Some Home Truths

[Guest Jagsaw_Singh]

Re; the 'Sikh Gori Argues with Punjabi Bibian' thread on the main page:

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i saw this video the other day, 1st thing thatcame into my mind was....oh gawd not another eco-warrior!

Our 7th master, Sri Guru Har Rai ji was the world's foremost eco-warrior. We would do well to remember what he taught us and the whole world about the relationship between man, animals and nature.

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And when the police come, they're going to ask:

Police - "what's the problem?". 

Loud lady - "arrest them all, they're using Fairy Liquid"

Police - " ??, what do you think we are, the Ecover Squad or wat? " 

 

From the video, it looks as though it is the 'Punjabi bibian' threatening to involve the police regarding the issue of 'fairy liquid'. Not the Singhni.

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She clearly doesn't seem all there. And if she is, what is there to learn from the video? Zilch. Why circulate such a video?

3 points: Yes, she could have handled her point alot better, without making herself look emotionally and mentally out of control. Her point however, is a valid one, i.e. when a supermarket own label washing up liquid is not tested on animals why do we take to our Guru's abode a washing up liquid that is tested on animals. In other words, she is forcing us to think about what we do. She is forcing us to think about whether or not it is ethically correct for us to wash dishes in the langar hall - dishes that the sangat will eat langar from - with a product that many innocent animals will be killed for. Her point (which she makes very badly) is actually a VERY VERY valid one, i.e we are actually sullying our Guru and langar by doing things without thinking, even though we belong to the faith that broke free from mindless ritualness and embraced free thought and critical thinking.

 

 

Re; the 'Scary Demographics Change in Punjab' thread on the main page :

Every thing you guys have said on that thread...turn it around and imagine it was a white Englishman or a white Canadian saying it. They'd be saying it about YOU and YOUR FAMILY and they would be racist, ignorant and frightened of the future people for saying it.

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Sikhs fell from 61% share of punjab demography in 2001 to 57% in 2011 survey.

If the trend continues, the day is not far when sikhs will become a minority in their own state and hindutva brigade will have a field day

 

In a united Punjab we were just 14% of the population and during our glory days of the Khalsa Raj we were just 5 to 8% of the Population of the Punjab Kingdom.  Another stat: In a united Punjab we were just 20% of the population of our most holiest city: Amritsar. It is easy to be negative. But a Sikh should always look on the positive.

 

Clarification of something I said in my previous post before this one. As the Greek influence on Punjab and Punjabi occurred around 300BC we are of course talking about Classical Greek rather than Modern Greek. Therefore, when I say that Punjabi and Greek share the same word for the word girl (Kuri) I am of course talking about the Greek language that existed at that time. Since that time, the word Kuri has taken a slight variation in modern Greek  but of course none of that detracts from the facts that parcharaks that attempt to justify gender discrimination by equating the word kuri to dirt and falsehood are plain and simple wrong and lying.

[Ranjeet01]

On 04/02/2017 at 3:13 PM, Guest Jagsaw_Singh said:

This was a great thread. A really great thread.

I'm bringing it back up again because I recently listened to a few speeches of the great Sant Jarnail Singh Bhindranwale and other parcharaks from the Damdami Taksal. When questioned about their ban on Sikh females doing kirtan, wearing dastars etc I notice that they use the word 'kuri' in order to justify their stance on females. In their speeches, writings and websites etc they say the punjabi word for girl 'kuri' comes from the definition of koor, which means jhoot (falsehood) and dirt.

I'm not singling out Damdami Taksal here because on so many occassions I am equally as critical about parcharaks affiliated to AKJ, especially here in the UK, who rely on the ignorance and uneducated nature of the sangat to say and espouse things that have absolutely no basis in historical fact. I am hoping my contributions to the 'Punjabi Language' thread (above) will be enough for many of you to be able to respect the knowledge I have about the history of the Punjabi language so I wish to articulate this fact:

After Alexander the Great's men decided they wanted to go no further than Punjab and setlled there, Punjab went through a phase lasting 300 years whereby the Greeks ruled the Punjab and the Greek language made inroads not only into the psyche of political and critical thinking of Punjabis but also in terms of everyday speech. It is no coincidence then that while every nation and language on all sides of Punjab have a word for 'girl', such as ladki etc, that has its roots in the sub-continent, Punjabi is the only language that has a word for girl (kuri) that has its roots firmly thousands of miles away in Greece. The punjabi word for girl is exactly the same as the Greek word for girl : Kuri.  People, groups and parcharaks that want to justify their low opinion of females will always find a way of justifying it. As a rule, they rely on your ignorance and un-educated nature in order to get away with it.

How many Greeks/Macedonians did settle in Punjab.

They had their a*** handed to them in Multan and a lot of the Greek/Macedonians wanted go back.

We hear a lot of contradictory stuff that does not make sense.

On one hand we hear that he defeated Porus and Porus went on all fours whilst Alexander used him as a footstool.

In other accounts, apparently Porus defeated Alexander.

Then we hear that Alexander was warned not to venture further east because of even bigger kingdoms and armies in the Gangetic plains.

Punjab always seems to be Greek or Persian or Arab or Turkish or some other culture. Have we anything original about ourselves. Do we even influence anyone else? 

Are there are any Punjabi words that originate in Punjab that have made their way into Persian or Arabic or Greek?

[dallysingh101]

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Punjab always seems to be Greek or Persian or Arab or Turkish or some other culture. Have we anything original about ourselves. Do we even influence anyone else? 

Best thing said on this forum in a long while. 

I tell you, some of us Sikh Panjabis are a bunch of insecure w**kers, who've internalised such a low opinion of themselves in relation to certain other communities, that they have wet dreams of these foreigners' blood flowing in their veins. 

What clowns. 

[MisterrSingh]

I want to respond to a post in a thread on the main site, but the buggy formatting rules prevent me from doing so. The post in question mentions a giani / kathavacak saying, I'm assuming, on stage that the Christian faith only has one martyr. It's the equivalent of stating that the only martyrs in the Sikh faith are the two Guru Sahibs who gave shaheedi, conveniently ignoring the thousands of others we venerate daily during the Ardaas. Anyone who's briefly flicked through a book on Christianity will know that's patently false. There's hordes of Christian martyrs throughout their history. It's that kind of misinformation that will create doubts in the mind of any Sikh who has even an iota of knowledge of history and critical thinking. The average aunty and uncle might believe that to be true, but anyone else will come away thinking, "If giani is wrong about something like that, what else does he not know?" You can't sit on a stage, get caught up in the moment, and add your own masale to make any such arguments ring true. Soon enough people will start calling that stuff out, or even worse, will just walk away thinking the sangat is being lied to. 

[Guest Jagsaw_Singh]

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How many Greeks/Macedonians did settle in Punjab.

After Alexander left, Eudemus ruled vast tracts of Punjab north of the Beas (everything that includes Amritsar and Lahore today) and after him Peithon (another Greek general) ruled Punjab until 316bc. Another Greek, Sophytes, also established another independent nation within Punjab and crowned himself the Prince of
 

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They had their a*** handed to them in Multan and a lot of the Greek/Macedonians wanted go back.

 

No. You need to brush up on your motherland's history. Alexander got his a*s kicked in Multan after his men abandoned him on the banks of the Beas, halfway between Jalandhar and Amritsar, and Alexander was on his way home (through Multan).

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Punjab always seems to be Greek or Persian or Arab or Turkish or some other culture. Have we anything original about ourselves. Do we even influence anyone else?

 

We have influenced EVERYBODY around us in the sub-continent. Punjabi is the mother of Hindi, Urdu and a plethora of their north Indian languages. Contrary to what some believe it is actually Punjabi that came before Sanskrit. Not the other way around. For Prakit.....the ancient 'language of the rural folk' as prescribed in the Rig Vedas in reference to the area we know as Punjab, is none other than Punjabi, and that came before Sanskrit.

Hope that clears up any queries you had Ranjeet. Don't be afraid to ask if you have any other questions.

[Guest Jacfsing2]

1 hour ago, dallysingh101 said:

that they have wet dreams of these foreigners' blood flowing in their veins.

What's wrong with knowing where our ancestors came from? Unless we were Adivasi our ancestors probably came somewhere else than the Indian subcontinent. As long as it doesn't actually lead to discrimination; then it's all good to know where our ancestors came from.

[Ranjeet01]

28 minutes ago, Jacfsing2 said:

What's wrong with knowing where our ancestors came from? Unless we were Adivasi our ancestors probably came somewhere else than the Indian subcontinent. As long as it doesn't actually lead to discrimination; then it's all good to know where our ancestors came from.

Punjab was ruled by the British Raj for almost a century. I am certain that there are English words that are in the Punjabi vocabulary.

I am sure we have British ancestry. 

[MisterrSingh]

The Hebrew word for 'paradise' (relating to the Bible's Garden of Eden) is a word familiar to Punjabis: pardes. Of course, it went through many forms such as Greek, Old Iranian, and Assyrian. It's a word I've heard mentioned most of my life (in various songs or conversations), so to learn that its modern Punjabi usage has connotations relating to a timeless, heavenly place, is quite amusing.

[Guest Jacfsing2]

1 hour ago, Ranjeet01 said:

Punjab was ruled by the British Raj for almost a century. I am certain that there are English words that are in the Punjabi vocabulary.

I am sure we have British ancestry. 

You seem to be forgetting the fact that, "Satguru Nanak Pargateya", so all the post 1469 Punjab conquerors won't likely be in Punjabi genes. The Sikh religion also gave the Punjabis the will to stand-up to outside oppression. Also I never mentioned literature or grammer as a form of genetic similarity. Who stood-up to the Mughals since the reign of Babur? Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji! (Everything before 1469 still stands, and Punjabis are probably a mix og every conqueror pre-1469.

 

[jkvlondon]

1 hour ago, Jacfsing2 said:

You seem to be forgetting the fact that, "Satguru Nanak Pargateya", so all the post 1469 Punjab conquerors won't likely be in Punjabi genes. The Sikh religion also gave the Punjabis the will to stand-up to outside oppression. Also I never mentioned literature or grammer as a form of genetic similarity. Who stood-up to the Mughals since the reign of Babur? Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji! (Everything before 1469 still stands, and Punjabis are probably a mix og every conqueror pre-1469.

 

I reckon we influenced their cuisine and there is quite a lot of similarity in between the two cultures attitudes to family honour and loyalty, extended family, sense of humour.

Maybe it's me but after Alexander died there seemed to be cooling of the whole bro-mance scene ...could this be conservative hetero attitude from Punjab?