is dhunda doing katha in delhi gurudwara anymore?

[GPS]

UKLondonsikh

You should be knowing that missionaries were debarred from delhi gurudwaras before Sarna rule say more than ten years ago. That time dhundha may be a kiddo attending his final class of worldly education ( 8 grade).So this disagreement is not between Sant samaj or kala afghana brigade, it is between sikhs and and anti sikh agents.

Missionary literature and kala afghna books were barred from stalls put by missionary surjit singh by Avtar singh Hit around 20001. It is Sarna and congress who brought missionaries to these stages.

Likes of dhundha are cheats and liars. he gives in writing to akal takhat jathedar and apologized for condemning Dasam bani and other traditions.After a few months he does same thing again.

Days of missionaries are over in delhi same way like Punjab. They are debarred because of their views against sikhi.

[GPS]

UKlondonsikh writes

He is there less at the moment as a direct consequence of the political calculations by which Sant Samaj (who oppose him) have to be kept sweet by Badal camp.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________

My response

Again a big lie.What do you mean by less. He is not there at all now. A sikh should not tell lies.

[GPS]

P9 Paji you're my brother in the Panth so I won't argue with you on this subject but it may be that Dhunda Sahib did not use those exact words and may have instead been stressing that without keeping a saaf dhill, abstaining from meat becomes less meaningful (as Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharaj stated in Gurbani) and I might be a bigger Pappi than you if looked at it in that way.

Paji do not weave stories that are anti gurmat. guru sahib has shown us a path and essence of which is Naam simran. If you follow that and are a naam abhiasi you will not even like to look at meat leave aside eating it. Dhundha telling to take meat is pure nonsense and is not in line with gurmat. He should keep his mouth shut on such topics and not mislead simple folks.

Does he not read Gurbani that says to eat simple and in moderation. May be he is busy on face book promoting himself and then uttering nonsense to gullibles.

[UKLondonSikh]

@ GPS Paji

Paji, you must obviously be aware that Avtar Singh Hit Ji was affiliated with the Badal camp and that explains why the pro-Gurmat position was not given access to the stage in those years. Paji if Dhunda is a cheat and anti-Sikh then can you point his anti-Sikh cheating positions where the Sangat was in full agreement with him below? So if Sangat agree with him on certain issues (but not everything) does that define the Sangat as being anti-Sikh or atheist? Surely, we should all focus on the points where everybody agrees (though we can respectfully debate minor points of polite disagreement)

Paji i mentioned that it would be the local Sangat that gets the kathakars from the pro-Gurmat camp back at Sri Bangla Sahib in the future. The opposite of more often is less (regardless if the occurrence is never). If Sikhs should not tell lies then why do some claim Guru Sahib had other lives or on who the author of Charitropakhyan tales was?

I believe where there is ready access to vegetarian bhojan we should not eat meat. Dhunda Sahib has not encouraged Sangat like myself to eat meat.

We need to join forces for Unity (rather than nitpick on any minor pretext)

[Singh559]

Most people who called him here in Fresno regret or will regret calling him because they are slowly starting to find out that youth, even those from the Gurdwaras they attend won't allow it and will outright put a stop to malicious lies that dhundi and his band of missionaries are spewing. All these pardhaans have very basic or limited knowledge of Sikhi and SIkh history and even a very basic knowledge of Sikhi can put them in their place.

Here in California alone Dhundi took 100,000 U.S. dollars on his tour. Where this money is going I don't know. Either they are pocketing it or putting it into causing more problems in the panth. Who needs RSS when we have unpard pindoos putting titles like professors and gianis in front of their names.

In California he basically admitted he does not believe in Jaap Sahib and Dasam Granth Nitnem, but only recites them out of "majboori" and thinks maybe in the future they will find evidence they don't exist. He only said this so he wouldn't get embarrassed in front of sangat, in reality he doesn't believe in any of the Nitnem Banis from Dasam Granth.

These guys are politicians and are only out for money, similar to pakhandi babe who travel abroad and speak the language of the sangat and take home money.

[UKLondonSikh]

@ Singh559 Paji

Paji what I'm surprised about is why certain youth (like we had out here in the UK too) are so bitterly opposed to people like Sarbhjit Singh Khalsa (Dhunda) and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa. No Sikh on the planet will ever oppose the authenticated Bani of Dasme PaathShah but the fact that there are two opinions about what is and isn't Bani of Dasme PaathShah is a reality, so why not all of us accept that all sides of the debate have equal reverence for Dhan Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj. My personal belief is that the money would have gone to promoting access to education in Malwa and Majha where Dhunda Sahib and the pro-Gurmat camp have a positive reputation. People there would be shocked as to why clearly pro-Sikh and anti-Congress kathakars from the pro-Gurmat camp are met with near hysteria and threats of violence by a small section of Diaspora youth. Regarding the pro-Gurmat camp as anti-Sikh is misguided and that's my strongly held opinion. Because Sri Anandpur Sahib and the birth of the Khalsa Panth should count for more than the stories supposedly connected to the Hindu Maa Durga and Sri Hemkhunt Sahib location. And that is a viewpoiunt within the Panth that can be never be shut down no matter how hard a minority might try.

[GPS]

UKlondonsikh wrote

Paji i mentioned that it would be the local Sangat that gets the kathakars from the pro-Gurmat camp back at Sri Bangla Sahib in the future. The opposite of more often is less (regardless if the occurrence is never). If Sikhs should not tell lies then why do some claim Guru Sahib had other lives or on who the author of Charitropakhyan tales was?

===================================================================================================

My response

You are from UK and understand English well. You were lying yourself. You wrote earlier

Quote from UKlondons

"He is there less at the moment as a direct consequence of the political calculations ---------"

Unquote

Above means he does katha there but not many times. The fact is he is debarred from doing katha there. So let us not tell lies for forwarding an agenda.

I see you raise doubt any bani of Dasam Granth sahib quite often. I have read Dasam Granth sahib myself thoroughly. Your two points is about guru sahib doing meditation at hem Kunt sahib.This is second time you are stating this.Previously you stated that he was durga bhagat there. I replied to you that you are wrong and then you kept mum. And now you come again. How do you know he did not meditate there? Have you any proof.If so furnish here.

Coming to charitropakhayan, what is wrong there? How were you born? You did not fall from sky.You and all of us are the offspring of our parents. I do not need to tell you how they brought us to earth. In the same way Charitropakhayan advises us to refrain from lustful acts out of wedlock by telling stories. It says that union between husband and wife is acceptable whereas sexual union out of wedlock is forbidden as it is harmful for society.

Lust is part of life.We have to control it. Guru Granth sahib tells us to refrain from lust.Dasam Granth sahib tells us this is lust and how people bitten by it resort to inappropriate acts.

Apart from that charitropakhayan teaches sikhs how to see through tricks of wicked people, teaches us politics, bring environmental awareness, avoid moral pitfalls.Khalsa character was strong because they were gurmukhs and reading charitropakhayan.It was called turkish ki pothi and singhs ahd it in battlefield as well.

On the other hand its critics for example kala afghana is himself was caught while trying to rape a girl of his daughter's age.

If you have any issues on dasam granth, as told earlier act like a man and accept my request to discuss it in a separate thread.Bring all those who criticze it and i will reply you to your satisfaction.

Uksikh wrote

. Dhunda Sahib has not encouraged Sangat like myself to eat meat.

My response

Not only he devours it himself but also encourages sangat to eat it. Did he find it in Guru Granth sahib?

[GPS]

@ Singh559 Paji

Paji what I'm surprised about is why certain youth (like we had out here in the UK too) are so bitterly opposed to people like Sarbhjit Singh Khalsa (Dhunda) and Panthpreet Singh Khalsa. No Sikh on the planet will ever oppose the authenticated Bani of Dasme PaathShah but the fact that there are two opinions about what is and isn't Bani of Dasme PaathShah is a reality, so why not all of us accept that all sides of the debate have equal reverence for Dhan Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj. My personal belief is that the money would have gone to promoting access to education in Malwa and Majha where Dhunda Sahib and the pro-Gurmat camp have a positive reputation. People there would be shocked as to why clearly pro-Sikh and anti-Congress kathakars from the pro-Gurmat camp are met with near hysteria and threats of violence by a small section of Diaspora youth. Regarding the pro-Gurmat camp as anti-Sikh is misguided and that's my strongly held opinion. Because Sri Anandpur Sahib and the birth of the Khalsa Panth should count for more than the stories supposedly connected to the Hindu Maa Durga and Sri Hemkhunt Sahib location. And that is a viewpoiunt within the Panth that can be never be shut down no matter how hard a minority might try.

Whole Dasam Granth sahib is from Dasam pita ji. Its structure does not permit any alteration in it.All chhands are numbered. So those who say authenticated dasam bani are nothing but either misled by missionaries or say at behest of anti sikh forces.

It is pertinnent to mention here missionaries do not accept any part of Dasam granth at all.Dhundha himself was striking stick at Jaap sahib bani by hiding his face like a coward of worst order.

He is hardly seen in Punjab as missionaries have zero presence in Punjab.They are by and large shunned in Punjab.You can count them on fingers.Their foolish acts bring this to them as they are taught manmat in their schools.No naam simran in their courses.

Again you are saying Dasam Granth sahib labels Guru sahib as Durga bhagat. I give you stanzas from the beginning of Chandi di vaar, sit back, read and chew it for future correction. It says it is akal Purakh who created all devi and devtas

ਪਉੜੀ ॥

पउड़ी ॥

PAURI

ਖੰਡਾ ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮੈ ਸਾਜ ਕੈ ਜਿਨ ਸਭ ਸੈਸਾਰੁ ਉਪਾਇਆ ॥

खंडा प्रिथमै साज कै जिन सभ सैसारु उपाइआ ॥

At first the Lord created the double-edged sword and then He created the whole world.

ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਬਿਸਨੁ ਮਹੇਸ ਸਾਜਿ ਕੁਦਰਤਿ ਦਾ ਖੇਲੁ ਰਚਾਇ ਬਣਾਇਆ ॥

ब्रहमा बिसनु महेस साजि कुदरति दा खेलु रचाइ बणाइआ ॥

He created Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva and then created the play of Nature.

ਸਿੰਧੁ ਪਰਬਤ ਮੇਦਨੀ ਬਿਨੁ ਥੰਮ੍ਹਾ ਗਗਨਿ ਰਹਾਇਆ ॥

सिंधु परबत मेदनी बिनु थम्हा गगनि रहाइआ ॥

He created the oceans, mountains and the earth made the sky stable without columns.

ਸਿਰਜੇ ਦਾਨੋ ਦੇਵਤੇ ਤਿਨ ਅੰਦਰਿ ਬਾਦੁ ਰਚਾਇਆ ॥

सिरजे दानो देवते तिन अंदरि बादु रचाइआ ॥

He created the demons and gods and caused strife between them.

Chandi di vaar, Dasam granth sahib

[GPS]

Most people who called him here in Fresno regret or will regret calling him because they are slowly starting to find out that youth, even those from the Gurdwaras they attend won't allow it and will outright put a stop to malicious lies that dhundi and his band of missionaries are spewing. All these pardhaans have very basic or limited knowledge of Sikhi and SIkh history and even a very basic knowledge of Sikhi can put them in their place.

Here in California alone Dhundi took 100,000 U.S. dollars on his tour. Where this money is going I don't know. Either they are pocketing it or putting it into causing more problems in the panth. Who needs RSS when we have unpard pindoos putting titles like professors and gianis in front of their names.

In California he basically admitted he does not believe in Jaap Sahib and Dasam Granth Nitnem, but only recites them out of "majboori" and thinks maybe in the future they will find evidence they don't exist. He only said this so he wouldn't get embarrassed in front of sangat, in reality he doesn't believe in any of the Nitnem Banis from Dasam Granth.

These guys are politicians and are only out for money, similar to pakhandi babe who travel abroad and speak the language of the sangat and take home money.

Great post veer ji. Dhundha is from very impoverished background which is not a sin. Guru ji advises us to be content with what we have and do hard work to earn an honest living, share it with needy. But dhundha has found another way for making money to get rid of poverty and that is to discard sikh scriptures.Money he collects goes to buy personal land in Punjab and buy a luxurious vehicle.

[UKLondonSikh]

GPS = UKlondonsikh wrote

UK = Paji i mentioned that it would be the local Sangat that gets the kathakars from the pro-Gurmat camp back at Sri Bangla Sahib in the future. The opposite of more often is less (regardless if the occurrence is never). If Sikhs should not tell lies then why do some claim Guru Sahib had other lives or on who the author of Charitropakhyan tales was?

===================================================================================================

GPS = You were lying yourself. You wrote earlier

GPS = Quote from UKlondons

UK = "He is there less at the moment as a direct consequence of the political calculations ---------"

Unquote

GPS = Above means he does katha there but not many times.

UK = No that's where you are wrong GPS Paji. It may imply that but it does not state outright what you have inferred. I don't think anybody doubts that Sant Samaj have asked for pro-Gurmat kathakars to be excluded from Sri Bangla Sahib - but like I said it's only a matter of time before the Dehli Sangat request such kathakars back as they never once spoke in favour of a crook like Sarna. Those that support Bhai Rajoana and Professor Bhullar are not Congress lapdogs.

GPS = Your two points is about guru sahib doing meditation at hem Kunt sahib.This is second time you are stating this.

UK = I only place my my faith in Dhan Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj (jin'ki GurGaddi). I do not place any faith in the stories cooked up by anti-Sikh forces such as the Mughals and Manu Smriti waalay that claim our Guru Sahib had any connection to Hindu Goddess Maa Durga in a previous life near Sri Hemkhunt Sahib.

GPS = Previously you stated that he was durga bhagat there.

UK = No Paji I don't believe Guru Sahib had any connection with Hindu Maa Durga whatsoever. It's you who believe that.

GPS = How do you know he did not meditate there (in a previous life)?

UK = Paji where is your proof about Dhan Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj's supposed previous life?

GPS = Coming to charitropakhayan, what is wrong there?

UK = What is wrong is people like yourself claiming that Dhan Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj wrote Charitropakhiyan at the age of 9 on the banks of the Yamuna River in the aftermath of Dhan Dhan Guru Tegh Bahadur Ji Maharaj's shaheedi for Sarbat Da Bhala

GPS = In the same way Charitropakhayan advises us to refrain from lustful acts by telling stories. It says that union between husband and wife is acceptable whereas sexual union of wedlock is forbidden as it is harmful for society.

UK = And according to you Paji, Dhan Dhan Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is deficient in the above advice supposedly. Even if you don't say it, it's what you are implying.

GPS = If you have any issues on (certain parts of) dasam granth,

UK = Paji i have no issues with authentic bani of Dasme PaathShah. My problems are with parts that you, the RSS and Khemu Bedi asscoiate with Guru Sahib without sufficient proof.

GPS = Uksikh wrote "Dhunda Sahib has not encouraged Sangat like myself to eat meat"

GPS = Not only he devours it himself also encourages sangat to eat it. Did he find it in Guru Granth sahib?

UK = I don't eat meat myself and I don't think any Gursikh is ehna kach'chah to eat meat at the prompting of another. Khalsa Fauj was not restricted to vegetarian bhojan in times of war.

UK = Paji you know full well that only parts of Charitropakhiyan and the Kul-mentioning parts of Bachittar Natak which reference Ram Chander as a so-called ancestor of the Sodhi's are what many many GurSikhs dispute so there is no relavance to you quoting parts of Bani that I also have reverence for.