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Why It Is Adviced By Gurmukhs To Keep Dhyan Not At Forehead For Ghristis?


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No where in that shabad on ang 974 does Guru Sahib say to focus on these points. If you read further into this shabad Guru sahib says I focus on Vaheguru by taking the beej mantra to my heart (I fully focus on the Shabad).

Read Bhagat Naam dev ji's Bani starting on ang 972 to 973 and he says I sing Vaheguru's praises and I am imbued with the shabad.

Read bhagat kabir ji's Bani on ang334 and he even in a more blunt way rips this third eye idea apart. Bhagat ji also says I focus where Vaheguru dwells. VAHEGURU dwells in the Shabad and the Shabad dwells in Vaheguru. Both are one and the same. Focus there.

And here is the stamp that completely disowns the third eye focus idea. On ang 944 by Guru Nanak Dev ji.

ਸੁ ਸਬਦ ਕਉ ਨਿਰੰਤਰਿ ਵਾਸੁ ਅਲਖੰ ਜਹ ਦੇਖਾ ਤਹ ਸੋਈ

सु सबद कउ निरंतरि वासु अलखं जह देखा तह सोई ॥

So sabaḏ ka▫o niranṯar vās alkẖaʼn jah ḏekẖā ṯah so▫ī.

That Shabad dwells deep within the nucleus of all beings. God is invisible; wherever I look, there I see Him.

ਪਵਨ ਕਾ ਵਾਸਾ ਸੁੰਨ ਨਿਵਾਸਾ ਅਕਲ ਕਲਾ ਧਰ ਸੋਈ

पवन का वासा सुंन निवासा अकल कला धर सोई ॥

Pavan kā vāsā sunn nivāsā akal kalā ḏẖar so▫ī.

The air is the dwelling place of the absolute Lord. He has no qualities; He has all qualities.

ਨਦਰਿ ਕਰੇ ਸਬਦੁ ਘਟ ਮਹਿ ਵਸੈ ਵਿਚਹੁ ਭਰਮੁ ਗਵਾਏ

नदरि करे सबदु घट महि वसै विचहु भरमु गवाए ॥

Naḏar kare sabaḏ gẖat mėh vasai vicẖahu bẖaram gavā▫e.

When He bestows His Glance of Grace, the Shabad comes to abide within the heart, and doubt is eradicated from within.

ਤਨੁ ਮਨੁ ਨਿਰਮਲੁ ਨਿਰਮਲ ਬਾਣੀ ਨਾਮ ਮੰਨਿ ਵਸਾਏ

तनु मनु निरमलु निरमल बाणी नामो मंनि वसाए ॥

Ŧan man nirmal nirmal baṇī nāmo man vasā▫e.

The body and mind become immaculate, through the Immaculate Word of His Bani. Let His Name be enshrined in your mind.

ਸਬਦਿ ਗੁਰੂ ਭਵਸਾਗਰੁ ਤਰੀਐ ਇਤ ਉਤ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੈ

सबदि गुरू भवसागरु तरीऐ इत उत एको जाणै ॥

Sabaḏ gurū bẖavsāgar ṯarī▫ai iṯ uṯ eko jāṇai.

The Shabad is the Guru, to carry you across the terrifying world-ocean. Know the One Lord alone, here and hereafter.

ਚਿਹਨੁ ਵਰਨੁ ਨਹੀ ਛਾਇਆ ਮਾਇਆ ਨਾਨਕ ਸਬਦੁ ਪਛਾਣੈ

चिहनु वरनु नही छाइआ माइआ नानक सबदु पछाणै ॥५९॥

Cẖihan varan nahī cẖẖā▫i▫ā mā▫i▫ā Nānak sabaḏ pacẖẖāṇai. ||59||

He has no form or color, shadow or illusion; O Nanak, realize the Shabad. ||59||

ਤ੍ਰੈ ਸਤ ਅੰਗੁਲ ਵਾਈ ਅਉਧੂ ਸੁੰਨ ਸਚੁ ਆਹਾਰੋ

त्रै सत अंगुल वाई अउधू सुंन सचु आहारो ॥

Ŧarai saṯ angul vā▫ī a▫oḏẖū sunn sacẖ āhāro.

O reclusive hermit, the True, Absolute Lord is the support of the exhaled breath, which extends out ten finger lengths.

ਗੁਰਮੁਖਿ ਬੋਲੈ ਤਤੁ ਬਿਰੋਲੈ ਚੀਨੈ ਅਲਖ ਅਪਾਰੋ

गुरमुखि बोलै ततु बिरोलै चीनै अलख अपारो ॥

Gurmukẖ bolai ṯaṯ birolai cẖīnai alakẖ apāro.

The Gurmukh speaks and churns the essence of reality, and realizes the unseen, infinite Lord.

ਤ੍ਰੈ ਗੁਣ ਮੇਟੈ ਸਬਦੁ ਵਸਾਏ ਤਾ ਮਨਿ ਚੂਕੈ ਅਹੰਕਾਰੋ

त्रै गुण मेटै सबदु वसाए ता मनि चूकै अहंकारो ॥

Ŧarai guṇ metai sabaḏ vasā▫e ṯā man cẖūkai ahankāro.

Eradicating the three qualities, he enshrines the Shabad within, and then, his mind is rid of egotism.

ਅੰਤਰਿ ਬਾਹਰਿ ਏਕੋ ਜਾਣੈ ਤਾ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮਿ ਲਗੈ ਪਿਆਰੋ

अंतरि बाहरि एको जाणै ता हरि नामि लगै पिआरो ॥

Anṯar bāhar eko jāṇai ṯā har nām lagai pi▫āro.

Inside and out, he knows the One Lord alone; he is in love with the Name of the Lord.

ਸੁਖਮਨਾ ਇੜਾ ਪਿੰਗੁਲਾ ਬੂਝੈ ਜਾ ਆਪੇ ਅਲਖੁ ਲਖਾਏ

सुखमना इड़ा पिंगुला बूझै जा आपे अलखु लखाए ॥

Sukẖmanā iṛā pingulā būjẖai jā āpe alakẖ lakẖā▫e.

He understands the Sushmana, Ida and Pingala, when the unseen Lord reveals Himself.

ਨਾਨਕ ਤਿਹੁ ਤੇ ਊਪਰਿ ਸਾਚਾ ਸਤਿਗੁਰ ਸਬਦਿ ਸਮਾਏ

नानक तिहु ते ऊपरि साचा सतिगुर सबदि समाए ॥६०॥

Nānak ṯihu ṯe ūpar sācẖā saṯgur sabaḏ samā▫e. ||60||

O Nanak, the True Lord is above these three energy channels. Through the Word, the Shabad of the True Guru, one merges with Him. ||60||

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Veer ji, I cannot argue with you over interpretations. We both agree that you have to focus on the shabad which is great! My view is that when you do hear anhad sounds internally at that time you concentrate your dhyaan by listening to the sounds at the trikuti position. I.e bathing at that point. This is no small feat to achieve so we are debating stuff that maybe well beyond our capabilities which is a time wasting exercise.

Like the last line of your post the anhad shabad will take you above the trikuti.

I will finally say I do wish you well in your spiritual journey and I hope which ever path you take it gets you to Waheguru's abode. Follow the "Shabad" and you can't go wrong.

God bless.

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Veer ji, I cannot argue with you over interpretations. We both agree that you have to focus on the shabad which is great! My view is that when you do hear anhad sounds internally at that time you concentrate your dhyaan by listening to the sounds at the trikuti position. I.e bathing at that point. This is no small feat to achieve so we are debating stuff that maybe well beyond our capabilities which is a time wasting exercise.

Like the last line of your post the anhad shabad will take you above the trikuti.

I will finally say I do wish you well in your spiritual journey and I hope which ever path you take it gets you to Waheguru's abode. Follow the "Shabad" and you can't go wrong.

God bless.

A fantastic and a very mature reply . :khalsa2:

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Veer ji, I cannot argue with you over interpretations. We both agree that you have to focus on the shabad which is great! My view is that when you do hear anhad sounds internally at that time you concentrate your dhyaan by listening to the sounds at the trikuti position. I.e bathing at that point. This is no small feat to achieve so we are debating stuff that maybe well beyond our capabilities which is a time wasting exercise.

Like the last line of your post the anhad shabad will take you above the trikuti.

I will finally say I do wish you well in your spiritual journey and I hope which ever path you take it gets you to Waheguru's abode. Follow the "Shabad" and you can't go wrong.

God bless.

The last line is saying Vaheguru is above the third eye point and a person unites with Vaheguru through the Shabad. When I look at Gurbani I look at the Gurmukhi.

The title of this thread is asking the question regarding where to focus. Satguru gives this answer beautifully by saying focus on the Shabad.

Although Gurbani from Sri Guru Granth Sahib has provided the answer not to focus at the third eye point. I will be looking at Dasam Bani later on in the day on this topic and provide any Dasam Bani that speaks on this matter. It important look to fully explore ideas and not rely on 'Gurmukhs' that teach this as the gospel truth without verifying it with Gurbani.

Put everything on the table for readers to see the full image. If you dont want to continue further with this discuss I can respect your decision.

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As I was searching for Dasam Bani on this topic I discovered Vaars of Bhai Gurdas ji tell us to attach ourselves to the Guru's feet (shabad) and the shabad is above the practice of focusing on the third eye. Bhai Gurdas Ji is an accepted interpreter of Gurbani not only by Sikhs, but by Sri Guru Arjun Dev ji.

Let's listen to the Vaars of Bhai Gurdas ji. First one is referenced from here:

http://sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=5682

crn kml mkrMdu ris hoie Bvru lY vwsu luBwvY]

charan kamal makara(n)dh ras hoe bhavar lai vaas lubhaavai||

Like the black bee they surrender at the lotus feet of Guru and enjoy the sap and remain happy.

ieVw ipMgulw suKmnw lµiG iqRbyxI inj Gir AwvY]

eirraa pi(n)gulaa sukhamanaa la(n)gh thribaenee nij ghar aavai||

They go beyond the triveni of ira, pingala and susumna and stabilize in their own self.

swih swih mnu pvx ilv sohM hMsw jpY jpwvY]

saahi saahi man pavan liv soha(n) ha(n)saa japai japaavai||

They through the flame of breath, mind and the life force, recite and make others recite the soham and hans recitations (jap).

Acrj rUp AnUp ilv gMD sugMiD Avysu mcwvY]

acharaj roop anoop liv ga(n)dhh suga(n)dhh avaes machaavai||

The form of surati is wonderfully fragrant and enrapturing.

suKswgr crxwribMd suK sMpt ivic shij smwvY]

sukhasaagar charanaarabi(n)dh sukh sa(n)patt vich sehaj samaavai||

The Gurmukhs calmly absorb in the pleasure-ocean of the Guru feet.

gurmuiK suKPl iprm rsu dyh ibdyh prm pdu pwvY]

guramukh sukhafal piram ras dhaeh bidhaeh param padh paavai||

When they in the form of pleasure-fruit obtain the supreme joy, they go beyond the bondages of body and bodylessness and attain the highest station.

swDsMgiq imil AlKu lKwvY ]11]

saadhhasa(n)gath mil alakh lakhaavai ||11||

Such Gurmukhs have the glimpse of that invisible Lord in the Holy Congregation.(11)

In the first Vaar something that sticks out is when Bhai Gurdas Ji says Gurmukhs go beyond the third eye meditation technique by attaching themselves to the feet of the Guru. Also Bhai Gurdas ji explains how to use the breath and mind. Many people in the Panth have lost the plot and started using Kundalini yoga exercises and focus on the third eye point while using the breath and mind. Bhai Gurdas ji is directly disowning such practices and saying to use the breath into reciting the shabad and making others recite the shabad (Gurbani) as your mind focuses on the Shabad.

And here is the second Vaar.

http://sikhitothemax.com/page.asp?ShabadID=5835

gurmuiK suK Plu iprm rsu iCA rs hYrwxw]

guramukh sukh fal piram ras shhia ras hairaanaa||

Even the six tastes (satras) are full of wonder before the Gurmukhs delightful fruit in the form of elixir of Love.

CqIh AMimRq qrsdy ivsmwd ivfwxw]

shhatheeh a(n)mrith tharasadhae visamaadh viddaanaa||

Thirty six types of repasts, getting aweful before its grandeur, crave for being equal to it.

inJr Dwr hjwr hoie BY cikq Bulwxw]

nijhar dhhaar hajaar hoe bhai chakith bhulaanaa||

Even myriads of currents of delight flowing through the tenth gate become full of wonder and fear before it.

ieVw ipMgulw suKmnw sohM n smwxw]

eirraa pi(n)gulaa sukhamanaa soha(n) n samaanaa||

The taste of the recitation of Soham in the base of ira, pingala and susumna nerves is not equal to the taste of the elixir of Love.

vIh iekIh cVwau ciV prcw prvwxw]

veeh eikeeh charraao charr parachaa paravaanaa||

Going beyond the animate and inanimate i.e. the whole world, the consciousness is merged in the Lord.

pIqY boil n hMGeI AwKwx vKwxw ]5]

peethai bol n ha(n)ghee aakhaan vakhaanaa ||5||

Then the situation turns out to be such that as one cannot speak while drinking, the talk of drinking of the elixir of Love becomes divine.(5)

No doubt others commonly known figures in Sikhi have practiced and told others to practice this third eye focus technique, but a Scholar on Gurbani says to go beyond some lowly practices. Attach yourself to the Shabad (Gurbani) and feel the love that cannot be obtained through the third eye focus technique.

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I'm actually surprised to read by Bhai Gurdas ji advocating the use of soham hansa mantra instead of Waheguru.

saahi saahi man pavan liv soha(n) ha(n)saa japai japaavai||

They through the flame of breath, mind and the life force, recite and make others recite the soham and hans recitations (jap).

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I'm actually surprised to read by Bhai Gurdas ji advocating the use of soham hansa mantra instead of Waheguru.

saahi saahi man pavan liv soha(n) ha(n)saa japai japaavai||

They through the flame of breath, mind and the life force, recite and make others recite the soham and hans recitations (jap).

It is saying to do jap of Vaheguru. Read the following lines. The Guru's use many words from older schools of thought but then change the meaning of the words. In the same Vaar Bhai Sahib says to be a Gurmukh and focus on the Gurus feet. In the second Vaar Bhai Sahib says the following.

ieVw ipMgulw suKmnw sohM n smwxw]

eirraa pi(n)gulaa sukhamanaa soha(n) n samaanaa||

The taste of the recitation of Soham in the base of ira, pingala and susumna nerves is not equal to the taste of the elixir of Love.

If you take the first vaar the words to mean soham and hans then he contradicts himself. Looking at the Vaars by taking in all the lines a clear picture is painted.

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What Bhai Gurdas ji is talking about is very advanced and only a person who has achieved what is written can correctly explain what it all means. This is my feeble attempt at trying to make sense of what is written from my limited knowledge.

charan kamal makara(n)dh ras hoe bhavar lai vaas lubhaavai||
Like the black bee they surrender at the lotus feet of Guru and enjoy the sap and remain happy.

Analogy of surrendering the mind before the lotus feet of the Guru.

eirraa pi(n)gulaa sukhamanaa la(n)gh thribaenee nij ghar aavai||
They go beyond the triveni of ira, pingala and sukhamanaa and stabilize in their own self.

They pass the triveni (aka 3rd eye) of ida, pingala and sukhmana to reach nij ghar also known as dassam duar. Like I stated in my earlier posts you bathe at triveni, not stay seated there permanently. Eventually one will rise above it with the aid of the Anhad Shabads and Naad. When one has a bath he doesn't stay sitting in the bath forever, eventually you get out and move on. Similarly before one enters the court of the lord one bathes at this point in the Shabad.

saahi saahi man pavan liv soha(n) ha(n)saa japai japaavai||
They through the flame of breath, mind and the life force, recite and make others recite the soham and hans recitations (jap).

With each and every breath (inhale/exhale) they get their mind/surti to merge into the breath by having it jap the soham - hansaa mantra. This is a very old school mantra to thread the mind smoothly into the breath. (Soooo on inhale, haaam on exhale) The mantra is also designated as Hamsa, Hansa, Sohum, So Ham, or So Hum. The Soham mantra is also called the Hamsa mantra. Hamsa (or hansa) poses the question, Who am I? Soham provides the answer, I am that. Lets be clear here I am no way suggesting people drop the Waheguru mantra in place of Soham. Similarly the Waheguru mantar can be used instead of Soham.

acharaj roop anoop liv ga(n)dhh suga(n)dhh avaes machaavai||
The form of surati is wonderfully fragrant and enrapturing.

You will experience incomparable sights and fragrances as the mind, mantra and breath are tied together

sukhasaagar charanaarabi(n)dh sukh sa(n)patt vich sehaj samaavai||
The Gurmukhs calmly absorb in the pleasure-ocean of the Guru feet.

They merge into a state of sehaj which is the pleasure-ocean of the Guru's feet.

guramukh sukhafal piram ras dhaeh bidhaeh param padh paavai||
When they in the form of pleasure-fruit obtain the supreme joy, they go beyond the bondages of body and bodylessness and attain the highest station.

With the Mind focused towards the Guru it rises above the attachments of the body.

saadhhasa(n)gath mil alakh lakhaavai
Such Gurmukhs have the glimpse of that invisible Lord in the Holy Congregation.

Once he realises that Waheguru is within himself, then it is only right that Waheguru is everywhere and in every being. Hence where ever he looks he sees Waheguru.

Das has probably made countless mistakes here and does ardas that Waheguru himself show the correct way via direct experience.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

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