali-aa. ||24||

Having forgotten the Name, the world is roaming around like a wild demon. ||24||

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Benti to sangat - please research SGGS before posting your opinions on any topic

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

Jadoo toona, bhoot pret just add shagun-apshagun(ਸਗੁਨ ਅਪਸਗੁਨ ) and grah(ਗਰਹ planet of horoscope) in this topic from gurbani pg 400-401

ਆਸਾ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

Aasaa Mehalaa 5 ||

ਸੂਖ ਸਹਜ ਆਨਦੁ ਘਣਾ ਹਰਿ ਕੀਰਤਨੁ ਗਾਉ ॥

Peace, celestial poise and absolute bliss are obtained, singing the Kirtan of the Lord's Praises.

ਗਰਹ ਨਿਵਾਰੇ ਸਤਿਗੁਰੂ ਦੇ ਅਪਣਾ ਨਾਉ ॥੧॥

Bestowing His Name, the True Guru removes the evil omens. ||1||

ਬਲਿਹਾਰੀ ਗੁਰ ਆਪਣੇ ਸਦ ਸਦ ਬਲਿ ਜਾਉ ॥

I am a sacrifice to my Guru; forever and ever, I am a sacrifice to Him.

ਗੁਰੂ ਵਿਟਹੁ ਹਉ ਵਾਰਿਆ ਜਿਸੁ ਮਿਲਿ ਸਚੁ ਸੁਆਉ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

I am a sacrifice to the Guru; meeting Him, I am absorbed into the True Lord. ||1||Pause||

ਸਗੁਨ ਅਪਸਗੁਨ ਤਿਸ ਕਉ ਲਗਹਿ ਜਿਸੁ ਚੀਤਿ ਨ ਆਵੈ ॥

Good omens and bad omens affect those who do not keep the Lord in the mind.

ਤਿਸੁ ਜਮੁ ਨੇੜਿ ਨ ਆਵਈ ਜੋ ਹਰਿ ਪ੍ਰਭਿ ਭਾਵੈ ॥੨॥

The Messenger of Death does not approach those who are pleasing to the Lord God. ||2||

ਪੁੰਨ ਦਾਨ ਜਪ ਤਪ ਜੇਤੇ ਸਭ ਊਪਰਿ ਨਾਮੁ ॥

Donations to charity, meditation and penance - above all of them is the Naam.

ਹਰਿ ਹਰਿ ਰਸਨਾ ਜੋ ਜਪੈ ਤਿਸੁ ਪੂਰਨ ਕਾਮੁ ॥੩॥

One who chants with his tongue the Name of the Lord, Har, Har - his works are brought to perfect completion. ||3||

ਭੈ ਬਿਨਸੇ ਭ੍ਰਮ ਮੋਹ ਗਏ ਕੋ ਦਿਸੈ ਨ ਬੀਆ ॥

His fears are removed, and his doubts and attachments are gone; he sees none other than God.

ਨਾਨਕ ਰਾਖੇ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮਿ ਫਿਰਿ ਦੂਖੁ ਨ ਥੀਆ ॥੪॥੧੮॥੧੨੦॥

O Nanak, the Supreme Lord God preserves him, and no pain or sorrow afflicts him any longer. ||4||18||120||

[Jonny101]

Panthic Unity veerji, bhoot in Gurbani does not mean the same thing everywhere. This term has multiple meanings through out. It can mean Ghost, it can mean the past(bhoot kaal) it can be used as a metaphor for Manmukhs who don't jap naam as in they are no better than ghosts. Many words in Gurbani have multiple meanings, it all depends on the context the word is being used. For example Sant can be used for Vaheguru, Guru and even a Gursikh depending on the tukh.

[Jonny101]

Jadoo toona, bhoot pret just add shagun-apshagun(ਸਗੁਨ ਅਪਸਗੁਨ ) and grah(ਗਰਹ planet of horoscope) in this topic from gurbani pg 400-401

Jadoo Tona, Bhoots, Prets are not the same as Shagun Apsagun or grah. Since you could not find a single shabad in Gurbad to support your argument you tried to over stretch the condemnation of Shagun Apsagun and grah in Gurbani to also include non relating things. This is intellectual dishonestly. You are mixing apples with oranges. Nice try though.

[panthicunity]

Panthic Unity veerji, bhoot in Gurbani does not mean the same thing

everywhere. This term has multiple meanings through out. It can mean

Ghost, it can mean the past(bhoot kaal) it can be used as a metaphor for

Manmukhs who don't jap naam as in they are no better than ghosts. Many

words in Gurbani have multiple meanings, it all depends on the context

the word is being used. For example Sant can be used for Vaheguru, Guru

and even a Gursikh depending on the tukh.

ok even if they exist if they are inconsequential - what does it matter to us