Wanted To Tell Sangat About My Past Identity On This Forum!

[shastarSingh]

Read what bhai sahib said more carefully veerji. He said Sri Sarbloh Granth first came to Punjab in around 1805, and he is right. Guru Sahib actually brought Sri Sarbloh Granth to the attention of the Sikhs when he was travelling in Nanded, the place where he left his corporeal form in 1708 (a lot later than 1698). It was said to have been jealously guarded by the Nihang Singhs who were present at Guru Sahib's pyre, and who remained in the Deccan. I don't see how Sarbloh Granth, in its current form, could possibly have existed in 1698 because it frequently mentions the Khalsa, which was of course founded in 1699.

1805 was around about the time the Sikhs of Punjab had finally recovered from the constant invasions and assumed their full height as a people, it is unlikely that they came across Sri Sarbloh Granth before this, particularly since there was very little communication between the Punjabi Sikhs and the Deccani Sikhs until Maharaja Ranjit Singh had established his Empire.

I agree that Dasmesh Pita informed Khalsa about Sarbloh Granth Sahib jee at Nanded but I dont think Sarbloh Granth Sahib came to Punjab in 1805. It is oral tradtion in Dal Panth that Sarbloh Granth Sahib was a guarded secret text during Misal Period.

[StarStriker]

Wasnt sarbloh granth dug up, frm the ground, because it had been written in guru gobind singhs previous lifetime, as dusht daman? Or am i confusing sarbloh granth with another?

[jkvlondon]

Wasnt sarbloh granth dug up, frm the ground, because it had been written in guru gobind singhs previous lifetime, as dusht daman? Or am i confusing sarbloh granth with another?

it wasn't dug up but brought to Guru ji in this janam by his followers from their cheledom under Brahmanand they waited for him in the interim in the jungle . Apparently they were told Guru ji would come and ask for it from them .

[Jonny101]

My extremely pyaare Johny veer.

Even if we agree that Sarbloh Granth Sahib Jee came to Punjab in 1805, Dal Panth outside Punjab and definitely in Hazur Sahib must be doing Parkash of all 3 Granth Sahibs.

After 1805 Dal Panth in Punjab started doing parkash of all 3 Granth Sahibs.

Budha Dal shud NEVER do amrit sanchar without the parkash of DASAM GURU DARBAAR and shud ideally do amrit sanchar with the parkash of all 3 Granth Sahibs.

Panth(other than dal panth) must have parkash of Guru Granth Sahib during amrit sanchar.

IN case of emergency or war times, amrit sanchar can be done by PUNJ only without the parkash of any Granth Sahib Jee.

The story goes that it was in the possession of an Udasi. The Udasi gave it to a Nihang telling him that it was written by Guru Gobind Singh Jee. That Nihang then brought it to Punjab in 1805. And even when the Granth arrived in Punjab in 1805 it was not part of Amrit Samagams for decades even after that as we do not find mention of this Granth in puratan literature of Sikhs or even by the British. It is most likely that Nihangs only began including this Granth in Amrit Sanchaars after 1850s when the conquest of Punjab had happened because some Sikh scholars like Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha had studied it and mention it by then.

The story of it being written in ancient times by Guru Sahib when they were Dusht Daman. Now Dusht Daman lived during ancient times, like thousands of years ago. Yet the language of Sarbloh Granth is not of thousands of years ago. It is modern, It even contains Farsi and even English word like pistol. So judging from the language it was most likely written by Guru Sahib while they lived as Guru Gobind Singh jee rather than Dusht Daman.

I wish more mainstream Sikhs scholars would study this granth and write about it. Nihangs tend to give a mythological twist to any story.

[jkvlondon]

The story goes that it was in the possession of an Udasi. The Udasi gave it to a Nihang telling him that it was written by Guru Gobind Singh Jee. That Nihang then brought it to Punjab in 1805. And even when the Granth arrived in Punjab in 1805 it was not part of Amrit Samagams for decades even after that as we do not find mention of this Granth in puratan literature of Sikhs or even by the British. It is most likely that Nihangs only began including this Granth in Amrit Sanchaars after 1850s when the conquest of Punjab had happened because some Sikh scholars like Bhai Kahn Singh Nabha had studied it and mention it by then.

The story of it being written in ancient times by Guru Sahib when they were Dusht Daman. Now Dusht Daman lived during ancient times, like thousands of years ago. Yet the language of Sarbloh Granth is not of thousands of years ago. It is modern, It even contains Farsi and even English word like pistol. So judging from the language it was most likely written by Guru Sahib while they lived as Guru Gobind Singh jee rather than Dusht Daman.

I wish more mainstream Sikhs scholars would study this granth and write about it. Nihangs tend to give a mythological twist to any story.

from what I understood dusht daman wrote this granth in sanskrit covering the battle during satyug of Sarbloh avtar then Guru ji rewrote in modern languages ...

[shastarSingh]

Proof that Sri Sarbloh Guru Darbaar came to Punjab before 1805:-

1. Oral tradition of Dal Panth that Sarbloh Guru Darbaar was a secret guarded text during Misal Period.

2. Damdami Taksal has some records that mention Baba Banda Singh Bahadur doing the seva of writing Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib birs

3 Source :- http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Sarbloh_Granth

.Baba Gurbakhsh Singh Ji like Baba Deep Singh Ji Shahid made hand written copies of Sikh scriptures and small liturgy booklets and sent them to appropriate places. His handwritten copy of Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib is also mentioned before 1920 it was at the Gurdwara Shahid Ganj at the place of martyrdom of Baba Gurbakhsh Singh, but then during the Akali agitation [1920-1925] it was lost by the elder lady who served there.’ - from - ‘Itihas Damdami Taksal (Sankhep)' (Page 54)

[Jonny101]

ਜਿੰਨੇ ਮੂੰਹ ਉੱਨੀਆਂ ਹੀ ਗੱਪਾਂ

First oral tradition was saying there was no sarbloh granth in Punjab before 1805 and that it was found by an udasi living in the jungle who gave it to a Nihang. Now new oral tradition is saying there has always been Sarbloh Granth in Punjab and that baba banda singh bahadur and baba gurbaksh singh wrote copies of them. It seems the oral tradition is constantly changing every now and then. I wonder what the new nihang oral 'tradition' will become by next year.

[shastarSingh]

ਜਿੰਨੇ ਮੂੰਹ ਉੱਨੀਆਂ ਹੀ ਗੱਪਾਂ

First oral tradition was saying there was no sarbloh granth in Punjab before 1805 and that it was found by an udasi living in the jungle who gave it to a Nihang. Now new oral tradition is saying there has always been Sarbloh Granth in Punjab and that baba banda singh bahadur and baba gurbaksh singh wrote copies of them. It seems the oral tradition is constantly changing every now and then. I wonder what the new nihang oral 'tradition' will become by next year.

In Dal Panth, lots of stuff is explained via oral tradition but in Damdami Taksal, singhs read lots of books and they write lots of history. Baba Banda Singh Bahadur writing Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Birs and Shahid Baba Gurbaksh Singh doing the same is from DAMDAMI TAKSAL and not Dal Panth.

Dhan Dhan Damdami Taksal

Dhan Dhan Dal Panth

[Jonny101]

In Dal Panth, lots of stuff is explained via oral tradition but in Damdami Taksal, singhs read lots of books and they write lots of history. Baba Banda Singh Bahadur writing Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Birs and Shahid Baba Gurbaksh Singh doing the same is from DAMDAMI TAKSAL and not Dal Panth.

Dhan Dhan Damdami Taksal

Dhan Dhan Dal Panth

I still remember when there was just one story: udasi-nihang-1805. Slowly the story tellers are getting more imaginative embelishing the narrative adding that it was written thousands of years ago where it was burried underground(even though paper cannot last underground for so long).

The oral tradition story tellers should have said it was found in a cave because that would have been more believable since the cave would have protected the granth much like the dead sea scrolls were protected.

Now I am hearing of new oral traditions of famous Shaheeds also writing copies of the Sarbloh Granth in Punjab. ਗੱਪਾਂ ਦੀ ਭੀ ਕੋਈ ਹੱਦ ਹੁੰਦੀ ਆ

I'm all for Sarbloh Granth but adding unrealistic mythology and ਗੱਪਾਂ to the narrative will only serve to discredit the Granth. What we need are GurSikh academics to thoroughly study the Granth and its history and come to a realistic conclusion.

[shastarSingh]

Pyare Veer,

Have no doubt in ur mind about Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib Jee.

We still have birs of Sri Sarbloh Granth Sahib jee from Guru Jee's time at Mai Bhago Bunga and Gurdwara Mata Sahib devaan Hazur Sahib.Damdami taksal also believes in Sarbloh Granth Sahib jee to be gurbani. Damdami Taksali Singhs are the best Gursikh Academics we have. We need to have faith in our puratan organizations otherwise all we will have is

SHANKAA AND DISUNITY.