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[MrDoaba]

13 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

You can always convert if you don't like monotheistic Sikhi . 

What has conversion, and monotheism got to do with this? Few points for you:

1) I've never stated Sikhi is not monotheistic, nor have any vidhavaans of Sampardaic Sikhi. Nor has any Sikh for that matter.

2) The term "monotheism" is an overly simplistic word. Sikhi cannot be defined by western standards or terms regardless lol.

3) You clearly have no clue of the theology of Sikhi.

12 hours ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

If there would have been no Singh Sabha, there would have been NO Sikhism today ! period ! 

Singh Sabha movement gave water to the dying plant of Sikhi . It revitalized and reinvogorated the sikh qaum . 

No wonder then , the kaum de dushman (rss and some sikhs within the qaum) despise singh sabha . 

Round of applause for the Sikhism we have today!

If that's what you want to believe that's your prerogative. Although I like to think of it more like they poured tezaab to plant of Sikhi.

And if by Qaum de dushman you mean the RSS and some Sikhs within the Qaum, and by some Sikhs within the Qaum you mean:

Akali Nihangs (Buddha Dal, Tarna Dal, Sursingh Dal etc) Hazoor Sahib, Patna Sahib, Damdami Taksal (Mehte, Bhindran), Nirmale (Bhai Daya Singh Upsamparda & Bhai Dharam Singh Upsamparda and all branches under this banner...Nanaksar, Rara Sahib, Harkhowal, Nirmal Akhara etc), Sevapanthis, Udasis and many many more...who have all brought to the Panth a beant treasure trove of information (which everybody seems to wanna make use of nowadays), done prachaar, and actually properly done veechaar with Hindus AND actually convinced them...and who have also given countless shaheediyan.....................................................

IF, to you these are, and I quote "Qaum de dushman" then you are seriously misguided and have just spoken words verging on beadbi lol. I have no interest in trying to tell you or others like you of your folly. Wish you all the best.

Maharaaj Ji, Guru Mata Ji Samatt Bakhshan.

 

Gurbar Akaal!

 

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

9 hours ago, MrDoaba said:

What has conversion, and monotheism got to do with this? Few points for you:

1) I've never stated Sikhi is not monotheistic, nor have any vidhavaans of Sampardaic Sikhi. Nor has any Sikh for that matter.

2) The term "monotheism" is an overly simplistic word. Sikhi cannot be defined by western standards or terms regardless lol.

3) You clearly have no clue of the theology of Sikhi.

Round of applause for the Sikhism we have today!

If that's what you want to believe that's your prerogative. Although I like to think of it more like they poured tezaab to plant of Sikhi.

And if by Qaum de dushman you mean the RSS and some Sikhs within the Qaum, and by some Sikhs within the Qaum you mean:

Akali Nihangs (Buddha Dal, Tarna Dal, Sursingh Dal etc) Hazoor Sahib, Patna Sahib, Damdami Taksal (Mehte, Bhindran), Nirmale (Bhai Daya Singh Upsamparda & Bhai Dharam Singh Upsamparda and all branches under this banner...Nanaksar, Rara Sahib, Harkhowal, Nirmal Akhara etc), Sevapanthis, Udasis and many many more...who have all brought to the Panth a beant treasure trove of information (which everybody seems to wanna make use of nowadays), done prachaar, and actually properly done veechaar with Hindus AND actually convinced them...and who have also given countless shaheediyan.....................................................

IF, to you these are, and I quote "Qaum de dushman" then you are seriously misguided and have just spoken words verging on beadbi lol. I have no interest in trying to tell you or others like you of your folly. Wish you all the best.

Maharaaj Ji, Guru Mata Ji Samatt Bakhshan.

 

Gurbar Akaal!

 

just stop assuming dude ! when did i say i consider the list of ppl you quoteed as enemies 

[MrDoaba]

4 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

just stop assuming dude ! when did i say i consider the list of ppl you quoteed as enemies 

You said:

Quote

No wonder then , the kaum de dushman (rss and some sikhs within the qaum) despise singh sabha . 

From which I made an inference. The groups I listed rarely have anything good to say about Singh Sabha for a number of reasons, one being because they were and are considered the opposition...the Singh Sabha marginalised them due to their own paranoia and warped view of Sikhi. Often you will also hear them try to correct the kind of thinking that has crept into the Panth...the insidious mindset which I have spoken about, the mindset which is a direct result of the Singh Sabha. They will also mock the typical Singh Sabhia approach to Sikhi, their framework, and again..the kind of thinking they introduced. Barring a few things here or there, in general these groups are against Singh Sabha, and I would go as far as to say some do actually despise "Singh-Sabhaianess".

And no for Christ's sake they are not RSS. Seriously, why do you think everybody who is against Singh Sabha has something to do with the RSS? Just because they were against "Hinduism"? Being anti-Singh Sabha does not equal Sikhi = Hinduism.

There are many many Sikhs who see the Singh Sabha "Sikhism" the way I do. I myself was raised with this "Sikhism" and have direct links to the original lehar.

You have a personal issue with Hinduism (and I'm not saying none of it is valid) but people these days cannot even seem to accept the parts of Sikhi which overlap with Hinduism, hence, they try to remove it. There is a very deep rooted hysterical paranoia which is damaging to Sikhi. Who is responsible for this?

 

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

15 minutes ago, MrDoaba said:

You said:

From which I made an inference. The groups I listed rarely have anything good to say about Singh Sabha for a number of reasons, one being because they were and are considered the opposition...the Singh Sabha marginalised them due to their own paranoia and warped view of Sikhi. Often you will also hear them try to correct the kind of thinking that has crept into the Panth...the insidious mindset which I have spoken about, the mindset which is a direct result of the Singh Sabha. They will also mock the typical Singh Sabhia approach to Sikhi, their framework, and again..the kind of thinking they introduced. Barring a few things here or there, in general these groups are against Singh Sabha, and I would go as far as to say some do actually despise "Singh-Sabhaianess".

And no for Christ's sake they are not RSS. Seriously, why do you think everybody who is against Singh Sabha has something to do with the RSS? Just because they were against "Hinduism"? Being anti-Singh Sabha does not equal Sikhi = Hinduism.

There are many many Sikhs who see the Singh Sabha "Sikhism" the way I do. I myself was raised with this "Sikhism" and have direct links to the original lehar.

You have a personal issue with Hinduism (and I'm not saying none of it is valid) but people these days cannot even seem to accept the parts of Sikhi which overlap with Hinduism, hence, they try to remove it. There is a very deep rooted hysterical paranoia which is damaging to Sikhi. Who is responsible for this?

 

wrong again BRO ! 

 

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Akali Nihangs (Buddha Dal, Tarna Dal, Sursingh Dal etc) : 

no sikh would even think of disrespecting our beloved nihangs . I am speaking of true nihangs, not the wannabe pretenders .

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Hazoor Sahib, Patna Sahib 

I am more of fascinated and curious about the certain "hindu-like" practices like aarti and bells , etc at these sacred places. I don't reject them outright or their practices, but it would be nice if someone could answer why these places have different traditions. NOW please don't say all gurdware were like these before singh sabha !

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Damdami Taksal (Mehte, Bhindran) 

 

umm comeon this must be ludircrous 
 

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 Nirmale (Bhai Daya Singh Upsamparda & Bhai Dharam Singh Upsamparda and all branches under this banner...

 

I respect nirmale sants , and I think they're valuable sources for a sikh who wishes to learn the vedantic viewpoints and upanishads. Honestly I don't think ppl in punjab, even sgpc or ss disrespect them. I think they have their own subtraditions and gurdware.

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Nanaksar,  Rara Sahib Harkhowal, Nirmal Akhara etc),

There's nothing in Nanaksar or Rara sahib which would make them anti singh sabha . Honestly I can't think of a difference. Perhaps nanaksar emphasizes on celibacy which doesn't fit in sikhi framework but other than that , not much diff
 

Quote

 

Sevapanthis 

 

I think ppl look up to them 

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Udasis

the most controversial of all ! Honestly Baba Sri Chand is overhyped in Sikhi . Baani in SGGS speaks of them in not favorable tone . Yet Sikhs somehow revere him. Which shows how much we lack understanding of bani 

[MrDoaba]

29 minutes ago, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

wrong again BRO ! 

 

no sikh would even think of disrespecting our beloved nihangs . I am speaking of true nihangs, not the wannabe pretenders .

I am more of fascinated and curious about the certain "hindu-like" practices like aarti and bells , etc at these sacred places. I don't reject them outright or their practices, but it would be nice if someone could answer why these places have different traditions. NOW please don't say all gurdware were like these before singh sabha !

umm comeon this must be ludircrous 
 

I respect nirmale sants , and I think they're valuable sources for a sikh who wishes to learn the vedantic viewpoints and upanishads. Honestly I don't think ppl in punjab, even sgpc or ss disrespect them. I think they have their own subtraditions and gurdware.

There's nothing in Nanaksar or Rara sahib which would make them anti singh sabha . Honestly I can't think of a difference. Perhaps nanaksar emphasizes on celibacy which doesn't fit in sikhi framework but other than that , not much diff
 

I think ppl look up to them 

the most controversial of all ! Honestly Baba Sri Chand is overhyped in Sikhi . Baani in SGGS speaks of them in not favorable tone . Yet Sikhs somehow revere him. Which shows how much we lack understanding of bani 

What is the maksad of your post? It has no relation to anything I stated. You have listed all the groups I mentioned and added some irrelevant captions. You missed the point entirely.

Those Sampardas are on a totally different spectrum to Singh Sabha Sikhism. They have not, do not, and will not ever preach that Sikhism. They may not mention the words "ohh jehre Singh Sabhia ahh" but there are plenty of references to that revisonist-reformist thinking and they regularly preach things and do Katha which would not be considered acceptable by Singh Sabha standards by a long shot. All you have mentioned and alluded to in your captions are stereotypes of those Sampardas which you believe are not a problem. You seem to have no idea of their interpretation of Sikhi and Gurmat Sidhant and overall vision/essence of Sikhi. Nor do you have any idea of, or, experience with people of those Sampardas lol.

I can't be bothered speaking on this matter with you any further. You're simply not going to get it. You wanna follow that watered down nonsense? Be my guest. It's not very popular in the west anyway amongst serious Gursikhs lol. But hey, it never hurts to do Ghar Wapsi every now and then. Did I just say Ghar Wapsi, my bad.

However on the off chance you want to know what I'm talking about (for reference of course), go and spend time with people who follow Sampardaic Sikhi, do Sangat with them. Listen to Katha by them. See things from their perspective. Then you will get it.

 

Gurbar Akaal!

 

[Guest AjeetSinghPunjabi]

12 minutes ago, MrDoaba said:

I can't be bothered speaking on this matter with you any further. You're simply not going to get it. You wanna follow that watered down nonsense?

I will be honest on one thing though . Yes , sometimes it does seem the english translation of gurbani or even the "teekas" tend to be a little abrahamic . 

By Abrahamic I mean there's more focus on "there's god , fear him , worship him blah blah " than the "meditate and find" approach.

Last year and last-to-last I got curious about upanishads and started reading their translations. I have mixed reactions . They're tough to understand anyways and are very metaphorical.   However , what sparked me was WHAT IF you read upanishad first and then gurbani . you would def interpret gurbani differently ! 

[Guest guest]

On 11/3/2018 at 5:29 AM, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

On 11/3/2018 at 5:29 AM, AjeetSinghPunjabi said:

If there would have been no Singh Sabha, there would have been NO Sikhism today ! period ! 

Singh Sabha movement gave water to the dying plant of Sikhi . It revitalized and reinvogorated the sikh qaum . 

No wonder then , the kaum de dushman (rss and some sikhs within the qaum) despise singh sabha . 

Sikhism wasn't 'dying' pre Singh Sabha.  Singh Sabha seems likes knee <banned word filter activated> insecurity reaction raised in a climate of British education (framing everything according to their terms).  Hindu groups were having similar crises.

People don't like Singh Sabha precisely the same way you come across as unlikeable.  its one person's view of things being forced on everyone else as the legitimate view.