Where To Give Dasvandh?

[jashb]

During the olden times there was indeed tax. Farmers for example had to pay 25% of what they made off their land as tax.

Yet still during olden times Sikhs gave Daswand. Dawand is 10% of net income.

Very well identified and correctly stated Jonny veer.

The unwillingness to get oneself educated in one's history is a worrying trend within our community. For one, it is partially responsible for large sections of our community dismissing religion as a 17th/18th century concept. This trend has had dire consequences for the Sikh Nation.

One sign of such ignorance is the oft-repeated narrative that the modern world, and, hence, modern man, is far more advanced than that which existed in previous times.

However, any good student of history, it psychology for that matter, will tell you that other than the technological innovations that have made modern life much faster, very little has changed to man himself.

This is because times and situations may change, but HUMAN PSYCHOLOGY WILL ALWAYS REMAIN THE SAME.

It is the failure to understand the above fact that leads the overly "modern" citizen, ironically, into a state of blissful ignorance; quite far from their ill-informed idea of being "far advanced".

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It is often said that Death and Taxes are the only two certainties in life.

It is not said without historical consequence.

Tax is a concept that has existed since time immemorial.

It, together with the aim of amassing stolen wealth, is the one idea that propelled the greatest and most adventurous invaders to plunder nations far outside their imagination.

It, being a continued revenue stream produced with comparatively little effort, was like the cherry on the cake for successful invaders.

It has also motivated armed and militarised nations to enforce protection rackets in their areas of dominance from way back (or "rakhi" money, in our language )

Sikhs, should know better than others, the factor that the collection of tax played in the most daring and impressive Sikh raids of the 18th and 19th centuries on surrounding nations, kingdoms and principalities.

Delhi, U.P., Rajasthan, and Gujarat; for one.

Afghanistan; for another.

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Anyone whose ancestral family contains a lambardaar or zaildaar will be very familiar with what the word "chaudhry" means.

Far from being a term to be proud of (as the mostly muslim juts of pakistan have turned it, as a generalised term for a zamindaar);

It is simply a term to identify a tax collector working for the government.

"Chaudhry" literally means a collector of the "fourth part".

Since mughal times (if not before), each village has had a lambardaar, or village "chaudhry", typically one of the more influential and landed zamindaars, who collected the fourth part of each farmer's produce for the government.

Essentially, he was also a slave; but had more power than the average slave.

Hence, the modern disdain for the term "Chaudhry" on our side of panjaab (hence, I see Parkash Chand Badal, for one, as a true b@$t*4d of a "Chaudhry" :lol2: )

The mughal kingdoms all collected tax through this franchised, decentralised system.

One of the greatest beneficiaries of this kind of tax collection system was, ironically, the juts themselves, as the mughal system of placing large landowners into, what were, essentially, positions of considerable local influence, worked increasingly in the juts' favour, as they progressively displaced the rajputs and other zanindaar communities from ownership of land in the panjaab region.

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I will finish with a popular pangati from Gurbani;

BABAANIA KAHAANIYAN PUTH SUPUTH KARAIN

Much of our ignorance could be dispelled from the minds of the average member of the Panth if this was practiced alone.

[jashb]

Definately not to sangat tv since this new trimmed beard guy Aps mann took control, when ever they are at an event and other tv channel representatives are called to talk or a Gurdwara spokesman mention any other channel, sangat tv seems to have problems with its volume (it goes off), or they end the programme and go to commercials, yet this channel proclaims ekta of the panth, thats a joke when it does these kind of dirty tricks, so not Sangat tv unless you clean up your act and start behaving and playing fairly and putting the panth first no support from me and that goes for all of them but at the moment they seem fine!

APS Mann is not a bad guy. From what I know about him, he is born and bred in east panjaab and led from the front in pushing Sikh youth politics at university there, which had been systematically suppressed by both the central and state governments since the huge success of the blessed Shaheed Bhai Amrik Singh in expanding the AISSF in the early 80's. He has been vocal about the oppression of the Sikh Nation even while in east panjaab, never mind here.

He may not be "dyed in the wool" :biggrin2: , but he is not what is wrong with Sangat TV.

On the other hand, I can tell you what certainly is.

The anti-Panthic stance taken by its disgustingly communal (in that it favoured one community in particular) coverage of the UK riots, and its continued excuses which eventually resulted in it refusing to screen the critical sexual grooming documentary produced by the SAS, in the fear of upsetting its pak muslim paedophile masters.

I have not donated a penny to Sangat TV, nor watched it, since.

At the same time though, I have donated £'000's to the Sikh Channel.

This is purely out of protest.

Using presenters who not only have no affiliation to Sikhi and Sikh values (upinder randhawa, sonia deol, harjap bhangal), but, furthermore, promote non-Sikh ideologies on a Sikh channel, funded out of the pockets of Sikhs, and overwhelmingly viewed by Sikhs.

Banning popular jaikaaray by those who protected the Gurdwaras of KHALISTHAAN ZINDABAAD!!! Yet openly calling for Sikhs worldwide to convert to Islam is not a hypocrisy to be forgiven quickly.

[jashb]

I would suggest Khalsa Aid a good charity but soe of their latest projects and adventures in non-Sikh area's without helping convert those non-sikhs has left me feeling I would rather give to a charity and cause that uses its resources 100% on bettering the lives and security of fellow Sikhs in troubled Muslim ruled parts of the world.

It is hard to disagree with that. This is the problem I have long had with Khalsa Aid.

When it comes to donating one's hard earned money, the principle will always take precedence.

Apart from once when I donated for a family member to help them achieve a donation target for a fundraising event where they had chosen Khalsa Aid as their recipient charity, I have not donated to Khalsa Aid.

At a time when our own population is being systematically eroded in India, and no-one, I repeat NO western body is working to put an end to the systematic nuclear poisoning of river water that is putting thousands of rural Sikhs at the mercy of death by cancer, and new born babies with birth deformities, an unlimited inflow of drugs into east panjaab, farmer suicides by rural Sikhs heavily in debt, the abject failure of the smaller farming sector in the face of a Government of India led monopoly on purchase of grain, and the purposely unchecked mass abortion of female babies due to poverty and an enforced "UN education" - to name a few;

I find it hard to understand how Sikh charities can find the time and money to spend £'000's in overseas disaster areas, which are subject to huge receipts of emergency appeal donations from established, worldwide, western charity organisations, and after already literally swarming with UNO and western aid workers.

Getting our priorities right???

... Is something, we clearly need to work on.

[proactive]

Organisations like Khalsa Aid will always throw back 'Sarbat da Bhala' at anyone who asks them why they are basically replicating the work of dozens of charities in disaster areas using the hard earned money of the Sikhs. They started off in 1999 during the Kosovo war and God knows how much of the Sangat's money they wasted in helping Kosovan refugees who were already getting thousands of pounds spent on each one by the UN, Oxfam and other charities. They have spent thousands in Haiti, Sri Lanka, Indonesia etc whilst the money could have saved many a Sikh farmer. I remember discussing this on the Sikhnet forum at the time with someone I think called Ravi or Ravinder Singh and he said that I was a Manmukh! This is the level of thinking of people running these charities.

They have made a start in helping in Punjab but even then it is impossible to know if your donation is going to Punjab or some other place. I would much rather give donations to organisations like SOPW. I have just made a donation to them because they do such admirable work in first getting innocent Sikh political prisoners freed and then giving them them a trade or employment

[TuhadaDaas]

Thanks for your replies guys.

Just one thing I would like to say is that Dasvandh is not just giving to charity, it is a particular use of money for furthering the Khalsa Panth. So its use should be on the Khalsa Panth itself. So while I would definitely agree with giving money to Khalsa Aid which is a very admirable organisation, this should be done on top of one's dasvandh as the money is not being used purely on the panth but to help others (which is also a MUST for the Khalsa).

[Sikhistan]

I directly buy stuff and give it to those who needs them. I do not give any $ to gurdwaras but always find a way to give back money I earn to its rightful owner (waheguru).... Ex. Giving something to langar.

I do not trust any NGO at all !!!

[Jonny101]

Agree with the brothers above, especially proactive jee. To all, I request that before you give your hard earned money away, first consider some points.

-Sikh population is growing at a very slow pace. Some argue it is actually decreasing. Our population % in Punjab and in India has gone down. So Parchar is needed.

-Shaheed Pariwars and children of the Shaheeds are not (financially) well off since their fathers became Shaheed

-Dharmi Faujis lost their employment for the Sikh cause and are living a meager existence.

-Recently new Sikhs have joined our family in MP and more are continuing to join the Sikh family but they are financially disadvantaged and need our help for what we take for granted

With the above raised points, we need to send our money to these people more than Libya or Kosovo and other international projects because those people already have thousands of charities donating to them. But who is helping the Sikhs? no one! we only have each other. If we will not spend money on making our foundation strong right now, then what future do we have left?

Singhs doing parchar related activity in MP or helping Sikligars to rejoin the Panth need our help. We always have been saying for years, "if only someone was doing some real parchar of Sikhi, I would help them out". Well this is now your turn to contribute to the advancement of the Sikh Dharm. Besides this, don't forget the children of the Shaheeds, for they need our financial help. If we don't help them, no one else will.

[sat]

APS Mann is not a bad guy. From what I know about him, he is born and bred in east panjaab and led from the front in pushing Sikh youth politics at university there, which had been systematically suppressed by both the central and state governments since the huge success of the blessed Shaheed Bhai Amrik Singh in expanding the AISSF in the early 80's. He has been vocal about the oppression of the Sikh Nation even while in east panjaab, never mind here.

He may not be "dyed in the wool" :biggrin2: , but he is not what is wrong with Sangat TV.

On the other hand, I can tell you what certainly is.

The anti-Panthic stance taken by its disgustingly communal (in that it favoured one community in particular) coverage of the UK riots, and its continued excuses which eventually resulted in it refusing to screen the critical sexual grooming documentary produced by the SAS, in the fear of upsetting its pak muslim paedophile masters.

I have not donated a penny to Sangat TV, nor watched it, since.

At the same time though, I have donated £'000's to the Sikh Channel.

This is purely out of protest.

Using presenters who not only have no affiliation to Sikhi and Sikh values (upinder randhawa, sonia deol, harjap bhangal), but, furthermore, promote non-Sikh ideologies on a Sikh channel, funded out of the pockets of Sikhs, and overwhelmingly viewed by Sikhs.

Banning popular jaikaaray by those who protected the Gurdwaras of KHALISTHAAN ZINDABAAD!!! Yet openly calling for Sikhs worldwide to convert to Islam is not a hypocrisy to be forgiven quickly.

Agreed but i have spoken to Aps mann and he seems to come across as bitter and keeps saying why does the youth who have so much to say not come forward and the answer is sangat tv, he may not be a bad person but he needs to think seriously about the channel he is associated with at present also he comes across as a bit arrogant but that could be due to frustration , by stopping / editing other channel speakers or making the volume go off when other people from another org are trying to make a point is not good for the panth or for his image either, we may not like what we hear or even disagree with others but sometimes it may just be a way forward, without unity we have nothing.

[N30S1NGH]

I would personally split daswand to two areas -

1. Funding towards restoring/preserving sikh heritage, vidya be it- raag vidya, gurmat bhram vidya, shastar vidya etc, funding towards restoring/preserving old manuscripts, sikh arts, texts, online parchar seva projects- basic of sikhi etc.

2. Funding towards humanitarian need- natural disasters, donations based on appeal so on and so forth.

[jasdeepsingh2k125]

I would personally split daswand to two areas -

1. Funding towards restoring/preserving sikh heritage, vidya be it- raag vidya, gurmat bhram vidya, shastar vidya etc, funding towards restoring/preserving old manuscripts, sikh arts, texts, online parchar seva projects- basic of sikhi etc.

2. Funding towards humanitarian need- natural disasters, donations based on appeal so on and so forth.

i second it