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Questions About Sikhi (From A Non-Sikh)


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There are similarities between Buddhism and Sikhi. Waheguru is everywhere, every part of creation is Waheguru. Within you is Waheguru. Our goal is to realise Waheguru, to understand ourselves. Ego separates us from Waheguru. This ego needs to be destroyed to reach Waheguru and find contentment. Sikhi is not concerned about liberation. Sikhi is all about understanding Waheguru now. Practice Sikhi, do what the Gurus tell you, see the light within everyone and everything. Cultivate naam, meditate, reflect, serve people, sing and fight the 5 thieves. This is how you will experience Waheguru.

Sachkhand is a state of mind, not a magic place or heaven. Sachkhand is the state when you realise the truth. You see Waheguru everywhere. This is enlightenment, this is liberation. Sachkhand isn't heaven.

The SGGS is our Guru, it is the thing we turn to for guidance and help. It is the Guru who will help us find Waheguru. Reading bani is very important because it is like having a conversation with your Guru. Everyday he reminds you of what you should be doing, everyday he instructs you. Read bani, understand it and implement it into your life. Singing is very important. Just sing your soul out, call for your beloved. The Gurus gave their message in song. The SGGS is written in raag, musical notes. There are no chapters, instead the SGGS is divided by raag. Kirtan is very important in Sikhi. Self reflection is also important, look within yourself. Sikhi is all about improving yourself. The treasure is within you, so self reflection is important. However, the Guru is the one who shows you how to achieve this treasure.

The SGGS says nothing about homosexuals or anything. The SGGS is not a rule book. There is no dogma in the SGGS. You'll find the yearings of those who walked the path of the saints who wished to find Waheguru. The SGGS doesn't say anything about marriage or homosexuals. Every human contains the light of Waheguru, everyone is equal. Punjabi culture is very homophobic, not Sikhi. The decision to not allow homosexuals to marry has not been made by Sikhi. The panth (Sikhs themselves) decided this in 1920 when they released the current form of the rehat maryada or code of conduct. This code of conduct is a living document and Sikhs have the power to change it as a collective. Perhaps, in the future the panth will decide to allow homosexuals to marry.

Sikhi says all humans are equal. Guru Nanak Dev Ji empowered women. Sikhi gives equal treatment to both men and women. Both men and women can do the same things in Sikhi.

Again Punjabi culture means most people have arranged marriages. Sikhi doesn't care how you get married. Some people get love marriages, other people get arranged marriages. Interfaith marriages are not allowed by Anand Karaj because you are promising to live according to the Gurus teachings. If it is an interfaith marriage, you clearly aren't going to live according to Sikh teachings and follow the Guru. Whats the point of getting an Anand Karaj and promising the Guru you will follow him if you aren't going to? You are free to date whoever you want, but only Sikhs can have an Anand Karaj.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji is saying religious labels don't matter, everyone is equal before Waheguru. Waheguru doesn't care if you call yourself a Sikh, Hindu, Christian or Muslim. He was saying just by calling yourself a Sikh or Christian won't get you to Waheguru. Sikhi is about actions, you have to put the work in. Just giving yourself a label doesn't mean anything. The other religions have a lot of rituals and dogma in them. Guru Nanak Dev Ji started Sikhi as a path that was devoid of rituals and dogma to create something where people could find Waheguru.

Kalyug is not a real thing. Kalyug is our state of mind, it is when our mind is controlled by the 5 thieves. When we don't try to find Waheguru. This is kalyug, the darkness of ignorance.

The SGGS is the last Guru of the Sikhs. We also call it the Guru of the world. Anyone can come and find out what SGGS says and apply it to their life. The SGGS is the complete Guru. The way to find Waheguru is the SGGS. I don't care if there will be future Gurus. The SGGS is the complete Guru.

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There are similarities between Buddhism and Sikhi. Waheguru is everywhere, every part of creation is Waheguru. Within you is Waheguru. Our goal is to realise Waheguru, to understand ourselves. Ego separates us from Waheguru. This ego needs to be destroyed to reach Waheguru and find contentment. Sikhi is not concerned about liberation. Sikhi is all about understanding Waheguru now. Practice Sikhi, do what the Gurus tell you, see the light within everyone and everything. Cultivate naam, meditate, reflect, serve people, sing and fight the 5 thieves. This is how you will experience Waheguru.

Sachkhand is a state of mind, not a magic place or heaven. Sachkhand is the state when you realise the truth. You see Waheguru everywhere. This is enlightenment, this is liberation. Sachkhand isn't heaven.

The SGGS is our Guru, it is the thing we turn to for guidance and help. It is the Guru who will help us find Waheguru. Reading bani is very important because it is like having a conversation with your Guru. Everyday he reminds you of what you should be doing, everyday he instructs you. Read bani, understand it and implement it into your life. Singing is very important. Just sing your soul out, call for your beloved. The Gurus gave their message in song. The SGGS is written in raag, musical notes. There are no chapters, instead the SGGS is divided by raag. Kirtan is very important in Sikhi. Self reflection is also important, look within yourself. Sikhi is all about improving yourself. The treasure is within you, so self reflection is important. However, the Guru is the one who shows you how to achieve this treasure.

The SGGS says nothing about homosexuals or anything. The SGGS is not a rule book. There is no dogma in the SGGS. You'll find the yearings of those who walked the path of the saints who wished to find Waheguru. The SGGS doesn't say anything about marriage or homosexuals. Every human contains the light of Waheguru, everyone is equal. Punjabi culture is very homophobic, not Sikhi. The decision to not allow homosexuals to marry has not been made by Sikhi. The panth (Sikhs themselves) decided this in 1920 when they released the current form of the rehat maryada or code of conduct. This code of conduct is a living document and Sikhs have the power to change it as a collective. Perhaps, in the future the panth will decide to allow homosexuals to marry.

Sikhi says all humans are equal. Guru Nanak Dev Ji empowered women. Sikhi gives equal treatment to both men and women. Both men and women can do the same things in Sikhi.

Again Punjabi culture means most people have arranged marriages. Sikhi doesn't care how you get married. Some people get love marriages, other people get arranged marriages. Interfaith marriages are not allowed by Anand Karaj because you are promising to live according to the Gurus teachings. If it is an interfaith marriage, you clearly aren't going to live according to Sikh teachings and follow the Guru. Whats the point of getting an Anand Karaj and promising the Guru you will follow him if you aren't going to? You are free to date whoever you want, but only Sikhs can have an Anand Karaj.

Guru Nanak Dev Ji is saying religious labels don't matter, everyone is equal before Waheguru. Waheguru doesn't care if you call yourself a Sikh, Hindu, Christian or Muslim. He was saying just by calling yourself a Sikh or Christian won't get you to Waheguru. Sikhi is about actions, you have to put the work in. Just giving yourself a label doesn't mean anything. The other religions have a lot of rituals and dogma in them. Guru Nanak Dev Ji started Sikhi as a path that was devoid of rituals and dogma to create something where people could find Waheguru.

Kalyug is not a real thing. Kalyug is our state of mind, it is when our mind is controlled by the 5 thieves. When we don't try to find Waheguru. This is kalyug, the darkness of ignorance.

The SGGS is the last Guru of the Sikhs. We also call it the Guru of the world. Anyone can come and find out what SGGS says and apply it to their life. The SGGS is the complete Guru. The way to find Waheguru is the SGGS. I don't care if there will be future Gurus. The SGGS is the complete Guru.

This poster always has the need to disregard the core values of Sikhi and delude certain aspects of Sikhi for his own beliefs. Best to ignore this secular quasi-religious fanatic advice.

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"3. So if the goal is to get rid of desires and ego and such, would a monastic life not be more effective at doing so?

4. That makes sense. As a westerner it is hard for me to accept arranged marriages, since love is so ingrained in my cultural values and is very important to me. Love marriages are acceptable then, but not encouraged? What about a marriage in which there is more mature love and the couple grows together spiritually? Is this easier to achieve in a love marriage or an arranged marriage? I don't think I could live in a loveless marriage, but perhaps I am misunderstanding arranged marriages. Pardon me, it is simply something I've never considered before."

Yes of course a monastic life is more effective and easier for getting rid of desires than living in a desire filled world and then tryingbto get rid of desires.But then society is depleted of good, spititual people as they all leave to become yogis, sidhas, monks. In fact that was the condition of society when Guru Nanak Dev Ji came. Society was being led by corrupt leaders the brahmins n pundits n kings. And yet nobody was saving people from the Mughal invaders n raiders who were enslaving n killin ppl. So guru Ji decided to create warrior saints. Yes their job was harder to be saints while living in the world and serving people as defenders. So in a Gurudwara one was able to get food for the soul,food for the body,and protection. That is why Gurbani is so important. It is the thing that allows one to live in the world and be a renunciate as well. Its good that u reading japji sahib but it can be a bit too complex n philosophical. I recommend reading Sukhmani Sahib after ur finished with jap Ji sahib. The man in blue ( he is a dutch convert into Sikhi, u shud read his blog) says sukhmani sahib is easier to translate so easier to grasp. Also check out Yuttadhama Bhikhu on youtube , he is a Canadian Buddhist monk, I like his way of meditating. Other forum/blogs u shud check out is gurmatbibek.com n manvirsingh.blogspot and gupt wannabe naam abhiyaasi blog.

4. The thing about arranged marriage is to find a person who is compatible with ur views, lifestyle etc by using ppl who know u to find someone that matches. But if u can find that in a love marriage good but the thing is not to care about outer looks which can be hard. So if u can find mature love and grow in spiritality, great.

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3. So if the goal is to get rid of desires and ego and such, would a monastic life not be more effective at doing so?

4. That makes sense. As a westerner it is hard for me to accept arranged marriages, since love is so ingrained in my cultural values and is very important to me. Love marriages are acceptable then, but not encouraged? What about a marriage in which there is more mature love and the couple grows together spiritually? Is this easier to achieve in a love marriage or an arranged marriage? I don't think I could live in a loveless marriage, but perhaps I am misunderstanding arranged marriages. Pardon me, it is simply something I've never considered before.

5. This makes a lot of sense. Just as Christians have a very strong sense of morals and principles, many have forgotten them and I would say most Christians nowadays just go to Church on Sunday and consider that their moral responsibility. There is no spiritual striving, and no growth.

How can you know that God is the true teacher? How can you know that God exists? I ask these questions not as an attack, but because I would like to hear your answers and the answers of other Sikhs.

This is a very good point. Thank you for making this clear to me.

1. How do you know that the Buddha was not totally enlightened?

2. I will give it a look, thank you for the recommendation.

3. So homosexuality is a punishment? Why is this the case, and why would being homosexual be any lesser than being heterosexual? This doesn't seem to be in the spirit of tolerance that initially drew me to Sikhi.

4. This is definitely true, at least for young people. The western world has a very high divorce rate, and that's for a reason. However, what about older couples, or couples with more mature love for each other? I guess that would be the other 10%.

I don't see different religions as a barrier. Of course, being of the same religion can greatly help your spiritual growth if you are both on the same path, however if you are married to someone who is of the same religion but you are not as compatible as you thought, it can hinder your growth. I would argue that it is not impossible for both to live together. My parents have an interfaith marriage (or, what some would consider to be one. They come from two very very different sects of Christianity).

5. That is a good message. We should not look at religious labels as barriers, and realize we are all humans and of the same source, but we should also adhere to our religion and be true to our faith. However I still don't feel like my question was answered. Why did Sikhi, in particular, become a religion? Perhaps I am misunderstanding what you stated and if I am then I apologize.

Thank you all for the answers. They are very interesting to me, and have given me things to think about. Last night I read the Japji Sahib and tonight I will read more.

Japji sahib is not a bani to be read in night it should be recited only before the sun set and after midnight (i.e 12:30 a.m approx).

You cannot reach satisfaction from our points,facts and stories.Hard work is necessary and by hard work i mean faith,patience,compassion and dicipline.

There is a theory that there are 5 main realms (khand) which a human being goes through.Every obtained khand remain with him as he continues the joury.

They are

1.Karam khand

2.dharam khand

3.gyan khand

4.saram khand

5.sach khand

1.Karam khand÷All people have this,they all sow the seeds of good and bad here and get them when crop is ripe.When a person does good deeds he is promoted to dharam khand.But as said he also have karam khand with him.

2.Dharam khand÷It is the place where he starts becoming religious.Follow the order of his guru with 100% faith and with rules and regulations.

3.Gyan khand÷After that comes gyan khand where guru gives necessary knowledge to the learner.Then the cover of illusion is teared from learners mind and reality is brought into focus.Due to his hard work he is gifted with the opening of third eye(divya drishti).

4.Saram khand÷The realm in which when one enters notices the reality.Angels,demons,heaven,hell etc can be seen by him.

5.Sach khand(The realm of TRUTH)÷Here we gets access to the place where the GOD recites.

These all are the truths i have told you from my experience of learning from Gurbani's teachings.Any further questions can be answered in inbox.

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This poster always has the need to disregard the core values of Sikhi and delude certain aspects of Sikhi for his own beliefs. Best to ignore this secular quasi-religious fanatic advice.

LOL.

Please point out the core values I have disregarded? Tell me how I am deluded.

Read the SGGS, tell me where all these Vedic and Hindu beliefs are accepted.

We claim Guru Nanak Dev Ji came to start a new path, it is a unique path. As a child, he refused to wear the janeu. From that moment, he destroyed the Vedic beliefs. What do we keep doing? We keep running back to the building he destroyed and keep picking up the rubble.

This is the problem with the panth, if someone disagrees with you are your jathebandi views you immediately start accusing them of being naastiks, Hindus, fake Sikhs and other insults.

Also, when I have I posted before? Show me examples where I have gone against the core beliefs of Sikhi.

If someone disagrees with you, tell them why. Don't start name calling and accusing them of being athiests and fake Sikhs.

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Guest Anonymous

The SGGS is our Guru, it is the thing we turn to for guidance and help. It is the Guru who will help us find Waheguru. Reading bani is very important because it is like having a conversation with your Guru. Everyday he reminds you of what you should be doing, everyday he instructs you. Read bani, understand it and implement it into your life. Singing is very important. Just sing your soul out, call for your beloved. The Gurus gave their message in song. The SGGS is written in raag, musical notes. There are no chapters, instead the SGGS is divided by raag. Kirtan is very important in Sikhi. Self reflection is also important, look within yourself. Sikhi is all about improving yourself. The treasure is within you, so self reflection is important. However, the Guru is the one who shows you how to achieve this treasure.

So all of them are equally important?

The SGGS says nothing about homosexuals or anything. The SGGS is not a rule book. There is no dogma in the SGGS. You'll find the yearings of those who walked the path of the saints who wished to find Waheguru. The SGGS doesn't say anything about marriage or homosexuals. Every human contains the light of Waheguru, everyone is equal. Punjabi culture is very homophobic, not Sikhi. The decision to not allow homosexuals to marry has not been made by Sikhi. The panth (Sikhs themselves) decided this in 1920 when they released the current form of the rehat maryada or code of conduct. This code of conduct is a living document and Sikhs have the power to change it as a collective. Perhaps, in the future the panth will decide to allow homosexuals to marry.

So you reject the Rehat Maryada then? What of those who say that true Sikhs, the Amritdhari, must follow the Rehat Maryada? So it is not unquestionable, but rather changeable as values change?

Again Punjabi culture means most people have arranged marriages. Sikhi doesn't care how you get married. Some people get love marriages, other people get arranged marriages. Interfaith marriages are not allowed by Anand Karaj because you are promising to live according to the Gurus teachings. If it is an interfaith marriage, you clearly aren't going to live according to Sikh teachings and follow the Guru. Whats the point of getting an Anand Karaj and promising the Guru you will follow him if you aren't going to? You are free to date whoever you want, but only Sikhs can have an Anand Karaj.

Why does getting an interfaith marriage mean you are not going to live according to Sikh teachings? At one point you are speaking against the Rehat Maryada and here you are speaking for it.

This poster always has the need to disregard the core values of Sikhi and delude certain aspects of Sikhi for his own beliefs. Best to ignore this secular quasi-religious fanatic advice.

Why do you feel this way? What aspects is he deluding? His post offers a different viewpoint and adds to the discussion. If you think I should ignore him, I would like to hear why you think so.

"3. So if the goal is to get rid of desires and ego and such, would a monastic life not be more effective at doing so?

4. That makes sense. As a westerner it is hard for me to accept arranged marriages, since love is so ingrained in my cultural values and is very important to me. Love marriages are acceptable then, but not encouraged? What about a marriage in which there is more mature love and the couple grows together spiritually? Is this easier to achieve in a love marriage or an arranged marriage? I don't think I could live in a loveless marriage, but perhaps I am misunderstanding arranged marriages. Pardon me, it is simply something I've never considered before."

Yes of course a monastic life is more effective and easier for getting rid of desires than living in a desire filled world and then tryingbto get rid of desires.But then society is depleted of good, spititual people as they all leave to become yogis, sidhas, monks. In fact that was the condition of society when Guru Nanak Dev Ji came. Society was being led by corrupt leaders the brahmins n pundits n kings. And yet nobody was saving people from the Mughal invaders n raiders who were enslaving n killin ppl. So guru Ji decided to create warrior saints. Yes their job was harder to be saints while living in the world and serving people as defenders. So in a Gurudwara one was able to get food for the soul,food for the body,and protection. That is why Gurbani is so important. It is the thing that allows one to live in the world and be a renunciate as well. Its good that u reading japji sahib but it can be a bit too complex n philosophical. I recommend reading Sukhmani Sahib after ur finished with jap Ji sahib. The man in blue ( he is a dutch convert into Sikhi, u shud read his blog) says sukhmani sahib is easier to translate so easier to grasp. Also check out Yuttadhama Bhikhu on youtube , he is a Canadian Buddhist monk, I like his way of meditating. Other forum/blogs u shud check out is gurmatbibek.com n manvirsingh.blogspot and gupt wannabe naam abhiyaasi blog.

4. The thing about arranged marriage is to find a person who is compatible with ur views, lifestyle etc by using ppl who know u to find someone that matches. But if u can find that in a love marriage good but the thing is not to care about outer looks which can be hard. So if u can find mature love and grow in spiritality, great.

I hadn't thought about that. I'll take a look at those, thank you.

Japji sahib is not a bani to be read in night it should be recited only before the sun set and after midnight (i.e 12:30 a.m approx).

You cannot reach satisfaction from our points,facts and stories.Hard work is necessary and by hard work i mean faith,patience,compassion and dicipline.

There is a theory that there are 5 main realms (khand) which a human being goes through.Every obtained khand remain with him as he continues the joury.

Apologies that I didn't do it properly. I am going to university right now and nighttime is the best time I have available to read Bani. Why is there a rule on when it can be read? Are there any other rules I should be aware of while I read?

I'm not expecting to achieve enlightenment from your responses. I'm just trying to understand my own path and exploring a religion I find fascinating :)

Interesting point about the khands.

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1. Guru Sahib has seen God Himself with His very own eyes. He also provided us with the path to have the same vision. It follows logically that you trust the one who knows for sure over the one who is not sure. Sikhi is a monotheistic faith whereas Buddhism is atheistic. Gurmat condemns asceticism but Buddhism encourages it. Nirvana is the result of self-effort but Gurmat salvation is the result of grace of God. Both faiths are poles apart.

2. Gurbani is divine and its source is God Himself. Gurbani is Satguru. Hence, reading Bani means talking to Satguru and receiving guidance. Naam Simran must be done according to the way Gurbani teaches because Gurbani (Guru) is where a devotee would receive Naam from. I fail to see how you can engage in Naam Simran without obtaining it from Satguru. Leaving the Bani means leaving the path of Simran. Gurbani is like a doctor and Naam is like a medicine. There is no such thing as over the counter Naam.

3. Let me be very clear. Philosophically speaking, there is no such thing as Western religion or Western values because pretty much everything comes from the East. The so-called Western ideas are stemming from American society and its understanding of the world-view. These ideas are neither divine nor always ethically grounded. Gurmat strictly prohibits homosexuality. I could write a long article on this subject (maybe I will some day when Guru Sahib wills) but the gist of it is this: Anand Karaj is a physical cum spiritual union between a man and a woman. It is to be emulated after the relationship between a Husband Lord and the Soul bride. Marriage completes a family unit. While it serves as a mean to have local sangat, it is also a way created by God for procreation. Procreation happens because of heterosexual relationship. Without it humanity will cease to exist. The philosophy of Gurmat is that it only accepts principles that can be universally applicable to all and can benefit the entire humanity. For procreation, heterosexuality can be universally applied to all males and females whereas homosexuality terribly fails to deliver the same results. Just as wandering ascetics who claim to be on the right path go begging to householders for food and clothes, homosexuals claim to be the same and want to have the same rights yet entirely depend on heterosexuals for children. So where is the equality? Lets put any homosexual couple on an uninhabited planet and see if humanity survives. This is why homosexuals are not allowed to have Anand Karaj because they are not qualified. They faill to meet the Anand Karaj teachings and ideals. In order to meet the spiritual criteria, one needs not to have any homosexual relationship at all. This entire relationship is based on physical attraction and nothing more. Gurbani, Vaars etc. all speak to heterosexual marriage very explicitly. Just because homosexuals are humans and have equal human rights doesnt mean they are Sikhs as well. Gurbani covers the topics that affect a person on the spiritual path i.e. topics that benefit him/her as well as the one that can harm his/her. If someone is completely off the path of Gurmat and while engaging in anti-Gurmat acts wishes to obtain Gurbani teachings concerning his deeds, he wont find anything. For example, if one wants to know what to do if he is cheating on his spouse, beating her, going through a divorce or a drug addict. The Gurmat message would be to stop all of this because anyone who commits such acts is not a Sikh. Homosexuality is in the same basket which is incompatible with the path of Gurmat, hence, it is not mentioned in Gurbani. The remedy is to stop it and submit to the path enunciated by Satguru. Ill end this here.

4. Do you even know what love is? Compare the divorce rate between love marriages versus arranged marriages and find out yourself. Why are so many marriages failing in the West? Arranged marriages are not devoid of love. In fact, such marriages tend to do better and last longer compared to their counterpart love marriages. I wont speak to their differences but inter-faith marriage creates problems if both are deeply religious. All faiths are different so it is pertinent to have the same faith in order to have peace, unanimity and love in the household. A Sikh is to marry a Sikh. If a Sikh wants to marry a non-Sikh, he is not a Sikh at all. In such a case, why bother to have Anand Karaj? I am of the opinion that only Amritdharis should be allowed to have Anand Karaj because it is a SIKH ceremony.

5. Sikh is not a label. It is a way of life. A Hindu/Muslim can claim to be a religious person yet not follow it at all. A Muslim would go to heaven regardless of how bad he is. Guru Sahib condemned external symbolism as an end in itself. A Sikh cannot have external appearance alone. All the external symbols, kakkars etc. have connection to internal way of life. Sikh code of conduct is not mechanical acts but Islamic and Hindu conducts are.

6. Guru Granth Sahib is the eternal Guru. It is beyond death, birth and time. As long as God exists, Gurbani will exist.

The best way to learn about Gurmat is by keeping in the company of practicing Sikhs.

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Guest Anonymous

I'm sorry to say this but if this is the "true" Sikh perspective, I think I have lost my interest (though not my respect) in following this religion.

1. Guru Sahib has seen God Himself with His very own eyes. He also provided us with the path to have the same vision. It follows logically that you trust the one who knows for sure over the one who is not sure. Sikhi is a monotheistic faith whereas Buddhism is atheistic. Gurmat condemns asceticism but Buddhism encourages it. Nirvana is the result of self-effort but Gurmat salvation is the result of grace of God. Both faiths are poles apart.

Here I have to ask you how much you have studied Buddhism. Yes, Buddhism is essentially atheistic, though some Mahayana schools do have some deities. Buddhism also condemns asceticism, and quite strongly. Gautama tried asceticism himself, and said very clearly that it is as useless as hedonism. What Buddhism does advocate is monasticism, which is a very different thing entirely. I would say that Buddhism and Sikhism are much more similar to each other than Sikhism is to Abrahamic religions.

2. Gurbani is divine and its source is God Himself. Gurbani is Satguru. Hence, reading Bani means talking to Satguru and receiving guidance. Naam Simran must be done according to the way Gurbani teaches because Gurbani (Guru) is where a devotee would receive Naam from. I fail to see how you can engage in Naam Simran without obtaining it from Satguru. Leaving the Bani means leaving the path of Simran. Gurbani is like a doctor and Naam is like a medicine. There is no such thing as over the counter Naam.

How do you know it is directly from God? Many religions claim that their religion is the "only way", or the "best way". What makes Sikhi any different? Especially when claims like these are made, it makes Sikhi seem like just another self-aggrandizing religion. I'm looking for truth, not dogma.

3. Let me be very clear. Philosophically speaking, there is no such thing as Western religion or Western values because pretty much everything comes from the East. The so-called Western ideas are stemming from American society and its understanding of the world-view. These ideas are neither divine nor always ethically grounded. Gurmat strictly prohibits homosexuality. I could write a long article on this subject (maybe I will some day when Guru Sahib wills) but the gist of it is this: Anand Karaj is a physical cum spiritual union between a man and a woman. It is to be emulated after the relationship between a Husband Lord and the Soul bride. Marriage completes a family unit. While it serves as a mean to have local sangat, it is also a way created by God for procreation. Procreation happens because of heterosexual relationship. Without it humanity will cease to exist. The philosophy of Gurmat is that it only accepts principles that can be universally applicable to all and can benefit the entire humanity. For procreation, heterosexuality can be universally applied to all males and females whereas homosexuality terribly fails to deliver the same results. Just as wandering ascetics who claim to be on the right path go begging to householders for food and clothes, homosexuals claim to be the same and want to have the same rights yet entirely depend on heterosexuals for children. So where is the equality? Lets put any homosexual couple on an uninhabited planet and see if humanity survives. This is why homosexuals are not allowed to have Anand Karaj because they are not qualified. They faill to meet the Anand Karaj teachings and ideals. In order to meet the spiritual criteria, one needs not to have any homosexual relationship at all. This entire relationship is based on physical attraction and nothing more. Gurbani, Vaars etc. all speak to heterosexual marriage very explicitly. Just because homosexuals are humans and have equal human rights doesnt mean they are Sikhs as well. Gurbani covers the topics that affect a person on the spiritual path i.e. topics that benefit him/her as well as the one that can harm his/her. If someone is completely off the path of Gurmat and while engaging in anti-Gurmat acts wishes to obtain Gurbani teachings concerning his deeds, he wont find anything. For example, if one wants to know what to do if he is cheating on his spouse, beating her, going through a divorce or a drug addict. The Gurmat message would be to stop all of this because anyone who commits such acts is not a Sikh. Homosexuality is in the same basket which is incompatible with the path of Gurmat, hence, it is not mentioned in Gurbani. The remedy is to stop it and submit to the path enunciated by Satguru. Ill end this here.

Alright, fair enough. There is no such thing as "Western" values. Call it "liberal" values then. Whatever label you want to use, they are my values. I don't see how "pretty much everything" comes from the East, and I think that is grossly unfair to the independent development that we have had here in the West. Now you can claim they are coming from the American world view, but where does that come from? Largely from Europe, especially the UK and Western Europe. I am American, so, no conflict there. To say that these values are neither divine nor ethically grounded is extremely narrow-minded on your part, and reinforces that you see your way as the only right way. Also to say that because homosexuals cannot have children, they are useless shows your bias. Homosexuals can not only have surrogate children, they can also adopt, which is also very useful to society as there are many orphaned and abused children in need of homes. This would also be true of anyone who is infertile, or simply chooses not to marry. Is it against Gurmat to be infertile? They can't procreate either. Your comparison of homosexuals to ascetics is also equally unfair. Homosexuals do NOT go begging, they are perfectly capable of living their own independent *householder* lives, and do not need society to support them any more than you do. Do they depend on heterosexuals for children? Yes they do, but what does it matter? They are not the majority, they never will be, and we're not exactly at risk for running out of children either. If you look at evolutionary psychology, homosexuality serves an evolutionary advantage by furthering genetic relatedness indirectly by PARTICIPATING IN THE COMMUNITY and HELPING TO TAKE CARE OF OTHERS CHILDREN. Homosexuals are an asset to society, not a hindrance.

My understanding, though I am willing to be corrected, is that the SGGSJ does not speak about homosexuality at all. The only document which does is the Rehat Maryada, which states that marriage is between a man and a woman. Though one could argue, if the soul is genderless (STATED IN THE SGGSJ), just like God, then why is there such an arbitrary constraint on marriage? And this is not my argument, this is an argument that SIKHS have made. Are you also stating that homosexuals cannot be Sikhs? What about the path of the Satguru being available to all humans? And now you are comparing homosexuality to wife-beating, domestic abuse, cheating, and drug abuse. I too will end this here because I am afraid if I continue I will not be able to contain myself.

4. Do you even know what love is? Compare the divorce rate between love marriages versus arranged marriages and find out yourself. Why are so many marriages failing in the West? Arranged marriages are not devoid of love. In fact, such marriages tend to do better and last longer compared to their counterpart love marriages. I wont speak to their differences but inter-faith marriage creates problems if both are deeply religious. All faiths are different so it is pertinent to have the same faith in order to have peace, unanimity and love in the household. A Sikh is to marry a Sikh. If a Sikh wants to marry a non-Sikh, he is not a Sikh at all. In such a case, why bother to have Anand Karaj? I am of the opinion that only Amritdharis should be allowed to have Anand Karaj because it is a SIKH ceremony.

I do. I have experienced it. Have you? Are divorce rates higher in the West? Yes, they are, I won't deny that. Why is that the case? That's a very complicated question, and it does not have as simple of an answer as arranged is better. Remember, correlation is not causation. If you are going to ask a sociological question like that, you need to approach it from a scientific perspective.

5. Sikh is not a label. It is a way of life. A Hindu/Muslim can claim to be a religious person yet not follow it at all. A Muslim would go to heaven regardless of how bad he is. Guru Sahib condemned external symbolism as an end in itself. A Sikh cannot have external appearance alone. All the external symbols, kakkars etc. have connection to internal way of life. Sikh code of conduct is not mechanical acts but Islamic and Hindu conducts are.

A Sikh can also claim to be a Sikh and not follow it at all. This is true for any religion. Are you saying that Muslim and Hindu conducts are completely meaningless? I would advise you to remember that Guru Nanak Ji himself had a Muslim companion, and verses composed by Kabir, a SUFI MUSLIM, are present in the SGGSJ. A Muslim will not go to heaven regardless of how bad he is, as there are sins within their own code of conduct that are unforgivable or require repentance before death. ISIS members are most certainly not going to any kind of heaven, and any Muslim will tell you that, even though they claim to be Muslim. An example of an unforgivable sin is shirk, to associate partners with Allah or worship any god other than Allah. The Qu'ran states that even a prophet who commits shirk will be abandoned by Allah, and will be forsaken by Him. I would suggest you do your research before you make such bold claims on other religions.

Apologies if I have caused any offense. These are very important issues to me, and I, just like Sikhs are called to do, will defend people who have been attacked by your post.

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You asked questions and many provided answers. If you are thinking of having an argument or a debate then you will have to find someone else for it.

Having some similarities does not mean anything. What sets Gurmat apart from Buddhism is the fact (and a very important one) is that the former believes in One Supreme Being whereas the latter does not. Hence, all other concepts concerning way of life and salvation would be vastly different. Similarities can be found in all religions. This does not prove anything.

How do I know? Because my Satguru told me and He is not a liar. He received the revelation and penned it down Himself. He preached and practiced the same message. Countless Sikhs have experienced the Divine from this message. The true message can only preach what is according to the very nature of God i.e. without hate, fear, equality, peace etc. What proof do you have that Gurbani is not revealed? If you are looking for truth then why not compare the original Gurbani message to other holy books and see for yourself. Truth is not sought by asking questions on forums and picking an argument. Truth is obtained by following Satguru and having an inner connection with Vaheguru which is wholly absent in Buddhism.

It seems to me you do not understand logic. If you want to treat homosexuality topic as something personal then it leaves no room for any objective discussion. I never said homosexuals are useless. I only stated they cannot procreate which is part of Anand Karaj lifestyle. Hence, within Gurmat they have no place. Surely they can adopt but I have already refuted such a useless point. They depend on heterosexuals for it. Assume there are no children left in the world for adoption, what then? On what basis do homosexuals justify having a family unit? On what basis is this marriage justified? You failed to address my point: Lets put any homosexual couple on an uninhabited planet and see if humanity survives. Gurmat is universal and all of its principles are universally applicable. If homosexuality was universally applied, humanity will cease to exist. Infertility is a medical disability. Are all homosexuals medically disabled? You are the one doing apples to oranges comparison not me. You are the one comparing healthy homos to infertile. Procreation is not the only criterion but is definitely one of the criteria. First criterion for Anand Karaj is to have a man and a woman. Many Gurbani verses explicitly state this. Vaars also state the same fact in no ambiguous terms. I never said homosexuals are beggars but are like ascetics who depend on heterosexuals. I dont think you understand how examples work. Homosexuals are NOT householders as defined in Gurbani (I highly doubt you know what householder means within the scope of Gurmat). Their entire relationship is predicated upon physical attraction towards the same sex be it for companionship, intimacy or lust. Living the ideal Gurmat lifestyle is never on their mind. Mind you, we are not discussing pros and cons of homosexuality but whether it is accepted in Sikhi or not. The topic is not homosexuality in general but very specific as to Gurmat injunctions in regards to it.

I have already stated why Gurbani does not mention it explicitly. Again, it is incompatible with Gurmat i.e. it is opposite to Sikh way of life. You argue in vain that soul is genderless. So what? Is homosexual relationship soul based? No. It is same sex based. It is physical based. Hence, your argument is invalid. I can argue that since soul has no gender why cant all homosexuals marry the opposite sex and form heterosexual family units? Why do they feel attracted to the same gender which is purely physical? A Sikh and homosexual are contradictory. It is analogous to saying criminal and cop are one and the same or a saint and a sinner are the same. Not to say that homosexuals are criminals or sinners. Absolutely not. The point being that two are contradictory in nature. A Gursikh who is God oriented person can never be homosexual. This is how Gurbani defines it. Divorce, abuse, wife-beating etc. are topics which are not mentioned in Gurbani so should we assume Gurbani endorses such practices? Absolutely not. These topics are not covered because they are incompatible with true way of life. If someone was to ask what Gurbani says concerning a Sikh getting a divorce or beating his wife, the answer would be that the person is not a Sikh. Homosexuality is in the same boat. A Sikh is heterosexual by definition. His life centers around being a heterosexual person. His marriage is not founded upon physical attraction but rather is grounded in having a household sangat and procreation. God created us in balance. For man He created woman and vice versa. Why should we go against such a natural design and resort to animalistic behavior in which physical traits is the only basis for a relationship? Homosexuals are not Sikhs. Period. The path is open to them but they must follow it wholeheartedly. It is not my way but Gurus way. Guru advocated heterosexuality. This is what he preached, practiced and emulated for us.

I think you need to calm down. If love marriage is better then why does it fail more than an arranged marriage? Shouldnt love be stronger? Clearly, what most Westerners call love is nothing more than physical attraction from which they seek worldly pleasures. They dont understand what it takes to make a marriage successful. Many marriages fall apart because they dont experience the same love or the feelings are not there anymore or one of them starts to cheat. If one truly loves another person, their relationship should go stronger and stronger every day. Love is not something that fades or weakens over time.

A person can claim to be a Sikh and not follow it. Correct. But this is not the point I made. My point is that one who doesnt follow Sikhi is not a Sikh doesnt matter how religious he presents himself to be. He is called a hypocrite in Gurbani. This is not the case in many other religions especially Hinduism and Islam. A Hindu can believe in God or not but remains a Hindu. A Muslim must observe prayers but there are many exceptions. In Islam, the most sinful Muslim in the world would go to heaven (after he is cleansed in hell) but the most saintly non-Muslim would go to hell. Prophets are exempt from mistakes and sins so no punishments for them. Read the Maariful Quran commentary yourself. Hence, it comes down to labels for them. I have studied these religions from their own books written by their eminent scholars.

This is in contrast to Gurmat. Guru Sahibs companion Mardana became a Sikh during the odysseys. Bhagat Kabir Ji rejects Islam in his own compositions. I am not here to argue with you or offend anyone. I respect all humans but those who dont follow Sikhi are not Sikhs. It doesnt mean they are inferior or unequal. Gurmat is the path of submission to God. Dont expect it to be like Hinduism which accommodates any manmat thinking. Very easy to say you seek truth but it I shard to accept it and follow it. It is up to you to make a choice. If you choose Gurmat then follow it nearly and dearly by giving up your own way of thinking including seeing homosexuality the same as heterosexuality. Otherwise you will have to find another religion that accommodates your belief system which in my opinion is contrary to the very nature of seeking a religion. Just dont become a Sikh and start to push your own thinking over Gurmat. We already have enough of those doing internal damage. Again, I am least interested in having arguments. I only presented my answers. I am not here to convince you but simply provide the information. You can reject all of it and look the other way which would be contrary to the claim of seeking truth. Good luck on your search. Guru Rakha

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As the title of the thread suggests, I am currently exploring Sikhi as well as other religious beliefs (including Buddhism and Radha Soami, though I have issues with following a human master). I come from a Christian background, but I would not describe my beliefs as being particularly Christian, as I believe in an all-pervading God who is impersonal, and I believe in systems such as reincarnation and karma. So, I have many questions about Sikhi as I am on my search, and I was hoping that you all might be able to answer some questions for me. None of these questions are meant to challenge your beliefs at all, but merely to express my own doubts and challenges that I face in my search
.
You came to right place regarding your concerns following human master.
-Sikhi is one unique dharma where it challenges one particular point of view or mindset of mandatory needed of human master. It does not totally reject the concept being in society of teachers to learn as it talks about benefits sant parsad, sadh sangat- soceity of saints- masters all to encourage one go to introvert as overall ultimately-Satguru is within all of us- it challenges conventional prevalent view based on dogmatic cultural/conceptual notions that one must need physical human master.
What sikhi provides is beyond human master which is direct link with God/ Satguru (nirgun roop) which is in shabad form within/inner shabad gyan- satguru (true consciousness) within in all of us via manifested form of Satguru guidance ( Sargun roop-Visible form of God-Sri guru granth sahib ji)-
It's direct link between seeker and within seeker pure God's divine alive functioning light-knowledge-Satguru- inner guiding force.
In order to access or abide within within all of us that pure God's divine alive functioning light-knowledge- Satguru (nirgun roop) inner bani-naam- inner guiding force...sikhs read manifested form satguru- sri guru granth sahib (visible Sargun roop of Guru) to break one's egoic conditioning- go introvert and explore divine within, and with Gurparsad (grace of true guru manifested/unmanifested within) merges in absolute truth.
1. Buddhism and Sikhism I think are largely similar, but they have a major difference that I find hard to reconcile. Buddhism (at least Theravadan and Zen) teaches that the existence of God can't be answered for sure, and the same can be said for the soul. Instead the Buddha says that we should forget such questions, and instead focus on achieving Nirvana, as these questions impede our spiritual growth. Sikhi (as far as I am aware) states that our ultimate purpose is to merge with God, and reach Sach Khand. The problem is, I can see and understand the reasoning behind both of these positions, and I have a really hard time figuring out what to believe on this issue. How can I resolve this conflict?
There is secret indication what buddha is saying, its statement to avoid people making mountains of conceptual philosophies/ideas about truth which impedes one own spirituality as opposed to living the truth and experience it for yourself as this is sad reality of humanity.
Most people reside in comfort of conceptual ideas about the truth-egoistic mind conditioning as false sense of security instead of taking truth inside and let the truth does its work.
There are similarities- absolute truth, grace always happening we need to study more deeper to get list of similarities- If you want to learn about nirvana read buddhist heart sutra which tries to explain ultimate non dual reality/realization,- Gate, Gate, Paragate, Para Sam gate Bodhi svaha. It talks about absolute reality- emptiness is form, form is emptiness always being always becoming can be experienced by buddha nature (pure awareness enlightened being).
However since there are many interpretations of it via many school of thoughts, its not very clear as one can easily confuse or caught up empty awakeness/pure awareness as void-half transcendental awakening etc etc.
Absolute reality/truth is defined in Sikh Mool mantra(Root Mantra) is very clear and pristine:
Ik Oankar - One universal Eternal Absolute unchanged Awareness Being-Light-Knowledge- God- all in one, one in all- embodiment of stillness awareness, expressing itself in its movement - creating, preserving and changing creation spontaneously effortlessly.
Which is
Satnam- Eternal Truth Pure Existence
Kartapurkh- Creative consciousness
Nirbhauo- No fear- fearless as there is only one in all, all in one- fear from what? There is NO other. Ikoankar is all, all is ikoankar
Nirvair- No enemy of anyone- since its only one in all, all in one, there is no enemy.
Akaal Moorat- Timeless Being which is one being in all, all in one- One-JOT-Light-pure knowledge form.
Ajooni- Unborn non dual pure awareness being all in one, one in all.
Gurparsad- Pure consciousness/awareness bliss is realized by grace of true Guru-Satguru-sargun-manifested Guru in form of sri guru granth sahib/ invisible alive SatGuru within all- bestowed grace.
2. Scriptures are obviously very important to Sikhs, as the SGGSJ forms the foundation for Sikhi. My question regarding this is, why is reading the Bani repeatedly so important? Is kirtan more beneficial than to practice simran and meditation on the atman inside? I can understand reading it for understanding, and of course reading scriptures at different times in our lives, we will receive different lessons. But is inward meditation not more valuable, provided it is done with a proper spiritual understanding?
For every sikh, reading gurbani, contemplating on it, practising is quite important because gurbani breaks sikh-seeker egoistic conditioning, pre conceived notions/ideology/mindset if seeker allows- ALIVE GURBANI (ALIVE DIVINE BEING KNOWLEDGE) to take center stage of being let truth gurbani do its work, most of times its egoic conditioning pretends they are reading gurbani (ocean of bliss) however they are anyalizing ocean of gurbani from off shore rather being in it.
For example there is a famous story in our history where gurbani is used as medicine as analogy to show dogmatic notion for patient- where one groups of sikhs are shown doing gargles of medicine instead of taking it all in and other group is shown taking it all in one having full affect of gurbani.
In Sikh dharma, reading-Contemplation, kirtan, meditation are not in clash courses with each other they all can be incorporated whatever one is drawn too. They all can provided great divine insight, naam awakening inside as naam which is integral focus in sikh dharma where interpretation of naam can be grasped at many different levels depending on the spiritual maturity of the aspirant.
5. Again as far as I understand, Guru Nanak Ji shunned religious labels. He stated "There is no Hindu, there is no Muslim." So therefore, why have his teachings started a religion? This is something I haven't been able to find much discussion about, and I am quite curious about it. Has Sikhism fallen prey to the same dogmatism that he taught against?
Not Sikhism but on many levels more than handful areas of sikh community definitely has fallen prey because of Victorian abhramic notions.

6. The SGGSJ was named as the last Guru for the Sikhs. Does this mean there will never be another Guru? What about when we move out of Kal Yug and into the next age, will there be another succession of Gurus?
Guru and Waheguru are same. There is only Guru/God. There won't be any other. Ultimate Guru is inner One God/ Guru within all of us as all pervading God, thats what Sri guru granth sahib ji is manifested personal Guru visible form is referring to (Sargun personal manifested guru is referring to its impersonal nirgun form). There is no duality as such- SGGS is personified manifested Guru form of non manifested non confined non dual Shabad Guru/Satguru-true consciousness/awareness within all of us which is alive never born and dies-Vaho Vaho Bani Nirankar Hai ||. Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji.
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