Jump to content

Singhnis with Dastaar look ugly?


Guest kaurrrrr
 Share

Recommended Posts

5 hours ago, Mahakaal96 said:

I asked for historical sources that predate 1900 that give evidence of women taking amrit... not emotional blackmail pappu parchar. Even if what your saying is right then that would mean that in 1699 the Panj Pyare would only have been allowed to take amrit WITH their wives & when Mahraj themselves took amrit they would only have been allowed to do so WITH Mata Sundri Ji, Mata Jeeto Ji & Mata Sahib Deva Ji! There's eye witness written accounts of what happened that day... of how mahraj asked for 5 heads.. beheaded 5 heads then bought back to life then bowed down & took amrit from panj pyare themselves... no where does it mention women or that the men could only take amrit with their wife. 

If women took amrit & became 'kaurs' then why are all handwritten hukamname of Mata Sahib Deva signed Mata Sahib Devi & not kaur??

Naamdharis have written sources that say they were the first to give women amrit & did so around 1850 onwards.

 

bro you still didn't respond to itihass of Guru Gobind SIngh ji giving amrit to Mai Bhago ji after she was wandering around in enlightened state beparwah of bodily state... was this true or not ...did she become his Bodyguard (for that she would definitely have to be amritdhari and rehitvaan gursikh) 

Bhat vahis mentioned amritdhari women by name 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, Guest Maya said:

SSA,

Yes most men find dastaar wearing singhni's its not cos of the dastaar its more to do with the kesh. Its extremism because Guru's didnt say women should wear dastaar or not cut kesh. Dashmesh pitta created kaur for Sikh women to be princesses to beautify themselves and not created singhni's (lionesses). Singhni's are a new innovation created by the singh sabha movement in 18th-19th century to separate their women from hindus and muslims. Guru ji knew women and men are different in nature with different bodys for a different purpose. Men are naturally attracted to hairless beautiful women and women are attracted to masculine hairy chest hunter gather brave confident men.

The false narrative of equality was given by liberal cuck Sikhs by the british to create weak sikhs and singh sabha movement to stop their women being attractive to non-khalsa men.

There are 3 type of women who become sikh women who tend to be daastar wearers

1) Those who believe in brainwashed false concept of equality and are feminists

2) Those who are weak minded and bullied into wearing it and keeping kesh by peers, family,etc

3) Liberal types who wear dastaar but may continue to cut their hair, wear makeup, have tattoo's and partake in anti-sikh lifestyle and activities.

In the end you should always go back to the Guru and what did Sikh women at the time wear. Did they wear dastaar or did they wear modest clothes and chuni? You will find most wore chuni's

 

 

 

you are aptly named because your theories deeply steeped in it.

ALL sikhs have to keep their kesh this is rehit from Guru Nanak Dev ji's time which mayadhari log forget conveniently.

you categorise women like they are objects , they are human beings and they have just as much love and desire to look like their father as guys so don't diminish them this way . 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Akalifauj said:

Hazoor Sahib as Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji left it is very different than how it is today.  Many false practices are taking place at Hazoor Sahib today.  Not to mention it's run by a RSS leader/member currently by the name of Amrik Singh Varsikar. 

Buddha Dal claim their lineage goes back to the Sixth Guru and is named after Baba Budha ji.  Amrit was first introduced by Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji as Charan Pahul.  Bhai Gurdas ji has wrote this history in his vaaran (vaar 1, pauri 23).  Bhai Gurdas ji writes Sikhs were given Charan Pahul by the Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji.  There was no stipulation on which gender can take Charan Pahul or who can't, clearly stated Sikhs.  Sixth Guru kept up the lineage of Charan Pahul as Amrit from the Punj Pyare started much later in 1699.  Since Buddha Dal wants to claim their lineage all the way back to the first war fought by Sikhs (which were at the time of Sixth Guru), this would mean Buddha Dal followed Charan Pahul from the Guru given to Sikhs, which includes males and females.  So the question for you to answer now is, what changed from Charan Pahul to Punj Pyare where women were never given Khande Di Pahul?  This is your claim, women were never given amrit from the Punj Pyare, so substantiate it and tells us what changed.  Provide references to where you find the answers and links, so you can be given a good lesson.  Little kids shouldn`t play with fire...

Well when you define Sikhi including manmat practices, then its very easily for the locals to follow that fake version of Sikhi.  It's like the other deras who allow their followers to drink and smoke.  All they have to do is make a false claim they are apart of the dera and like magic the dera followers are much stronger in their beliefs.  Kesh and shastar only help when the shackles of manmat practices are lifted off the head.  These poor people are enslaved by hindu rituals in the disguise of a Sikh identity. 

So what, they worship the very devta and devis Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji tells them not to worship in Sri Dasam Granth Sahib ji. 

 

Very confusing sentences, but I believe you are saying, the Hazoor Sahib leaders had no problem with mahants bringing murtis in Gurdwaras.  If so, then you don`t have the basic understanding of Gurbani from Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji or Sri Dasam Granth Sahib ji.  Sri Guru Nanak Dev ji called the murti worshipper a murakh (completely blind) and Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji says, he break murtis.  The first and 10 Guru have made it crystal clear on not to allow murtis in Gurdwaras, which will basically turn into murti worship.  Mahant were bringing in murtis of devta and devis who were never to be worshipped.  So take your head out of the murti and maybe start reading Gurbani.  

If you are going to believe the claim of Naamdharis, then you also must believe Baba Ram Singh ji said he was the Guru of the Sikhs.  Here I will give you a better example of your illogical reasoning.  I was the first one to claim this poster, Mahakaal is a pandit terrorist who believes in cow worship.  I claimed it, now it must be true.  So mahakaal how does it feels to drink the urine of cows as you worship them.

 

1 hour ago, Akalifauj said:

In your previous post you say amrit from Punj Pyare was not given to women.  You believe this to be true.  The other side claims kaur was given to women who took amrit.  Since you think women were never given Amrit before naamdhari started around 1850, you can`t say Mata Sahib Kaur ji never took amrit because her handwritten hukamname never put kaur in her name.  How could she place Kaur in her name when you don`t even believe the initial event of taking Amrit by a women never happened, which would have allowed her to place kaur in her name.  Once you use the primary claim of no women was given amrit.  The secondary reason (hand written hukamname never had kaur in them) is nulled and can`t be a support for the primary reason.  

Guess what.......I`m just getting started with you.  This will be a good brain refreshing exercise.       

Don't know if you've ever been to Hazur Sahib or not but I'm sure most would agree that if they were following manmat practices then there's no way that place would have so much shakti & kirpa there.

You seem to lack understanding of evidence collecting & in general don't seem capable of having an intellectual adult conversation but never the less...

In my first post I wrote 'according' to maryada of Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal women were not given khanda da amrit (they are given kirpan amrit at Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal) in 1699. In support of this stance both Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal claim that there is no evidence from 1699 that suggests women took Khanda da amrit. To further support this they say that handwritten hukamname of Mata Sahib Deva shows that Mata signed them as Mata Sahib Devi... but why would she do this if she had taken amrit & become a 'Kaur' as is popular practice at other takhts. There's apparently also hukamname by Mata Sundri Ji where Kaur has not been used but I don't know if that is true or not as I haven't seen them myself. Separate to these but of interest is the fact that around 1850s the naamdharis make written claims that they are the first ones to give women Khanda Da amrit... if women were already being given khanda da amrit why would they make such a claim that would be easily blown out the water? If men can only take amrit with their wives then what are the names of the wives of the panj pyare who would have also taken amrit? Why do eyewitness accounts from that actual day in 1699 not mention women at all apart from Mata adding patasee into the amrit. Accounts from 1699 unanimously state mahraj asked for 5 heads.... not 5 couples heads.

also you misunderstood the murti comment. Before formation of SGPC mahants had installed murtis of Devi Devte into the parkarma at Harimandir Sahib... in the Punjab, yet in Hazur Sahib where they are supposedly meant to be Hindu worshippers this never happened. Point being, not just based on the murti incident but a general feeling seems to be that Hazur Sahib sikhs seem more dedicated & committed to following a maryada & rehit that they claim has been unchanged since time of 10ve patshah. We can't just sideline Hazur Sahib & dismiss it as manmat... it's 1 of the 5 takhts so all their claims & practices need to be examined & looked at seriously in an intellectual adult way. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Koi said:

So, how does a woman have a Guru if she does not take amrit? 

patta nahin maybe someone will pipe up and say the Brahmin thing that she has to serve her pati parmeshwar to earn the right to be reborn as a Singh ... I've heard similar before .

For those doubting use of Kaur for singhnees other than royals remember this :

Bibi Harsharan Kaur: The Final Shaheed of the Battle of Chamkaur In the battle of Chamkaur, Guru Gobind Singh jee and 40 starving Singhs battle the Mughal army. The battle which took place in Chamkaur's mud fort lasted 72 hours and saw the loss of many Mughal soldiers and also 36 of Guru Gobind Singh jee's companions along with the two Sahibzadas. Fighting an army of hundreds of thousands, Guru Gobind Singh jee gave an exhibition of his battle skills. Guru jee, following the orders of the Panth Khalsa (in the form of the Punj Pyaaray) left the fort along with Bhai Daya Singh, Bhai Maan Singh and one other Singh, after giving his clothes to Bhai Sangat Singh jee to wear. Only Bhai Sangat Singh and Bhai Sant Singh fought the battle to its end. They too were martyred. Seeing Guru jee's clothes on Bhai Sangat Singh, the Mughals were ecstatic and taking him to be Guru Gobind Singh, cut off his head and took it to Delhi. In every village it was announced that Guru Gobind Singh had been killed, "Look here at his chopped off head! His family is also finished. His two sons were killed in the battle and the two younger ones will also die abandoned. The revolution has been crushed. No one should go to the Chamkaur Fort. No one should cremate the dead Singhs." A tight cordon was put around the Fort. As the soldiers were going from village to village making their announcement, the people were retreating in terror into their homes. However, in village Khroond, a daughter of Guru Gobind Singh, Bibi Harsharan Kaur, asked for her mother's permission to peform the final rites for the Shaheeds. Her old mother replied, "it is total darkness outside and soldiers are everywhere around the fort, how will you even go near?" Hearing this, Kalgeedhar's lioness daughter replied with resolve "I will avoid the soldiers and perform the cremation, and if need be, I'll fight and die." The mother gave her courage and hugged her daughter and then explained the maryada to follow for the cremation. After performing Ardaas, Bibi Harsharan Kaur left for the Chamkaur Fort. The battlefield which saw iron smashing against iron, the bellows of elephants, the trotting of hooves and calls of "Kill! Capture!", was now totally silent and enveloped in complete darkness. In such a situation, the 16 year old girl Bibi Harsharan Kaur avoided the guards and arrived at the Fort. She saw that bodies were lying everywhere and distinguishing between Sikh and Mughal was very difficult. She still had faith and began to find arms with kaRas and torsos with kachheras and heads with long kesh. As she found a body, she would wipe the face of every shaheed. Both Sahibzadas and about 30 The stories of one's ancestors make the children good children. They accept what is pleasing to the Will of the True Guru, and act accordingly. ( Guru Granth Sahib Ji - 951) www.tuhitu.blogspot.com 16 of 154 shaheeds were found and then she began to collect wood. Fearing the approaching light of dawn, Bibi Harsharan Kaur worked very quickly and soon prepared a pyre. She then lit the fire. Seeing the rising flames, the guards were shocked and advanced towards the pyre. Bibi Harsharan Kaur was seen in the light of the flames sitting beside the pyre. She was quietly reciting Keertan Sohilaa. The guards were shocked and confused as to how a lone woman could come into the fort on such a dark night. The guards asked in a loud voice, "Who are you?!" Bibi jee: I am the daughter of Guru Gobind Singh Officer: What are you doing here? Bibi Jee: I am cremating my martyred brothers. Officer: Don't you know about the order that coming here is a crime? Bibi Jee: I know it. Officer: Then why have you disobeyed that order? Bibi Jee: The orders of a false king do not stand before the orders of the Sachay Patshah (True King) Officer: Meaning? Bibi Jee: Meaning that I have respect for the Singhs in my heart and with the Guru's grace I have done my duty. I don't care about your King's orders. Hearing such stern answers from Bibi Harsharan Kaur, the infuriated Mughal soldiers attempted to capture her and attacked. Bibi jee grabbed her kirpaan and fought back with determination. After killing and maiming many soldiers, Bibi Harsharan Kaur was injured and fell to the ground. The soldiers picked Bibi Harsharan Kaur up and threw her into the pyre, burning her alive. The next day the cordon around the Fort was lifted because it was clear that the Sahibzadas and most of the Shaheed Singhs had been cremated. The ancestors of the Phulkiaan family, Rama and Triloka, then cremated whichever Singhs remained. The story of Bibi Harsharan Kaur reached Guru Gobind Singh jee Mahaaraaj in Talvandee Sabo (Damdama Sahib). Upon hearing of her daughter's martyrdom, the old mother thanked Akaal Purakh. She said, "my daughter has proven herself worthy." The story of the cremation of the Chamkaur Shaheeds will forever serve as a glowing star of inspiration for all Singhs and Singhnees.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

extract from DDT amrit sanskar maryada about suitability of Panj :

The Panj Pyare and the Granthi Singh are to all wear the same colour clothes and these should be from the following colours, saffron, blue or white. Their Kirpans are to be worn over their clothes, a Kamar-Kasa (waistband) is to be tied and a parna (scarf like cloth) is to be placed around their neck before entering the Darbar.  Their Gatra’s are not to be of leather.  The Pehradaar is to be a highly disciplined Sikh.  The five Singh’s are to humbly bow to Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee and stand up, the sixth Singh is to do the same and stand holding his hands together.  The Jathedar is to hold a large Sri Sahib in his right hand and do the Chaur Sahib Seva with his left. He is to question the sixth Singh – "Are you a highly disciplined Sikh? Do you keep the discipline of the 5 Kakkaars? Have you committed any of the four cardinal sins?  Do you recite the specified daily Nitnem prayers? If the Singh is married, he is to be asked if his spouse is living in accordance with the Rehat Maryada. The Singh is to face the Sri Guru Granth Sahib Jee and reply humbly that with the Guru Jee’s blessing I am living according to the Rehat Maryada. I have not committed any cardinal sin and do recite the daily Nitnem prayers. I am physically complete, fit and healthy. He should say that he is forever erroneous due to the entrapments of the mind (showing his humility).  If he is married, then he should say that his wife is also a highly disciplined Sikh and lives by the Rehat Maryada. The Jathedar is to question all the six Singh’s individually, moving from his right to his left. After the questioning is over – if all are suitable, one Singh becomes the Granthi Singh and the rest join the Jathedar in becoming Panj Pyare.

 

if a bibi has no true amrit i.e. just gurti/kirpan da amrit then she is being held at lower rehit so then that would create problems for SInghs too because they cannot truthfully say she is amritdhari because the amrit should would have been subjected to only has the two first banian and six pauri of anand sahib maximum . It is clear from discussions that amrit can only be made by the panj which doesn't happen with kirpan-di -amrit that is just one singh , also gurti/kirpan-di-amrit is not considered sufficient for a child to be fully initiated into the panth so how can a woman be by this method ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, Guest Gupt said:

Jasbir Kaur Villaschi,

Give it a rest.

Are you sure you are an Amritdhari Sikh? You certainly do not act nor speak like one. If you are, please consider visiting the Panj Pyare and asking for Pesh. Making violent threats and using potty-mouth language is not Gurmat. Samjh?

Also, I doubt your husband would do that as violence seeing as he is a Brazilian who knows very, very little about Sikhi itihaas.

You are not fooling anyone here.

Ok you may be just making new names for yourself and presenting silly things and personal attacks because your logic is awry ..Waheguru knows  I frankly do not care what you believe because it's arguments presented like yours and this :

Its extremism because Guru's didnt say women should wear dastaar or not cut kesh. Dashmesh pitta created kaur for Sikh women to be princesses to beautify themselves and not created singhni's (lionesses) "

which makes me sad for the panth  because it is foolishness such as this that drags people down . Why are you so blind that you cannot see strong rehitvaan females will bring up and encourage strong rehitvaan kids or maybe like Jathedar Gurmukh SIngh Musafir you want put back sikhi's progress too and want chanchal mat dollies who don't look after anything but preen themselves to make themselves objects for you to ogle.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Mahakaal96 said:

 

Don't know if you've ever been to Hazur Sahib or not but I'm sure most would agree that if they were following manmat practices then there's no way that place would have so much shakti & kirpa there.

The kirpa and Shakti at Hazur Sahib is because of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji Maharaj and current Guru Dhan Dhan Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.  If a place having so much Shakti and kirpa is your reason to say the place is not corrupt then how come in a previous post you say the following:

Quote

Sikhi in the area of Hazoor Sahib is much stronger then the whole of Punjab (man made maryada land).

When we know people who were blind have received the blessing of sight at Sri Harmandir Sahib.  So this mean the SGPC thieves and Badal using Sri Harmandir Sahib golak as his personal bank account and the fact SGPC maryada is wrong never takes place because there is so much Shakti and kirpa there.  Clearly logic and linking claim to reason was never taught to you.   

You're clown college teachings don't stand a chance to Gurmat.  I had a whole post written up but it got deleted by mistake.  Currently I don't have time to write it back up.  Don't go anywhere, there is a lot more to come.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Akalifauj said:

The kirpa and Shakti at Hazur Sahib is because of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Sahib ji Maharaj and current Guru Dhan Dhan Satguru Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.  If a place having so much Shakti and kirpa is your reason to say the place is not corrupt then how come in a previous post you say the following:

When we know people who were blind have received the blessing of sight at Sri Harmandir Sahib.  So this mean the SGPC thieves and Badal using Sri Harmandir Sahib golak as his personal bank account and the fact SGPC maryada is wrong never takes place because there is so much Shakti and kirpa there.  Clearly logic and linking claim to reason was never taught to you.   

You're clown college teachings don't stand a chance to Gurmat.  I had a whole post written up but it got deleted by mistake.  Currently I don't have time to write it back up.  Don't go anywhere, there is a lot more to come.

seems like you have selective vision that alters what is actually written so that it can be changed to fit a narrative that suits you... My post said '

  Quote

Sikhi in the area of Hazoor Sahib is much stronger then the whole of Punjab (man made maryada land). Obviously there is kirpa & shakti at Harimandir Sahib but can it be said that Panjab as a whole is flourishing when it come to sikhi? I think we all know the answer to that. Anyone who has even spent a few days in Nanded can see how dedicated to Guru & Sikhi people are there.... it's a world apart from Panjab.

you can come out with whatever you want... there's a reason why Hazur Sahib & Buddha Dal only give kirpan amrit to women, there's a reason Mata signed her handwritten hukamname using Sahib Devi & not Kaur, there's a reason why naamdharis claim they were the first to give women Khanda da amrit, theres a reason why eyewitness accounts from 1699, some even written by our enemies & there's no mention of women, there's a reason why there's apparently no written evidential source pre 1900 that proves women were given Khanda da amrit... you can conjur up whatever phantom narratives, emotional blackmail stories you want but please try & disprove the above points IF you can. Do that & I'll be a happy man... I'm looking for answers myself 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Hide and sikh
On 12/03/2017 at 1:51 PM, jkvlondon said:

I will not tolerate beadbhi of our mahaan gursikhs  so you can choose to call me hot headed I don't care  but that was your warning the three times is coming close ...

And as for my husband he would have handed you your teeth by now for being disrespectful to Mahaan Gursikh Bibian of our panth. 

oh so now we know civil in BJ's vocab means meek and will not speak even when something bad is happening. Sure you aren't a closet pandit?

Yeah, but isnt your husband brazilian? What does he know about sikhi? And unless he is also amridhari convert, arent a lot of your extremist posts hypocritical e.g. did you have anand karaj? just sayin'

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share


  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt
  • advertisement_alt


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • yeh it's true, we shouldn't be lazy and need to learn jhatka shikaar. It doesn't help some of grew up in surrounding areas like Slough and Southall where everyone thought it was super bad for amrit dharis to eat meat, and they were following Sant babas and jathas, and instead the Singhs should have been normalising jhatka just like the recent world war soldiers did. We are trying to rectifiy this and khalsa should learn jhatka.  But I am just writing about bhog for those that are still learning rehit. As I explained, there are all these negative influences in the panth that talk against rehit, but this shouldn't deter us from taking khanda pahul, no matter what level of rehit we are!
    • How is it going to help? The link is of a Sikh hunter. Fine, but what good does that do the lazy Sikh who ate khulla maas in a restaurant? By the way, for the OP, yes, it's against rehit to eat khulla maas.
    • Yeah, Sikhs should do bhog of food they eat. But the point of bhog is to only do bhog of food which is fit to be presented to Maharaj. It's not maryada to do bhog of khulla maas and pretend it's OK to eat. It's not. Come on, bro, you should know better than to bring this Sakhi into it. Is this Sikh in the restaurant accompanied by Guru Gobind Singh ji? Is he fighting a dharam yudh? Or is he merely filling his belly with the nearest restaurant?  Please don't make a mockery of our puratan Singhs' sacrifices by comparing them to lazy Sikhs who eat khulla maas.
    • Seriously?? The Dhadi is trying to be cute. For those who didn't get it, he said: "Some say Maharaj killed bakras (goats). Some say he cut the heads of the Panj Piyaras. The truth is that they weren't goats. It was she-goats (ਬਕਰੀਆਂ). He jhatka'd she-goats. Not he-goats." Wow. This is possibly the stupidest thing I've ever heard in relation to Sikhi.
    • Instead of a 9 inch or larger kirpan, take a smaller kirpan and put it (without gatra) inside your smaller turban and tie the turban tightly. This keeps a kirpan on your person without interfering with the massage or alarming the masseuse. I'm not talking about a trinket but rather an actual small kirpan that fits in a sheath (you'll have to search to find one). As for ahem, "problems", you could get a male masseuse. I don't know where you are, but in most places there are professional masseuses who actually know what they are doing and can really relieve your muscle pains.
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use