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LifeIsBeautiful

Surrey Nagar Kirtan - Ahmediya Muslim Stall

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1 hour ago, LifeIsBeautiful said:

I was so surprised that the Ahmediya Muslim people had a stall at the Surrey Nagar Kirtan with books on Life of Mohammed and preaching material.

Mindblowing. Thanks for highlighting this.

Although I would mention that these people are the "fundamentalist Muslims" you see in the media. According to Muslims, Ahmadyas are not even actually Muslims. But, yeah, I get your point.

The question regarding stalls is this: Do they have the legal right to be there? Where were they, exactly? On the sidewalk along the route? If so, that's illegal, right? You can't block the sidewalk. So call the police, or inform the organizers, and let them call the police.

I think a lot of people set up their langar stalls on the front yards of people along the router, either their own house, or a Sikh they know, or even a Sikh that they asked permission from. Which is all OK. So if these Ahmadias are on a Sikh's lawn, we can obviously get them booted. Perhaps even if they are on a white Canadian's lawn. 

But ... what if there's an Ahmadia along the route? Then we can't do anything.

Although, we could try asking the mosque, like you say, but why would they have to consent to what we want?

Seriously though, these non-Sikhs are lined up like vultures trying to feast off of us.

The non-Sikhs sense that we Punjabis have energy, and they want to utilize it.

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Ahmediyas: a historically persecuted -- at the hands of mainstream Islam! -- Muslim sect that's held up as an example of the "good", acceptable, and tolerant side of Islam. Yet, this is what happens when you give any Islamic group an inch; they reveal their true hand, and reach for a mile! This is EXACTLY the reason I roll my eyes when people get misty eyed about fringe Muslim sects -- such as Sufis -- being an antidote to the mainstream khattar orthodoxy of the Sunni & Shia crews. The fact isn't that Ahmediyas and Sufis don't share the beliefs and the aim of their Ummah brethren, i.e. the establishment of the Caliphate and the subjugation of the Kaffir. The difference is these minor sects desire the same outcomes as their bigger brothers, only they aren't too fussed on getting to that destination in a hurry, as opposed to the Sunnis and Shia who want it all yesterday. The Ummah reigns supreme. Muslim apologists and sympathisers are either too dense to process this FACT, or are willfully omitting these inconvenient truths in order to strengthen their narrative of #notallmuslims.

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10 hours ago, TheeTurbanator said:

I was at the Basics of Sikhi stall located at 128th and 80th, I wish someone had come to us and informed us of this, the ahmadiyya believe that Guru Nanak Dev Ji was a Muslim, and it would have been a perfect opportunity for us to have a discussion with them, and clear up their misconceptions about Sikhi. 

And to have recorded it for Youtube, too. After all, why have the same discussion over and over again with a handful of people when you can get it out to thousands?

10 hours ago, TheeTurbanator said:

 

Let this be a warning to all Sikhs, if we do not do parchaar of Sikhi, someone else will. It's time we start getting serious about Sikhi, before it's too late. 

Agreed.

ਆਪਿ ਜਪਹੁ ਅਵਰਹ ਨਾਮੁ ਜਪਾਵਹੁ ॥

Aap Japahu Avareh Naam Japaavahu ||

Chant the Naam yourself, and inspire others to chant it.

ਗਉੜੀ ਸੁਖਮਨੀ (ਮਃ ੫) (੨੦), ੫:੪ - ਗੁਰੂ ਗ੍ਰੰਥ ਸਾਹਿਬ : ਅੰਗ ੨੯੦ ਪੰ. ੪ 
Raag Gauri Sukhmanee Guru Arjan Dev

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Are we nice or being fools for allowing this to happen. This is our religious event. Why are they setting up stalls targeting Sikhs? 

 

It is due to our foolishness and openness that we allowed Christian missionaries to target Sikhs in Punjab. We are seen as a soft target. Now ahmadies are taking advantage of this too

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5 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

I wrote and dispatched a particular article on the falsity that Bhagat Fareed was a hardcore Muslim and by incorporating his Bani into the Adi Guru Granth Sahib Ji, the Sikh Gurus proved their respect for Islam and hence all Sikhs should become Muslims. 

Great writeup on Sheikh ji, bro. There was actually a big (10 page) thread on the question of whether Sheikh Fareed ji was a Muslim where a bunch of us refuted just that allegation. I would like to ask you to post this plus the rest of your writing on the Sheikh there as it is a valuable perspective, and the thread would definitely benefit from that. Thanks.

5 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

Basically they were clutching at straws. The pamphlets were enough to make the Sikhs ignore these idiots and they grew worried and left the scene.

Lovely. I would love to see the Youtube video of that, lol.

5 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

Later a famous attendant Gyani, from Taksal (and who I will not name), got hold of one of the pamphlets. After having it explained to him he called me over and asked me what jatha I belonged to. I told him none.

I'll refrain from criticizing Taksal specifically, but we all know that some (but not all) people in many different Jathas have the my-organization-is-the-best mentality.

5 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

Few days later all the pamphlets were thrown in the trash

I assume these pamphlets, like most writings on Sikh topics, had Gurbani on them? Stunning  that people's dharabazi would be so strong that they could not flinch disrespecting Bani if it means that they could disrespect what they perceive as enemies (or even non-allies) of their particular jatha.

Even if they didn't contain Bani, it's still bad throwing them in the garbage.

5 hours ago, 13Mirch said:

After this some of us decided to stick to the social media.

Good for you. That's where (almost) all the people are, anyway.

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14 hours ago, LifeIsBeautiful said:

I was so surprised that the Ahmediya Muslim people had a stall at the Surrey Nagar Kirtan with books on Life of Mohammed and preaching material.

Bro, please respond to this to say whether you saw this with your own eyes, or you just heard about it.

If the former, then where where exactly were the Ahmadiyas and Brahmkumaris situated? Sidewalk? A stall allocated by the nagar kirtan organizers? A private lawn? With permission, or without?

Also, on what street between what cross streets?

Thanks.

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I saw with it my own eyes. It was a stall that said "love for all .. hatred for none" 

.,they had books on the life of Mohammed and had 3 Muslim old uncle's with topis on.  I was in a car accident about 2 months and honestly stayed at the Nagar kietan for like 1 hour.

It was the Delta mosque in tillsbury road. I really regret not approaching them, but he'll there was a brahmkumari stall as well on 128th.

I

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16 minutes ago, Jonny101 said:

Are we nice or being fools for allowing this to happen. This is our religious event. Why are they setting up stalls targeting Sikhs? 

Well, as I mentioned above, it's unclear what the specific situation was where they were located (sidewalk, private lawn, etc.). We may or may not be able to legally stop them from setting up a stall.

But, yeah, I agree the reason they target us is they perceive us as weak.

Even if we can't boot them via the police, we can swarm their stall with knowledgeable Sikhs. We should be prepared with a contingent of Sikhs to do parchar to Sikhs, and then also contingents to debate with any non-Sikhs that show up.

It's like an army attack. Army vs. army is a fair fight. Prepared Muslims vs the average unprepared Sikh is a slaughter. Anyway, the the knowledgeable Sikhs will debate the Muslims, while the average Sikhs can stand around and watch, and get enlightened instead of being bombarded with false factoids by the Muslims.

If they get the message that that's what's going to happen to them every nagar kirtan, then at some point, they'll stop showing up to nagar kirtans.

Another tack we can take is to make it clear to them that we have no problem with them following their own faith, but if they're going to try to convert Sikhs, then we'll return the favor with a stall every Friday at their mosque. I have a feeling they'll back off.

Thoughts?

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12 minutes ago, LifeIsBeautiful said:

I saw with it my own eyes. It was a stall that said "love for all .. hatred for none" 

.,they had books on the life of Mohammed and had 3 Muslim old uncle's with topis on.  I was in a car accident about 2 months and honestly stayed at the Nagar kietan for like 1 hour.

It was the Delta mosque in tillsbury road. I really regret not approaching them, but he'll there was a brahmkumari stall as well on 128th.

I

Thanks bro.

Just one more thing: Where exactly was the stall situated (so we can prepare our response for upcoming Nagar Kirtans).

Was it on somebody's front yard? 

Was it on a sidewalk?

Or was it in a stall allocated by the Nagar Kirtan organizers?

 

Also, were there a lot of Sikhs perusing the books or talking to them? Or were they being ignored by our peeps?

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5 hours ago, Ranjeet01 said:

As per usual,  our openness and tolerance is seen as weakness for others, and they take full advantage. 

Hey, don't you know?  All religions are equal.

Get with the program, bro!

(sarc)

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2 hours ago, MisterrSingh said:

Ahmediyas: a historically persecuted -- at the hands of mainstream Islam! -- Muslim sect that's held up as an example of the "good", acceptable, and tolerant side of Islam. Yet, this is what happens when you give any Islamic group an inch; they reveal their true hand, and reach for a mile! This is EXACTLY the reason I roll my eyes when people get misty eyed about fringe Muslim sects -- such as Sufis -- being an antidote to the mainstream khattar orthodoxy of the Sunni & Shia crews.

So many good points here.

For one, we think of Sufis as the "good" and tolerant Muslims. But did you know that the main religious cheerleader for the martyrdom of Guru Arjan Dev ji was a Sufi Muslim leader from Sirhind (a huge city of that time)?

His name was Ahmed Sirhindi, and he was a prominent member of the  Naqshbandī Sufi order. Supposedly he was a big philosopher. Here's Brittanica on him:

In refuting the Naqshbandīyah order’s extreme monistic position of waḥdat al-wujūd (the concept of divine existential unity of God and the world, and hence man), he instead advanced the notion of waḥdat ash-shuhūd (the concept of unity of vision). According to this doctrine, any experience of unity between God and the world he has created is purely subjective and occurs only in the mind of the believer; it has no objective counterpart in the real world. 

So you'd think this guy was just living the life of the mind, right? No, he was a fanatic who encouraged the Mughal emperor employ policy of radical Islam (also known as simply "Islam") and to execute Guru Arjan Dev ji Maharaj.

This fool's tomb is hardly a mile from the site of the execution of the 2 younger Sahibzade at Fatehgarh Sahib. It's huge complex called Rauza Sharif, and it's quite popular with Muslims. You can also see a few stupid Sikhs visiting the tomb of their 5th Guru's enemy.

Note: I'm not saying all Sufis are murderers or encouragers of murder. I'm just saying keep your eyes wide open.

Edited by BhForce
added name of the Sufi
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