Bbc One Must Watch -Sikh Girls Groomed By Muslims

[Mehtab Singh]

I guess its the same story everywhere, which is why some elder Punjabis also say that its better to confide your secrets in a close friend but never a relative.

[Jonny101]

Word.

My dad lost everything he'd worked for to greedy and calculating siblings back home, and it eventually destroyed him to the point where he had a huge heart attack and passed away. He was a Gursikh so his health problems weren't due to the classic Panjabi issues related to booze, etc.

Feel bad for your father. This is just like my parent's story. But my father is still in denial about the betrayal he went though worth about 1 crore rupees. He still loves his sibling who did this to him and acts like nothing even happened. My mother's sibling(and children) are the worst, they also took about 1 crore rupees worth of property from us. This after all the huge amount of monetary help my parents sent to them over the years. Luckily we still had other property bought in the cities(plots) that these greedy people could not get their hands on through their cunning ways while we trusted them. What has this world come to? being betrayed by your own siblings is so common that it's just embarrassing to tell people about it. But the more you tell people, you realize that this is the sad story of almost every family in the west.

The only good thing that we can take out of these mistakes of our parents is to be more shrewd in our dealings with relatives back in India. Never be too generous with them. Keep them at arms length.

[VanHelsingh]

Feel bad for your father. This is just like my parent's story. But my father is still in denial about the betrayal he went though worth about 1 crore rupees. He still loves his sibling who did this to him and acts like nothing even happened. My mother's sibling(and children) are the worst, they also took about 1 crore rupees worth of property from us. This after all the huge amount of monetary help my parents sent to them over the years. Luckily we still had other property bought in the cities(plots) that these greedy people could not get their hands on through their cunning ways while we trusted them. What has this world come to? being betrayed by your own siblings is so common that it's just embarrassing to tell people about it. But the more you tell people, you realize that this is the sad story of almost every family in the west.

The only good thing that we can take out of these mistakes of our parents is to be more shrewd in our dealings with relatives back in India. Never be too generous with them. Keep them at arms length.

That's it SIngh Ji, we can learn from and apply those lessons in our own lives. It's one of the reasons going back home is just not a very attractive prospect. As much as what makes us what we are is due to our heritage, it's the other stuff like these masaleh and dramas that so many of our generation (and even those older than us) don't want anything to do with "the old country", especially with the recent surge in almost Sicilian-like behaviour such as arranging murders of visiting loved ones over land and money disputes, etc. It just isn't worth it, especially when the police over there is bought and paid-for before stuff goes down.

[hsinghGB]

Abuse of muslim girls by pakistani grooming gangs:

Report released today by the Muslim Women's Network (Birmingham) UK after research into the hidden experiences of Asian / Muslim girls and young women so that everyone can better understand how to support and protect them. A total of 35 case studies were collected. The report, UNHEARD VOICES - Sexual Exploitation of Asian Girls and Young Women, highlights:

• Profile of Victims - all case studies are proved within the 100+ page report
• Profile of Offenders
• Nature of the Exploitation
• Barriers to Disclosure and Reporting
• Factors Driving Sexually Abusive Behaviour
• Family and Community Responses
• Frontline Professional and Service Provider Responses

It's no suprise that they have been doing such things to their own as it is always easier to cover things up within one's own community. The report uses both the words 'Asian' and 'Muslim', with the former used alot for offenders and the latter more for the victims as they obviously wish to spare their community further damage - although the 'Pakistani origin' of offenders being disproportionate is specifically mentioned it is accompanied with an explaination of why it could be misleading. 'Male attitudes' and 'family honour' is blamed much, as they have done in the western media generally, again without appreciating this is a double edged sword that has probably also prevented such grooming from being more widespread victim-wise within the Asian (Sikh/Muslim/Hindu) communities. Once again many of the findings do ring true with what the likes of Shere Punjab, SAS and Sikh youth living in areas like Birmingham, Bradford etc have been saying for over 25 years. Hopefully with the momentum the issue of grooming has been gathering over the last year or so this will now lead to the opening of eyes, changes in the law, parent support from social services, earlier police action and proper lengthy sentencing for offenders. This will be a great result and a testament to those that fought for the victims over such a long period, sacrificing so much when many of their own community and the authorities branded them racists.

Video interview with Guardian newspaper on this report:

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http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/video/2013/sep/10/asian-girls-hidden-victims-sex-grooming-report-video

Pdf of report available here (10.2Mb, so too large to attach here):

http://www.mwnuk.co.uk/resourcesDetail.php?id=97

Report Conclusions (verbatim):

Our project findings led us to put forward a different picture than the one presented by the media, where Asian men only target and sexually exploit vulnerable White girls because they have less respect for them due to their different ethnicity. It is evident from this research that Asian men also target Asian girls who are not safe from sexual exploitation as presumed. It is clear that sexual predators of Asian background, like those from any other ethnic background, have no respect for women and girls of any race, faith or culture. This shows that child sexual exploitation is not about ethnicity or faith but about male attitudes towards women. This argument is supported by the work of Malcolm Cowburn, a criminologist based at Sheffield Hallam University, who has studied issues related to sexual violence over the last 15 years. He states that he “had not seen any empirical evidence to say that one group of people has a greater proclivity to sexual violence than any other” and “The larger issue is of problematic masculinity and how certain men view women, children and their sexual rights. I don’t think it lies within ethnicity but within gender.” (Akwagyiram 2012). His work has been published in the Journal of Sexual Aggression and the British Journal of Community Justice among others.

Although it is difficult to determine the scale of sexual exploitation within Asian and Muslim communities and whether it is at disproportionate levels, it is clear that a significant problem does exist. This very limited pilot study has revealed 35 case studies which indicates that a more extensive piece of research would most likely find many more examples of abuse and exploitation. It is also to be noted that although the offenders and victims came from a range of backgrounds, a substantial number were from a Pakistani background and this cannot be neglected. This may largely reflect the size of the representative population of Pakistanis in Britain and may not mean that they are overrepresented among sexual offenders. A further and fuller exploration of sexual exploitation among Asian / Muslim communities could shed more light on this matter.

Upon a detailed analysis of ethnicities, it was noticeable that in the majority of cases the offenders were from the same ethnic / faith background as their victims. This seemed like a calculated choice even though Asian and Muslim girls were harder to reach. A key driver for targeting Asian and Muslim girls could be that they were considered as a ”less risky” option because they were unlikely to seek help or report their abuse due to ”shame” and ”dishonour”. It also appeared that one of the most important factors pulling girls towards the offenders was the promise of love and marriage. The particular vulnerabilities of Asian / Muslim girls and young women were being exploited routinely, making them more likely to be groomed and sexually exploited by offenders from their own backgrounds. This finding could indicate that Asian/Muslim girls are possible more likley to be groomed and sexually exploited by offenders from their own backgrounds than White girls to exploitation by Asian predators.

The lack of identification of Asian and Muslim female victims and the lack of legal prosecutions involving them confirms that frontline professionals and mainstream agencies are neglecting them. Even though the reluctance of Asian and Muslim victims in coming forward is making it harder to provide them with the necessary support and to investigate their cases, little, if anything is being done to reach out to them and to make it easier for them to seek the much needed help.

Community attitudes towards gender status and role which lead to the unequal treatment of girls compared to boys also played a prominent role in victims not seeking help and perpetrators continuing to operate with impunity. Generally victims do not complain due to the repercussions flowing from dishonouring their family. When they disclose their experiences of exploitation, victims are blamed instead of the perpetrators. If mosques, families, community groups, community leaders, continue turning a blind eye to the situation, then this will amount to silent consent.

When developing awareness-raising tools to combat predatory behaviour, we must resist the blaming of girls’ attitudes and consider the fact that some perpetrators are of the same age or only a few years older. While Asian and Muslim communities fail to acknowledge that the problem exists and keep accepting male attitudes, it will be difficult to address the issue.

Current initiatives protecting Asian and Muslim girls from violence focus primarily on issues such as honour crime, forced marriage, female genital mutilation. No work (except for a tiny minority of projects, often delivered voluntarily), tackles grooming and sexual exploitation. It is hoped that this research will result in more resources being dedicated to helping and protecting girls and women from Asian and Muslim communities.

More awareness training needs to be offered to communities to enable them to support victims and to believe that the latter’s experiences are true. Frontline professionals and agencies need training to ensure they do not miss victims from BME backgrounds and that they have a better understanding of cultural sensitivities preventing victims from coming forward.

<END>

[Mehtab Singh]

Question: Are these female Muslim victims Shia or Ahmadi or Ismaili or Aga Khani? I am asking because all of these mentioned sects are considered Kafir by the mainstream Sunni majority, even though to the non-Muslim world they are all Muslims.

[jashb]

But my father is still in denial about the betrayal he went though worth about 1 crore rupees. He still loves his sibling who did this to him and acts like nothing even happened.

This is precisely the reason why this crap happens in the first place.

__________________________________________________________________

An ordinary person can usually suss a rishtedaar out, particularly from a one-off meeting, because it it's not too hard to figure out anyone's intentions from their character and behaviour.

But this is just not possible for the eldest siblings in the family, (and even to an extent, for parents), because these people have grown up always acting as the 'father' figure for their younger brothers and sisters (or children).

They sacrifice so much joy and happiness from their own life, and instead work real hard, purely in order to protect and give their younger siblings/children a better life; so they don't have to go through what they did.

What this life process does, to an eldest sibling (or parent), is that it blinds them to the true, and often changing, nature of their younger siblings (or children).

They continue to view their younger siblings (or children) with the same affection as when the younger siblings (or children) were still young, and truly depended on them.

No matter how much you try to reason with someone who is an eldest sibling (or parent), that your "laadle", "pyare" younger siblings, that used to love you, are, now, in actual fact, just using you, they will not be able to understand;

Purely because the "protector" role, that is, by now, ingrained within their psyche, will not allow them to look at their younger siblings' changes in attitude and behaviour towards them with an objective eye.

So this is why eldest siblings (or parents) are often unable to recognise subtle changes in behaviour, that are often the tell-tale signs that a person's attitude is changing; for example, a younger sibling's (or child's) incredibly cunning, deceitful, and downright cruel ways.

Because the "purdha" (blindfold), that is fixed over their eyes, and still sees their younger siblings (or children) the way they were 20+ years ago, doesn't come off easily.

[jashb]

The only good thing that we can take out of these mistakes of our parents is to be more shrewd in our dealings with relatives back in India. Never be too generous with them. Keep them at arms length.

Having written all that I have just said above (!!!).... on the same token, I still believe that we mustn't tar all our Indian relatives with the same brush.

The cruel, cunning, deceitful behaviour that is so infamous, almost always seems to emanate from the younger siblings, or children.

The fact that they are so unappreciative of their eldest siblings/parents is partly because they are so blissfully unaware of the painful sacrifices that their eldest siblings, or parents, have had to make for them, just so that they don't have to tread down the same painful path.

This ignorance can have tragic consequences, for all those involved; but it can be destroyed.

__________________________________________________________________

Eldest siblings, and parents, on the other hand, can really be incredibly honourable; although, of course, on the same token, you can still get unattached, greedy elder siblings too.

We mustn't throw them all into the same category.

I know, from my experience within my wider extended family, that it was always the eldest siblings that got screwed; but, on the other hand, they never failed to help in every possible way, and in fact, went out of their way, when any of their younger siblings needed help.

__________________________________________________________________

Before anyone shouts "OFF-TOPIC!!!", I'll say it myself!

But the psychology lesson is, ironically, hardly irrelevant to the main discussion.

Painfully, as too many parents have discovered, albeit, far too late, is that the same changes in human behaviour that cause a child our younger sibling to rebel and betray their parents/elder siblings;

Are nearly always the same changes in behaviour, that sexually groomed children display, when they are under the tight control of their oppressor; i.e. deceit, lying, becoming withdrawn, keeping themselves to themselves, aggression, tendancy to fight, greed, etc etc.

I missed the Sikh Channel programme that came on Sunday, about the tell tale warning signs of sexual grooming in a child's changes in behaviour; but I'm sure the above factors would have been mentioned, if not far more.

[jashb]

Ranjeet Singh Dhadriwale has a big congregation where ever he goes he should spend 10-20 min on this subject. would go a long way

I fully agree with this point.

Singh's need to take it up with them. We need as much parchar as we can get on this matter; across our whole community.

Sant Ranjit Singh Dhadrianwale indeed enjoys a huge following, and large scale support, so any help he provides in communicating the matter to their Sangat, (which is actually, in most cases, the exact target audience!!!), will really help to get the message across because of their stature. And, hopefully, help to prevent a large chunk of future cases.

[Big_Tera]

What I dont get is why Sikh girls are so trusting of Muslims in the first place? Nearly everyday Muslims are on the news for a terrorist attack, grooming, drug dealing and many other crimes.

Yet Sikh girls are oblivious to these stories.

I think these kinds of cases happen in all family situations.

But I suspect that the overwhelming majority of cases happen when the family unit is all girls or the family has no older sibling to look out for their sisters.

When this is the case - They are very Vulnerable to muslims predators. In the same circumstance. Muslim family unit be it girls or boys. they have a much stronger family network then Sikhs. Ie Many cousins will look out for their cousin sisters ect.

Many Sikh families are made up of 1 or 2 kids. hence there is a good chance their is no older brother in the family unit or no male offspring. This is what the Muslims go for. As they know their will be no older brother looking out for their sisters and thats when they attack with devestating concesquences.

Many are left either in brothels, in a mixed religion marriage or addicted to drugs. While the Muslims just laugh!

[Koi]