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genie

The real reason why Hindustani's celebrate Bhagat Singh

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I used to think Shaheed bhagat singh came from a Sikh family and he was influenced by Sikhism at young age but then later came under wrong socialist communist Marxist influences which made him turn atheistic.

But it turns out from what I read recently his family was actually hindu punjabi arya samajists and arya samajists were deeply opposed to Sikh rights marches and movements back before partition.

This is why I believe he is celebrated more of a hero by indian/hindustani nationalists.than shaheed udham singh and other Indian independence Sikh revolutionaries. Perhaps its time we totally got shot of bhagat singh and look at him in a different light as he contributed nothing for Sikhs or Sikh nationalism.

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His contribution was a united Indian voice to the British to stop their unjust ways of dealing with Indians which were the shootings of innocent citizens gathered at jileya wala bhag. His voice was also that of demanding independence. If he had not done what he had done, then maybe more such massacres would have taken place. he put the law breakers into their place. His contribution was never meant to be supportive of any religion. Maybe just the word Singh added after his name seems misleading in the first instance. Thank God that he was an atheist or else then the community gets the labelling of his fighting back behaviour. Perhaps this was also one of the incidents used to label the sikhs as fierce. 

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5 hours ago, genie said:

I used to think Shaheed bhagat singh came from a Sikh family and he was influenced by Sikhism at young age but then later came under wrong socialist communist Marxist influences which made him turn atheistic.

But it turns out from what I read recently his family was actually hindu punjabi arya samajists and arya samajists were deeply opposed to Sikh rights marches and movements back before partition.

This is why I believe he is celebrated more of a hero by indian/hindustani nationalists.than shaheed udham singh and other Indian independence Sikh revolutionaries. Perhaps its time we totally got shot of bhagat singh and look at him in a different light as he contributed nothing for Sikhs or Sikh nationalism.

Yes, I agree

 

Also, in those days, the division between being a Hindu and Sikh wasn't recognized very much by lots of nominal Sikhs.  They still partook in Hindu practices, etc.  Bhagat Singh's family was nominally Sikh, but they were in reality more into Arya Samaj practices.  Therefore it is not surprising that (to my knowledge) all of Bhagat Singh's brothers became clean shaven.  It was highly unusual for Sikhs born in the early 20th century to be monay.  Also, one of Bhagat Singh's brothers, Kulbir Singh, was an MLA for the Hindu nationalist Jan Sangh party.  So we can see that his family's connection to Sikhi was not very strong.

 

You nailed why Hindustanis celebrate Bhagat Singh, but I will add one reason why "modern" Sikhs celebrate him: became he was a mona.  Monay have inferiority complexes and are happy to have their own "shaheed", and to have someone who they can point to in order to justify why killing their kesh does not matter.

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he may have come from arya samajist (remember that only existed from the second decade of the 2oth century) but he made his peace and accepted his sikhi saroop before death.

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23 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

he may have come from arya samajist (remember that only existed from the second decade of the 2oth century) but he made his peace and accepted his sikhi saroop before death.

 

Where are you getting this information?  The historical record states otherwise.  He died an atheist mona.

Edited by californiasardar1

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21 minutes ago, californiasardar1 said:

 

Where are you getting this information?  The historical record states otherwise.  He died an atheist mona.

he didn't say to Bhai Randhir Singh he believed in God but by the end of the conversation he accepted that there was something more to life , that he had a soul and there was  an afterlife ... The eyewitness confirms that he had grown his moustache, beard and hair before death , the last picture was taken during the time of the conversation . It suits the hindus to make out he didn't change his position or look, because who else would they hold up as a hero of the struggle ?

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3 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

he didn't say to Bhai Randhir Singh he believed in God but by the end of the conversation he accepted that there was something more to life , that he had a soul and there was  an afterlife ... The eyewitness confirms that he had grown his moustache, beard and hair before death , the last picture was taken during the time of the conversation . It suits the hindus to make out he didn't change his position or look, because who else would they hold up as a hero of the struggle ?

 

The photo of Bhagat Singh sitting in prison with his dhari and kesh intact is from an arrest in 1927, not the days before his execution.

 

I agree that it is in the interest of Hindustanis to minimize the efforts of Sikhs, and propping up an atheist/arya samaji mona like Bhagat Singh as the only kind of acceptable "sikh" freedom fighter is part of that.  However, I disagree that they do not have icons of their own to hold up as heros of the struggle (see Rajguru, Sukhdev, Lala Lajpat Rai, for instance). 

What the Hindus did was not transform a devout Sikh hero to a secular or Hindu one to make up for the lack of a hero of their own.  But what they did do was, out of thousands of freedom fighters of Sikh descent, choose to highlight the one "Sikh" hero who was the most secular/Hindu.  They did this to portray Sikhs moving in a secular and/or Hindu direction (most importantly, away from Sikhi) as something positive and desirable.  On the other hand, their lack of recognition for the thousands of other, more observant Sikh freedom fighters shows their efforts to obscure the role of the Sikh values and spirit in liberating India.  The goal of these efforts is to prevent the ascendance of role models for the Sikh youth who might inspire them to move towards Sikhi.

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48 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

OK so the photo was earlier but he did stop shaving and cutting hair after talking to Bhai Sahib ...

Where is the proof that pic was taken in a supposed 1st arrest? Complete garbage, he accepted sikhi again b4 he was hung as u mentioned. Sum fuddhus cant/wont accept this, but cling on to sum tatti book, he SUPPOSEDLY wrote.

Sardar kapur singh wrote in his book, 'sachi sakhi', that bhagat singh wanted to take amrit and also have bhai randhir singh to b 1 of the panj singhs. But i suppose sardars kapur/randhir singhs were a bunch of liars eh.😒

 

Edited by StarStriker
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6 hours ago, californiasardar1 said:

 

Monay have inferiority complexes and are happy to have their own "shaheed", and to have someone who they can point to in order to justify why killing their kesh does not matter.

U takin the mick? Monay have inferiority complex? Their own shaheed? Justifiying kesh cutting? Never read such tatti in my life. Yea, i suppose us monay really dont consider sant jarnail singh as a real shaheed then, or any of the old puratan singhs as shaheeds then? Seriously shut ur mouth with that garbage. Attitudes like ur just push monay away, rather than bringing them in. Thank god u aint got no voice out there to make any difference. I dunno wat it is in ur america water, but u man spout serious garbage.

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7 hours ago, californiasardar1 said:

You nailed why Hindustanis celebrate Bhagat Singh, but I will add one reason why "modern" Sikhs celebrate him: became he was a mona.  Monay have inferiority complexes and are happy to have their own "shaheed", and to have someone who they can point to in order to justify why killing their kesh does not matter.

I agreed with most of your statement but I don't agree with that there.

From my experience monay have more love and fight for Sikhs and Sikhi than your everyday keshdhari Sikh. This monay/keshdhari divide is very dangerous as this was the same tactic used to push some sahejdhari Sikhs into the camps of Hindu punjabi's and into the Hindtuva agenda in 19th century. Just cause a person can grow some kesh and look like a khalsa roop does not make them a Sikh. Many pro-indian government criminals and police black cat terrorists were brahmin hindus who put on a turban and grew kesh as did some indian punjabi muslims to murder Sikh youths and Sikh separatists and other innocents by pretending to be Sikh militants. We just need to look at butchers like KPS Gill who is a keshdhari looking Sikh aswell as was the other butcher beant singh and neither of them are monay.

In 1980s/90 in uk when there was street fights with racist skinhead goray and muslim extremists it was usually monay Sikhs who would have fist and sword fights with the racists and muslim gangs not sardar's.

Balwant+Singh+Rajoana+-+Before+&+After.j

Monay / sehajdhari Sikhs have saved Sikhi and Sikh civilians countless times in history more recently during 1980s/90s they formed death hit squads taking out op blue star Indian general vadiya on motorbikes and 1984 genocide accused politicians. Even bhai rajoana was a monah in the punjab police before he and his colleague took out butcher of punjab cheif minister beant singh.

sukha-jinda.jpg

So we as a kaum need to stop having this dangerous mindset against monay and thinking they have inferiority complex as they dont. Its usually our keshdhari bros that have inferiority complexes these days on many issues.

Edited by genie
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2 hours ago, genie said:

I agreed with most of your statement but I don't agree with that there.

From my experience monay have more love and fight for Sikhs and Sikhi than your everyday keshdhari Sikh. This monay/keshdhari divide is very dangerous as this was the same tactic used to push some sahejdhari Sikhs into the camps of Hindu punjabi's and into the Hindtuva agenda in 19th century. Just cause a person can grow some kesh and look like a khalsa roop does not make them a Sikh. Many pro-indian government criminals and police black cat terrorists were brahmin hindus who put on a turban and grew kesh as did some indian punjabi muslims to murder Sikh youths and Sikh separatists and other innocents by pretending to be Sikh militants. We just need to look at butchers like KPS Gill who is a keshdhari looking Sikh aswell as was the other butcher beant singh and neither of them are monay.

In 1980s/90 in uk when there was street fights with racist skinhead goray and muslim extremists it was usually monay Sikhs who would have fist and sword fights with the racists and muslim gangs not sardar's.

Balwant+Singh+Rajoana+-+Before+&+After.j

Monay / sehajdhari Sikhs have saved Sikhi and Sikh civilians countless times in history more recently during 1980s/90s they formed death hit squads taking out op blue star Indian general vadiya on motorbikes and 1984 genocide accused politicians. Even bhai rajoana was a monah in the punjab police before he and his colleague took out butcher of punjab cheif minister beant singh.

sukha-jinda.jpg

So we as a kaum need to stop having this dangerous mindset against monay and thinking they have inferiority complex as they dont. Its usually our keshdhari bros that have inferiority complexes these days on many issues.

Exactly, if someones insides aren't pure then there's little point in taking pride on your external appearance, Anand Sahib even a-tests to that. I've met so many monay who are the most spiritual people I've seen in my life, and I'm a keshdhari individual here. Baby steps are the way to go, rather than isolate them help them in their journey. Rather than shame them, encourage them.

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14 hours ago, genie said:

I agreed with most of your statement but I don't agree with that there.

From my experience monay have more love and fight for Sikhs and Sikhi than your everyday keshdhari Sikh. This monay/keshdhari divide is very dangerous as this was the same tactic used to push some sahejdhari Sikhs into the camps of Hindu punjabi's and into the Hindtuva agenda in 19th century. Just cause a person can grow some kesh and look like a khalsa roop does not make them a Sikh. Many pro-indian government criminals and police black cat terrorists were brahmin hindus who put on a turban and grew kesh as did some indian punjabi muslims to murder Sikh youths and Sikh separatists and other innocents by pretending to be Sikh militants. We just need to look at butchers like KPS Gill who is a keshdhari looking Sikh aswell as was the other butcher beant singh and neither of them are monay.

In 1980s/90 in uk when there was street fights with racist skinhead goray and muslim extremists it was usually monay Sikhs who would have fist and sword fights with the racists and muslim gangs not sardar's.

Balwant+Singh+Rajoana+-+Before+&+After.j

Monay / sehajdhari Sikhs have saved Sikhi and Sikh civilians countless times in history more recently during 1980s/90s they formed death hit squads taking out op blue star Indian general vadiya on motorbikes and 1984 genocide accused politicians. Even bhai rajoana was a monah in the punjab police before he and his colleague took out butcher of punjab cheif minister beant singh.

sukha-jinda.jpg

So we as a kaum need to stop having this dangerous mindset against monay and thinking they have inferiority complex as they dont. Its usually our keshdhari bros that have inferiority complexes these days on many issues.

 

Bhai Harjinder Singh Jinda became a mona only so that he could punish dushts like General Vaidya.  The change in appearance was almost a necessity in order to not arouse suspicion in parts of India where there were very few Sikhs.

As for the monay Sikhs doing most of the fighting in the UK in the 80s and 90s.  Of course they did.  When monay outnumber Singhs 100 to 1 or whatever, it is not a remarkable fact that monay end up doing more of everything.

Anyway, you are right there have been some mona shaheeds, especially during the 80s and 90s period.  Bhai Dilawar Singh, for example.  But let's not revise history and act like 90% of the people on the front lines of the movement in India were monay.

 

All I am saying is that monay want to feel included and it makes them feel good to be able to point to shaheeds who were monay in order to make the same argument you just made: the Khalsa roop alone does not make one a Sikh, what is on the inside counts, etc.  These are all valid points.  I am merely pointing out that Bhagat Singh's popularity with the modern Sikh quam (the vast majority who are monay) probably has something to do with the fact that he was a mona.  Think about it: among thousands of Sikh shaheeds during the colonial period, 99.9% who were Singhs, how does a mona emerge as the most celebrated?  People like having someone who looks like them as a "hero" that they can point to.

Anyway, I wish everyone would calm down.  I'm not saying monay are lesser than anyone.  I am sure most monay are much better Sikhs than me.  I was just making a point that their prevalence in our quam has something to do with Bhagat Singh's popularity.

Edited by californiasardar1

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