Why the need to convert others ?

[Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh]

On the main page of this very forum there are regular threads asking for the 'best ways to convert' others to Sikhism.  I read them, but of course I can't post in them, and I wait for someone to ask why we need to spend time and energy converting others. That alternative viewpoint never comes, hence this thread.

Now, it's really not that many years since I became a son of my Guru and since I have been every moment of my life has been spent trying to uplift myself to his standard. Trying to improve and cleanse my own mind, body, soul and actions. This is a never ending task and I really don't think the day will ever come when I will have achieved perfection and so can devote time and energy into 'converting' others. As long as those others are not doing truly hurtful things to humanity such as child abuse, murder, thieving etc I consider all of them decent human beings...or at least as decent as I am. So where does this need in some of you to convert others come from ?  We know Christians and Muslims actively try to convert Sikhs but that's because it's part of their religion to do so. When they do so I always think to myself how unloving these people must be that they seek to convert others instead of spending that time cleansing their own souls. Just because they do it - it doesn't mean we should do it too. Just because they do it - it doesn't mean its the right thing to do. My own personal view - and I maybe wrong about this - is that one who tries to conquer other souls surely has not yet conquered his own for once he conquers and then understands his own he begins to understand the love and goodness that permeates between all mankind and how the idea of conversion strategies themselves goes against this grain of goodness.  This is my view. Tell me yours ?

[Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh]

OK. With no responses, as usual, let's try a different approach (I'm getting used to this) in order to wake you up:  Sikhi is adavanced. Those others are not. Those others still work at ape primate levels. Our primate instincts as humans are to either fight, flee or convert. But Sikhi is beyond these primate levels. Sikhi is way beyond. Sikhi gives the opportunity to find the truth within. So why ignore that and go back to one of the basic ape-like primate levels ?

[Big_Tera]

On 8/31/2018 at 4:21 PM, Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh said:

On the main page of this very forum there are regular threads asking for the 'best ways to convert' others to Sikhism.  I read them, but of course I can't post in them, and I wait for someone to ask why we need to spend time and energy converting others. That alternative viewpoint never comes, hence this thread.

Now, it's really not that many years since I became a son of my Guru and since I have been every moment of my life has been spent trying to uplift myself to his standard. Trying to improve and cleanse my own mind, body, soul and actions. This is a never ending task and I really don't think the day will ever come when I will have achieved perfection and so can devote time and energy into 'converting' others. As long as those others are not doing truly hurtful things to humanity such as child abuse, murder, thieving etc I consider all of them decent human beings...or at least as decent as I am. So where does this need in some of you to convert others come from ?  We know Christians and Muslims actively try to convert Sikhs but that's because it's part of their religion to do so. When they do so I always think to myself how unloving these people must be that they seek to convert others instead of spending that time cleansing their own souls. Just because they do it - it doesn't mean we should do it too. Just because they do it - it doesn't mean its the right thing to do. My own personal view - and I maybe wrong about this - is that one who tries to conquer other souls surely has not yet conquered his own for once he conquers and then understands his own he begins to understand the love and goodness that permeates between all mankind and how the idea of conversion strategies themselves goes against this grain of goodness.  This is my view. Tell me yours ?

I think you could be refering to one of my topics here. Let me explain. 

So if we believe something is good and will greatly help and be beneficial to a persons life.  Why not share it with the world? Is Sikhism a faith just for people who were lucky to be born into the faith and something to be kept private and not talk about it?

Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to various places on earth to spread the faith. Why should we continue not to do so. Also there is a big difference when Sikhs preech to the way muslims do. Sikhs rather teach about the Sikh faith and do not criticise other faiths. We mainly concentrate on our own faith. We do not say things like ' our faith is better then yours'. Or try and come up with arguement against their faith. We also do not pressurise anyone to convert. We just teach our faith and are happy wheather someone chooses to become a sikh, stay in their faith or even if they dont have a faith.With muslims its a self reward. Convert and you get extra wine and women in heaven. 

Muslims and christians as we all know use all kinds of underhanded methods. They pressurise and use false deception aswell as other underhanded tactics. 

Theres a big difference my friend, with the Sikh way of parchaar and the muslim and christian way. 

 

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

Hindu troll suspected ! 

 

[Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh]

Quote

Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to various places on earth to spread the faith. Why should we continue not to do so.

No man can be compared to Guru ji. That's half the problem we have at the moment. We have tens of thousands thinking they have mastered themselves and are at the Guru level. No mere mortal should be even thinking about converting others until he has first mastered his own being. 

Conversions, my friend, by their very nature, come with very heavy baggage and should not be treated lightly. A by-product of any conversion - either to Sikhi or away from Sikhi - is family break-ups and marital problems, among others. The very desire to convert others does, in my opinion, emanate from a basic disapproval of the morality of others for no reason other than the fact that they belong to a different faith if one at all. 

Quote

Hindu troll suspected ! 

Wow, I've gone from muslim troll to hindu troll in world record speed. Someone needs to contact Limca.

[Sukhvirk1976]

7 hours ago, Big_Tera said:

I think you could be refering to one of my topics here. Let me explain. 

So if we believe something is good and will greatly help and be beneficial to a persons life.  Why not share it with the world? Is Sikhism a faith just for people who were lucky to be born into the faith and something to be kept private and not talk about it?

Guru Nanak Dev Ji went to various places on earth to spread the faith. Why should we continue not to do so. Also there is a big difference when Sikhs preech to the way muslims do. Sikhs rather teach about the Sikh faith and do not criticise other faiths. We mainly concentrate on our own faith. We do not say things like ' our faith is better then yours'. Or try and come up with arguement against their faith. We also do not pressurise anyone to convert. We just teach our faith and are happy wheather someone chooses to become a sikh, stay in their faith or even if they dont have a faith.With muslims its a self reward. Convert and you get extra wine and women in heaven. 

Muslims and christians as we all know use all kinds of underhanded methods. They pressurise and use false deception aswell as other underhanded tactics. 

Theres a big difference my friend, with the Sikh way of parchaar and the muslim and christian way. 

 

This is ridiculous.. Guru nanak never sought to convert anyone.. The idea proselytising and evangelising to convert people is anathema to a sikh..

 

The fact that a sikh acts truthfully and behaves truthfully is enough to make people ask deeper questions.. 

Guru tegh Bahadur gave his life in opposition to the idea of conversion.. Have some shame 

[jkvlondon]

15 hours ago, Sukhvirk1976 said:

This is ridiculous.. Guru nanak never sought to convert anyone.. The idea proselytising and evangelising to convert people is anathema to a sikh..

 

The fact that a sikh acts truthfully and behaves truthfully is enough to make people ask deeper questions.. 

Guru tegh Bahadur gave his life in opposition to the idea of conversion.. Have some shame 

Guru ji did convert the  unbelieving cynics  to believers and practisers ...so yes all Guru Sahiban did this ...
Guru Teg Bahadur ji gave his life for freedom of conscience and faith  and against oppression of humans in that respect.  Sikhi is not oppression but realisation of truth. gurbani instructs Sikhs to do abhiyaas of naam and encourage others to do the same

[Big_Tera]

21 hours ago, Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh said:

No man can be compared to Guru ji. That's half the problem we have at the moment. We have tens of thousands thinking they have mastered themselves and are at the Guru level. No mere mortal should be even thinking about converting others until he has first mastered his own being. 

Conversions, my friend, by their very nature, come with very heavy baggage and should not be treated lightly. A by-product of any conversion - either to Sikhi or away from Sikhi - is family break-ups and marital problems, among others. The very desire to convert others does, in my opinion, emanate from a basic disapproval of the morality of others for no reason other than the fact that they belong to a different faith if one at all. 

Wow, I've gone from muslim troll to hindu troll in world record speed. Someone needs to contact Limca.

I am not comparing. We are merely spreading the beliefs of Sikhism. If Guru Nanak Dev Ji, did not want anyone to become Sikh. Then why would he have created Sikhism? Just for fun? I am sure all the Gurus would love the fact that people become true Sikhs. As I said its not about converting. Its about teaching. If people choose to become Sikh from these teachings then that can only be a good thing. There is no force or coercion. As I said if they want to become Sikh that is good, if they feel it is not for them then that is also good. It is not about disrespecting or saying other faiths are wrong. We believe our faith to be the true way. Do you think Sikh should not go out there and talk about their faith and just keep it behind closed doors for know one to know about? Do you think organisations such as basics of sikhi should he closed?

When Guru Nanak went to Sri Lanka. was he not happy when many left Hinduism and became sikhs? Guru Ji went to spread the message of Sikhism. Yet according to you it was just for fun. He really wanted them to stay hindu. The truth is he was happy whatever faith they chose to be. whether they stayed hindu or became sikh. 

Who are you to say who has mastered and who has not? Converting others in not just a matter of doing it face to face yourself.  - Ie you can help with it in all kinds of ways. Such as by donating to people like basics of sikhi who are doing the job. helping by creating websites or doing all kinds of things to help with it. Instead of just sitting on your ar$e and criticizing others. 

Your obviously one of them left wing Sikhs. Who would like nothing more to be celebrating christmas, eating turkey and trying to make all Sikhs like you. You need to toughen up and smell the coffee because at the moment you are comming across as panzified tree hugging Sikh.

Overly westernised

overly gorafied

overly Christiansen

overely  liberalized

overly muslimfied

Get back to drawing another painting. I am sure you will make the world a better place with that. 

 

 

[Big_Tera]

18 minutes ago, jkvlondon said:

Guru ji did convert the  unbelieving cynics  to believers and practisers ...so yes all Guru Sahiban did this ...
Guru Teg Bahadur ji gave his life for freedom of conscience and faith  and against oppression of humans in that respect.  Sikhi is not oppression but realisation of truth. gurbani instructs Sikhs to do abhiyaas of naam and encourage others to do the same

Exactly. To many people are very touchy on the whole conversion thing. Would our ancestors have become Sikh if someone did not preach or teach to them. According to jagsaw only Guru Nanak can preach or teach and even Guru Ji was not looking to convert anyone. He just made up an entire religion for the fun of it. . 

[mahandulai]

22 hours ago, Guest jagsaw_puzzled_singh said:

No man can be compared to Guru ji. That's half the problem we have at the moment. We have tens of thousands thinking they have mastered themselves and are at the Guru level. No mere mortal should be even thinking about converting others until he has first mastered his own being. 

Conversions, my friend, by their very nature, come with very heavy baggage and should not be treated lightly. A by-product of any conversion - either to Sikhi or away from Sikhi - is family break-ups and marital problems, among others. The very desire to convert others does, in my opinion, emanate from a basic disapproval of the morality of others for no reason other than the fact that they belong to a different faith if one at all. 

Wow, I've gone from muslim troll to hindu troll in world record speed. Someone needs to contact Limca.

youre not the only one theyve accused as trolls, because its a wierd view, but a just question you ask.

The answer, we dont need to convert anyone. The plant does not think to grow, it just does.