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puzzled

What if Punjab was in Pakistan ?

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You hear stories of how Jinnah the founder of Pakistan had offered Sikhs the choice of making Pakistan their home, which means that rather than carving Punjab into half, the majority of Punjab would of been included in the Pakistan side of the border, the Sikh leaders apparently refused the offer. Don't know how true this story is but its one of the many stories you hear regarding the fate of Sikhs and 1947.

So lets say if All of Punjab was carved into Pakistan side of the border then what would be the current state of the Sikhs?  that would be aprox 25 million Sikhs living in Pakistan.  

Would Sikhs be in a better state or would it be worse?  would life be easier or worse ?  25 million is a big population of non muslims residing in a muslim country  

also, do you think Sikhs would culturally be different if they were from a majority Islamic country or would Sikhs be the same as Sikhs are today 

 

your opinions ...

Edited by puzzled

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We'd be at the mercy of the Pakistanis similar to how we're currently at the mercy of Hindustanis. There is no silver lining in either situation. Also, our fate would be dictated by the whims of the establishment of the ruling country and its majority faith. I'm sure, anecdotally, there'd be positives on a local level, but overall from a long term perspective there's no genuine prosperity on virtually every front that matters for Sikhs by being the meat in the Indian-Pakistani sandwich. Although, I suppose the comparatively conservative Pakistani culture might have inadvertently endowed our people with a certain degree of restraint and decorum, but again i'm sure there'd be downsides to this aspect of it, too.  

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36 minutes ago, puzzled said:

You hear stories of how Jinnah the founder of Pakistan had offered Sikhs the choice of making Pakistan their home, which means that rather than carving Punjab into half the majority of Punjab would of been included in the Pakistan side of the border, the Sikh leaders apparently refused the offer. Don't know how true this story is but its one of the many stories you hear regarding the fate of Sikhs and 1947.

So lets say if All of Punjab was carved into Pakistan side of the border then what would be the current state of the Sikhs?  that would be aprox 25 million Sikhs living in Pakistan.  

Would Sikhs be in a better state or would it be worse?  would life be easier or worse ?  25 million is a big population of non muslims residing in a muslim country  

also, do you think Sikhs would culturally be different if they were from a majority Islamic country or would Sikhs be the same as Sikhs are today 

 

your opinions ...

It would be terrible. How would we have fared in a military ruled state? Pakistans always have military coups where dictators rule for 10+ years.

Plus we would fear suicide bombers. I think pakistan was listed as the country with most suicide bombings in public places.

Also taliban stopped women from attending schools in the frontier areas. 

And we would live in a place where paan would be spit in the streets. 

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why would anyone contemplate something so enslaving? THoughts are tangible things every bit as real as any object - meditate instead upon the liberation of moslem-occupied Aryavarta - Dharmic religions and Dharmic life cannot exist in presence of mohamadans. RamRajya-Khalsa Raj - this is the Future for the World. Xtianity is dying. islam is demented  - only Dharmic philosophy (this includes Vedanta/Sikhi/teachings of Gautam Buddh make sense.  All the sacrifices of the Early Gursikhs and the ones who valiantly fought the colonial bastards would have been for naught had all of Panjab been moslem occupied.

Think, do ardas on how all of Panjab  (indeed all the af-pak lands) are to be reunified under the Dharmic banner of Sikhi, Vedanta, yoga etc. Sanatan community is working on this thru Ghar Wapsi - they have led delusional Sikhs who became xtian back to the Dharmic fold and back to Sikhi - xtianity ruins charmic village life. We are born divine - we have spark of Paramatman within us - the idea that people are born sinners creates a vicious sin-repent-guilt cycle difficult to escape.

Life in halal torture lands is hell for vegetaryans/vaishnu peoples.  Guru ka Langar is pure vegetarian.  anglo jew hijacked veg movement with veganism - Milk and Milk products are healthful - we need proper dharmic dairy facilities.  The idea that any mass of land is thought to belong to anyone on basis of ethnicity/colour/creed  is stupid - the idea that any state is black or white or brown or moslem or xtian or jew is nonsensical.

One Uniform Civil Code of Law (rooted in Dharmic truths) must apply without any favouritism shown to anyone.

Polygamy is dysgenic and enslaving, particularly the Islamic type. Demographic warfare in hopes of establishing international caliphate must be uprooted.

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milk is needed for making Prasad - I could write a whole lot on why veganism is demented -another time.

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7 hours ago, Prabh108 said:

only Dharmic philosophy (this includes Vedanta/Sikhi/teachings of Gautam Buddh make sense.

Interesting post. 

Are you a Sikh?

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13 hours ago, puzzled said:

 

 

your opinions ...

read the history of what it was like British Raaj in muslim majority areas in Punjab. There's history involving Kartar Singh Jhabbar.

 

Also I wonder what would have happened during partition? I think there would have been the same battles no matter which side we stayed on. Look at Action day and the terrorism committed by Muslim League in Punjab before partition days. 

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10 hours ago, Prabh108 said:

milk is needed for making Prasad - I could write a whole lot on why veganism is demented -another time.

oh ok so you get the milk from abused cows, and that is Prasad, can you explain this any further?

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On 4/26/2019 at 10:41 AM, mahandulai said:

oh ok so you get the milk from abused cows, and that is Prasad, can you explain this any further?

alot of milk donated to uk gurdwaras is from non-organic gurdwaras, where the cows are more or less abused.

Unsure about ghee, probably the same?

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I think it would of been very difficult. Pakistan also has blasphemy laws. All someone needs to do is falsely accuse you of insulting Muhammad or the Quran and you will be stoned to death. There are the radical mullahs preaching hate, forced conversions etc 

25 million is a big number of non Muslims, that would make them feel uneasy. 

Also would sikhs be allowed to openly talk about our ithiaas, talk about the mughal torture? I think not.  Pakistan even has weapons named after Abduli. Would sikhs been allowed to play rehras eating out loud through the speaker like they do in the pind gurdware  I don't think so. 

But yeah I agree because of the conservative culture of that country sikhs probably would of been more conservative, more similar to the sikhs of the 40s and 50s. 

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At the time of partition there would have been approx 6 million Sikhs.

If Punjab was fully in Pakistan, there would be a miniscule number today as that 6 million population would be seriously diminished by various methods.

 

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1 hour ago, Ranjeet01 said:

At the time of partition there would have been approx 6 million Sikhs.

If Punjab was fully in Pakistan, there would be a miniscule number today as that 6 million population would be seriously diminished by various methods.

 

Apparently in 47 there were around 40 million Hindus in pakisan mainly Sindhi but there now are only 3 million. Don't know how true this is or how exaggerated the figures are but I wouldn't be surprised if the paki hindu population hasn't seen a healthy steady growth since then. 

It's a known reported fact that many Sindhi hindu females get kidnapped and forced into conversion 

Yeah we have suffered a lot under the indian government perhaps it would of been worse under the Islamic government 

Whatever waheguru did he did it for the best ...

Edited by puzzled

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13 minutes ago, puzzled said:

Apparently in 47 there were around 40 million Hindus in pakisan mainly Sindhi but there now are only 3 million. Don't know how true this is or how exaggerated the figures are but I wouldn't be surprised if the paki hindu population hasn't seen a healthy steady growth since then. 

It's a known reported fact that many Sindhi hindu females get kidnapped and forced into conversion 

Yeah we have suffered a lot under the indian government perhaps it would of been worse under the Islamic government 

Whatever waheguru did he did it for the best ...

In a non-muslim majority countries , the Muslim population always grows and it grows fast.

In a muslim majority country, the non muslim population will shrink.

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2 hours ago, Ranjeet01 said:

In a non-muslim majority countries , the Muslim population always grows and it grows fast.

In a muslim majority country, the non muslim population will shrink.

What about Hinduism in India? Hasn't it just engulfed any religion that has made contact with the subcontinent?  Even Islam in India is Hindufyed and more Sufi and grave/peer worshipping 

I think it's this ability to engulf that has made Hinduism last so long   

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2 hours ago, puzzled said:

What about Hinduism in India? Hasn't it just engulfed any religion that has made contact with the subcontinent?  Even Islam in India is Hindufyed and more Sufi and grave/peer worshipping 

I think it's this ability to engulf that has made Hinduism last so long   

Hindus have lost Pakistan and Bangladesh. They probably lost parts of Afghanistan as well.

It may start of Sufi but it ends up more Arabic.

Look at those Sri Lankan muslims, twenty odd years ago, they would look like every other Sri Lankan now they have those black burkha,  their men are growing those moustachless Abraham Lincoln beards and wearing those outfits that make them walk like penguins. 

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