Is Guru Granth Sahib Your Teacher / Guide Or Is It A Diety

[Guest]

gur parmaysar ayko jaan.

Know that the Guru and the Transcendent Lord are One.

jo tis bhaavai so parvaan. ||1|| rahaa-o.

Whatever pleases Him is acceptable and approved. ||1||Pause||

gur daataa samrath gur gur sabh meh rahi-aa samaa-ay.

The Guru is the Giver, the Guru is All-powerful. The Guru is All-pervading, contained amongst all.

gur parmaysar paarbarahm gur dubdaa la-ay taraa-ay. ||2||

The Guru is the Transcendent Lord, the Supreme Lord God. The Guru lifts up and saves those who are drowning. ||2||

[N30S1NGH]

There should not be any doubts- Satguru granth sahib ji is same jot and naam roop in sargun, shabad and nirgun form. Satguru connects with sikh consciousness at every step of the way in stages for betterment of sikh spiritual development. Satguru himself draws his sikh(bhagat) to his sargun form to help him to do bhagti-naam-bhagti nine folds- then Satguru granth sahib itself further draw his sikh(bhagat) to go inside himself and explore naam within via shabad surta then finally same Satguru draw his sikh towards estoric gyan layer of naam and eventually/ultimately reveal jot saroop of himself (merge sikh in him) in form of self realization

The reason we don't see this because we are not receptive or see things in stages, one has to let go all pre-conditioning, semantics, techanalities..Does love have any conditions? Love has no conditions whatsoever.

[Guest]

Ps those are two different tuks.They are not from the same shabad.

[hsingh68]

When I read passages about the Guru "being" God, I believe that means the Gurus have the light of God. Equally, so do we all, as God is everything and pervades all matter and the universe, but the Gurus were on such a high spiritual enlightenment and had such a deep connection with Waheguru that they could guide the rest of us.

It's a very deep, complex issue, but I personally don't like to say the Gurus "are" God, because then people take that to mean Gurus are incarnations of God, and that limits perception of the almighty to just one physical entity. That's a concept which Guru Nanak Dev Ji rejected - God does not come down to Earth as incarnations (Ram, Krishna etc), but we are all part of God.

You are right.

[hsingh68]

There should not be any doubts- Satguru granth sahib ji is same jot and naam roop in sargun, shabad and nirgun form. Satguru connects with sikh consciousness at every step of the way in stages for betterment of sikh spiritual development. Satguru himself draws his sikh(bhagat) to his sargun form to help him to do bhagti-naam-bhagti nine folds- then Satguru granth sahib itself further draw his sikh(bhagat) to go inside himself and explore naam within via shabad surta then finally same Satguru draw his sikh towards estoric gyan layer of naam and eventually/ultimately reveal jot saroop of himself (merge sikh in him) in form of self realization

The reason we don't see this because we are not receptive or see things in stages, one has to let go all pre-conditioning, semantics, techanalities..Does love have any conditions? Love has no conditions whatsoever.

Nor does love have stages! Stop making sikhi into a long step by step system. All those steps you mention are just steps of ignorance. You either realise everything is God or you don't. There are too many cults in sikhi we don't need more man made systems.

In gurbani there are no stages people have made stages from gurbani like the khands in japji sahib they are not stages and guru nanak never says they are stages to access progress. Cults say they are stages but they are not. All those khands are not to access level of progress.

[N30S1NGH]

Nor does love have stages! Stop making sikhi into a long step by step system. All those steps you mention are just steps of ignorance. You either realise everything is God or you don't. There are too many cults in sikhi we don't need more man made systems.

In gurbani there are no stages people have made stages from gurbani like the khands in japji sahib they are not stages and guru nanak never says they are stages to access progress. Cults say they are stages but they are not. All those khands are not to access level of progress.

Actually from spiritual adhyatamic point of view you are right love does not have stages..but my post was from gurmat scholary theological framework point of view in hopes to show journey of sikh in spiritual development stages for understanding purposes thats all.

[hsingh68]

Actually from spiritual adhyatamic point of view you are right love does not have stages..but my post was from gurmat theological framework point of view in hopes to show journey of sikh in spiritual development stages for understanding purposes thats all.

I understand what you are saying but I have met so many people who are under the illusion of stages. They keep saying I'm at this level or I need to do more kamai to progress to the next level. These individuals have been brainwashed and because of all these stages are lost to ignorance. The stages for them are the hindrance that prevents them from realising God.

The same people have been misled and for some reason these stages are never ending there is always one more stage before they can meet God. What a paradox!

[sunnyji]

I understand what you are saying but I have met so many people who are under the illusion of stages. They keep saying I'm at this level or I need to do more kamai to progress to the next level. These individuals have been brainwashed and because of all these stages are lost to ignorance. The stages for them are the hindrance that prevents them from realising God.

The same people have been misled and for some reason these stages are never ending there is always one more stage before they can meet God. What a paradox!

Totally agreed veerji, many Singhs I know follow a "system" of rules which they feel they need to abide by to progress to the next stage - I've been told so many times that I should do X amount of Japji Sahibs to achieve this, or Y amount to achieve that. It's a shame that this sort of mentality is so widespread

[hsingh68]

Totally agreed veerji, many Singhs I know follow a "system" of rules which they feel they need to abide by to progress to the next stage - I've been told so many times that I should do X amount of Japji Sahibs to achieve this, or Y amount to achieve that. It's a shame that this sort of mentality is so widespread

Yes it's all wrong and the worst part is that I used to do a lot of paarts of japji sahib again and again - it got me nowhere. It's not about reciting something again and again it's about understanding and applying it to your life. But once I took my time and understood gurbani that was a life changer.

This mentality is so widespread because of groups and cults within sikhi that promote this mentality.

[hsingh68]

People think that reciting something again and again will give them some sort of power and that's the problem it just enhances the ego. These cults say it doesn't matter if you don't understand gurbani just repeat and you will get reward.