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Dasam Granth Issue Behind Attack On Dhandriawale ?


nehkeval
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Baba Santa Singh killed a SIngh ?

I never said he did. I brought it up because you think that it is fine to ask for Baba Harnam Singhs resignation but I'm sure that you would never have contemplated asking the same of Baba Santa Singh if his scenario was played out today.

No need to mention Santa Singh.

Yes there is.

Dhuma is in Punjab by support of Indian government on extended visa. What Bhai Ranjit Singh said about him as being a lapdog of Badal and an agent of kps gill is true. They use their connections with these murderers to do kabza on land and GWs in exchange for supporting them.

So what? Even today idiots still say thet Sant Jarnail Singh was a congress agent. Why not beleive that as well?

What kabzas has he done?

Dhum admitted to supporting the murder of Bhai Bhupinder Singh.

Has he? the only thing I have heard him about them is He said he would support the murderers in their criminal case.

Everyone knew about dhumas reality ages ago and some people made excuses for him and sangat kept quiet but this has crossed the line.

That's just the thing. You don't know about his reality. You know about the last 10/15 years. Tell me what you know about him from 1984 onwards and then we'll see.

Sikh Panth now wants to take back honor of Damdami Taksal and throw these dushts in jail.

Right, so now you are speaking for the whole of the Sikh Panth?

Few things get me emotional but a clear cut case like this is one of them. Chatanga bro surely you agree with what I mentioned above? There really are no two ways about it.

No, bro, I don't agree because you already have a preconceived notion about Baba Harnam Singh. I have seen this from your form on this forum from years.

Rememer your clear cut case of Baba Harnam Singh doing beadbi of bani ? There were two ways then weren't there?

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No, bro, I don't agree because you already have a preconceived notion about Baba Harnam Singh. I have seen this from your form on this forum from years.

Rememer your clear cut case of Baba Harnam Singh doing beadbi of bani ? There were two ways then weren't there?

I never made it a clear cut case, but I always knew that Dhuma is a dirty individual. I'm not AKJ and yes I was critical of him, but I don't remember the complete controversy and would you be surprised if I even agreed with Dhuma ? There are some issues regarding differences in Panthic Jathebandian that I've come to realize that don't have an end in terms of debate and I never claimed there were no two ways about that issue - my main gripe from beginning was Dhumma because I have a special place in my heart for Damdami Taksal given the previous Jathedar Sahiban of this Jathebandi and to see a government agent doing bezti of Sikh Panth hurts a lot. Also, even if I agree with the panthic issues that Dhuma has brought forward that still doesn't mean he isn't a lackey of KP Gill and Badal with a free ticket to stay in Punjab because of his government connections. Many things missionaries say about pakhandi babay say are true, but what bholay lohk don't realize is that they use something that 100% of Sikh Panth agree with and then include their venom in a package along with parchar.

Yes there is.

So what? Even today idiots still say thet Sant Jarnail Singh was a congress agent. Why not beleive that as well?

What kabzas has he done?

\\
Re: Santa Singh - no there isn't. Two wrongs do not make a right. Santa Singh betrayed khalsa panth and he got excommunicated if my memory serves correctly and he begged to be let back into panth in his old age and Guru Sahib is forever forgiving and he was forgiven. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Re: Sant Jarnail Singh Ji as a congress agent: He proved it with his Shaheedi that he was a Singh of Dhan Guru Gobind SIngh Ji. The kathavachak takhur singh patiala and all these folks with massive stomachs try to make themselves seem better by mentioning names of Shaheed Singhs like Bhai Amrik Singh Ji and goes as far as to say he got shaheed in his goudhi. After he was confronted he lied and changed his story with an even bigger lie. He came out of Harmandir Sahib with his hands up mentioning a few names. The reason I'm mentioning I'll cover in another quote.
Also there is proof that dhuma is directly involved with badal and no one will deny his connection with kp gill
Re: Kabza: He's allegedly done kabza of an ahasthaan at Anandpur Sahib (and has done kabza of Damdami Taksal), but can I also ask you what kabzas badal has done? If you say none and that there is no proof, you're being academically dishonest and completely ignoring the situation of Punjab and how things are run there. Just look at badal's acres of jameen when he started and look where he's at now and look how his thugs control the monopoly of buses. There aren't official things you can read regarding these thuggeries, but in terms of land most of us have agricultural land in Punjab and know how things are run. If someone does kabza on your jameen they pull the appropriate strings with connections and if the individual who is having his land stolen hasn't taken the appropriate steps to not allow for a loophole to be exploited by a thief - then anyone can potentially steal your jameen. Similarly there will not be clear cut proof floating online just how badal is helping dhuma cover up his murder plot against Bhai Ranjit Singh. Nihang Singhs constantly have land disputes and do kabza as well as per N30Singh and what I've heard from other Sikhs and just because the form of proof is by word of mouth and not a tangible piece of evidence it doesn't discount it from being true.

Has he? the only thing I have heard him about them is He said he would support the murderers in their criminal case.

Yes, legally, even before he opened his mouth he should have been arrested and treated as a prime suspect once they realized who owned the gaddiaan. After he opened his mouth he said these attacks against people will justly happen if someone speaks out against him. That is condoning violence and should have been dealt with instant arrest, but being the chamcha of badal it hasn't yet happened.

In the Sikh Panth's eyes in the writing of Bhai Chaupa Singh Ji Rehitname he writes:

ਜੋ ਸਿੱਖ, ਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਜਾਣ ਕੇ ਕੈਦ ਕਰਾਏ, ਲੁਟਾਏ, ਮਰਵਾਏ, ਸੋ ਦੈਂਤ ਜਾਨਣਾ।

My rough translation: Any Sikh who intentionally jails, loots or has another Sikh killed - consider them a demon. Since this is a Tankhahnama it is obvious that along with being a demon they are Thankhah. Four points: 1) Dhuma with his latest statement has said he will support anyone who speaks out against him as a person and he and other dhuma fanboys will twist it into being an attack of Dasam Granth Sahib and Damdami Taksal and they will find you and they will kill you.

2) Dhuma is supporting the murderers who did maha beadbi of Shabeel and those who kill fellow Sikhs. This is a very clear cut case that he is more interested in his thug fanboys than the interest of the Panth. There is freedom of speech and Bhai Ranjit Singh has the right to correctly expose dhuma as having very close and submissive relationship with KP Gill and Badal.

3) In a place where your connections to the butchers of Punjab (Badal and KP Gill) won't get you off the hook there is something called a legal system. In this case, if this had happened in the USA, there would have been due process. Prosecutors and detectives on this case would have without question would have begun investigating Dhuma for involvement even prior to finding the murderers and their plates because there is reasonable cause to treat Dhuma as a prime individual involved in the attack on Bhai Ranjit Singh. After the vehicles were registered and found under his name he would have been tried as a prime suspect and accessory to murder by the prosecutor even if his gang thugs covered their boss by saying he wasn't involved - BECAUSE this happened in Punjab- people who support Dhuma are able to make such claims that he isn't responsible because of his connection with badal/kp gill.

4) The above line from Tankhahnama also applies to Dhumma because he has indirectly supported the further murders (via legal assistance and by word of mouth support/condoning) of anyone who dares to speak the truth that Dhuma is a lackey of kp gill and a lapdop for badal and thus without a shadow of doubt he is thankhah.

That's just the thing. You don't know about his reality. You know about the last 10/15 years. Tell me what you know about him from 1984 onwards and then we'll see.

Let's start here, but also address rest of my points: old school Taksali Singhs say he had no role in 1984 and wasn't even remotely close to Sant Jarnail Singh Ji. From what I've seen majority of the people who follow Dhuma are very young and impressionable individuals and that old paagal banda who was shouting naaray of Khalistan and Taksal zindabad, outside of the tana where the goons of dhuma were in jail, has 0 connections to 1980s - you can tell he's the type of person who talks a lot but will run right when the going gets tough.

These individuals like takhur singh patiala make their business by making themselves seem like they were close to the Shaheed Singhs of 1984 by making up lies and making up tall-tale miracle stories to sell themselves to the public. Those who have real ridhi sidhiaan and have experienced such miracles will never talk about it because it will defeat the purpose.

Right, so now you are speaking for the whole of the Sikh Panth?

I am making a reasonable deduction that the vast majority of Panth is now against dhuma with the exception of a few of those who support dhuma. Even majority of monay from Sikh families know dhum is a sarkaari agent and they respect Sant Jarnail Singh Ji.

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Badal was responsible for 1984. He knew of Sant Jarnail Singh Khalsa Bhindranwale varge Singh houn te ehna haramzadeyan di chaudaraan ni rehniyaa. They pressured Indira Gandhi to attack Harmandir Sahib because they knew Panth would have collectively put in good leaders in Sri Akaal Takhat Sahib and all our Sikh institutions. Badal and KP gill had secret meetings and were involved in planning the slaughter of countless innocent Sikh youth wiping out generations.

There is no excuse for dhuma to bend over and dance for badal and kp gill. What an excuse some people use for the betterment of panth he's allying with badal. The reason why Dhuma is in seat of Damdami Taksal is because they know if a good Singh is there they won't be able to control him and it will be a problem for them. As long as they have a puppet they can control they laugh at Sikhs.

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I have a serious question.

Who is responsible in making him the head of DDT? Chatanga can you name them? I am sure Jasbir Singh Rode is one of them. Who else?

I use to think Baba Thakur Singh ji made him head. But every Taksali Singh I have talked to vehemently denies this.

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I use to think Baba Thakur Singh ji made him head. But every Taksali Singh I have talked to vehemently denies this.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Sikh/comments/4koxev/brief_history_on_harnam_singh_dhumma_and_damdami/

Here is full history of dhumma. Watch the video and see him using his cunning language. He had his laalchi eyes on the position from the beginning.

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If dhumma is jathedar or not is not my concern as other upsamparda such as bhai dya singh ji and bhai dharam singh ji including previous jathedar in taksal had multiple successors if we look at the lineage..so its never been issue before in the past up until only recently.

Thats beside the point, the point here it is dhumma is supporting/glorifying those violent cold blooded murderers/extremist who a) broke serious maryada of chabeel b) killed fellow innocent person , fellow sikh and injured other innocent sikhs in cold blood assassination plot which makes him just as implicit as those who carried the attacks. This is great wake up call for those who attempts to use deadly brute force violence to address non violent situations to step back and think that you are going against key gurmat sidhant- Dhaul Dharam Daya Ka Poot, you would hurt a innocent person, and you will torn whole family apart including small kids and wife, somebody son, sibling, father. husband.

What a complete savagery, what a contrast to see highest chivalry gurmat teaching enshrined directly in gurbani and comparing those teachings with practical emobiment of those teachings in so called some chela sikhs and so called jathedar of today. Unbelievable. Truth, integrity, earnesyt and embodiment of gurbani teaching is real sikhi rest is all maya and tribal- pendu non sense. This isnt urban vs penduness..this is straight Gurmat vs penduness...take your pick, one transforms you to param hans and gives you liberation and other send you back to fake anakh vicious cycle of ego and pride.

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I agree with everything you have written. But why associate this assassination attempt which has all the characteristics of an urban gang attack and urban gang rivalry with the Pends? In the Pends when people have disputes they call a panchayat of elders and the sarpanch to solve disputes and if police needs to be involved both parties agree to a razinama. This attack has nothing at all to do with how pends solve their problems. But open up any Indian views paper and see for yourself how calculated urbanites in India with careful planning take down their opponents in property disputes.

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I never made it a clear cut case,

Don't bull$hit now. You made a very clear case and I showed that you have nothing but hatred for Baba Harnam Singh in your mind. I know you haven't forgotten it.

but I always knew that Dhuma is a dirty individual. I'm not AKJ and yes I was critical of him, but I don't remember the complete controversy and would you be surprised if I even agreed with Dhuma ?

How did you ALWAYS know? You know him from a long time ago? If you don't remember the complete story why are you running round mouthing off lie you are an expert?

my main gripe from beginning was Dhumma because I have a special place in my heart for Damdami Taksal given the previous Jathedar Sahiban of this Jathebandi and to see a government agent doing bezti of Sikh Panth hurts a lot.

People said exactly the same things about Sant Jarnail Singh. How did you know "from the beginning" that Baba Harnam Singh was a govt agent ?

Re: Sant Jarnail Singh Ji as a congress agent: He proved it with his Shaheedi that he was a Singh of Dhan Guru Gobind SIngh Ji.

"Shaheedi" ?? Who says that Sant Jarnail Singh is shaheed? Doesn't Bhai Amrik Singh Ajnala and others still believe in Baba Thakur Singhs bachan that Sant Ji is alive?

Do you believe that Sant Ji is shaheed? This is what started the divide in the Taksal that you claim to be so fond of. But I'm sure you already knew that.

Also there is proof that dhuma is directly involved with badal and no one will deny his connection with kp gill

Forget people who will deny it. In the next sentence you will deny that Sant Ji is shaheed. Bring on people who will PROVE it.

Re: Kabza: He's allegedly done kabza of an ahasthaan at Anandpur Sahib

Is that it? could equally say that you allegedlystole money from the golak at your loacl gurdwara. Would that be enough grounds to see it as the truth?

Allegedly is good enough for you isn't it, whenever Baba Harnam Singh is involved. You need to move on form being a $hit stirrer.

If you say none and that there is no proof, you're being academically dishonest and completely ignoring the situation of Punjab and how things are run there.

I couldn't care less about badal. Let's talk about academic honesty though. Right now you are coming across as dishonest as one could possibly be.

Yes, legally, even before he opened his mouth he should have been arrested and treated as a prime suspect once they realized who owned the gaddiaan.

How do you know that Baba Ji wasn't questioned by police?

In the Sikh Panth's eyes in the writing of Bhai Chaupa Singh Ji Rehitname he writes:

ਜੋ ਸਿੱਖ, ਸਿੱਖ ਨੂੰ ਜਾਣ ਕੇ ਕੈਦ ਕਰਾਏ, ਲੁਟਾਏ, ਮਰਵਾਏ, ਸੋ ਦੈਂਤ ਜਾਨਣਾ।

That woiuld apply to the men who did the murder, not to Baba Harnam Singh who's involvement or authorisation upto now has not been proven.

Let's start here, but also address rest of my points: old school Taksali Singhs say he had no role in 1984 and wasn't even remotely close to Sant Jarnail Singh Ji.

Who are these old school Taksali Singhs. Have them come on camera and give a statement to such effect. Otherwise I could just respond with 10 people saw this singh559 guy steal money from the golak in the same vein.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Sikh/comments/4koxev/brief_history_on_harnam_singh_dhumma_and_damdami/

Here is full history of dhumma. Watch the video and see him using his cunning language. He had his laalchi eyes on the position from the beginning.

That is just some stupid stuff which only a cretin would recommend fr further reading. You need to stop thi $hit stirring as it will leave you as a non-sikh as per the rehatnama you are so fond of quoting.

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I have a serious question.

Who is responsible in making him the head of DDT? Chatanga can you name them? I am sure Jasbir Singh Rode is one of them. Who else?

Finally something serious after the turds by 559.

AFAIK the students chose the next head. Baba Harnam Singh was chosen and accepted by majority of students of the Taksal inc Bhai Jasvir Singh. But I don't know if there was any sort of heirarchy involved in choosing the next head.

I use to think Baba Thakur Singh ji made him head. But every Taksali Singh I have talked to vehemently denies this.

Baba Thakur Singh refused to elect the next head, as they beleived that Sant Jarnail Singh was alive and would come back to taking his position again. So Baba Ji refused to elect anyone. After Baba Ji, passed away the students between them AFAIK chose Baba Harnam Singh.

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