feedback needed

[simran_kaur]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

i got this e-mail from someone.. i coudn't exactly answer his question in full form.. :D instead it got me confused too...

sadhsanagt ji.. help me out by giving you opinion on this pls... :

" I would like to ask you a question if you dont mind, i went to a gurdwara in west london in the uk, there was a akhand paath there and , one thing i saw out of place was that along side the paati some body was reading jap ji sahaib non stop , i ask y thats was but people couldnt give me a stright answer,i was told that it makes up for the mistakes the paati makes but i assumed that would be asked for in the addarss. i asked a number of people but nobody could give me a satisfactory answer. so could you explain to me to the best of your knowledge why this is done thats way

the akand paath came to an end and arttee was carried out, i never saw this carried out before , but a few friends of mine who are ni hung singhs were there carring out the arrtee, artte was done through kirtan and than towards the end they had a bell and a dhaall with candels on and were waving it in the fashion that hindus carry out arrtee , and than flowers were thro

wn on to the Guru Granth Sahib,

i asked people about arrtee and i was told it was not a done thing in gurdwaras, but its carried out at haazoor sahib, but its under hindu inflence, because people would go bak into hindu rituals, but i was told that arrtee or arrtaa is carried out through kirtan but not through the dhaall waving , , i have asked a number of people who have knowlegde of sikhism but i would like your opion on that if possible ."

please post your feedback.. thankyou..

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Son of Guru Gobind Singh Ji]

this kind of service is not uncommon for any Nanaksar Gurdwara. Even Taksali Gurdwara Sahibs have people read Jap Ji sahib along with Sri Akhand Path Sahib. It just gives them more laaha cuz they do more path. But the answer about it making up for mistakes doesn't really make much sense.

This might not be a ritual, but since people didn't really know why they were doing these things then it sure is a ritual for THEM.

[Guest SikhForLife]

i agree with you mostly.. but a little baffled about this

people read Jap Ji sahib along with Sri Akhand Path Sahib. It just gives them more laaha cuz they do more path

i am guessing they r some amazing people who are paying attention to both paaths being read.. and they can hear and understand both at the same time..

hmm.. i wish i could be like that

[Son of Guru Gobind Singh Ji]

the Jap Ji Sahib's path is actually silent.

So you do have a point.

[simran_kaur]

waheguru ji ka khalsa

waheguru ji ki fateh

it dosen't make sence tho.. they read it silently...

the sangat can't hear it.. so it dosneèt matter if they

listen to unshud gurbani.. i unno.. still confued :D

and one more thing... umm some ppl say that at amrit sanchar

if dasam granth is not present it dosen't hold any meaning..

is that right?? :D

please answer if anyone gets time.. casue i know i got a lot of time to ask questions...

thankyou for your feedback...

still confuse... a lil :T:

waheguru ji ka khalsa

waheguru ji ki fateh

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

nanaksaar is'nt a gurdwara but a dera

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Law of the Sikhs, the Rehat Maryada states this:

Chapter IV, Article V

(d) Anything except the afore-mentioned reverential ceremonies, for instance, such practices as the arti with burning incense and lamps, offering of eatables to Guru Granth Sahib, burning of lights, beating of gongs, etc., is contrary to gurmat (the Guru’s way). However, for the perfuming of the place, the use of flowers, incense and scent is not barred. For light inside the room, oil or butter-oil lamps, candles, electric lamps, kerosene oil lamps, etc. may be lighted.

Aarti as a ceremony is NOT in line with Sikhism. I have seen video footage of aarti done in Hazoor Sahib. This same Thakat also has a picture of "Guru Gobind Singh" (in quotes because the physical roop of Guru Sahib is in the Panj Pyare, not a picture!). :D

The Rehat Maryada also makes no mention of reading Japji Sahib a second time (it is to be read once, as each page of the Guru Granth Sahib is supposed to be read). This rule is unknown to me, and adding rules to the Rehat Maryada is not correct either.

Also, bells, flowers and candles for ritualistic purposes is not in line with the Rehat Maryada. The only time candles are to be used is if they serve as a source if light without any ritualistic attachment to them (see above).

As per the presence of the Dasam Granth being a requirement for Amrit Sanchar, it is not. The Guru Granth Sahib's presence is required, not the Dasam Granth's nor the Sarbloh Granth:

C

hapter XIII, Article XXIV

(B) At the place where ambrosial baptism is to be administered, the holy Guru Granth Sahib should be installed and ceremonially opened. Also present should be six committed baptized Sikhs, one of whom should sit in attendance of the Guru Granth Sahib and the other five should be there to administer the ambrosial baptism.

As per the Nanaksar comment...it is actually true to a point. In Nanaksar history presented at a website (forgot which one), it was stated that Nanaksar establishments do not fly the Nishan Sahib. If this is true, then the place is inelegible to be called a Gurudwara, as a Nishan Sahib is REQUIRED for a place to be titled a Gurudwara:

Chapter IV, Article V

r) At a high-level site in every gurdwara should be installed the nishan sahib (Sikh flag). The cloth of the flag should be either of xanthic or of greyish blue colour and on top of the flag post, there should either be a spearhead or a Khanda (a straight dagger with convex side edges leading to slanting top edges ending in a vertex).

So if the Nanaksar establishments do fly the Nishan Sahib, they may be titled Gurudwaras. If not, sorry...it's not a Gurudwara.

Now, how can Gurbani be "unshud"? Simply Impossible.

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

That B) should be a B with a ). Emoticons kinda took over the letters...

[Deep Singh]

I AGREE 100 % WITH ms514 Bhaji....

i think unshud bani means when we not read the correct pronunciation.....BUT it is not unshud BANI but Unshud UCHARAN [unpure pronuncation] :T:

Arti is not something Sikh....only Guru Granth Sahib is required at Amrit Sanchar...

[Singh 5]

Look at the aartee shabads "gagan mai thaal" and Bhagat Ravidas jees "Naam tayro aartee majan muraaray" and the others and you'll note that they are all saying that praising Vahiguru is true artee and that plate with candles etc. is so small and insignificant. That naam is the only true offering. Aartee with divas and flowers is a Hindu custom.

As for no Amrit Sinchaar being complete without Dasam Granth present: was Dasam Granth present in amrit sinchaars in time of Guru Gobind Singh jee? No. Because Dasam Granth didn't exist in the time of Guru Gobind Singh jee, just Guru Granth Sahib in form of Adi Granth. So unless we say that all the Singhs who received amrit in the time of Guru Gobind Singh received illegitimate amrit, then Dasam Granth is not necessary. GurGaddi or Guruship was given only to Guru Granth Sahib jee. Dasam Granth is baaNee and should be read, but it is not on par with Guru Granth Sahib.